Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Christian Schneider]

Logging in java always reminds me of this comic strip:
https://xkcd.com/927/

Christian

On 20.04.2017 14:03, Christian Schneider wrote:
So to fight the multiple logging frameworks problem we add another one 



I understand, that the logging initialization with a static factory is 
a bad pattern in OSGi ... but as we have so much code out there that 
already uses this I think we could as well just leave the situation 
like it is now.
Pax-logging for example is not really nice code when it comes to 
providing the bridge to existing logging frameworks but as we will 
still need it for lots of libraries we will not get rid of it anyway.


Christian

On 20.04.2017 12:44, Cristiano Gavião wrote:


If you read the proposed spec, they won't tie to SLF4J. OSGi will 
have an own set of classes (as already they have) with methods and 
factories *based* on the style existent in SLF4J and will not use 
slf4j-api.


The https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi 
 is aimed to be just a binding 
implementation for those projects that uses slf4j's static binding, 
but it will redirect all log entries to new osgi services...  you can 
build you own too :)


I'm one of those that would use DS-managed Loggers for new projects 
when creating service classes... but I'll still use the static logger 
for non-service classes.




--
Christian Schneider
http://www.liquid-reality.de

Open Source Architect
http://www.talend.com



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http://www.liquid-reality.de

Open Source Architect
http://www.talend.com

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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Christian Schneider]

So to fight the multiple logging frameworks problem we add another one 

I understand, that the logging initialization with a static factory is a 
bad pattern in OSGi ... but as we have so much code out there that 
already uses this I think we could as well just leave the situation like 
it is now.
Pax-logging for example is not really nice code when it comes to 
providing the bridge to existing logging frameworks but as we will still 
need it for lots of libraries we will not get rid of it anyway.


Christian

On 20.04.2017 12:44, Cristiano Gavião wrote:


If you read the proposed spec, they won't tie to SLF4J. OSGi will have 
an own set of classes (as already they have) with methods and 
factories *based* on the style existent in SLF4J and will not use 
slf4j-api.


The https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi 
 is aimed to be just a binding 
implementation for those projects that uses slf4j's static binding, 
but it will redirect all log entries to new osgi services...  you can 
build you own too :)


I'm one of those that would use DS-managed Loggers for new projects 
when creating service classes... but I'll still use the static logger 
for non-service classes.




--
Christian Schneider
http://www.liquid-reality.de

Open Source Architect
http://www.talend.com

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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Cristiano Gavião]

If you read the proposed spec, they won't tie to SLF4J. OSGi will have 
an own set of classes (as already they have) with methods and factories 
*based* on the style existent in SLF4J and will not use slf4j-api.


The https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi 
 is aimed to be just a binding 
implementation for those projects that uses slf4j's static binding, but 
it will redirect all log entries to new osgi services...  you can build 
you own too :)


I'm one of those that would use DS-managed Loggers for new projects when 
creating service classes... but I'll still use the static logger for 
non-service classes.



On 19/04/2017 21:23, Matt Sicker wrote:
I'm not a fan of tying the logging service to SLF4J. See our FAQ entry 
for comparison with Log4j 2.x: 
. Really, 
I don't think OSGi should be defining a logging API, but instead 
should be providing a vendor-neutral service to activate whatever 
backend is desired by the user. I can't imagine that many users will 
switch to DS-managed Loggers instead of obtaining them the same exact 
way they've always gotten them: LoggerFactory or LogManager.


On 19 April 2017 at 14:59, Cristiano Gavião > wrote:


Hello BJ, finally I had a time to look into this.


On 06/04/2017 15:58, BJ Hargrave wrote:

Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi
 which holds an slf4j binding
to the new Log Service.

I looked into this code, butI just read here
https://www.slf4j.org/codes.html#loggerNameMismatch
 that static
binding is deprecated.

From the next version of SLF4J (1.8.x) forward they are going to
use poor java's ServiceLoader

mechanism. :(



It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are
not in the draft spec so you can see

https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf


for some more detail/background on the change.


I liked it a lot !
One question about Logger Admin and Logger Context.

I'm wondering... How would be they behaviour when used with scoped
Subsystems(composite/application)?

how would be the best approach in order to create an exclusive
root context for each isolated hierarchy ? one instance of Logger
Admin for each scoped subsystem?

best,

Cristiano




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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Matt Sicker]

I'm not a fan of tying the logging service to SLF4J. See our FAQ entry for
comparison with Log4j 2.x: <
https://logging.apache.org/log4j/2.x/faq.html#api-tradeoffs>. Really, I
don't think OSGi should be defining a logging API, but instead should be
providing a vendor-neutral service to activate whatever backend is desired
by the user. I can't imagine that many users will switch to DS-managed
Loggers instead of obtaining them the same exact way they've always gotten
them: LoggerFactory or LogManager.

On 19 April 2017 at 14:59, Cristiano Gavião  wrote:

> Hello BJ, finally I had a time to look into this.
>
> On 06/04/2017 15:58, BJ Hargrave wrote:
>
>
> Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j binding
> to the new Log Service.
>
> I looked into this code, butI just read here https://www.slf4j.org/codes.
> html#loggerNameMismatch that static binding is deprecated.
>
> From the next version of SLF4J (1.8.x) forward they are going to use poor
> java's ServiceLoader
> 
> mechanism. :(
>
>
> It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the
> draft spec so you can see https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/
> rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf for some more detail/background on
> the change.
>
> I liked it a lot !
> One question about Logger Admin and Logger Context.
>
> I'm wondering... How would be they behaviour when used with scoped
> Subsystems(composite/application)?
>
> how would be the best approach in order to create an exclusive root
> context for each isolated hierarchy ? one instance of Logger Admin for each
> scoped subsystem?
>
> best,
>
> Cristiano
>
>
>
> ___
> OSGi Developer Mail List
> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>



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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Cristiano Gavião]

Hello BJ, finally I had a time to look into this.


On 06/04/2017 15:58, BJ Hargrave wrote:
Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j 
binding to the new Log Service.
I looked into this code, butI just read here 
https://www.slf4j.org/codes.html#loggerNameMismatch that static binding 
is deprecated.


From the next version of SLF4J (1.8.x) forward they are going to use 
poor java's ServiceLoader 
 
mechanism. :(



It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in 
the draft spec so you can see 
https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf 
for some more detail/background on the change.


I liked it a lot !
One question about Logger Admin and Logger Context.

I'm wondering... How would be they behaviour when used with scoped 
Subsystems(composite/application)?


how would be the best approach in order to create an exclusive root 
context for each isolated hierarchy ? one instance of Logger Admin for 
each scoped subsystem?


best,

Cristiano



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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Cristiano Gavião]

Thanks BJ, I will take a better look on them this weekend.

regards,

Cristiano


On 06/04/2017 15:58, BJ Hargrave wrote:
It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in 
the draft spec so you can see 
https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf 
for some more detail/background on the change.
Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j 
binding to the new Log Service.

--

BJ Hargrave
Senior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781
OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788
hargr...@us.ibm.com

- Original message -
From: Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.org
To: OSGi Developer Mail List <osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org>
Cc:
    Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt
Date: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM
As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton
like in SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi
context. If it's yet another static factory, then I'd promote the
use of Log4j2 instead as we don't need yet another logging facade.
On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião <cvgav...@gmail.com
<mailto:cvgav...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Hello,

I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.

I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory
and Logger.

could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not
importing/extending interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?

If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as
a service, but I wondering, it would be possible toobtain a
Logger from the factory statically as well as we do when using
sfl4j/logback on non-service classes?

thanks,

Cristiano

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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[BJ Hargrave]

If you have any comments on and RFC or spec draft, please make them in the OSGi public bugzilla system as requested in the documents. Thanks.
--BJ HargraveSenior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788hargr...@us.ibm.com
 
 
- Original message -From: Simon Spero Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.orgTo: OSGi Developer Mail List Cc:Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubtDate: Fri, Apr 7, 2017 11:41 AM 
On Apr 7, 2017 5:58 AM, "Neil Bartlett"  wrote:

The draft specification repeatedly mentions SLF4J and supports it explicitly. Log4j is an implementation that can be used behind SLF4J.
 
So… what’s missing?
 
I have some actual comments (from  RFC) 
 
1. Deprecation annotations  on LogListener and LogReaderService (also class @Deprecated on LogService). 
 
2. Marker interface  (and appropriate methods on Logger) 
 
3. On Logger, add generic isEnabled(LogLevel) and log(LogLevel, Blah blah) methods. Hate that this isn't exposed by slf4j api. 
 
4. Allow non-fqdn Logger names. Could support hierarchy,  or could force parent to ROOT. 
 
5. Allow Loggers to be selected using a filter.
 
6. Provide specification for pre-bundle logging for frameworks. (maybe) 
 
Simon
 
P.S. 
  Any estimate of what percentage of hosted fragments are guests of slf4j? 
 
 
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[BJ Hargrave]

The spec wont be "codifying SLF4J". It will work with slf4j as shows in the github project and uses principles from slf4j.
--BJ HargraveSenior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788hargr...@us.ibm.com
 
 
- Original message -From: Matt Sicker Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.orgTo: OSGi Developer Mail List Cc:Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubtDate: Fri, Apr 7, 2017 11:06 AM 
Log4j is also a logging API besides an implementation with numerous advantages to SLF4J. By codifying SLF4J in the standard, I feel that this unnecessarily limits the log service API.
 
On 7 April 2017 at 04:58, Neil Bartlett  wrote:

The draft specification repeatedly mentions SLF4J and supports it explicitly. Log4j is an implementation that can be used behind SLF4J.
 
So… what’s missing?
 
On 6 Apr 2017, at 22:25, Matt Sicker  wrote: 

I'm honestly surprised that there was no collaboration between SLF4J or Log4j about this considering most implementations of the service will end up delegating to Log4j2 or Logback most likely (see pax-logging for example).
 
On 6 April 2017 at 13:58, BJ Hargrave  wrote:

It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the draft spec so you can see https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf for some more detail/background on the change.
 
 
Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j binding to the new Log Service.
--BJ HargraveSenior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788hargr...@us.ibm.com
 
 
- Original message -From: Matt Sicker Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.orgTo: OSGi Developer Mail List Cc:Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubtDate: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM 
As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we don't need yet another logging facade.
 
On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião  wrote:

Hello,I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not importing/extending interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a service, but I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from the factory statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on non-service classes?thanks,Cristiano___OSGi Developer Mail Listosgi-dev@mail.osgi.orghttps://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev 

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___OSGi Developer Mail Listosgi-dev@mail.osgi.orghttps://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Simon Spero]

On Apr 7, 2017 5:58 AM, "Neil Bartlett"  wrote:

The draft specification repeatedly mentions SLF4J and supports it
explicitly. Log4j is an implementation that can be used behind SLF4J.

So… what’s missing?


I have some actual comments (from  RFC)

1. Deprecation annotations  on LogListener and LogReaderService (also class
@Deprecated on LogService).

2. Marker interface  (and appropriate methods on Logger)

3. On Logger, add generic isEnabled(LogLevel) and log(LogLevel, Blah blah)
methods. Hate that this isn't exposed by slf4j api.

4. Allow non-fqdn Logger names. Could support hierarchy,  or could force
parent to ROOT.

5. Allow Loggers to be selected using a filter.

6. Provide specification for pre-bundle logging for frameworks. (maybe)

Simon

P.S.
  Any estimate of what percentage of hosted fragments are guests of slf4j?
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Matt Sicker]

Log4j is also a logging API besides an implementation with numerous
advantages to SLF4J. By codifying SLF4J in the standard, I feel that this
unnecessarily limits the log service API.

On 7 April 2017 at 04:58, Neil Bartlett <njbartl...@gmail.com> wrote:

> The draft specification repeatedly mentions SLF4J and supports it
> explicitly. Log4j is an implementation that can be used behind SLF4J.
>
> So… what’s missing?
>
> On 6 Apr 2017, at 22:25, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I'm honestly surprised that there was no collaboration between SLF4J or
> Log4j about this considering most implementations of the service will end
> up delegating to Log4j2 or Logback most likely (see pax-logging for
> example).
>
> On 6 April 2017 at 13:58, BJ Hargrave <hargr...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>
>> It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the
>> draft spec so you can see https://github.com/osgi/design
>> /blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf for some more
>> detail/background on the change.
>>
>>
>> Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j binding
>> to the new Log Service.
>> --
>>
>> BJ Hargrave
>> Senior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781
>> <(386)%20848-1781>
>> OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788
>> <(386)%20848-3788>
>> hargr...@us.ibm.com
>>
>>
>>
>> - Original message -
>> From: Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>> Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.org
>> To: OSGi Developer Mail List <osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org>
>> Cc:
>> Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt
>> Date: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM
>>
>> As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in
>> SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet
>> another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we
>> don't need yet another logging facade.
>>
>> On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião <cvgav...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>> I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.
>>
>> I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.
>>
>> could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not
>> importing/extending interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?
>>
>> If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a
>> service, but I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from
>> the factory statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on
>> non-service classes?
>>
>> thanks,
>>
>> Cristiano
>>
>> ___
>> OSGi Developer Mail List
>> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>> ___
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>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Neil Bartlett]

The draft specification repeatedly mentions SLF4J and supports it explicitly. 
Log4j is an implementation that can be used behind SLF4J.

So… what’s missing?

> On 6 Apr 2017, at 22:25, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> I'm honestly surprised that there was no collaboration between SLF4J or Log4j 
> about this considering most implementations of the service will end up 
> delegating to Log4j2 or Logback most likely (see pax-logging for example).
> 
> On 6 April 2017 at 13:58, BJ Hargrave <hargr...@us.ibm.com 
> <mailto:hargr...@us.ibm.com>> wrote:
> It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the 
> draft spec so you can see 
> https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf
>  
> <https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf>
>  for some more detail/background on the change.
>  
>  
> Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi 
> <https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi> which holds an slf4j binding to the new 
> Log Service.
> --
> 
> BJ Hargrave
> Senior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781 
> <tel:(386)%20848-1781>
> OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788 
> <tel:(386)%20848-3788>
> hargr...@us.ibm.com <mailto:hargr...@us.ibm.com>
>  
>  
> - Original message -
> From: Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com <mailto:boa...@gmail.com>>
> Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.org 
> <mailto:osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.org>
> To: OSGi Developer Mail List <osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org 
> <mailto:osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org>>
> Cc:
> Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt
> Date: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM
>  
> As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in 
> SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet 
> another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we 
> don't need yet another logging facade.
>  
> On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião <cvgav...@gmail.com 
> <mailto:cvgav...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.
> 
> I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.
> 
> could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not importing/extending 
> interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?
> 
> If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a service, but 
> I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from the factory 
> statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on non-service classes?
> 
> thanks,
> 
> Cristiano
> 
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>  
> --
> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com <mailto:boa...@gmail.com>>
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>  
> 
> 
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com <mailto:boa...@gmail.com>>
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Robert Munteanu]

 Hi Matt,

On Fri, Apr 7, 2017 at 3:06 AM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Actually, after looking at the list of who makes up the main OSGi Alliance,
> I'm not surprised. I am surprised, however, that Apache is not part of the
> OSGi Alliance despite hosting like half of the open source OSGi projects out
> there.

The Apache Software Foundation is a shell for projects and does not
involve itself in technical matters. See http://apache.org/foundation/
for more details.

As a matter of fact, there are ASF committers and members part of the
OSGi alliance. Any interested individuals are welcome to join and - to
my knowledge - input related to the specifications can be offered
without being a member of the OSGi alliance.

Robert

(with no formal participation in the OSGi alliance)

>
> On 6 April 2017 at 16:25, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> I'm honestly surprised that there was no collaboration between SLF4J or
>> Log4j about this considering most implementations of the service will end up
>> delegating to Log4j2 or Logback most likely (see pax-logging for example).
>>
>> On 6 April 2017 at 13:58, BJ Hargrave <hargr...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the
>>> draft spec so you can see
>>> https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf
>>> for some more detail/background on the change.
>>>
>>>
>>> Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j binding
>>> to the new Log Service.
>>> --
>>>
>>> BJ Hargrave
>>> Senior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781
>>> OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788
>>> hargr...@us.ibm.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original message -
>>> From: Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>>> Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.org
>>> To: OSGi Developer Mail List <osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org>
>>> Cc:
>>> Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt
>>> Date: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM
>>>
>>> As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in
>>> SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet
>>> another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we
>>> don't need yet another logging facade.
>>>
>>> On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião <cvgav...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hello,
>>>
>>> I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.
>>>
>>> I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.
>>>
>>> could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not
>>> importing/extending interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?
>>>
>>> If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a service,
>>> but I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from the factory
>>> statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on non-service classes?
>>>
>>> thanks,
>>>
>>> Cristiano
>>>
>>> ___
>>> OSGi Developer Mail List
>>> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
>>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>>> ___
>>> OSGi Developer Mail List
>>> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
>>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ___
>>> OSGi Developer Mail List
>>> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
>>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>
>
>
>
> --
> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>
> ___
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Matt Sicker]

Actually, after looking at the list of who makes up the main OSGi Alliance,
I'm not surprised. I am surprised, however, that Apache is not part of the
OSGi Alliance despite hosting like half of the open source OSGi projects
out there.

On 6 April 2017 at 16:25, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'm honestly surprised that there was no collaboration between SLF4J or
> Log4j about this considering most implementations of the service will end
> up delegating to Log4j2 or Logback most likely (see pax-logging for
> example).
>
> On 6 April 2017 at 13:58, BJ Hargrave <hargr...@us.ibm.com> wrote:
>
>> It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the
>> draft spec so you can see https://github.com/osgi/design
>> /blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf for some more
>> detail/background on the change.
>>
>>
>> Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j binding
>> to the new Log Service.
>> --
>>
>> BJ Hargrave
>> Senior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781
>> <(386)%20848-1781>
>> OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788
>> <(386)%20848-3788>
>> hargr...@us.ibm.com
>>
>>
>>
>> - Original message -----
>> From: Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>> Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.org
>> To: OSGi Developer Mail List <osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org>
>> Cc:
>> Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt
>> Date: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM
>>
>> As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in
>> SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet
>> another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we
>> don't need yet another logging facade.
>>
>> On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião <cvgav...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hello,
>> I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.
>>
>> I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.
>>
>> could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not
>> importing/extending interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?
>>
>> If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a
>> service, but I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from
>> the factory statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on
>> non-service classes?
>>
>> thanks,
>>
>> Cristiano
>>
>> ___
>> OSGi Developer Mail List
>> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>> ___
>> OSGi Developer Mail List
>> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
>> OSGi Developer Mail List
>> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
>> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
>



-- 
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Matt Sicker]

I'm honestly surprised that there was no collaboration between SLF4J or
Log4j about this considering most implementations of the service will end
up delegating to Log4j2 or Logback most likely (see pax-logging for
example).

On 6 April 2017 at 13:58, BJ Hargrave <hargr...@us.ibm.com> wrote:

> It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the
> draft spec so you can see https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/
> rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf for some more detail/background on
> the change.
>
>
> Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j binding
> to the new Log Service.
> --
>
> BJ Hargrave
> Senior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781
> <(386)%20848-1781>
> OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788
> <(386)%20848-3788>
> hargr...@us.ibm.com
>
>
>
> - Original message -
> From: Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
> Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.org
> To: OSGi Developer Mail List <osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org>
> Cc:
> Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt
> Date: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM
>
> As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in
> SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet
> another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we
> don't need yet another logging facade.
>
> On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião <cvgav...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hello,
> I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.
>
> I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.
>
> could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not importing/extending
> interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?
>
> If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a service,
> but I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from the factory
> statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on non-service classes?
>
> thanks,
>
> Cristiano
>
> ___
> OSGi Developer Mail List
> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>
>
>
> --
> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
> ___
> OSGi Developer Mail List
> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>
>
>
>
> ___
> OSGi Developer Mail List
> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>



-- 
Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com>
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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[BJ Hargrave]

It is indeed a service. The spec writing for these changes are not in the draft spec so you can see https://github.com/osgi/design/blob/master/rfcs/rfc0219/rfc-0219-LogService-Update.pdf for some more detail/background on the change.
 
 
Also see https://github.com/osgi/slf4j-osgi which holds an slf4j binding to the new Log Service.
--BJ HargraveSenior Technical Staff Member, IBM // office: +1 386 848 1781OSGi Fellow and CTO of the OSGi Alliance // mobile: +1 386 848 3788hargr...@us.ibm.com
 
 
- Original message -From: Matt Sicker Sent by: osgi-dev-boun...@mail.osgi.orgTo: OSGi Developer Mail List Cc:Subject: Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubtDate: Thu, Apr 6, 2017 2:11 PM 
As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we don't need yet another logging facade.
 
On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião  wrote:

Hello,I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not importing/extending interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a service, but I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from the factory statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on non-service classes?thanks,Cristiano___OSGi Developer Mail Listosgi-dev@mail.osgi.orghttps://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev 

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Matt Sicker 
___OSGi Developer Mail Listosgi-dev@mail.osgi.orghttps://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
 

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Re: [osgi-dev] Log Service Specification Version 1.4 doubt

[Matt Sicker]

As long as LoggerFactory is a service and not a static singleton like in
SLF4J and Log4j2, then the API makes sense in an OSGi context. If it's yet
another static factory, then I'd promote the use of Log4j2 instead as we
don't need yet another logging facade.

On 6 April 2017 at 12:27, Cristiano Gavião  wrote:

> Hello,
> I was reading today the early draft of compendium 7.0.0.
>
> I saw two interfaces that caught my attention: LoggerFactory and Logger.
>
> could someone explain me the idea behind them? why not importing/extending
> interfaces from org.slf4j.api instead?
>
> If I understood it right, LoggerFactory is aimed to be used as a service,
> but I wondering, it would be possible to obtain a Logger from the factory
> statically as well as we do when using sfl4j/logback on non-service
> classes?
>
> thanks,
>
> Cristiano
>
> ___
> OSGi Developer Mail List
> osgi-dev@mail.osgi.org
> https://mail.osgi.org/mailman/listinfo/osgi-dev
>



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