Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

, January 06, 2020 5:18 PM > To: Mercedes Discussion List > Cc: Peter Frederick > Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up > > I was told back in the day that one of those 16" HE shells did a fine job of > opening up a helicopter landing zone. _

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

And still impressive.   If I were some tin pot dictator, and the BB-61 (or any BB)  pulled up outside my door, I'd be a little nervous. Scott Ritchey via Mercedes January 9, 2020 at 12:48 AM Obsolete for sea battles. Still useful as amphibious artillery.

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Daisy Cutter: LZ in a can. > -Original Message- > From: Mercedes [mailto:mercedes-boun...@okiebenz.com] On Behalf Of > Peter Frederick via Mercedes > Sent: Monday, January 06, 2020 5:18 PM > To: Mercedes Discussion List > Cc: Peter Frederick > Subject: Re:

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

c: Peter Frederick > Subject: Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up > > Battleships were obsolete in 1941, I really don't think anything has happened > since then that would return them to utility! > ___ > http://www.okiebenz.c

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Battleships were obsolete in 1941, I really don't think anything has happened since then that would return them to utility! ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

That makes sense.   I never bought the blame when it happened, and I didn't buy the BS they had in the accident display onboard. at any rate, it led to the mothballing again of the BB fleet. Peter Frederick via Mercedes January 6, 2020 at 9:50 PM One of the

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

16" dummy shell and 6 dummy powder bags. Mitch Haley via Mercedes January 6, 2020 at 7:32 PM What about the 16"? We still have ammo for that. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxRBP2ZKUZY _ ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Missile, goes Boom. Bomb dropped from airplane goes Boom 16" shell goes Boom Rocket from airplane goes Boom All make a big hole in the ground. different means of delivery, but the result is the same.  only some variance in size of the crater. 16" dummy shell, and 3 powder bag canister:

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

The were not "bombing" Baghdad with shells fired from a 16" gun. The Iowa class was upgraded with missile batteries during the 80's, different weapon. Max range for might be a little more than 20km, but not by much for a gun. Missiles are another story altogether.

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

One of the forward turrets on the Iowa was burned out by a cordite flashover in the 80's, 86 or 87 I think. I remember it being A, but I could easily be wrong. Killed everyone in the turret and damned near blew the ship up. Don't know if they lifted the turret and set it back on the

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

1955 actually.    They show that one on the Iowa, beside #1 turret. G Mann via Mercedes January 6, 2020 at 6:38 PM https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OmOQs0ziSU Training video for 16 inch gun operation.. circa WW2 Also see:

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Funny, but they were bombing bagdad from more than 20 miles away. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armament_of_the_Iowa-class_battleship Pay particular attention to the second paragraph. Peter Frederick via Mercedes January 6, 2020 at 5:53 PM Yup. Mechanical

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

We just returned from a trip to see the BB-64, BB-55,  CV-10 (Yorktown) and the USS Laffey.   In May we went to the BB-61 and the CV-41 (Midway)  and April, BB-60.  All very impressive! USS Iowa  BB-61  I believe was released from "reserve" status for active duty this past summer.   It was on

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Those computers fill a small room.   They stand about 4' tall.    They are as accurate as any digital computer, and have the added bonus that the smoke NEVER comes out!   THey will ALWAYS work.  USN did consider replacing them in 1987-88 refit, ( I was told aboard the USS Iowa, BB-61) but

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

What about the 16"? We still have ammo for that. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TxRBP2ZKUZY ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to:

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OmOQs0ziSU Training video for 16 inch gun operation.. circa WW2 On Mon, Jan 6, 2020 at 4:58 PM Peter Frederick via Mercedes < mercedes@okiebenz.com> wrote: > Yup. Mechanical computers in the fire control station actually aim and > fire the guns. I don't

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

roughly 2000 to 2700 lb. They are 3-4' tall, and most are around 4. archer75--- via Mercedes January 6, 2020 at 12:49 AM Awesome! Sixteen inches is a huge projectile. Gerry ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Yup. Mechanical computers in the fire control station actually aim and fire the guns. I don't believe they were upgraded to electronic in the 80's, but I don't know for sure. No, there are no battleships left in the fleet. They still exist in the "mothball fleet" but I don't believe any are

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Sadly they are either floating museums or in mothballs again, and I do believe they are no longer viable to be recalled back into service. They were enormously expensive to operate (steam plants burning bunker oil, and any casualty to the propulsion plant would pretty much require custom

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

I was told back in the day that one of those 16" HE shells did a fine job of opening up a helicopter landing zone. The AP shells, on the other hand, often went right through light ships (merchant marine converted carriers for instance) and exploded in the water on the far side. Bunker busters

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

As I recall they used mechanical fire control computers to aim the guns. They compensated for all kinds of variables including ship motion, powder load, atmospherics, and such. --FT Sent from iPhone > On Jan 6, 2020, at 4:58 PM, archer75--- via Mercedes > wrote: > > Good story! The

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Good story! The accuracy of the rolling battleship miles from the target is remarkable. Are battleships still part of the fleet? Gerry On Mon, 6 Jan 2020 09:58:38 -0500 Meade Dillon via Mercedes wrote: > Yes indeed, the shells weighed about as much as a VW beetle, IIRC a range > of over 30

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

On Mon, 6 Jan 2020 09:58:38 -0500 Meade Dillon via Mercedes wrote: > Yes indeed, the shells weighed about as much as a VW beetle, IIRC a > range of over 30 miles (well over the horizon). When I was in college, there was an article in the Los Angeles Times which stated exactly that. > I read a

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Yes indeed, the shells weighed about as much as a VW beetle, IIRC a range of over 30 miles (well over the horizon). I read a very impressive / humorous account of an Army patrol in Vietnam war that called for artillery support during an engagement with enemy forces. Their first call to the

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Awesome! Sixteen inches is a huge projectile. Gerry > Not very likely. I'm retired from Navy Reserve now. Retired from active duty > would be called before me. Army did that for the surge back in 2008, Navy did > not being back any retired that I know of, although they can always make >

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Max Dillon via Mercedes January 5, 2020 at 9:39 AM  They recalled a bunch of retired folks when Reagan brought the battleships back out of mothballs, for instance. There were no Gunner's Mates left who knew how to operate those sixteen inch guns. And they are

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Here are links you might find interesting. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Front_(Iran) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mohammad_Mosaddegh https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-1-d=imperialism+wiki Manifest destiny was a widely held belief in the 19th-century United States that

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Not very likely. I'm retired from Navy Reserve now. Retired from active duty would be called before me. Army did that for the surge back in 2008, Navy did not being back any retired that I know of, although they can always make exceptions for "by name" recall if someone has a needed skill.

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Will you be called back if this gets into war? Gerry On Fri, 3 Jan 2020 09:23:15 -0500 Meade Dillon via Mercedes wrote: > Wow! > > https://apnews.com/5597ff0f046a67805cc233d5933a53ed > > "BAGHDAD (AP) — The United States killed Iran’s top general and the > architect of Tehran’s proxy wars in

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

All those reindeer passing gas  (driving around in their SUVs) caused it to warm up and be green and warm when Erik the Red settled the place. Craig via Mercedes January 3, 2020 at 11:28 PM On Sat, 4 Jan 2020 00:00:49 -0500 Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes wrote:

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

On Sat, 4 Jan 2020 00:00:49 -0500 Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes wrote: > Quite the balmy day! Indeed! On the other side of the temperature scale (from my other list), We all saw the silly headlines about how Greenland was burning and sweltering last summer:

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Chuckles shows the results of inbreeding.   Lunatic moron: Chuckles the Clown. Dan Penoff via Mercedes January 3, 2020 at 5:48 PM I was watching a documentary on the UK, specifically the royals, and was surprised to learn about how Charles buddied up to the Arab

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

you have to remember that Merkel, under the whipped topping, is a communist.   What the communists have been doing since about 1950, is destroying the culture and destabilizing countries form within.    Well, actually that is what they did in Russia in the 1910s.   Destabilize, get 2 factions

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Quite the balmy day! --FT Sent from iPhone > On Jan 3, 2020, at 11:49 PM, G Mann via Mercedes > wrote: > > "Operation Black Glass" > Start time is 0400 > Start Date is optional. > 18,000 degrees for 11 seconds, followed by slow bake at 5,000 for days > following. Local winds may

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

"Operation Black Glass" Start time is 0400 Start Date is optional. 18,000 degrees for 11 seconds, followed by slow bake at 5,000 for days following. Local winds may exceed 800 MPH with following over pressure. Try not to stare at the bright light. The 72 Perpetual virgins and the 300

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

which is why the whole place shoulda been glass on 08:01 on 12 Sept, 2001. G Mann via Mercedes January 3, 2020 at 10:08 AM All valid arguments. However, there is one factor not considered. That factor is the imposition of Islam in the region, centuries ago. Islam

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Agreed.   When Saddam was fighting the aye ya toljas,  It was pretty close to the ideal. Peter Frederick via Mercedes January 3, 2020 at 9:48 AM Could be why the Turks neatly dumped Iraq on the British after WWI. It's stupid to play over there -- very little

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

shoulda all been turned to glass by 0800 on Sept 12 2001.  Nothin there anyone needs. Buggered Benzmail via Mercedes January 3, 2020 at 8:48 AM Good observations. I say we take off and nuke the whole site from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Based on what I saw about him buddying up with the Arab states, I can’t imagine it was too upsetting. -D > On Jan 3, 2020, at 6:52 PM, Dimitri Seretakis wrote: > > I wonder how Charles felt about Dodi boinking Diana. > > Sent from my iPhone > >> On Jan 3, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Dan Penoff via

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

I wonder how Charles felt about Dodi boinking Diana. Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 3, 2020, at 6:48 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes > wrote: > > I was watching a documentary on the UK, specifically the royals, and was > surprised to learn about how Charles buddied up to the Arab states and >

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

I was watching a documentary on the UK, specifically the royals, and was surprised to learn about how Charles buddied up to the Arab states and promoted Muslims to the country. He apparently got a lot of “cred” in the Arab world, but the Queen Mum and Dad were apparently not happy. -D > On

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Yes France and UK are the worst. Thanks to the E.U. policies which are dictated mostly by Germany, countries such as Italy and Greece and others have been inundated by these people. Hungary was smart and finally closed its borders. Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 3, 2020, at 6:25 PM, Dan Penoff

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

You could say much the same for France or the UK, but the UK has been doing this for a while based on colonialism.. -D > On Jan 3, 2020, at 6:04 PM, Dimitri Seretakis wrote: > > Except that many of these neutral countries don’t let hoardes of Muslim > “refugees” trample through their

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Except that many of these neutral countries don’t let hoardes of Muslim “refugees” trample through their borders. Europe under Merkel has been decimated and destroyed permanently by this scourge. Sent from my iPhone > On Jan 3, 2020, at 3:40 PM, Dan Penoff via Mercedes > wrote: > > True.

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

True. The Swiss really do it right. Nordic countries aren’t far away from this approach, either. -D > On Jan 3, 2020, at 3:35 PM, Clay via Mercedes wrote: > > The best foreign policy ever employed by the US has been to stay the heck out > of other peoples business and tidy up our own

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

The best foreign policy ever employed by the US has been to stay the heck out of other peoples business and tidy up our own internal issues. Not that we have employed that line of action in forever. Whenever we decide to meddle, the banana republic or other backward terrain becomes a

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Yup and for some reason people in this country think "Oh, we'll just bring them a cup of democracy and everything will suddenly get better." Yeah sure, we suddenly have figured out some magic that EVERYBODY else for two centuries has missed. -Curt On Friday, January 3, 2020, 11:41:56 AM

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

True. And religion aside, some of the conflicts in this area go back centuries, as we’re in no position nor is there any reason for us to get in the middle of them. I think that is one HUGE knowledge gap that exists in our population. People here don’t grasp some of the cultural and regional

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

This is my thought. Everything anybody from the west has ever done in the middle east has turned into poo. Why keep trying? -Curt On Friday, January 3, 2020, 10:53:57 AM EST, Peter Frederick via Mercedes wrote: Could be why the Turks neatly dumped Iraq on the British after WWI. 

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

All valid arguments. However, there is one factor not considered. That factor is the imposition of Islam in the region, centuries ago. Islam is a violent cult devoted to world conquest by any force available. It is not now, nor has it ever been, a religion. That factor has nothing to do with oil.

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Could be why the Turks neatly dumped Iraq on the British after WWI. It's stupid to play over there -- very little other than oil, and if we wean ourselves off wasting petroleum, the inhabitants of the middle east can battle each other over sand dunes forever with no impact beyond that.

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

Good observations. I say we take off and nuke the whole site from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure. --FT Sent from iPhone > On Jan 3, 2020, at 9:42 AM, Peter Frederick via Mercedes > wrote: > > We are still paying for allowing Churchill to talk us into overthrowing > Mossadeh (sp),

Re: [MBZ] OT: Temperature in MidEast just went up

We are still paying for allowing Churchill to talk us into overthrowing Mossadeh (sp), the duly elected Prime Minister of a democratic Iran in 1953. Not the only time he stabbed us in the back, either, in his drive to re-create the British Empire. All he needed was for the US to pay all the