[NSP] Re: small coals, and the peacock following the hen
To my ear the best thing about the Peacock with Gg drones is the prominent clashing f#, which resolves to a d; it is a strongly emphasised note in the 'C major' strains. BP would have a high g nat here instead but Peacock was stuck with f# on NSP and seems to have gloried in it. With Aa drones, f# dropping to d is just a d major chord - less exciting. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Mallorca
An important bit of advice when discussing Royal Compositions, is NEVER EVER CRITICISE THEM! This is because you never have any idea who wrote the things John In a message dated 29/04/2012 20:02:33 GMT Daylight Time, ross.ander...@cl.cam.ac.uk writes: There were two pipers called William Ross. The first was piper to Queen Victoria from 1854-1891; Edward VIII, as he became, was born three years later. The other Willie Ross was a top player from before WW1 to after WW2, and was for many years the chief instructor at the school of piping. But he was never a piper to royalty. Edward VIII was taught the pipes by Henry Forsyth, the sovereign's piper from 1910aEUR"1941. If anyone helped the prince polish Majorca, PM Forsyth is surely the prime suspect Ross To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[NSP] Re: March 2012 TOTM: "Adam a Bell" selected by Julia Say
I once wondered if the ballad fits the tune - can you sing it in 9/4? The answer is a tentative yes... But it isn't as obvious as I'd like. I have not checked every verse. The ballad seems to be a local analogue of a Robin Hood one, with Carlisle for Nottingham etc, Adam a Bell is not the Robin Hood figure - that job went to William of Cloudesley. But who had it first is a question I won't go into - except that the Borders, and borders in general, have always been better bandit country than middles of countries. (Duck!) John In a message dated 29/02/2012 05:53:51 GMT Standard Time, dir...@gmail.com writes: Many thanks to Julia Say for selecting a classic tune for March. Julia writes: William Dixon's "Adam a Bell" and its tune family - through the Peacock "My Dearie sits ower late up" (and the similar but not identical one in Clough). If any new players find these too intimidating there's a 2 strain version in the NPS first tunebook. Its an old tune whose title commemorates an even older event in West Border history - see the ballad of the same name. Dixon's version has 9 strains, Peacock's 5 - I'm sure others must have extended these or inserted strains of their own to suit their own taste for inventiveness. It would be interesting to hear the latest additions. I'm also interested in the different rhythmic emphasis occasioned by the 9/4 or 9/8 time signatures. It goes on both BP and nsp: if anyone wants a transposition of Dixon's version into G for nsp, I can supply either appropriate abc or "the dots". I might even try to find the time to fire up my own recorder and register on soundcloud. Mind...I did say "try"! -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[NSP] Re: NSP spotted on ebay UK
If that recent footage of a mammoth-shaped object fording a river in Chukhotka in the Russian Far East turns out not to have been faked, then presumably the species goes on the CITES list pretty sharpish, and carrying smallpipes across borders gets harder... John In a message dated 17/02/2012 21:48:50 GMT Standard Time, cwh...@santa-fe.freeserve.co.uk writes: A lot of the ivory actually came from old billiard and snooker balls as well and a lot of of them (and other ivory work) came from mammoth tusks from Russia. Europeans used ivory mainly for piano keys and cutlery handles! I remember being advised to look out for them to make some bits for the pipes - mind you, that was when the recommended cane source was flower baskets from Spain :) I never did get any as my attempt to make a set went very, very wrong when the drill came out of the side of the chanter and I realised it was beyond me! I think I still have a few pieces of lignum hanging around somewhere though (drone size). Hippo teeth are a common source as well (and sperm whale teeth) and anything from a mammal tooth is "ivory". All a bit gross really. Mammoth ivory is still legal. I'd rather have plastic myself. Colin Hill On 17/02/2012 21:21, Guy Tindale wrote: > > Hi All, > > The ivorycould possibly be walrus. Goeff Wooff used old walrus pieces > that I think he bought in NZ years ago in the limited number of sets > of pipes that he made. Then again am happy to be proven wrong!! > > Regards, > > > Guy T > --- On Wed, 15/2/12, John Dally wrote: > - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2112/4815 - Release Date: 02/17/12 - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2012.0.1913 / Virus Database: 2112/4815 - Release Date: 02/17/12 To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[NSP] (no subject)
In response to an unmet need for harvest tunes, and incidentally tunes commemorating Northumbrian wildlife, I was inspired to write this after an afternoon's piping with Edmund in Northumberland, when Edmund, Gisela and I all went for a walk afterwards... X:1 T:The Harvest Mite M:9/8 R:Slip Jig K:G |:c|BAf gAB GAB|dBf dBg Aec|BAf gAB GAB|BAd eAc A2:| |:e|gGA fBc edB| gGA Bfd ceA|gGA fBc edB|cBe fAc A2:| |:c|dBf gBe GdB| gBf GdB eAg|dBf gBe GdB|AeB fAc A2:| If anyone feels this deserves a set of irritating variations, they are welcome to go for a walk in long grass in search of inspiration! The inspiration develops from the next day onwards but is relieved with antihistamines John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Harvest tunes
Two or three from Vickers - The Kirn Staff (Kirn = Corn, as in Kirn Supper) and the Threshers, also perhaps The Hare in the Corn, though the hare being in the corn is more of a problem before you have cut it. You'd expect musicians at a Kirn supper. There are probably a few more out there. Of course I nearly forgot Corn Rigs. John In a message dated 02/09/2011 12:45:27 GMT Daylight Time, theborderpi...@googlemail.com writes: Yes, Cut & Dry is the obvious one. I did a survey of versions for an article in the NPS mag many (harvest) moons ago, and have since come up with more information and my own version, but one good version is enough (e.g. Peacock or Dixon). Others with appropriate titles are Jack's Gone A-Shearing (Vickers) and Robin Shure In Hairst [=Sheared in Harvest/Autumn] (in Dixon as Mock The Soldier's Lady), both fine 3/2 hornpipes. These have made me ponder about a connection between the lost 3/2 hornpipe and the physical activity of harvesting - I have read that pipers played for harvest workers. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[NSP] Re: Mr Dunk - Inspector of Public Nuisances
In a message dated 17/07/2011 20:33:27 GMT Daylight Time, barr...@nspipes.co.uk writes: Just because a piece breaks some notional (artificial?) rules, doesn't make it bad music. Oddly, I don't think W on the W does break any rules in this sense. Except for our preference for 4 bar phrases, and Dave may have spotted the remedy for that. But is the best thing we can say about it that it's grammatical? So is Chomsky's 'Colourless green ideas sleep furiously', though it is totally meaningless. Was Dunk trying to write a paradox, or Northumbrian-style music? Certainly not succeeding in the latter. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Mr Dunk - Inspector of Public Nuisances
In a message dated 17/07/2011 17:07:14 GMT Daylight Time, oatenp...@googlemail.com writes: http://www.northumbrianpipers.org.uk/pipersforum/viewtopic.php?f=18&; t=206 Dave is right, Dunk meant it to be in ternary form. A, B, A', with A' being an ornamented recap leading into a coda. But there is no sign of a repeat mark or 1st and 2nd time bars in the MS, even though he takes the trouble to say 'Briskly and cheerily'. I think what Dave reads as 1st and 2nd time bars are meant to be bridge passages, but they don't work, as they don't join what comes before to what follows John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Tune of the Month, July, "Roxborough Castle"
A good point - but if a musical style has any merit, it's worth studying for musical reasons alone. That's why, in Ireland, so many non-Kerrymen play slides and polkas John In a message dated 30/06/2011 20:51:14 GMT Daylight Time, oatenp...@googlemail.com writes: Hello again, Anthony, One question arises over the issue of absorbing a regional musical accent: which side of the hill are we talking about? If the hill is big enough, the style will be pretty different. Northumberland is a huge county, where travelling in the old days would not have been that easy. Aren't we talking about a variety of musical accents here? Francis > On 30 Jun 2011, at 20:09, Anthony Robb wrote: > > --- On Thu, 30/6/11, Francis Wood wrote: > > Hello Anthony, > I don't think we disagree. At Stuart Hardy's musical altitude, I'm sure > you're right. > That's a level I can only admire but never approach. On a more basic > level, playing the tune with a dotted rhythm will get you through in a > far less exposed manner than playing straight, which would seem to be > an ability to acquire before refining the playing to a more regionally > idiomatic expertise. > > Hello Francis > I'm still not sure I can agree completely. > I've taught lots now myself (more or less regularly since 1976 and > mostly beginners/youngsters) - probably in the region of 3500 > pupil-hours and found that (hornpipes aside - which are slowish anyway) > people get get away with jigs and reels played steady and straight but > as soon as we try and dot/lilt them they fall away after a bar or > two.This is especially true of (even) slowish jigs. I used to take the > approach you outline; get them playing evenly and steadily and then put > the regional (some would say the all important) accent in afterwards > but getting people to feel a good lilt and use it consistently after > having spent months mastering the straight version has proved very > difficult indeed. > In recent years I've tried to get the lilt in from the off so that even > if fingers aren't responding the brain would be taking something in and > it seems to work better. Of course the old guys would never hear the > straight version in the first place and they have the steadiest pace > and control I've ever heard. > Scottish and Irish bands were popular in Northumberland but when the > old guys swiped their tunes they used their own accent to play them. > Sadly that distinctive accent is all too rare these days and it would > be great to see more pipers from this area taking it on. The problem is > how best to achieve it - which ever way we tackle it results are a long > time coming. > As aye > Anthony > > -- > > > To get on or off this list see list information at > http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html --
[NSP] Re: Has there ever been an NSP with _all_ keys (no open holes)?
Adrian, I stand corrected Only the one known example, I take it? How do you mean part-Union? Do you mean a wholly keyed NSP chanter, cylindrical bored and closed ended, but with UP drones and regulators? I must go and look at it - even if they (it?) never caught on, and even if it never deserved to John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] wholly keyed chanter??
One obvious response is that playing finger holes on NSP is faster and more 'positive' than playing keyed notes. Half of this may be down to the poor dexterity of the little finger, but I can't play even thumb-keyed notes as crisply as open-holed ones. There's something in Tom Clough's writings about most players being less fluent on keyed notes, so it isn't just me. Now the 20 open-holed keyless chanter played by two telepathic people with small hands might be worth a go John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Tuning/pitch
Before the tuning fork was invented, there were pitch pipes. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Shellac
UHU is a pain if you need to get in there, though. Shellac is at least easy to soften. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] (no subject)
Is 'The rotting of the cotton threads' the title of a tune I haven't learned yet? -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: oil - and for other instruments?l
Almond is still popular for woodwind, and has been for 250 years or more. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: re-conditioning ... (dangers of brass tarnish?)
And gold is amazingly soft, so won't wear well. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: re-conditioning ... (dangers of brass tarnish?)
Brass is not gunmetal. With gunmetal, iron oxide forms a thin airtight layer for a while, protecting the metal underneath, at least till proper rust gets going. With brass, the same is not true for copper and its alloys. So corrosion doesn't prevent further corrosion. Further, the verdigris expands, relative to the metal that was there before, so mechanisms can be jammed. And it looks vile as well. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: A 70 cent divergence
70>66.6... = 2/3 semitone = 1/3 tone. -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Intonation
As many notes on an NSP chanter can be bent about a quarter tone without putting the drones far out - at least on a good reed day - I guess one difference between a good piper and a fairly good one is the former will squeeze notes into tune unconsciously and accurately, the latter consciously and only fairly accurately. I often think of singing the note, so I have an idea of the pitch in my head, to aim for. Listening to the chord with the drones - if these are in tune - also helps with some notes. It is the notes that harmonise with the drones which are most exposed if out of tune, so recognising a just 3rd or whatever tells you you've got there. The singing trick doesn't work so well if you are still thinking equal-tempered, mind. So chords are better. Long notes are good practice for this - I wonder if this is one reason Tom Clough liked playing hymn tunes? 'Oh God our Help in Ages Past' (aka St Anne, or 'The Goldfish') is a good one for this, dead slow. I sometimes use this to see if the drones are 'really' in tune. When I started playing NSP after playing the flute for years, my embouchure would bend to try to bring notes in - ineffective of itself, but I found I was doing something useful as well, as the notes came more into tune (I pinched a non-existent thumbhole to get the top octave on the whistle, as well). That first set I had needed a bit of variable squeezing to bring some notes close to where they should be. Intonation is a mystery on most instruments, and the hardest part to get right. A related issue is tone colour - finger vibrato alters the harmonics of a note substantially, changing the colour a lot; pressure vibrato much less so. Taking a lower finger off the chanter may vary the pitch up or down, so you can use finger vibrato to improve the intonation as well as the colour. Or worsen the intonation, if you use the wrong finger. Knowing which lower finger moves which notes in which direction is something one ought to learn. I tend to use the same finger whatever, if it works. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re:
It might be worth analysing recordings of a good piper or two playing in E minor and in G, to see if they squeeze the B that little bit harder in the minor tunes, to bring it more in tune with the E/B drones. They may not do it consciously, but the B that's a true third above G is a bit below the one a true fifth above E; at least if the fifths from G to D, D to A, and A to E are tuned (almost) justly, which you need for playing in G D and A minor. Squeezing a little harder could easily compensate this. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Doublin' (Keenan & Glackin)
A 70 cent divergence between one set of pipes and another is alarming! More than a third of a tone in old money. We are approaching the territory of that Irish flute player I mentioned. A tactful cull of the outliers might be a good idea - 'Your pipes are more suitable for solo playing' perhaps? -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Doubleday
"only one finger off at a time" is usually read as being about open-fingered ornaments, or the horrible slurred playing some people go in for. No need to make a fetish of it, avoiding vibrato too. I've heard at least 3 excellent close fingered pipers advising using vibrato in places, and never any saying it was a Bad Thing! John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Doubleday
One thing I like about NSP is the way vibrato alters the colour, rather than the volume of a note. You can emphasise higher harmonics this way, and Billy Pigg seemed to use this a lot in The Lark in the Clear Air, for example. As for apples and potatoes - in Cologne they have 'Himmel un Aed' - Heaven and Earth, meaning apple kompott and mashed potatoes served together with eg, Bratwurst. There's a place for both - not necessarily far apart. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Where hast though been all the night?
With me, the addiction only in the severe writing form since I got some NSP in 97 - but I'd been a Peacock addict since Cut and Dry Dolly came out in the 70's, and I bought the facsimile edition which I treasure to this day. Writing set in once I realised Peacock, Bewick and Clough had slowed down of late. Once FARNE let me do comparative playthroughs of different versions, I started collaging to assemble versions with all the good bits in, and before too long I'd got hooked. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: The Golden Eagle
Thanks for the hint, Matt. I went back and found it in Ryan's Mammoth Collection - I'd missed it before. For those that don't know this collection, it was published 'about 1883' in Boston, Mass. The Golden Eagle certainly doesn't sound like it was written too long before that, with all the chromatic bits. But lots of tunes like that were written on both sides of the Atlantic in the mid 19th C. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Will the Barber
Well remembered! It's also a grand tune. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Parnell's March
A way of notating hornpipes that's not too hard to read, and corresponds pretty closely to the actual rhythm I want to play, is alternate dotted and undotted quavers. That is 20/16, unfortunately, but it is the only way I can get Noteworthy to play anything that sounds like a hornpipe. Dotted quavers with semiquavers (a 3:1 ratio) are far too uneven - even triplets in 12/8 (a 2:1 ratio) don't sound like a hornpipe to me. So a 3:2 ratio is about right. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Open competition tunes
Julia, What was set in a competition 15 years ago may no longer be of as much interest as it was then, and is surely going to be a pain to retrieve. But is there a log of what non-set tunes people have actually won with more recently? John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: key springing.
Bob, I know nothing about pipemaking, but in good years there is one nsp event in Scotland (only just) - see [1]http://www.newcastleton.com/intro.html. But the nsp competition will be uncontested if nobody goes there. This has happened some years, I think. John -- References 1. http://www.newcastleton.com/intro.html To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Holy/Holey Halfpenny
Breathnach is a good source of advice here - I recall he said something I'd paraphrase as: "Tune titles are dummy labels for the tunes, without a 'real' meaning of their own. It is futile to enquire about 'The Mason's Apron' whether a stonemason's or freemason's apron is meant." But I'd add that if one found hard evidence it had been written for a Masonic Ball, one might hazard a guess. Such hard evidence is naturally thin on the ground after 2 centuries or more John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP duet with other instruments
In a message dated 07/02/2010 13:39:07 GMT Standard Time, i...@gretton-willems.com writes: But did you know that a recent survey showed that 96.83% of people who say that they "don't like Wagner's operas" have never actually heard or attended one? ;-) Cheers, Paul Gretton Doing it this way saves an awful lot of time! John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Goat to pipe-bag
[1]http://www.answers.com/topic/zampogna-2 says, inter alia, "Traditionally the bags are made from goat hides that are removed from the slaughtered animal in one piece, cured, turned inside out, then tied off just in front of the rear legs, one of the front legs serving to house the blow pipe with its simple leather valve (soffietto), and the other tied off. The typical round stock into which both chanters and drones are fixed goes into the neck of the skin. The hair is left on, and is contained in the inside of the bag (otre)." Good old photo ther, too. John -- References 1. http://www.answers.com/topic/zampogna-2 To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: bag shape
Philip, You wrote:: John's post about Helmholtz resonators seems to suggest that a long narrow neck would cause more (or at least different) resonance problems than a bag where the neck opens out broadly from the narrowest point at the stock, " I did the sum earlier this evening - a bag with a conical neck has the same fundamental frequency (ish) as a bag of the same volume, but a cylindrical neck of the same length, with the same cross-section as halfway along the cone. So the advantage is mainly that you avoid sharp corners. It doesn't move the frequency much. The higher harmonics of the bag resonance will typically be way higher, whatever its shape - experimentally you can check this by blowing the harmonics of a beer bottle. A Newcastle Brown bottle is a good Helmholtz shape, and the 2nd harmonic is a lot higher than the fundamental, while the 3rd and 4th are far higher again -- ear-splitting! Good embouchure practice, and excellent for getting yourself thrown out of places. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Pedantry alert!!
PS 'Inverted' is upside down; inside out is 'everted'. Ask any topologist, or classicist... John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: bag shape
I always understood the point of the open-cell foam in the neck is to remove the neck resonance problem referred to earlier. The frequency of this resonance depends critically on the shape - if you model the bag as a big cavity with a narrow tubular neck,like a bottle, the formula for a Helmholtz resonator applies - see wikipedia for this. The formula will be quantitatively off as the shape doesn't really fit the 'bottle' model well, the neck broadening smoothly into the main cavity. But the order of magnitude should be fairly good. If this frequency falls in the range of the chanter, the chanter notes near this pitch will couple strongly to it and the pitch will be well away from what you would get with the same chanter in a different bag. Killing the bag/neck resonance means the chanter pitches will be truer. As air can flow easily through the foam at low frequencies but not at higher, the rapid oscillation of the bag/neck resonance is damped out, without badly affecting the supply of air to the chanter. I dread to think what clagging the open-cell foam with seasoning would do to the airflow, though... John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP
The pipes and the kingdom belong to different eras - the Northumbrian pipes reached something like their modern form in a similar time and place to the steam locomotive. But they were called 'Northumberland pipes' then, as were their simpler 'unimproved' pre-Peacock version. 'Northumbrian' is now used, confusingly, to refer to any of -the Anglo-Saxon kingdom -the modern county -the modern NE region, from the Tees to the border, never ever specifying which is meant. It is apparently a gross error to do so, though I never understood why John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP
or the difference between a Scottish smallpipe player and a small Scottish pipe player -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Remembering titles
A lyric fragment, sung to the tune, eg 'All the Night I Lay with Jockey in my Arms', or -failing this - a dummy lyric including the title, can help - make up your own examples, as daft ones of your own invention stick better. Remembering the first bar or 2 of the tune, with the sound of yourself announcing it out loud before you start to play it, can help too. Remembering sets of tunes in order like Morpeth Rant/Jock Wilson of Fenton/ Cheviot Rant, or Hesleyside Reel/Roxburgh Castle can peg one to another usefully. But everyone's memory works in a different way - find what works for you. Don't try to learn a whole tunebook full at once - start with 2 or 3 of your favourites. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: From notation to music
The trouble is some think 'reading music' and 'reading music notation' are synonymous - the trick is to read the dots and put the music back into them. I guess the player who can only play from a notated copy she'd just written down, on hearing,, would be a good ear-player if she believed in it. Notation has its uses, particularly in complex music, but the people who can't play unless they are reading are limiting themselves. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: From notation to music
But remembering the words of a speech, writing them down verbatim, then being unable to remember them again without reading the transcript is plain weird -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: schei greiss
Maybe we should sort out the more literal dot-readers with more accurate notation. Notereader makes Hornpipes sound fairly good in 21/16, with dotted and undotted quavers alternating. 12/8 is too jiggy, straight quavers have no pulse, and normal 'dotted 4/4' is lumpier than school custard was. Stuart's ideas on how jigs sound and should be played are more complex yet. A revised edition of the tunebook, Julia?? John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: [nsp] Barrington
Adrian, Your message about a variant of The Barrington read as though it should have had a copy of the tune MS attached, but there was nothing there. Did you forget, or did it get stripped? The list server does strip messages of all attachments - very Buddhist. I'd be interested to see it - I was unaware of any version except the tunebook one. It is a grand tune, and good for beginners - to prove to themselves they aren't beginners anymore. Or that they still are! John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Synthetic key pads
Francis, Is the widespread use of synthetic pads in (mouth blown) orchestral woodwinds nowadays down to the fact that they operate in (often very) moist environments, which would presumably affect leather much more than a water-repellent plastic foam? The bore of NSP is oily, but not moist - so the most obvious advantage of plastic over leather disappears. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: [NSP]website
Makes more sense than 'Hyperacoustics', anyway -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Whinshields thingummy
It's a hornpipe, because J.L. Dunk said it was, and he wrote it; it's a rant because if you play it that way - as everyone does - it makes sense. For more by Dunk, see [1]http://www.archive.org/details/hyperacoustics02dunk John -- References 1. http://www.archive.org/details/hyperacoustics02dunk To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Cut and Dry Dolly
A couple of other meanings in [1]http://www.dsl.ac.uk/ but none that seem to fit the Cut and Dry context convincingly. John -- References 1. http://www.dsl.ac.uk/ To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Cut and Dry - underlay
Perhaps if we take the John Bell version (on FARNE) as the basic tune, the tag at the middle and end of the strain has the rhythm | qq c qq q...| this would fit ...|Cut and Dry Do-ol-ly ...| But you need to stretch the first syllable of Dolly across two notes. These 2 notes do tend to group together as I play them - how would a fiddler bow this bit of the tune? John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Cut and Dry Dolly
Can anyone with access to an OED or a Northumbrian dialect dictionary check this possible meaning of 'dolly' = peat-stack? It would be plausible enough if 'dolly' used to hold this meaning. Though is 'a small peat stack, ready to be taken from the moor for burning' a likely topic for a popular song? Song lyrics, from either side of the Border, (fitting this tune and title, Barry!) would be the clincher - but if they existed, they are probably lost. Occasionally an alternative title will extend or complete a line of a lyric - eg 'All the night I lay with Jockey in my arms'. But here, no version of the title I've seen adds any more words than 'Cut and Dry, Dolly', unfortunately. If it is just a dummy phrase attached to a 'pure' dance tune, of course looking for a lyric is a waste of time... I can't even work out a plausible underlay of the title under the tune that fits, unlike 'All the night..' which fits its tune perfectly. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Cut and Dry Dolly
That article was a good one - not only did it tell me about the existence of other versions of Cut and Dry than Peacock's, (some are on Farne now) but rather successfully proved the point that written traditions are as fluid as oral ones; if a bit slower. But no light on what the title meant - until someone turns up some song lyrics, we are probably left with guesswork as the best way of working out that one. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: [NPS-Discussion] British Library NSP Recordings
A lot of these BL recordings are annotated with helpful titles like 'Unidentified Tune' or 'Hornpipe'. I have identified a couple so far. If anyone can point to a specific recording, and identify the sequence of tunes, I can add a note. Non-UK-academics aren't trusted, apparently. Let alone non-academics John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Halcyon days gone by
The "Most illuminating" was in response to that message of John Dally's beginning, eloquently, "SG93IG5vc3RhbGdpYyBJIGFtIGZvciB0aG9zZSBoYWxjeW9uIGRheXMgb2YgYmxpc3NmdW wgaWdu b3JhbmNlIHdoZW4gdGhlIGdvZHMgb2YgdGhlIE5QUyBkaWQgbm90IGNhc3QgdGh1bmRlciB ib2x0 cyBkb3duIGZyb20gTXQuIE9seW1wdXMgb24gdGhpcyBodW1ibGUgbGl0dGxlIHZpbGxhZ2U gb2Yg YSBuZXdzZ3JvdXAsIGJ1dCByYXRoZXIgYnVzaWVkIHRoZW1zZWx2ZXMgb3JkZXJpbmcgc2l sdmVy..." I don't know if the "References" were added by the mailer or by Dartmouth, though. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Halcyon days gone by
Most illuminating! -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Transposing etc
Are these the guys at Dflat house in Camden? -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Transposing etc
Is there any software available which will input interminable arguments about the Pipers' Society rulebook, and output intelligent discussion about the instrument and its music? John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: nps
Maybe your violin teacher was teaching you classical style along with the good basic violin technique, and the classical style was impeding your traditional style. Two styles can be inconsistent. Doing one well might well mean doing the other badly. A classical violinist might try to play quavers equal, others such as a baroque violinist - or Willy Taylor - definitely wouldn't. But with the nsp, all good players, including Kathryn Tickell and Billy Pigg, have (have had) a largely detached technique, and crux of the argument is a stylistic point as to whether a 'good style' can include open-fingered ornament. If Chris and Adrian are at the 'wee free' end of the spectrum, all good players are some sort of protestant at least. The justification for the 'wee free' position is that if you allow open fingering in some contexts but not others, then bad players (they exist) will take these contentious elements as the basis of their 'style' and ignore the closed-fingered basic technique. If religious analogies are felt inappropriate in this forum, try the Judaean People's Liberation Front instead! John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: re written music
While many NSPers both can play by ear and can read and write music, the main problem is not that nobody writes the music down, but rather, that many players prefer, on hearing a tune in a session or playaround, to ask what book it's in, dig out the notes, and start playing from the dots. Some never seem to learn more than a few basic tunes. So a written tradition can be a hindrance to developing a memory of the repertoire. There is no lack of access to the playing of 'a master' - there is now a vast amount of excellently played pipe music on record. If you don't know what a tune should sound like, you will have more difficulty reading it, let alone learning it. Hardly anyone can expect to sight-read a fast tune like a reel or jig at speed - your mind and fingers need to know how it goes. Accurate notation of grace notes is very good (though sometimes ferociously difficult) as a record of a particular performance - but some musicians are inventive enough not to play things the same way every time - so writing 'the standard' gracing, as in Highland pipe music, would have the same effect as it did there, of fixing what should be fluid, and even fossilising the tradition. John -Original Message- From: Peter Dunn To: Dartmouth N.S.P. site Sent: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 20:17 Subject: [NSP] re written music With regard to the Tom Anderson quote, "Never try to learn a tune you don't already know", as posted by Christopher Birch, I would suggest that it was a comment very much of the time i.e. small, closely-knit communities who were in regular communication with each other and who shared a common cultural and musical history. The problem is that most people today no longer live in this type of community. To only follow this philosophy now would result in a great diservice to the music we love by restricting it to a smaller and ever-aging group of adherants. The result, of course, would be that eventually more and more music would be 'lost' to later generations. I would suggest that those today who desire to perpetrate this so-called 'ideal' are, in fact, also doing our music a great disservice. Those like Vickers, Bewick and others, and indeed the N.P.S., who had the good sense to recognise that unless tunes were captured in some sort of permanent medium, they would eventually be lost, as those who knew them became unable to pass them on orally, have ensured that these tunes were able to be passed on for all time. As for the written score, its first value is to record. What it cannot do is to demonstrate the interpretation of the music (although the adoption of more rigorous marking of, for instance, grace notes would help). For this, there is no better teacher than being able to listen to a master demonstrating his playing. As this is not always possible in today's more dispersed society, then we must rely on the score. There is a posibility that this may lead to the genre evolving over time. Is this an altogether bad thing? The purist may think so, but I would suggest that there is no such thing as a 'pure' tradition. All music evolves over time, not the least because of improvements to the actual instruments, but also in regard to tempering, changing tastes, the influence of other genres and, especially in the case of our music, music from other regions (e.g. Scottish music). It is noticeable how tunes in Matt Seatle's masterly reproduction of Vicker's collection have changed considerably since first collected. So, should there be a conflict between those who hold that only known tunes should be learnt or that tunes can only be passed on orally, or indeed that this is the only or best way to preserve them? Surely, the two traditions-oral and written- should compliment each other, both working together to ensure that our Northumbrian heritage is both preserved for future generations and made available to the widest possible audience. Peter Dunn -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
[NSP] Re: Reel of Tullochgorum
Printing does give a mirror image, so unless the artist flips it in his head, that's what you get. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Reel of Tullochgorum
In a message dated 14/01/2009 00:24:15 GMT Standard Time, richard.hea...@tiscali.co.uk writes: http://nms.scran.ac.uk/database/record.php?usi=000-000-579-620-C UP chanter all right, on the knee, but more like BP drones? The artist doesn't show what the tune looked like though! -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Reel of t
SMM has the strathspey tune - see [1]http://www.burnsscotland.com/database/record.php?usi=000-000-499-837 -C&PHPSESSID=mogu4k310q5f4sje49tpggju04&scache=1i8i6q4yll&searchdb=scra n -- References 1. http://www.burnsscotland.com/database/record.php?usi=000-000-499-837-C&PHPSESSID=mogu4k310q5f4sje49tpggju04&scache=1i8i6q4yll&searchdb=scran To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Reel of t
Are you saying these words 'Come gie's a sang Montgomery cried ...' fit the 'Reel of Tullochgorum' tune (they do) or the ex-strathspey that's found in Peacock (they fit that too). The difference between gobstopper and tomato soup is obscured by the stress of the verse. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Jimmy Allan traditional (?)
The first page Google turned up on 'And they call I Buttercup Joe' said: The words of this music hall song were published in the National Prize Medal Song Book in 1872, and they also appear in an undated copy in the Firth collection in the Bodleian Library, which provides the additional information 'Sung by Harry Garratt, the favourite comic'. More recent than Blaydon Races, then. But Google is relatively uninformative on Jimmy Allen, mostly as there are so many people of that name around still. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Starting point
The two books NSP1 and the Charlton Memorial book are a good overview of the repertoire - what people actually played - as seen in the mid-20th century. The Peacock collection does the same job for the beginning of the 19th, and so contains a higher proportion of purpose-built smallpipe tunes. If you can find a copy, Matt's edition of Bewick's MS does a similar job for a couple of decades after Peacock, so more aimed at keyed rather than keyless chanters. There is a fair proportion of tunes imported from Scotland - judging from the Vickers fiddle book, this has always been the case so near the border. But many sit well on the smallpipes. Some of the imported and recently composed tunes in the later books NSP2 and 3 don't suit the pipes so well, not really needing drones at all. I would advise beginners to start with NSP1 and Charlton, then graduate to the Peacock tunes early on. Besides being excellent music, they are also the best tunes for learning a precise technique. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: An ear for drone music
Good point John Dally made - perhaps this explains why there's such a split in repertoires? If you like the effect of drone harmony you will like Peacock, Bewick, Clough tunes - but if the drones are just something you tune to the tonic and dominant, then forget about, you prefer tunes with more modern harmonies - whether or not they fit the drones -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Concert pitch V traditional pitch
Rob's calculation isn't that sensitive to whether the current standard 'traditional' G is taken 20, 25 or even 30 cents above concert F - repeating it with this range of values only varies the pitch by a couple of Hz - within the typical range of fluctuations anyway John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP music for a funeral
Nobody has yet mentioned 'Fairly, fairly, fairly shot of her, buried my wife and danced on top of her' -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Peacock's Wylam Away
There is something similar in the 1st half bar of Keelman Ower Land. There it is dc/B/A/G, with the NM version putting a triplet on the c/B/A/, to get the time right, but making it harder to play. I feel dc/B/A/G/ is likelier. It would be easy in a MS to not quite take the second beam on the semiquavers far enough. So such typos are common. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Learning to tune drones
In a message dated 18/11/2007 11:58:54 GMT Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: http://www.milecastle27.co.uk/simulator/ Rob, Well done! A very useful & instructive widget - installing the soundbank was a bit terrifying, but I managed once I started reading the instructions - doing what they said was the difficult bit, mind... I can now tune the simulator to Gdg, so all remaining errors & bugs are my own. Now you need to get a colour button for real pipes as well as the simulator John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Practice
In a message dated 11/06/2007 20:29:19 GMT Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: http://www.chrisormston.pwp.blueyonder.co.uk/exercises.htm Chris, Many thanks for the pdf of these - I recall you taking us through them at Halsway once, and as long as I was using them for practice, the effect on my technique was noticeable. But good habits never last long... Another pattern which Adrian mentioned at the London session last week was a little weirder: ||:GgAf Becd | dceB fAgG |GgAf Becd | dceB fAgG :|| Francis pointed out it sounds like change-ringing if you get it right. Good, if rather extreme, practice for those tunes where there are 2 interleaved lines. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: G set
Klaus, If you want to play tunes in concert G and D, with a compass between D and b, with the simplest possible fingerings (holes rather than keys) then a G chanter is certainly what you need. If you use a D chanter you will have more range for playing notes below this compass, but will lose range at the top - only going up to (real) f sharp typically. You don't want to use overblowing! D chanters sound wonderful, but aren't what you need for playing along with others. G chanters can sound a bit shrill, and are fiddly to cover the holes properly (think of a sopranino recorder). So if you get the chance to try before you buy, do so. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Practice and Exercises
Exactly - just the melodic motifs that are used to build the variations in Peacock. Things like BAGABG or G2 BcdB or, building into an exercise... GABG ABcA BcdB cdec defd efge g4 If you can play the Peacock variations fluently, you are doing fine. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Practice
There's a story of a piper (Billy Pigg??) not being allowed to learn the Barrington hornpipe till he'd mastered the relevant exercises, then he could play it at once - one of these must have been a passage of parallel 6ths as in the 2nd strain - maybe another for the semiquaver turn. Add some arpeggio figures, and you have most of the tune. But if you can play Peacock patterns you're a long way there. Taking a tune apart into the different motifs that make it up, practising these, and then playing the tune 'reassembled' is a good discipline, but of course I'm too lazy, and not a football fan. Exam invigilation is ok for silent fingering practice on a biro though. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Highland Cathedral
---1178654244 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In principle Nancy was right. But since it has been sitting in my BP library bag for aeons, only played once, here's a scan to clog up your hard discs with. Perhaps you can enjoy not playing it, as well. John ---1178654244 Content-Type: text/html; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable In principle Nancy was right. But since it has been sitting in my BP library bag for aeons, only played once, here's a scan to clog up your hard discs with. Perhaps you can enjoy not playing it, as well. John ---1178654244-- -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: German word
_www.bagpipe.de_ (http://www.bagpipe.de) says 'Bordunen' John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: c# crow
As an ex-physicist, my starting point for designing a G chanter would be to reduce every linear dimension (bore, hole spacing, reed length, reed thickness) of an F chanter by 10%, or for a D chanter, to increase by 20%. I would aim to raise the crow pitch by just under a tone or just over a minor third. Other solutions would be possible, but they would sound different. My G chanter works fine, but it has a very different tone from the F chanter, as do most G chanters I have heard. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: c# crow
It does seem a bit odd that a G chanter and F chanter have reeds crowing at different notes, a third apart, and of significantly different sizes, but the same reed works in a D and F chanter - is there some compensation in the designs of the chanters? Or am I wrong? John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Trad V Classical ?
Steve's 'say a string quartet plus Ms Tickell with a more traditional scoring,...' and Max's KT + string quartet plus double bass, with the smallpipes mostly alternating as soloist with a cor anglais, are not that different. A myth seems to be going around that the smallpipes were pitted against a huge symphony orchestra. Also how can one person regard the piece as just a couple of notches above Disney, while someone else thinks it's excessively modernist? Were they not listening to the same piece, or just not listening? John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Kettletoft Inn
It's a good piece, but not really drone music. Max did at least write a piece which was properly tonal, unlike a lot he does. The traditional music he hears most of is in Orkney, so expecting it to sound Northumbrian is perhaps a bit hopeful. But the slow movement was beautiful. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Kathryn Tickell on Radio 3
Regular readers will know I'm not a fan of KT's usual playing style, but Max has got some good piping out of her. Some of the crispest rapid staccato I've ever heard her play. Some open fingered trills too, mind - are they Max's or hers, or did they agree on them? The piece is good to listen to - but Max didn't attempt to stick to a Northumbrian style - what traditional elements there are come from Orkney. At least with this he has accepted the necessity with NSP of working within the range of the pipes - the harmonics in his 'Cross Lane Fair' were very unhappy. Cor anglais playing with NSP gives a blend of sounds worth hearing again, and perhaps this is enough justify the piece. The mic placement was maybe a problem - but string quartet, cor anglais and double bass can make quite a loud noise together if the players have to - NSP is stuck with a steady mf. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] (no subject)
The BBC Radio 3 website is up and running again - one can listen to Peter Maxwell Davies' piece 'Kettletoft Inn' for NSP, cor anglais, string quartet and double bass at _http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/performanceon3/pip/vbngm/_ (http://www.bbc.co.uk/radio3/performanceon3/pip/vbngm/) but probably only today tomorrow and perhaps Friday. No comment on her style this time... John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Rothbury rules
I must say that some of the best competition music I ever heard at Rothbury was a variation set that should have been disqualified if the rules had been enforced - on the other hand, last year's smallpipe competition, when the rules were strictly applied, was relatively unsatisfying - there wasn't enough space for the best players to express themselves fully. If the a bad rule is not enforced, a player who complies feels unfairly treated; if it is enforced, the audience hear worse music. The solution is to change the rules. Is the venue only available for a short time slot, or is the rule only there for uniformity? There is no musical justification. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: boring discovery
I superglue the cotton bud to a bamboo skewer - it does the job nicely. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] smallpipe choyte
Just to tell you that 'smallpipe choyte' was a googleblast just now. What usually happens is that everyone lists any observed googleblast on a website, so if you want to see an example of this rare phenomenon, google it now. Almost unheard of to achieve it with related words, and hard enough with unrelated words - 'Alembicated zygospore' used to be one. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: choyters choice
Maybe the Pipes of all nations 78 should be released - with a health warning! I have never had the privilege of hearing it, though I have heard some remarkable and memorable attempts by people who don't normally play in that way. The next war will probably be over how such a warning should be phrased John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] New Highland Laddie
Not much help in playing the variations, but the words of this broadside ballad fit Peacock's tune. _http://www.nls.uk/broadsides/broadside.cfm/id/15803_ (http://www.nls.uk/broadsides/broadside.cfm/id/15803) John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: NSP Birl?
So the debate has moved on from why highland graces are a bad idea, to the question of which ones you can do. I suppose they aren't technically bad piping if the chanter is properly closed between each note & the next, but the idea does sound a bit wrong-headed. Is this what the instrument is for? Next, can you play cranns on a xylophone? John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Peacocks notation
Note - 'My Ain Kind Dearie' = 'The Lea Rigges' is a fiddle tune originally.
So the articulation marks are likely copied after some 'primarily fiddle'
source. I would read the slurred passages as 'poco staccato', and the read the
long slurred runs as phrasings - shorten the last note to separate it clearly
from what follows. But never slur any note into the next.
The first half of bar 1, for example, {G/A/}BD .D.E , I would play the {GA}
grace very staccato. The B I would play near maximum length, and both D's a
bit short. But never lose sight of the phrasing of the tune - it's the air of
a song.
I would read 'slurred' ornaments like in the next bar, {G/A/B/}A>B/
c/B/A/G/ with each of the {G/A/B/} staccato, but try to play them as a unit,
belonging to the A that follows.
The last bar but one, and the bar 4 bars earlier, have a passage B/A/ G/F/
G/D/E/F/. The 2nd time each pair of notes is written slurred, the 1st time
not. The slurred pairs I would try to lengthen the first to near full length,
shorten the second to separate from the next pair. When unslurred I would try
to play more even separate semiquavers, to bring out the contrast.
John
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[NSP] (no subject)
>From her website: =A9 2001 Kathryn Tickell A _lazy grace_ (http://www.lazygrace.com/) production My point exactly John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: penguin cafe etc
Steve, Not a thin root, but the stem cetainly narrowed down rather drastically in the 60's. The remarkable thing is that the plant is now in a much healthier state than for many years, (not just many more pipers, but more good ones than there have been at any time since the war? Depends who you count!) and the link to the roots of the tradition seems much more secure now since the Clough MSS, Bewick etc have been published. I wholly agree that the difficulty (and the aim) in a wholly-closed style is maintaining the rhythmic flow, and letting the tunes sing. Tom Clough and Chris Ormston have proved it can be done. For us mortals it is harder. Perhaps I should practise... John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: staccato
Dave, A lot of these markings (not all) appear in the extended range tunes - presumably transcribed/adapted fiddle tunes, and may be copieded from fiddle articulations. Any known sources, Matt? In the obvious pipe tunes, say Meggy's Foot, it is still possible to get a gradation between staccatissimo/staccato/ poco staccato/tenuto, (explained to me once as respectively 'pip', 'pop', 'pom', and 'pah' ) and play the notes without actually slurring anything. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin cafe n' that
Steve, You said "We now condemn "choyting" but it is only wth the advent of the millenium that we were told we were doing wrong!" Well, only then did we learn the word for it, but I think the idea "staccato=good, slurred=bad" was fairly well established, with some stylistic variants, more or less continuously. Even KT has been known to follow this rule when she feels like it! I think the 'fundamentalism' you refer to is a natural consequence of the scholarship and hard work of Chris, Matt and others over the last decade or two - instead of having to reinvent a 'possibly authentic' style, we have a rather clearer idea of what the real thing is. Whether it is a style worth aiming for is a matter of taste * . But if someone like Kathryn plays in a choyting style (or worse - remember Ryofu!!!) it is up to them to justify what their predecessors would have regarded as bad playing. As it is, this weekend I've had to defend my right to hold a critical opinion. John * Mencken - 'It's a matter of taste - some people think that's good architecture, and some people know better' -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin Cafe Choyting
John, You are right about Auntie. Maybe I should put a 'Your 3' into Late Junction? As for Kathryn, my opinion when I first heard her (long before I was a piper) was that she had ferocious technique, but was a bit flash, and too fast. I thought she would settle down and become a fine and tasteful musician. Unfortunately commercial pressures lead her to produce too many tracks like that one, and too many people who listen to her think that anyone who criticises her is the one with the problem. Whether it is herself or Auntie Beeb has given her that monopoly position, she has a responsibility to the tradition, and she isn't living up to that. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin cafe n' that
No - are you? -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin cafe n' that
Calling people names is one thing, though I withdrew that comment; calling them Nazis, because they hold different opinions to yourself, is a sight worse. If she can't or won't (won't, in her case) play properly at least her fans should accept another's right to have an opinion about it. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin Cafe Choyting
John, Have a listen to a bit of it at _http://www.last.fm/music/Penguin+Cafe+Orchestra/_/Organum_ (http://www.last.fm/music/Penguin+Cafe+Orchestra/_/Organum) +++ if you want to know what the fuss is about. It's a nice composition, as far as I can tell from a 30" clip, but a fine example of piping style it isn't. If an oboe had been used instead of NSP it would still be a pleasant sound, and oboists would be wondering whether the player had no tongue. The trouble is, when a piper is as successful and well-known as she is, and plays in such an untraditional way, newcomers to the instrument will get the idea that's what NSP ought to sound like. It isn't. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin Cafe Choyting
Edwin, I'll refer you to the original email. Don't recall ever reading that one though John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin Cafe Choyting
I didn't get the 'gutter press' reference either - unless they've started serialising the Mr Men books in the Sun! All the best, John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: Penguin Cafe Orchestra
I listened to the clip. Nice music, but not what I would call good piping. The open fingered trills grate a bit, and the staccato was damn near nonexistent! Whom am I slagging off? Oh, it's Ms Tickle John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
[NSP] Re: streching tunes and pushing pitches
Not only is Audacity (fairly) easy to use to slow down or shift the pitch of a tune, so (e.g.)Chris Ormston's 'I Saw my Love' can be brought down to F and a bit from F#, and reduced to mortal speed, but you can zoom in to see exactly how staccato the notes are - better than mine, for sure. It doesn't cost $50 either. For fun you can also try playing the track backwards etc. Worth trying once. John -- To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html
