: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
On 15 Oct 2003 at 17:18, Rob Brigham wrote:
RAW seems to allow for an extra 3 stops in either
direction which is actually pretty massive.
Relative to what contrast setting when saving jpeg in camera?
Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC
: Wednesday, October 15, 2003 9:01 AM
-- Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
--
--
--
--
-- Rob Brigham wrote:
--
-- [. . .]
--
-- BTW anyone wondering about the noise in my sample pics
-- for this test -
-- it was shot at 1600ISO!! I notice reducing the exposure
-- in the RAW
-- software
]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
I did a couple of shots when I handled a pre-production
model. I never posted since I was asked not to.
But from those shots I was quite pleased. I use 3200 quite
often when I shoot wedding ceremonies (bw prints) and as
such am quite used
On Sun, 12 Oct 2003, tom wrote:
-Original Message-
From: Jim Apilado [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 3:40 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
I wonder how many users of digital equipment carry a white
card to do white
On Sun, 12 Oct 2003, Cotty wrote:
On 12/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
The Rebel may have a plastic chassis but the 10D (and D30/60) do not.
The Rebel D apparently has a stainless steel frame holding the sensor and
lens mount in registration.
At least thats what I've been told.
John Francis wrote:
OK, now we're getting to the part where my analysis has to be spot on.
Shooting motorsports, I'm not going to have time to review in camera.
Not something you want to do, in any case, with large heavy objects
whizzing by at 200mph. Not that I haven't seen people doing
-
From: Rob Studdert [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 15 October 2003 01:26
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
On 15 Oct 2003 at 0:59, Rob Brigham wrote:
Seeing the full size files, this is clear cut for me. Jpg is not a
problem from a compression point of view
Rob Brigham wrote:
[. . .]
BTW anyone wondering about the noise in my sample pics for this test -
it was shot at 1600ISO!! I notice reducing the exposure in the RAW
software actually made the noise a lot better too, something that again
the jpg adjustments couldn't do - and not
:01 AM
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Rob Brigham wrote:
[. . .]
BTW anyone wondering about the noise in my sample pics for this test -
it was shot at 1600ISO!! I notice reducing the exposure in the RAW
software actually made the noise a lot better too, something that again
which is actually pretty massive.
-Original Message-
From: Cotty [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 15 October 2003 11:05
To: pentax list
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
On 14/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
Right, I have done this test (http://www.calcot.plus.com/RAWTest
On 15 Oct 2003 at 17:18, Rob Brigham wrote:
RAW seems to allow for an extra 3 stops in either
direction which is actually pretty massive.
Relative to what contrast setting when saving jpeg in camera?
Rob Studdert
HURSTVILLE AUSTRALIA
Tel +61-2-9554-4110
UTC(GMT) +10 Hours
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
John, have you got a web site? Fast cars fast cars fast cars fast cars *~*
I get my track access from motorsport.com, so most of my stuff goes there.
I've got a few older shots up at my home page http://www.panix.com/~johnf/,
and I've recently been given some space on a system operated by a
Hi,
Tuesday, October 14, 2003, 10:25:28 AM, you wrote:
On 13/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
[Have you heard the term for that activity? It's known as 'chimping';
folks staring at their camera dispay anf going Oooh! Oooh! Oooh!]
ROTFLMAO!
That is hilarious! I see it all the time. Is
On 14/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
p.s. chimps, like us, are apes, not monkeys.
You speak for yourself, mate ;-)
Cheers,
Cotty
___/\__
|| (O) | People, Places, Pastiche
||=| www.macads.co.uk/snaps
_
Free UK Mac Ads www.macads.co.uk
Hi,
Tuesday, October 14, 2003, 10:25:28 AM, you wrote:
Phillip Jones Griffiths (how come everybody in this email has 3
names?) commented scathingly on this once at a talk I went to. Said
photographers were missing a lot of shots doing this.
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Tuesday, October 14, 2003, 10:25:28 AM, you wrote:
Phillip Jones Griffiths (how come everybody in this email has 3
names?) commented scathingly on this once at a talk I went to. Said
photographers were missing a lot of shots doing this.
Several of the equine
2003 10:29
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
I am 100% certain that both will be fine. Will do it later
today to satisfy your wishes, if someone else doesn't do it first.
What I am more interested in is:
1 Take a slightly under/over-exposed RAW shot, set the WB
On 15 Oct 2003 at 0:59, Rob Brigham wrote:
Seeing the full size files, this is clear cut for me. Jpg is not a
problem from a compression point of view, but creating the jpgs from the
camera is throwing away some of the information from the image capture
which can never be recovered. If you
- Original Message -
From: Jim Apilado [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 3:40 PM
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
I wonder how many users of digital equipment carry a white card to do
white
balancing? Just like how many digital slr users carry
On 13 Oct 2003 at 0:09, graywolf wrote:
Probably a Macbeth Color Checker.
Could also be an IT8.7/2 calibrated colour target too. I have a print (scanner
or digicam) and slide version, both come with calibration offsets on floppy and
can be used to produce a customised colour calibration
$79 !?!?!?!
Did he sell ANY?
-Original Message-
From: tom [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 13 October 2003 04:07
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
-Original Message-
From: Rob Studdert [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Auto may be OK when you
-Original Message-
From: tom [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 13 October 2003 04:07
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Here's what I do:
- Shoot raw, auto WB.
That's not always practical, but I have just ordered my second 1Gb card,
so with 2.5Gb total
Couple of dozen, al least.
tv
-Original Message-
From: Rob Brigham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
$79 !?!?!?!
Did he sell ANY?
-Original Message-
From: tom [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 13 October 2003 04:07
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital
-Original Message-
From: Rob Brigham [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Here's my little theory about WB - you don't need to worry
about it. What have print labs been doing for years? Working
with a media that is stuck on daylight balance but shot in a
multitude of conditions. If
Fair enough. My attitude is that I'm the expert on composing the shot,
there's a geek in a coat somewhere who's the expert on making a print.
I've got my job, he's got his.
tv
Tom,
In your position I would do the same thing. Since I'm doing my own
printing, I find it's often easier to
On Monday, Oct 13, 2003, at 02:31 America/New_York, Rob Studdert wrote:
Could also be an IT8.7/2 calibrated colour target too.
We used a Kodak Q13 chart in the PhaseOne training course. But then
again, this is a US$14,000 digicam with no auto white balance. :-)
Note: we used a Q13 rather than a
Tell me about it. I buy high density polyethylene (HDPE) for fixtures
and jigs for my woodworking, and its mighty expensive stuff. I buy it
on ebay sometimes and machine it to the right dimensions. Its perfect
for stable, low friction applications though. Plastic comes in many
flavors!
On 13/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
Yep everything is plastic these days, guns, supersonic aircraft,
blankets, your drawers, my teeth (grin). Funny thing is there are cheap
plastics and plastics that cost more than machined titanium. cheap and
plastic are not necessarily synonymous
On 13/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
That's not always practical, but I have just ordered my second 1Gb card,
so with 2.5Gb total I will be able to do it more often now.
Jumping Jupiter Rob. That's a heck of a lot of space! I have 2X 512 Mb
cards and I've yet to fill both in one sitting. In
On 13/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
Here's my little theory about WB - you don't need to worry
about it. What have print labs been doing for years? Working
with a media that is stuck on daylight balance but shot in a
multitude of conditions. If you're making prints, find an
expert
- Original Message -
From: Cotty
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
On 13/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
Yep everything is plastic these days, guns, supersonic aircraft,
blankets, your drawers, my teeth (grin). Funny thing is there are cheap
plastics and plastics that cost
- Original Message -
From: Cotty
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Jumping Jupiter Rob. That's a heck of a lot of space! I have 2X 512 Mb
cards and I've yet to fill both in one sitting. In fact I have only just
filled one in one sitting, if you see what I mean.
Canon also
that I do a lot of work with pocket PCs that use CF
cards at the moment makes it easier to get hold of them cheaply.
-Original Message-
From: William Robb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 13 October 2003 21:44
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
- Original
list
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
We were snigering more at his attitude. Basically he was
saying you
couldn't get acceptable images unless you did a WB with
a perfectly
white object.
Luckily, he had several hundred perfectly white objects
with him,
and he
OK, now we're getting to the part where my analysis has to be spot on.
Shooting motorsports, I'm not going to have time to review in camera.
Not something you want to do, in any case, with large heavy objects
whizzing by at 200mph. Not that I haven't seen people doing that;
sitting on the
On Mon, 13 Oct 2003 17:33:36 -0600, William Robb wrote:
I can't actually verify it with my own little eyes, is that the
fine JPEG save is pretty much indistinguishable from RAW.
As long as I can still do the manipulations I can foresee needing to
do, without going nuts, or spending more time
Hi John,
On Mon, 13 Oct 2003 20:36:27 -0400 (EDT), John Francis wrote:
Not that I haven't seen people doing that; sitting on the Jersey
barrier, back to traffic, paying no attention.
I don't even stand around with my back to traffic when I'm flagging
(unless I'm the yellow flagger). And I'm
*istD has a stainless steel chassis... vs a plastic chassis for Canon
D100, S2, Sigma, 10D and Digital Rebel have a plastic chassis
*istD has a MUCH larger and a spectacular viewfinder..vs all other DSLRs
*istD features glass pentaprism, like 10D has, better than Rebel's
penta-mirror
*istD has a stainless steel chassis... [snipped many
favorable comparisons] Rebel Digital feels cheap and plastiky
So, Bill, what's your point? vbg
Fred
Just trying to show why the *istD costs considerably more than the digital
Rebel.
Bill
- Original Message -
From: Fred [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 8:23 AM
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
*istD has a stainless steel chassis
Excellent Bill, I may even take this is to the kid and tell him to study it...
Vic
*istD has a stainless steel chassis... vs a plastic chassis for Canon
D100, S2, Sigma, 10D and Digital Rebel have a plastic chassis
*istD has a MUCH larger and a spectacular viewfinder..vs all other
On 12/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
*istD has a stainless steel chassis... vs a plastic chassis for Canon
D100, S2, Sigma, 10D and Digital Rebel have a plastic chassis
Hi Uncle Bill,
I agree with the trend of your argument but a point of information
regarding the above:
from
*istD is faster...faster in waking up and operating than Canon
the Canon takes a week and a half to wake up
Um, the 10D takes 3 seconds.
So does the 300D. ;)
*istD allows user to choose AF sensor(s) .. 'automatic'
with D Rebel
Not true. There are something like nine or
://jcoconnell.com
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 9:25 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Excellent Bill, I may even take
So, Bill, what's your point? vbg
Just trying to show why the *istD costs considerably more than the
digital Rebel.
I understand, Bill - I was just kidding you (notice the vbg
after my query). Please know that I was ~not~ questioning the worth
of your post. On the contrary, I do agree that
- Original Message -
From: J. C. O'Connell
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
So it's OK to add all these features and drive up the
cost of the *istD to all buyers but adding the $10.00 K/M
lense compatibility was off-limits???
John, stop pulling numbers out of your ass
- Original Message -
From: tom
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Do people have a feel for how long a set of batteries last?
Not long. I don't think a set of 4 AA NIMH batteries would go for more than
a hundred and fifty shots. Mine shows low battery after about 75, but seems
- Original Message -
From: Cotty
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
The Rebel may have a plastic chassis but the 10D (and D30/60) do not.
The Rebel D apparently has a stainless steel frame holding the sensor and
lens mount in registration.
At least thats what I've been told
- Original Message -
From: Amita Guha
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Not true. There are something like nine or ten AF sensors to choose from
on the 300D.
The 300D has nicer buttons for choosing this stuff too. The 4 way rocker on
the ist D is kind of fiddly.
William Robb
In article [EMAIL PROTECTED],
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Bill Owens) wrote:
*istD has interchangeable screens... competitors don't
It does? Nothing about it in my manual. Do you mean the variable diopter
setting on the viewfinder?
---
John Dallman [EMAIL
-Original Message-
From: William Robb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
The 10D has good access to WB. I'm not sure that the
ist-D could be
any easier.
The ist D is pretty easy. Set the control wheel to WB, turn
the front dial
(I think) to the white balance you want, and go.
On the
- Original Message -
From: John Dallman
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
*istD has interchangeable screens... competitors don't
It does? Nothing about it in my manual. Do you mean the variable diopter
setting on the viewfinder?
Cool. I just had a look, and it sure
- Original Message -
From: tom
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
On the 10D you hit the WB button, spin a dial. The slected WB is
always displayed on the top panel.
It sounds like there isn't really any advantage to one or the other. They
are both getting there in much the same
-Original Message-
From: William Robb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 1:51 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
- Original Message -
From: J. C. O'Connell
Subject: RE
A.
From: William Robb [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 12:15:58 -0600
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Resent-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Resent-Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 14:15:59 -0400
- Original Message -
From: tom
Subject
On 12/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
I wonder how many users of digital equipment carry a white card to do white
balancing? Just like how many digital slr users carry a light meter around
with them all the time so they can get more accurate metering that their
dslr doesn't seemingly give
.
If you have to think about white balance, then setting it from something
white is pretty easy and more consistent than any other method.
-Original Message-
From: Jim Apilado [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 12 October 2003 20:40
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
On 12/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
Do people have a feel for how long a set of batteries last?
Not long. I don't think a set of 4 AA NIMH batteries would
go for more than
a hundred and fifty shots. Mine shows low battery after
about 75, but seems
to keep going for quite a while
The istD grip doesn't have any batteries integral. It takes 4 AAs just
like the body. These last the same as the ones in the body. If you
have both (first Pentax grip where you can keep the batts in the body?)
then it uses them in parrallel. Number of shots depends on the batts
used.
PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
-Original Message-
From: Jim Apilado [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 3:40 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
I wonder how many users of digital equipment carry a white
card
- the kids always want to see the pic right after I have taken
it!
-Original Message-
From: William Robb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 12 October 2003 18:45
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
- Original Message -
From: tom
Subject: RE: *istD vs
On 12/10/03, [EMAIL PROTECTED] disgorged:
Nope, I don't mean the diopter adjustment. If you have one, pull the lens
off and look up at the screen. You'll see the little metal thingy that is
used to hold the screen in place.
Cool. One of you guys is going to *have* to pull that sucker outa
I wonder how many users of digital equipment carry a white card to do white
balancing? Just like how many digital slr users carry a light meter around
with them all the time so they can get more accurate metering that their
dslr doesn't seemingly give them. Lots of extra stuff to carry.
Let's not mince words, Wheatfield.
HAR.
-Original Message-
From: William Robb [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 12-Oct-03 10:51
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
- Original Message -
From: J. C. O'Connell
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
So it's
Not me - I know (from experience) better than to start something which
will take hours to fix this close to sleep time!
-Original Message-
From: Cotty [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 12 October 2003 23:02
To: pentax list
Subject: Re: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
On 12/10/03, [EMAIL
On 12 Oct 2003 at 12:40, Jim Apilado wrote:
I wonder how many users of digital equipment carry a white card to do white
balancing? Just like how many digital slr users carry a light meter around
with them all the time so they can get more accurate metering that their
dslr doesn't seemingly
On 12 Oct 2003 at 18:04, John Francis wrote:
Not really. The other side of the grey card you carry for reflected light
metering is a white card that can be used for white balance.
My Kodak grey card isn't white (or grey) enough to make a good balance from, I
can't white balance from a white
On 12 Oct 2003 at 16:28, tom wrote:
No one that I know.
I actually went to a digital seminar thingie a while back which was
basically a front for this guy to sell his *really* white white-card.
He claimed you couldn't do proper photography without one. I was
with a bunch of photographer
2003 16:28:30 -0400
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Resent-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Resent-Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 16:24:59 -0400
-Original Message-
From: Jim Apilado [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October 12, 2003 3:40 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED
Here's my little theory about WB - you don't need to worry about it.
What have print labs been doing for years? Working with a media that
is stuck on daylight balance but shot in a multitude of conditions. If
you're making prints, find an expert printer and let him do his job.
Yep. I must
You have to buy the vertical grip to get a PC terminal on a D100, but
yes it it available though $150 seems like a lot to pay for a PC
terminal (grin).
Heiko Hamann wrote:
Hi Cotty,
on 12 Oct 03 you wrote in pentax.list:
The Rebel may have a plastic chassis but the 10D (and D30/60) do not.
Yep everything is plastic these days, guns, supersonic aircraft,
blankets, your drawers, my teeth (grin). Funny thing is there are cheap
plastics and plastics that cost more than machined titanium. cheap and
plastic are not necessarily synonymous anymore (look at the price of
those teeth).
PROTECTED]
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 16:28:30 -0400
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: RE: *istD vs. Digital Rebel
Resent-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Resent-Date: Sun, 12 Oct 2003 16:24:59 -0400
-Original Message-
From: Jim Apilado [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, October
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