RE: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Ken Schaefer]

All the Surface Book problems I’ve heard of are all firmware/software related 
(and I experienced plenty of issues, getting my model on Day 1). But since 
about July, all my issues are fixed.
There’s a bunch of new technology in the Skylake chipsets, and most vendors 
were struggling to get drivers working properly for a while.

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Bec C
Sent: Friday, 16 December 2016 5:46 PM
To: ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
Subject: Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

I don't know about them all being the about same. I haven't heard of any other 
laptop recently give as much problems as the surface book. Perhaps they're all 
about the same except the surface book ;p

On Friday, 16 December 2016, David Richards 
<ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com<mailto:ausdot...@davidsuniverse.com>> wrote:
Sheesh!  talk about flamebait!

I'm not going to pick a side in this.  What I will say is they are all 
essentially the same.  Both hardware and OS.  They all have their strengths and 
weaknesses.  Until recently, I had three (not including desktop PCs): A macbook 
pro running sierra and windows 10, an old (maybe 7-8 years) toshiba qosmio 
running windows 10 and linux (and has run 2 other versions of windows) and a 
very old hp tc1100 tablet (aka slate) running XP and linux that finally died 
after about 12 years I think.

They all mostly work and do their job.  They all have annoying hardware 
problems that you just have to deal with.  They all have OS problems you just 
have to deal with.  They all have design flaws that make you wonder what the 
designers were thinking.  I'm sick of ridiculous DNS problems, baffling network 
problems, dodgy ports, dodgy drivers, advertising on my login screen and 
notifications, scare tactics by antivirus software, and having to look up 
simple tasks I rarely do because I've forgotten how to do them.

Not one of them I would consider significantly better or worst than another 
that I could recommend for or against for "most" users.  Keep in mind I'm not 
comparing specs here, just the overall experience and fit-for-purpose. As 
Stephen said: "There is no perfect laptop...".

David

"If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes
 will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!"
 -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama

On 16 December 2016 at 13:02, Bec C 
<bec.usern...@gmail.com<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','bec.usern...@gmail.com');>>
 wrote:
Wow full refund after 11 months???

You can all say what you want but as I have always preached, the macbook is the 
best laptop for most users including devs.

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Bec C]

I don't know about them all being the about same. I haven't heard of any
other laptop recently give as much problems as the surface book. Perhaps
they're all about the same except the surface book ;p

On Friday, 16 December 2016, David Richards 
wrote:

> Sheesh!  talk about flamebait!
>
> I'm not going to pick a side in this.  What I will say is they are all
> essentially the same.  Both hardware and OS.  They all have their strengths
> and weaknesses.  Until recently, I had three (not including desktop PCs): A
> macbook pro running sierra and windows 10, an old (maybe 7-8 years) toshiba
> qosmio running windows 10 and linux (and has run 2 other versions of
> windows) and a very old hp tc1100 tablet (aka slate) running XP and linux
> that finally died after about 12 years I think.
>
> They all mostly work and do their job.  They all have annoying hardware
> problems that you just have to deal with.  They all have OS problems you
> just have to deal with.  They all have design flaws that make you wonder
> what the designers were thinking.  I'm sick of ridiculous DNS problems,
> baffling network problems, dodgy ports, dodgy drivers, advertising on my
> login screen and notifications, scare tactics by antivirus software, and
> having to look up simple tasks I rarely do because I've forgotten how to do
> them.
>
> Not one of them I would consider significantly better or worst than
> another that I could recommend for or against for "most" users.  Keep in
> mind I'm not comparing specs here, just the overall experience and
> fit-for-purpose. As Stephen said: "There is no perfect laptop...".
>
> David
>
> "If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes
>  will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!"
>  -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama
>
> On 16 December 2016 at 13:02, Bec C  > wrote:
>
>> Wow full refund after 11 months???
>>
>> You can all say what you want but as I have always preached, the macbook
>> is the best laptop for most users including devs.
>>
>>
>>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[David Richards]

Peril Sensitive Sunglasses
Joo Janta 200 Super-Chromatic Peril Sensitive Sunglasses have been
specially designed to help people develop a relaxed attitude to danger. At
the first hint of trouble, they turn totally black and thus prevent you
from seeing anything that might alarm you.

David

"If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes
 will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!"
 -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama

On 16 December 2016 at 15:29, Stephen Price 
wrote:

> Apple came out with a very novel fix for the complaints about battery
> life. They removed the estimated battery remaining time from the battery
> indicator at the top of the screen. Seriously? I updated my MBP last night
> and can verify indeed, it no longer estimates how long my battery will last
> in hours/minutes.
>
> Wow. /facepalm.
>
>
>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[David Richards]

Sheesh!  talk about flamebait!

I'm not going to pick a side in this.  What I will say is they are all
essentially the same.  Both hardware and OS.  They all have their strengths
and weaknesses.  Until recently, I had three (not including desktop PCs): A
macbook pro running sierra and windows 10, an old (maybe 7-8 years) toshiba
qosmio running windows 10 and linux (and has run 2 other versions of
windows) and a very old hp tc1100 tablet (aka slate) running XP and linux
that finally died after about 12 years I think.

They all mostly work and do their job.  They all have annoying hardware
problems that you just have to deal with.  They all have OS problems you
just have to deal with.  They all have design flaws that make you wonder
what the designers were thinking.  I'm sick of ridiculous DNS problems,
baffling network problems, dodgy ports, dodgy drivers, advertising on my
login screen and notifications, scare tactics by antivirus software, and
having to look up simple tasks I rarely do because I've forgotten how to do
them.

Not one of them I would consider significantly better or worst than another
that I could recommend for or against for "most" users.  Keep in mind I'm
not comparing specs here, just the overall experience and fit-for-purpose.
As Stephen said: "There is no perfect laptop...".

David

"If we can hit that bullseye, the rest of the dominoes
 will fall like a house of cards... checkmate!"
 -Zapp Brannigan, Futurama

On 16 December 2016 at 13:02, Bec C  wrote:

> Wow full refund after 11 months???
>
> You can all say what you want but as I have always preached, the macbook
> is the best laptop for most users including devs.
>
>
>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Stephen Price]

Ikr?!


One replacement, two faulty devices, many emails, and a mention of the Consumer 
protection website and the stuff about Consumer Guarantee (i.e. the product 
functions as expected) later.

I felt very lucky but at the same time, it never functioned as expected, 
unfortunately.


I know someone else who returned theirs (got his the same time as me) and he 
got a full refund after his first return. It was much easier for him than me, 
so perhaps I paved the way.


At one point they were telling me to return it to where I purchased it from (I 
got it from the Microsoft online store!) and then next they told me they had no 
refund policy. (which was where I followed up with the Australian laws related 
to refunds and products that don't function right). So maybe they made a refund 
policy for me.


Regarding MacBooks, I've not found a review yet that raves about it. Many very 
unhappy Apple fanbois out there. It's ok for me as I'm comparing it to my old 
2013 MacBook Pro 13. Apples and Oranges... wait, no. Apples to Apples? Hmm that 
old saying breaks down there.

Anyway, I do like it. Not perfect but very nice all the same.


Apple came out with a very novel fix for the complaints about battery life. 
They removed the estimated battery remaining time from the battery indicator at 
the top of the screen. Seriously? I updated my MBP last night and can verify 
indeed, it no longer estimates how long my battery will last in hours/minutes.

Wow. /facepalm.


Should be interesting how people react to that one...


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> on behalf 
of Bec C <bec.usern...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, 16 December 2016 10:02:50 AM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

Wow full refund after 11 months???

You can all say what you want but as I have always preached, the macbook is the 
best laptop for most users including devs.

On Friday, 16 December 2016, Stephen Price 
<step...@lythixdesigns.com<mailto:step...@lythixdesigns.com>> wrote:

I saw the mentions but figured people would be referring to the newer (and 
better) models of the Spectre x360.


My daughter is using my old Spectre x360 and she loves it. I did buy a pen for 
it, as my daughter is doing an Illustrator/graphic design degree but the thing 
didn't work. My attempts to get their support to tell me if I had a faulty pen, 
or just the wrong pen for the laptop resulted in a fail. I got emails but no 
one called me. Just got too busy to spend an hour on the phone following it up. 
So from a support perspective I wasn't that impressed with HP.

She does love the laptop though. Great battery life and I see her using it 
constantly.


I had some issues with a Dell order (mainly with Startrack not delivering, and 
then damaging the package - fortunately it wasn't the XPS 13, it was just a 
charger and they finally got it to me after almost a month...)

But the thing with Dell was they didn't ignore me. After purchase support is 
important, so I always buy the extra warranty. Nothing worse than it dying a 
month after the warranty and its cheaper to buy a whole new laptop than repair 
it.


I also have a new 2016 MacBook Pro 15". Quite happy with it... It's my main 
take everywhere laptop, mainly as I want to get more familiar with the Mac OS. 
Still use windows on it via BootCamp accessed via Parallels vm.


I returned my Surface Book after 11 months, Full refund. One replaced device 
(battery life was 3 hours, it was using battery as fast as it could) and the 
replacement was way better but the camera was failing. It often would not sleep 
while in bag (or wake up and battery would be used up). The XPS in comparison 
can be in my bag for a week and still be at 80% battery when I turned it back 
on.

I wasn't happy, I wanted the Surface Book to be great. When it worked it was. I 
was hoping for USB-C on the refresh version but they just made it heavier 
(slightly more battery plus stop it being so top heavy) and slightly better gfx.


There is no perfect laptop. You have to pick the one that has the strengths 
that align with how you want to use it. Bit like finding a woman... (haha very 
non PC comment, sorry! Kidding!)


good luck!

Stephen


From: 
ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com');>
 
<ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com');>>
 on behalf of DotNet Dude 
<adotnetd...@gmail.com<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','adotnetd...@gmail.com');>>
Sent: Friday, 16 December 2016 9:21:20 AM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

I recall Stephen Price had a Spectre x360. Maybe wait for him to join in this 
conversation with his thoughts.

On Friday, 16 December 2016, Tom P 
<tompbi...@gmail.com<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','tompbi...@gmail.com');>> 
w

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Bec C]

Wow full refund after 11 months???

You can all say what you want but as I have always preached, the macbook is
the best laptop for most users including devs.

On Friday, 16 December 2016, Stephen Price <step...@lythixdesigns.com>
wrote:

> I saw the mentions but figured people would be referring to the newer (and
> better) models of the Spectre x360.
>
>
> My daughter is using my old Spectre x360 and she loves it. I did buy a pen
> for it, as my daughter is doing an Illustrator/graphic design degree but
> the thing didn't work. My attempts to get their support to tell me if I had
> a faulty pen, or just the wrong pen for the laptop resulted in a fail. I
> got emails but no one called me. Just got too busy to spend an hour on the
> phone following it up. So from a support perspective I wasn't that
> impressed with HP.
>
> She does love the laptop though. Great battery life and I see her using it
> constantly.
>
>
> I had some issues with a Dell order (mainly with Startrack not delivering,
> and then damaging the package - fortunately it wasn't the XPS 13, it was
> just a charger and they finally got it to me after almost a month...)
>
> But the thing with Dell was they didn't ignore me. After purchase support
> is important, so I always buy the extra warranty. Nothing worse than it
> dying a month after the warranty and its cheaper to buy a whole new laptop
> than repair it.
>
>
> I also have a new 2016 MacBook Pro 15". Quite happy with it... It's my
> main take everywhere laptop, mainly as I want to get more familiar with the
> Mac OS. Still use windows on it via BootCamp accessed via Parallels vm.
>
>
> I returned my Surface Book after 11 months, Full refund. One replaced
> device (battery life was 3 hours, it was using battery as fast as it could)
> and the replacement was way better but the camera was failing. It often
> would not sleep while in bag (or wake up and battery would be used up). The
> XPS in comparison can be in my bag for a week and still be at 80% battery
> when I turned it back on.
>
> I wasn't happy, I wanted the Surface Book to be great. When it worked it
> was. I was hoping for USB-C on the refresh version but they just made it
> heavier (slightly more battery plus stop it being so top heavy) and
> slightly better gfx.
>
>
> There is no perfect laptop. You have to pick the one that has the
> strengths that align with how you want to use it. Bit like finding a
> woman... (haha very non PC comment, sorry! Kidding!)
>
>
> good luck!
>
> Stephen
> --
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com');> <
> ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com');>> on
> behalf of DotNet Dude <adotnetd...@gmail.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','adotnetd...@gmail.com');>>
> *Sent:* Friday, 16 December 2016 9:21:20 AM
> *To:* ozDotNet
> *Subject:* Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts
>
> I recall Stephen Price had a Spectre x360. Maybe wait for him to join in
> this conversation with his thoughts.
>
> On Friday, 16 December 2016, Tom P <tompbi...@gmail.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','tompbi...@gmail.com');>> wrote:
>
>> Not a requirement
>>
>> On Friday, 16 December 2016, mike smith <meski...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> It's a touch-screen, is that a feature you're looking for?
>>>
>>> On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 7:11 AM, Tom P <tompbi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I'll mostly be using it at my desk but I guess I'd like the option to
>>>> travel with it so I wouldn't go for anything larger than a 15". RAM I
>>>> thought 8GB would be enough but everyone keeps telling me 16GB is the way
>>>> to go, SSD for speed obviously, 512GB storage would be enough unless 1TB is
>>>> not much more expensive, screen res as high as possible given my budget,
>>>> Windows 10, onsite service 3 or 4 years unless there is a higher offering.
>>>> In the past I've had problems after 3 years right after not renewing the
>>>> warranty. Not sure about driving 4K screens, I probably wouldn't but again
>>>> if it does then I wouldn't complain. Budget is $3000 give or take $100 or
>>>> $200 since it's a lot of money already anyway.
>>>>
>>>> Sorry I speak like a user :-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 15 December 2016 at 21:51, Ken Schaefer <k...@adopenstatic.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> First thing, given there are a huge number of laptops out there, are
>>>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Stephen Price]

I saw the mentions but figured people would be referring to the newer (and 
better) models of the Spectre x360.


My daughter is using my old Spectre x360 and she loves it. I did buy a pen for 
it, as my daughter is doing an Illustrator/graphic design degree but the thing 
didn't work. My attempts to get their support to tell me if I had a faulty pen, 
or just the wrong pen for the laptop resulted in a fail. I got emails but no 
one called me. Just got too busy to spend an hour on the phone following it up. 
So from a support perspective I wasn't that impressed with HP.

She does love the laptop though. Great battery life and I see her using it 
constantly.


I had some issues with a Dell order (mainly with Startrack not delivering, and 
then damaging the package - fortunately it wasn't the XPS 13, it was just a 
charger and they finally got it to me after almost a month...)

But the thing with Dell was they didn't ignore me. After purchase support is 
important, so I always buy the extra warranty. Nothing worse than it dying a 
month after the warranty and its cheaper to buy a whole new laptop than repair 
it.


I also have a new 2016 MacBook Pro 15". Quite happy with it... It's my main 
take everywhere laptop, mainly as I want to get more familiar with the Mac OS. 
Still use windows on it via BootCamp accessed via Parallels vm.


I returned my Surface Book after 11 months, Full refund. One replaced device 
(battery life was 3 hours, it was using battery as fast as it could) and the 
replacement was way better but the camera was failing. It often would not sleep 
while in bag (or wake up and battery would be used up). The XPS in comparison 
can be in my bag for a week and still be at 80% battery when I turned it back 
on.

I wasn't happy, I wanted the Surface Book to be great. When it worked it was. I 
was hoping for USB-C on the refresh version but they just made it heavier 
(slightly more battery plus stop it being so top heavy) and slightly better gfx.


There is no perfect laptop. You have to pick the one that has the strengths 
that align with how you want to use it. Bit like finding a woman... (haha very 
non PC comment, sorry! Kidding!)


good luck!

Stephen


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> on behalf 
of DotNet Dude <adotnetd...@gmail.com>
Sent: Friday, 16 December 2016 9:21:20 AM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

I recall Stephen Price had a Spectre x360. Maybe wait for him to join in this 
conversation with his thoughts.

On Friday, 16 December 2016, Tom P 
<tompbi...@gmail.com<mailto:tompbi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Not a requirement

On Friday, 16 December 2016, mike smith 
<meski...@gmail.com<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','meski...@gmail.com');>> wrote:
It's a touch-screen, is that a feature you're looking for?

On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 7:11 AM, Tom P <tompbi...@gmail.com> wrote:
I'll mostly be using it at my desk but I guess I'd like the option to travel 
with it so I wouldn't go for anything larger than a 15". RAM I thought 8GB 
would be enough but everyone keeps telling me 16GB is the way to go, SSD for 
speed obviously, 512GB storage would be enough unless 1TB is not much more 
expensive, screen res as high as possible given my budget, Windows 10, onsite 
service 3 or 4 years unless there is a higher offering. In the past I've had 
problems after 3 years right after not renewing the warranty. Not sure about 
driving 4K screens, I probably wouldn't but again if it does then I wouldn't 
complain. Budget is $3000 give or take $100 or $200 since it's a lot of money 
already anyway.

Sorry I speak like a user :-)


On 15 December 2016 at 21:51, Ken Schaefer <k...@adopenstatic.com> wrote:
First thing, given there are a huge number of laptops out there, are what are 
your requirements/constraints/use cases…


a)  What are the minimums you think you need (storage, RAM, battery life, 
screen res)

b) What is your budget (or any other constraint – OS etc.)

c)  Is this going to be mostly portable, working in customer offices, 
cafes, planes etc), or mostly sit on your desk. Do you want to drive 4K screens 
etc. off it on your desk

Given that this is going to be your primary work machine, I guess it’s safe to 
assume you need either (a) maximum reliability or (b) onsite service – no 
“return to base and wait a week” type offerings.

Sorry I speak like an architect. I guess I’ve been doing that for too long now.

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Tom P
Sent: Thursday, 15 December 2016 8:40 AM
To: ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
Subject: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I actually did 
read about horror stories like yours where people ended up sending machines 
back several times. It's really disappointing when you're spendi

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[DotNet Dude]

I recall Stephen Price had a Spectre x360. Maybe wait for him to join in
this conversation with his thoughts.

On Friday, 16 December 2016, Tom P <tompbi...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Not a requirement
>
> On Friday, 16 December 2016, mike smith <meski...@gmail.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','meski...@gmail.com');>> wrote:
>
>> It's a touch-screen, is that a feature you're looking for?
>>
>> On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 7:11 AM, Tom P <tompbi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll mostly be using it at my desk but I guess I'd like the option to
>>> travel with it so I wouldn't go for anything larger than a 15". RAM I
>>> thought 8GB would be enough but everyone keeps telling me 16GB is the way
>>> to go, SSD for speed obviously, 512GB storage would be enough unless 1TB is
>>> not much more expensive, screen res as high as possible given my budget,
>>> Windows 10, onsite service 3 or 4 years unless there is a higher offering.
>>> In the past I've had problems after 3 years right after not renewing the
>>> warranty. Not sure about driving 4K screens, I probably wouldn't but again
>>> if it does then I wouldn't complain. Budget is $3000 give or take $100 or
>>> $200 since it's a lot of money already anyway.
>>>
>>> Sorry I speak like a user :-)
>>>
>>>
>>> On 15 December 2016 at 21:51, Ken Schaefer <k...@adopenstatic.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> First thing, given there are a huge number of laptops out there, are
>>>> what are your requirements/constraints/use cases…
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> a)  What are the minimums you think you need (storage, RAM,
>>>> battery life, screen res)
>>>>
>>>> b) What is your budget (or any other constraint – OS etc.)
>>>>
>>>> c)  Is this going to be mostly portable, working in customer
>>>> offices, cafes, planes etc), or mostly sit on your desk. Do you want to
>>>> drive 4K screens etc. off it on your desk
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Given that this is going to be your primary work machine, I guess it’s
>>>> safe to assume you need either (a) maximum reliability or (b) onsite
>>>> service – no “return to base and wait a week” type offerings.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Sorry I speak like an architect. I guess I’ve been doing that for too
>>>> long now.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-bounces@ozdot
>>>> net.com] *On Behalf Of *Tom P
>>>> *Sent:* Thursday, 15 December 2016 8:40 AM
>>>> *To:* ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
>>>> *Subject:* [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I
>>>> actually did read about horror stories like yours where people ended up
>>>> sending machines back several times. It's really disappointing when you're
>>>> spending so much money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with
>>>> Dell now after having many issues with them. I'll keep looking...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright <tonyw...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Tom,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided
>>>> the battery life on the x360 sucked.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo
>>>> thinkpad x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and
>>>> had 7th gen Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but
>>>> different port configuration.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if
>>>> you can get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external
>>>> monitors + Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters
>>>> to fit.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have
>>>> had major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to
>>>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tom P]

Not a requirement

On Friday, 16 December 2016, mike smith <meski...@gmail.com> wrote:

> It's a touch-screen, is that a feature you're looking for?
>
> On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 7:11 AM, Tom P <tompbi...@gmail.com
> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','tompbi...@gmail.com');>> wrote:
>
>> I'll mostly be using it at my desk but I guess I'd like the option to
>> travel with it so I wouldn't go for anything larger than a 15". RAM I
>> thought 8GB would be enough but everyone keeps telling me 16GB is the way
>> to go, SSD for speed obviously, 512GB storage would be enough unless 1TB is
>> not much more expensive, screen res as high as possible given my budget,
>> Windows 10, onsite service 3 or 4 years unless there is a higher offering.
>> In the past I've had problems after 3 years right after not renewing the
>> warranty. Not sure about driving 4K screens, I probably wouldn't but again
>> if it does then I wouldn't complain. Budget is $3000 give or take $100 or
>> $200 since it's a lot of money already anyway.
>>
>> Sorry I speak like a user :-)
>>
>>
>> On 15 December 2016 at 21:51, Ken Schaefer <k...@adopenstatic.com
>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','k...@adopenstatic.com');>> wrote:
>>
>>> First thing, given there are a huge number of laptops out there, are
>>> what are your requirements/constraints/use cases…
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> a)  What are the minimums you think you need (storage, RAM, battery
>>> life, screen res)
>>>
>>> b) What is your budget (or any other constraint – OS etc.)
>>>
>>> c)  Is this going to be mostly portable, working in customer
>>> offices, cafes, planes etc), or mostly sit on your desk. Do you want to
>>> drive 4K screens etc. off it on your desk
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Given that this is going to be your primary work machine, I guess it’s
>>> safe to assume you need either (a) maximum reliability or (b) onsite
>>> service – no “return to base and wait a week” type offerings.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Sorry I speak like an architect. I guess I’ve been doing that for too
>>> long now.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
>>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com');> [mailto:
>>> ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com
>>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com');>] *On
>>> Behalf Of *Tom P
>>> *Sent:* Thursday, 15 December 2016 8:40 AM
>>> *To:* ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com
>>> <javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com');>>
>>> *Subject:* [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I
>>> actually did read about horror stories like yours where people ended up
>>> sending machines back several times. It's really disappointing when you're
>>> spending so much money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with
>>> Dell now after having many issues with them. I'll keep looking...
>>>
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright <tonyw...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Tom,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the
>>> battery life on the x360 sucked.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo
>>> thinkpad x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and
>>> had 7th gen Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but
>>> different port configuration.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if
>>> you can get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external
>>> monitors + Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters
>>> to fit.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have
>>> had major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to
>>> crashes, screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they
>>> will replace my motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it
>>> fails this time, I'm getting a refund.
>>>
>>>
>>&g

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[mike smith]

It's a touch-screen, is that a feature you're looking for?

On Fri, Dec 16, 2016 at 7:11 AM, Tom P <tompbi...@gmail.com> wrote:

> I'll mostly be using it at my desk but I guess I'd like the option to
> travel with it so I wouldn't go for anything larger than a 15". RAM I
> thought 8GB would be enough but everyone keeps telling me 16GB is the way
> to go, SSD for speed obviously, 512GB storage would be enough unless 1TB is
> not much more expensive, screen res as high as possible given my budget,
> Windows 10, onsite service 3 or 4 years unless there is a higher offering.
> In the past I've had problems after 3 years right after not renewing the
> warranty. Not sure about driving 4K screens, I probably wouldn't but again
> if it does then I wouldn't complain. Budget is $3000 give or take $100 or
> $200 since it's a lot of money already anyway.
>
> Sorry I speak like a user :-)
>
>
> On 15 December 2016 at 21:51, Ken Schaefer <k...@adopenstatic.com> wrote:
>
>> First thing, given there are a huge number of laptops out there, are what
>> are your requirements/constraints/use cases…
>>
>>
>>
>> a)  What are the minimums you think you need (storage, RAM, battery
>> life, screen res)
>>
>> b) What is your budget (or any other constraint – OS etc.)
>>
>> c)  Is this going to be mostly portable, working in customer
>> offices, cafes, planes etc), or mostly sit on your desk. Do you want to
>> drive 4K screens etc. off it on your desk
>>
>>
>>
>> Given that this is going to be your primary work machine, I guess it’s
>> safe to assume you need either (a) maximum reliability or (b) onsite
>> service – no “return to base and wait a week” type offerings.
>>
>>
>>
>> Sorry I speak like an architect. I guess I’ve been doing that for too
>> long now.
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-bounces@ozdot
>> net.com] *On Behalf Of *Tom P
>> *Sent:* Thursday, 15 December 2016 8:40 AM
>> *To:* ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
>> *Subject:* [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts
>>
>>
>>
>> Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I
>> actually did read about horror stories like yours where people ended up
>> sending machines back several times. It's really disappointing when you're
>> spending so much money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with
>> Dell now after having many issues with them. I'll keep looking...
>>
>>
>> On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright <tonyw...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Tom,
>>
>>
>>
>> I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the
>> battery life on the x360 sucked.
>>
>>
>>
>> Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.
>>
>>
>>
>> If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo
>> thinkpad x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and
>> had 7th gen Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but
>> different port configuration.
>>
>>
>>
>> Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if
>> you can get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external
>> monitors + Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters
>> to fit.
>>
>>
>>
>> The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have
>> had major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to
>> crashes, screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they
>> will replace my motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it
>> fails this time, I'm getting a refund.
>>
>>
>>
>> My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student
>> account giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%),
>> Dell (15%) and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have
>> removed that deal. Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a
>> student discount. Auto clubs, like racv, also have discounts.
>>
>>
>>
>> If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I
>> might get a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get
>> a xeon chip or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme
>> pcie ssd of I like.
>>
>>
>>
>> The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of
>> thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows nativel

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tom P]

I'll mostly be using it at my desk but I guess I'd like the option to
travel with it so I wouldn't go for anything larger than a 15". RAM I
thought 8GB would be enough but everyone keeps telling me 16GB is the way
to go, SSD for speed obviously, 512GB storage would be enough unless 1TB is
not much more expensive, screen res as high as possible given my budget,
Windows 10, onsite service 3 or 4 years unless there is a higher offering.
In the past I've had problems after 3 years right after not renewing the
warranty. Not sure about driving 4K screens, I probably wouldn't but again
if it does then I wouldn't complain. Budget is $3000 give or take $100 or
$200 since it's a lot of money already anyway.

Sorry I speak like a user :-)

On 15 December 2016 at 21:51, Ken Schaefer <k...@adopenstatic.com> wrote:

> First thing, given there are a huge number of laptops out there, are what
> are your requirements/constraints/use cases…
>
>
>
> a)  What are the minimums you think you need (storage, RAM, battery
> life, screen res)
>
> b) What is your budget (or any other constraint – OS etc.)
>
> c)  Is this going to be mostly portable, working in customer offices,
> cafes, planes etc), or mostly sit on your desk. Do you want to drive 4K
> screens etc. off it on your desk
>
>
>
> Given that this is going to be your primary work machine, I guess it’s
> safe to assume you need either (a) maximum reliability or (b) onsite
> service – no “return to base and wait a week” type offerings.
>
>
>
> Sorry I speak like an architect. I guess I’ve been doing that for too long
> now.
>
>
>
> *From:* ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-bounces@
> ozdotnet.com] *On Behalf Of *Tom P
> *Sent:* Thursday, 15 December 2016 8:40 AM
> *To:* ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
> *Subject:* [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts
>
>
>
> Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I actually
> did read about horror stories like yours where people ended up sending
> machines back several times. It's really disappointing when you're spending
> so much money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with Dell now
> after having many issues with them. I'll keep looking...
>
>
> On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright <tonyw...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Tom,
>
>
>
> I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the
> battery life on the x360 sucked.
>
>
>
> Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.
>
>
>
> If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo
> thinkpad x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and
> had 7th gen Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but
> different port configuration.
>
>
>
> Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if you
> can get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external monitors +
> Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters to fit.
>
>
>
> The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have had
> major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to crashes,
> screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they will replace
> my motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it fails this time,
> I'm getting a refund.
>
>
>
> My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student account
> giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%), Dell
> (15%) and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have removed
> that deal. Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a student
> discount. Auto clubs, like racv, also have discounts.
>
>
>
> If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I might
> get a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get a
> xeon chip or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme
> pcie ssd of I like.
>
>
>
> The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of
> thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows natively on.
> It's got an awesome configuration but bad battery life, and that's reduced
> further by windows. Asus Zenbook pro 15 but couldn't find a price for the
> right configuration I want (I only want 1920x1080 as I want more battery
> life)
>
> Hp omen - lacks extensibility. Dell precision 7510 far too expensive in
> Australia.
>
>
>
> Hope this helps!
>
>
>
> Tony
>
>
>
> On 14 Dec 2016 5:34 PM, "Tom P" <tompbi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Folks,
>
>
>
> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a
> better alternative for the price?
>
>
>
> Cheers
>
> Tom
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks
>
> Tom
>
>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks
>
> Tom
>
>
>

RE: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Ken Schaefer]

First thing, given there are a huge number of laptops out there, are what are 
your requirements/constraints/use cases…


a)  What are the minimums you think you need (storage, RAM, battery life, 
screen res)

b) What is your budget (or any other constraint – OS etc.)

c)  Is this going to be mostly portable, working in customer offices, 
cafes, planes etc), or mostly sit on your desk. Do you want to drive 4K screens 
etc. off it on your desk

Given that this is going to be your primary work machine, I guess it’s safe to 
assume you need either (a) maximum reliability or (b) onsite service – no 
“return to base and wait a week” type offerings.

Sorry I speak like an architect. I guess I’ve been doing that for too long now.

From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com [mailto:ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com] On 
Behalf Of Tom P
Sent: Thursday, 15 December 2016 8:40 AM
To: ozDotNet <ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>
Subject: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I actually did 
read about horror stories like yours where people ended up sending machines 
back several times. It's really disappointing when you're spending so much 
money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with Dell now after having 
many issues with them. I'll keep looking...

On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright 
<tonyw...@gmail.com<javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','tonyw...@gmail.com');>> wrote:
Hi Tom,

I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the 
battery life on the x360 sucked.

Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.

If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo thinkpad 
x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and had 7th gen 
Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but different port 
configuration.

Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if you can 
get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external monitors + 
Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters to fit.

The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have had 
major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to crashes, 
screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they will replace my 
motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it fails this time, I'm 
getting a refund.

My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student account 
giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%), Dell (15%) 
and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have removed that deal. 
Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a student discount. Auto 
clubs, like racv, also have discounts.

If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I might get 
a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get a xeon chip 
or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme pcie ssd of I 
like.

The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of 
thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows natively on. It's 
got an awesome configuration but bad battery life, and that's reduced further 
by windows. Asus Zenbook pro 15 but couldn't find a price for the right 
configuration I want (I only want 1920x1080 as I want more battery life)
Hp omen - lacks extensibility. Dell precision 7510 far too expensive in 
Australia.

Hope this helps!

Tony

On 14 Dec 2016 5:34 PM, "Tom P" 
<tompbi...@gmail.com<mailto:tompbi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi Folks,

I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb ram, 
512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have any devs 
here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better alternative 
for the price?

Cheers
Tom


--
Thanks
Tom



--
Thanks
Tom

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tony Wright]

Ok, my Dell XPS 9550 laptop has now been fixed. It turns out that
yesterday's motherboard replacement wasn't necessary - there was an
unlisted software driver that they needed to install (they told me to
reinstall windows. I didn't install the Dell payload. I think it was called
something like Display Link or something. Kicking myself for not paying
more attention.) Yesterday's techie was too much in a rush to diagnose the
issues.

So now the screen doesn't flicker, the system isn't crashing, and I am
using 2 external screens as well as my laptop screen in the office. (Yes, 3
screens total, and I can even add more.)

So if you are interested in getting a machine like mine, it is likely that
you will be fine, or if you get issues like I had, it will be fixable, even
if it requires a bit of patience! I paid just under $3k which included a 4
year next day on site warranty for a machine with a i7-6700HQ, 16GB RAM,
and a 512GB Nvme pcie SSD. I am so relieved as the alternatives would have
been far more expensive. Now to upgrade it to 32GB RAM as I have VMs to run.

On Thu, Dec 15, 2016 at 11:30 AM, Tom P  wrote:

> Same as that except for 512 ssd. Model number is w032tu. Extra cost for
> more ssd isn't justified for me
>
>
> On Thursday, 15 December 2016, mike smith  wrote:
>
>> What's the full number?  The top range that I see is this one
>>
>> HP Spectre x360 13-w033tu Touchscreen Notebook (Natural Silver)
>> with these specs:
>>
>>
>>- Intel® Core™ i7-7500U Processor (Intel® HD Graphics 620, 2.7 GHz,
>>up to 3.5 GHz, 4 MB cache, 2 cores)
>>- Windows 10 Home 64
>>- 13.3" diagonal FHD UWVA BrightView WLED-backlit touch screen (1920
>>x 1080)
>>- 16 GB LPDDR3-1866 SDRAM (onboard)
>>- 1 TB PCIe® NVMe™ M.2 SSD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Wed, Dec 14, 2016 at 5:34 PM, Tom P  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Folks,
>>>
>>> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
>>> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
>>> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
>>> alternative
>>> for the price?
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Thanks
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Meski
>>
>>  http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv
>>
>> "Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure,
>> you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills
>>
>
>
> --
> Thanks
> Tom
>
>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tom P]

Same as that except for 512 ssd. Model number is w032tu. Extra cost for
more ssd isn't justified for me

On Thursday, 15 December 2016, mike smith  wrote:

> What's the full number?  The top range that I see is this one
>
> HP Spectre x360 13-w033tu Touchscreen Notebook (Natural Silver)
> with these specs:
>
>
>- Intel® Core™ i7-7500U Processor (Intel® HD Graphics 620, 2.7 GHz, up
>to 3.5 GHz, 4 MB cache, 2 cores)
>- Windows 10 Home 64
>- 13.3" diagonal FHD UWVA BrightView WLED-backlit touch screen (1920 x
>1080)
>- 16 GB LPDDR3-1866 SDRAM (onboard)
>- 1 TB PCIe® NVMe™ M.2 SSD
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Dec 14, 2016 at 5:34 PM, Tom P  > wrote:
>
>> Hi Folks,
>>
>> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
>> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
>> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
>> alternative
>> for the price?
>>
>> Cheers
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Thanks
>> Tom
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Meski
>
>  http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv
>
> "Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure,
> you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills
>


-- 
Thanks
Tom

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[mike smith]

What's the full number?  The top range that I see is this one

HP Spectre x360 13-w033tu Touchscreen Notebook (Natural Silver)
with these specs:


   - Intel® Core™ i7-7500U Processor (Intel® HD Graphics 620, 2.7 GHz, up
   to 3.5 GHz, 4 MB cache, 2 cores)
   - Windows 10 Home 64
   - 13.3" diagonal FHD UWVA BrightView WLED-backlit touch screen (1920 x
   1080)
   - 16 GB LPDDR3-1866 SDRAM (onboard)
   - 1 TB PCIe® NVMe™ M.2 SSD




On Wed, Dec 14, 2016 at 5:34 PM, Tom P  wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
> alternative
> for the price?
>
> Cheers
> Tom
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks
> Tom
>
>


-- 
Meski

 http://courteous.ly/aAOZcv

"Going to Starbucks for coffee is like going to prison for sex. Sure,
you'll get it, but it's going to be rough" - Adam Hills

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[罗格雷格博士]

My E7440 (Dell) has been brilliant but they did replace the screen because of a 
hinge issue - but functionality: wonderful

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low
1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax
SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com<http://www.sqldownunder.com>


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> on behalf 
of David Gardiner <da...@gardiner.net.au>
Sent: Thursday, December 15, 2016 10:23:04 AM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

Just to add to Tony's experience, I've been using a Dell XPS 15 (9550) since 
March. I did end up getting the battery replaced because it turned out there 
was something weird inside it that was pushing up against the touchpad, making 
it hard to 'click'. After that it's been pretty good - quite reliable. I don't 
make much use of the thunderbolt port though (I've seen a few firmware/driver 
updates come out for that so it does sound like there's been some issues there)

This is the second Dell laptop I've had (first one was a 1645) and one other 
thing I've noticed is that they tend to be pretty good working with various 
data projectors. A number of occasions I've been at a venue where my laptop has 
worked fine where other brands have problems with cropping or just refusing to 
work at all.

David

On 15 December 2016 at 08:09, Tom P 
<tompbi...@gmail.com<mailto:tompbi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I actually did 
read about horror stories like yours where people ended up sending machines 
back several times. It's really disappointing when you're spending so much 
money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with Dell now after having 
many issues with them. I'll keep looking...

On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright <tonyw...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Tom,

I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the 
battery life on the x360 sucked.

Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.

If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo thinkpad 
x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and had 7th gen 
Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but different port 
configuration.

Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if you can 
get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external monitors + 
Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters to fit.

The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have had 
major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to crashes, 
screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they will replace my 
motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it fails this time, I'm 
getting a refund.

My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student account 
giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%), Dell (15%) 
and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have removed that deal. 
Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a student discount. Auto 
clubs, like racv, also have discounts.

If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I might get 
a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get a xeon chip 
or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme pcie ssd of I 
like.

The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of 
thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows natively on. It's 
got an awesome configuration but bad battery life, and that's reduced further 
by windows. Asus Zenbook pro 15 but couldn't find a price for the right 
configuration I want (I only want 1920x1080 as I want more battery life)
Hp omen - lacks extensibility. Dell precision 7510 far too expensive in 
Australia.

Hope this helps!

Tony

On 14 Dec 2016 5:34 PM, "Tom P" <tompbi...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Folks,

I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb ram, 
512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have any devs 
here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better alternative 
for the price?

Cheers
Tom



--
Thanks
Tom



--
Thanks
Tom

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[David Gardiner]

Just to add to Tony's experience, I've been using a Dell XPS 15 (9550)
since March. I did end up getting the battery replaced because it turned
out there was something weird inside it that was pushing up against the
touchpad, making it hard to 'click'. After that it's been pretty good -
quite reliable. I don't make much use of the thunderbolt port though (I've
seen a few firmware/driver updates come out for that so it does sound like
there's been some issues there)

This is the second Dell laptop I've had (first one was a 1645) and one
other thing I've noticed is that they tend to be pretty good working with
various data projectors. A number of occasions I've been at a venue where
my laptop has worked fine where other brands have problems with cropping or
just refusing to work at all.

David

On 15 December 2016 at 08:09, Tom P  wrote:

> Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I actually
> did read about horror stories like yours where people ended up sending
> machines back several times. It's really disappointing when you're spending
> so much money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with Dell now
> after having many issues with them. I'll keep looking...
>
> On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright  wrote:
>
>> Hi Tom,
>>
>> I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the
>> battery life on the x360 sucked.
>>
>> Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.
>>
>> If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo
>> thinkpad x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and
>> had 7th gen Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but
>> different port configuration.
>>
>> Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if
>> you can get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external
>> monitors + Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters
>> to fit.
>>
>> The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have
>> had major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to
>> crashes, screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they
>> will replace my motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it
>> fails this time, I'm getting a refund.
>>
>> My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student
>> account giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%),
>> Dell (15%) and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have
>> removed that deal. Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a
>> student discount. Auto clubs, like racv, also have discounts.
>>
>> If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I
>> might get a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get
>> a xeon chip or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme
>> pcie ssd of I like.
>>
>> The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of
>> thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows natively on.
>> It's got an awesome configuration but bad battery life, and that's reduced
>> further by windows. Asus Zenbook pro 15 but couldn't find a price for the
>> right configuration I want (I only want 1920x1080 as I want more battery
>> life)
>> Hp omen - lacks extensibility. Dell precision 7510 far too expensive in
>> Australia.
>>
>> Hope this helps!
>>
>> Tony
>>
>> On 14 Dec 2016 5:34 PM, "Tom P"  wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Folks,
>>>
>>> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
>>> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
>>> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
>>> alternative
>>> for the price?
>>>
>>> Cheers
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Thanks
>>> Tom
>>>
>>>
>
> --
> Thanks
> Tom
>
>

[OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tom P]

Wow thanks for the comprehensive email Tony. During my research I actually
did read about horror stories like yours where people ended up sending
machines back several times. It's really disappointing when you're spending
so much money. I know several people who just refuse to deal with Dell now
after having many issues with them. I'll keep looking...

On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tony Wright > wrote:

> Hi Tom,
>
> I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the
> battery life on the x360 sucked.
>
> Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.
>
> If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo
> thinkpad x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and
> had 7th gen Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but
> different port configuration.
>
> Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if you
> can get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external monitors +
> Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters to fit.
>
> The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have had
> major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to crashes,
> screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they will replace
> my motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it fails this time,
> I'm getting a refund.
>
> My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student account
> giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%), Dell
> (15%) and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have removed
> that deal. Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a student
> discount. Auto clubs, like racv, also have discounts.
>
> If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I might
> get a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get a
> xeon chip or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme
> pcie ssd of I like.
>
> The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of
> thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows natively on.
> It's got an awesome configuration but bad battery life, and that's reduced
> further by windows. Asus Zenbook pro 15 but couldn't find a price for the
> right configuration I want (I only want 1920x1080 as I want more battery
> life)
> Hp omen - lacks extensibility. Dell precision 7510 far too expensive in
> Australia.
>
> Hope this helps!
>
> Tony
>
> On 14 Dec 2016 5:34 PM, "Tom P"  wrote:
>
>> Hi Folks,
>>
>> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
>> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
>> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
>> alternative
>> for the price?
>>
>> Cheers
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Thanks
>> Tom
>>
>>

-- 
Thanks
Tom

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[罗格雷格博士]

Yep love the look of the P50 and importantly a 4 channel nvme.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low
1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile│ +61 3 8676 4913 fax
SQL Down Under | Web: www.sqldownunder.com<http://www.sqldownunder.com>


From: ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com <ozdotnet-boun...@ozdotnet.com> on behalf 
of Tony Wright <tonyw...@gmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, December 14, 2016 10:16:41 PM
To: ozDotNet
Subject: Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

Hi Tom,

I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the 
battery life on the x360 sucked.

Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.

If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo thinkpad 
x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and had 7th gen 
Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but different port 
configuration.

Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if you can 
get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external monitors + 
Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters to fit.

The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have had 
major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to crashes, 
screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they will replace my 
motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it fails this time, I'm 
getting a refund.

My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student account 
giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%), Dell (15%) 
and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have removed that deal. 
Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a student discount. Auto 
clubs, like racv, also have discounts.

If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I might get 
a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get a xeon chip 
or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme pcie ssd of I 
like.

The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of 
thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows natively on. It's 
got an awesome configuration but bad battery life, and that's reduced further 
by windows. Asus Zenbook pro 15 but couldn't find a price for the right 
configuration I want (I only want 1920x1080 as I want more battery life)
Hp omen - lacks extensibility. Dell precision 7510 far too expensive in 
Australia.

Hope this helps!

Tony

On 14 Dec 2016 5:34 PM, "Tom P" 
<tompbi...@gmail.com<mailto:tompbi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi Folks,

I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb ram, 
512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have any devs 
here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better alternative 
for the price?

Cheers
Tom



--
Thanks
Tom

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tony Wright]

Hi Tom,

I have been reviewing laptops lately for value for money and decided the
battery life on the x360 sucked.

Most of the laptops in the $3000 range are dual core as well.

If you're after a 2in1 and dual core is fine you could consider Lenovo
thinkpad x1 yoga, or the Lenovo yoga 910. Lenovo yoga 910 is consumer and
had 7th gen Intel chip but no pen capability. Thinkpad x1 yoga has pen but
different port configuration.

Check ports on all laptops you consider. Thunderbolt ports are best if you
can get them. Usbc is second best (you can run multiple external monitors +
Ethernet cable via those ports) But you will also need adapters to fit.

The best value I ended up coming up with was a Dell Xps 15. But I have had
major issues. They have now replaced my motherboard 3 times due to crashes,
screen flickering and thunderbolt port failures. Tomorrow they will replace
my motherboard for the fourth time. Not good enough. If it fails this time,
I'm getting a refund.

My advice is look for discount codes as well. My son has a student account
giving him access to discounts on hp (limited selection up to 40%), Dell
(15%) and Microsoft (15%). Lenovo had up to 20% recently but have removed
that deal. Lenovo often have other deals. Apple 10% through a student
discount. Auto clubs, like racv, also have discounts.

If my laptop fails again and I have to buy another laptop, I think I might
get a Lenovo P50, but they're expensive and not as sexy,but I can get a
xeon chip or high end quad core, go up to 64gb ram, and put a second nvme
pcie ssd of I like.

The other laptops I considered were surface book. Didn't like the lack of
thunderbolt. Apple Macbook pro, which you can install windows natively on.
It's got an awesome configuration but bad battery life, and that's reduced
further by windows. Asus Zenbook pro 15 but couldn't find a price for the
right configuration I want (I only want 1920x1080 as I want more battery
life)
Hp omen - lacks extensibility. Dell precision 7510 far too expensive in
Australia.

Hope this helps!

Tony

On 14 Dec 2016 5:34 PM, "Tom P"  wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
> alternative
> for the price?
>
> Cheers
> Tom
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks
> Tom
>
>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tom P]

FHD. Can't see any option for QHD on hp site

On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, DotNet Dude  wrote:

> Is that with the FHD or QHD screen? Unlikely the latter
>
> On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tom P  > wrote:
>
>> Hi Folks,
>>
>> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
>> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
>> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
>> alternative
>> for the price?
>>
>> Cheers
>> Tom
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Thanks
>> Tom
>>
>>

-- 
Thanks
Tom

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[DotNet Dude]

Is that with the FHD or QHD screen? Unlikely the latter

On Wednesday, 14 December 2016, Tom P  wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
> alternative
> for the price?
>
> Cheers
> Tom
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks
> Tom
>
>

Re: [OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Preet Sangha]

Not used this device in particular, but I've found that the the best
increase in speed I've ever found was with raid 0 ssds.

It was blistering even on a pc from 5 years ago.


regards,
Preet, in Auckland NZ


On 14 December 2016 at 19:34, Tom P  wrote:

> Hi Folks,
>
> I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
> ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
> any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a better 
> alternative
> for the price?
>
> Cheers
> Tom
>
>
>
> --
> Thanks
> Tom
>
>

[OT] HP Spectre x360 thoughts

[Tom P]

Hi Folks,

I'm thinking of buying the HP Spectre x360 13 inch with high specs (16gb
ram, 512 ssd, i7) which ends up costing about $3100 with the warranty. Have
any devs here had bad experiences with this machine or recommend a
better alternative
for the price?

Cheers
Tom



-- 
Thanks
Tom