A couple of days ago the BBC carried a persuasive interview from a
well-educated representative of the independent Kurdish area in norther
Iraq, emphasising they have established a modern secularised society. He
stressed how destructive it is for them to have continued attacks from the
radical
Apologies for our oversight. This reply is to
Louis Proyect, not Bill Lear
Jonathan Nitzan wrote:
-
Louis Proyect wrote on PEN-L:
Basically, I believe that they overstate the level
of autonomy in the oil and arms sector. In the crudest expression
Jonathan Nitzan wrote:
So just to clear the waters, ours is anything but a conspiracy
theory. It deals with conspiracy among other things, sure. But so
should any theory of capitalist history. The key point is that we deal
with facts, and we make refutable propositions. They may be wrong,
my favorite piece of research shows that duct tape is good for almost everything except fixing leaky heat ducts. Jim
Can we use it to stop the war? jksDo you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
Who said:
Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of
the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to
drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist dictatorship,
or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the
yes, put the
duct tape over the mouths noses of all the Bushwackers -- except the
President himself, of course --so that they can't tell him to go to war.
Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://bellarmine.lmu.edu/~jdevine
-Original Message-From: andie nachgeborenen
Title: RE: [PEN-L:34602] Today's quiz
Goering? Goebbels? (BTW, what's the source?)
Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://bellarmine.lmu.edu/~jdevine
-Original Message-
From: Forstater, Mathew [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, February 12,
goehring
On Wed, Feb 12, 2003 at 10:06:22AM -0600, Forstater, Mathew wrote:
Who said:
Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's the leaders of
the country who determine the policy, and it's always a simple matter to
drag the people along whether it's a democracy, a fascist
Gil Skillman wrote:
Ravi writes, among other things:
russell attempted to avoid the circularity by introducing a theory of
types, but then came godel's incompleteness demonstration and the end of
the golden age of mathematics-logic ;-).
Well, perhaps not. It's possible that Russell's
Goering is right. Is it that well-known or is it going around the net?
Or are you guys really, really smart?
Title: RE: [PEN-L:34607] RE: Re: Today's quiz
I really wonder if it's really Goering, since a few years ago there was a spurious (and similar) quote from Hitler floating about. (My copy of THEY DIDN'T SAY THAT, which debunks famous quotes is at home.)
Jim Devine
Title: RE: [PEN-L:34607] RE: Re: Today's quiz
One of the Urban legends sites says it is actually
true.
-Original Message-
From: Devine, James
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003
10:43 AM
To: '[EMAIL PROTECTED]'
Subject: [PEN-L:34609] RE: RE: Re:
Jim wanted the source. Apparently it was from the Nuremburg trials,
although a very similar statement is in In War. Since you guys think
you are so hot, try this one:
Now I am prowling through the backyard and I am hiding under the car
and I've gotten out of everything I've gotten into so far
[New York Times]
February 12, 2003
Arms Makers See Great Potential in India Market
By SARITHA RAI
BANGALORE, India, Feb. 11 - Leading military equipment makers from around the
globe are aggressively promoting their products to India's huge defense
market, with its $100 billion in expected
Forstater, Mathew wrote:
Goering is right. Is it that well-known or is it going around the net?
Or are you guys really, really smart?
it is going around the net. and independently, yes, we guys are really,
really smart - which is why we spend our time debating formal logic
rather than
- Original Message -
From: ravi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
it is going around the net. and independently, yes, we guys are really,
really smart - which is why we spend our time debating formal logic
rather than protesting on the streets! ;-) (running for cover),
--ravi
LP writes:
I believe that Lenin
characterized the state as the executive committee of the bourgeoisie.
I don't know
what Lenin said exactly (since the archive at http://www.marxists.org/lacks his
STATE REVOLUTION for some unknown reason), but in the MANIFESTO, Marx and
Engels wrote
- Original Message -
From: Devine, James [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Please correct me if I am wrong.
I thought you wanted to stop the discussion, Ecclesiastes.
Ian Murray wrote:
- Original Message -
From: ravi [EMAIL PROTECTED]
it is going around the net. and independently, yes, we guys are really,
really smart - which is why we spend our time debating formal logic
rather than protesting on the streets! ;-) (running for cover),
Some of us
Origins: Another
timely quote in the vein of the apocryphal Julius Caesar warning about political leaders who can all too easily send the citizenry marching eagerly off to war by manufacturing crises that purportedly threaten national security and making popular appeals to patriotism. In
Title: RE: [PEN-L:34616] Re: doublethink
no, I only wanted to stop the discussion if the concept of paraconsistent logic remained undefined, vague, confusing, etc., with no specific example of any sort.
Jim Devine [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Title: RE: Today's quiz
no insult taken. I am very upset that I won't be able to attend the demo, since I'm flying to New York (on a red-eye!) to see my father-in-law inducted into the Toy-makers' Hall of Fame (for inventing the yacket-yak teeth, among other things) and then flying home
no insult taken. I am very upset that I won't be able
to attend the demo, since I'm flying to New York (on
a red-eye!) to see my father-in-law inducted into the
Toy-makers' Hall of Fame (for inventing the
yacket-yak teeth, among other things) and then flying
home almost immediately.
jeepers,
- Original Message -
From: Devine, James [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Wednesday, February 12, 2003 9:32 AM
Subject: [PEN-L:34619] RE: Re: doublethink
no, I only wanted to stop the discussion if the concept of paraconsistent
logic remained undefined, vague, confusing,
Devine, James wrote:
LP writes: I believe that Lenin characterized the state as the
executive committee of the bourgeoisie.
I don't know what Lenin said exactly (since the archive at
http://www.marxists.org/http://www.marxists.org/ lacks his STATE
REVOLUTION for some unknown reason), but
Title: kinder, gentler fascism
I sent the following message from Dan Scanlan to our Progressive
Caucus. Bill Moul in PolSCI commented:
Dear Bob; have not read all of this
BUT Hitler not elected to position of Chancellor. Appointed
January 30, 1933 by President. Nazi Party never elected to
At 05:11 PM 02/11/2003 -0800, you wrote:
Sorry about linear algebra. You didn't find eigenvectors beautiful?
No, but it may have had to do with my math teacher, he seemed to be
sleeping through the class too.
Joanna
In a message dated 2/12/03 10:40:35 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Devine, James wrote:
LP writes: I believe that Lenin characterized the state as the
executive committee of the bourgeoisie.
>From the Communist Manifesto: Section 1
Each step in the development of the
Doug Henwood wrote:
And, if I'm remembering right, ME emphasize the *executive* branch, not
the whole of the state, because they thought parliaments were open to
popular democratic influence.
It is doubtful to me that Marx or Engels ever formulated anything in
terms of popular democratic
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=storyncid=586e=3cid=586u=/nm/20030212/wl_nm/belgium_israel_sharon_dc
Belgian Court: Sharon Can Be Probed After Office
By Tom Miles
BRUSSELS (Reuters) - Belgium's supreme appeals court ruled Wednesday
that a genocide lawsuit against Ariel Sharon (news - web
Devine, James wrote:
It's notable in the Marx/Engels quote that it doesn't say that the
executive committee manages the common affairs of the bourgeoisie
_well_.
Yes. This needs extension: all human activity is clearly subject to
error, and almost any human activity of any complexity
(WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Americans have apparently heeded the U.S. government's
advice to prepare for terror attacks, emptying hardware store shelves of
duct tape. . .)
Now that duct tape is key to our survival, you might want to listen to the
classic, Duct Tape Blues.
It is a free MP3
At 11:28 AM 02/12/2003 -0500, you wrote:
which leads to einstein: insofar as the expressions of mathematics refer
to reality, they are not certain, and insofar as they are certain, they
do not refer to reality (which i am sure begs the question of reality
- is reimann geometry, which ironically,
Joanna wrote:
It only begs the question of reality if you assume reality to be
real only insofar as it is immutable. However, if reality is
continually changing/flowing, then mathematics might describe the
relations that power that change...which wouldn't be the same thing
at all as getting
Title: RE: [PEN-L:34622] Re: RE: Re: doublethink
I wrote:
no, I only wanted to stop the discussion if the concept of paraconsistent
logic remained undefined, vague, confusing, etc., with no specific example
of any sort.
Ian writes:
And I provided the list -including you- with a set
Presentation of the Question: The Aristocracy of Labor and Lenin's "Imperialism and the Split In Socialism," written 1916.
Let us begin with what Lenin wrote and not what someone said Lenin meant.
"The proletariat is the child of capitalism -- of world capitalism, and not only of European
Ken Hanly reposts Farrakhan:
No wonder he doesnt get much press coverage any more!
...Let's go to Nigeria. There's some sweet oil here. Do you know
what America tried to do? They tried to separate the eastern region
and call it Biafra, which started a civil war in Nigeria, causing
thousands
Part 2
"On December 7, 1889, Engels wrote to Sorge: "The most repulsive thing here [in England] is the bourgeois 'respectability', which has grown deep into the bones of the workers Even Tom Mann, whom I regard as the best of the lot, is fond of mentioning that he will be lunching with the
Part 3
Let us return to what Lenin wrote and not a paraphrase or what some said Lenin said.
" . . .Imperialism is monopoly capitalism. Every cartel, trust, syndicate, every giant bank is a monopoly Super profits have not disappeared; they still remain. The exploitation of all other countries
Well he has the players sides wrong that is true but he has the oil part
right, something ignored in your post. Is all the rest of his post a lie
too? While ethnic hatreds were a factor in the Biafran conflict, ownership
of regional resources such as oil were also important.
Full article is at:
Louis Proyect wrote:
Doug Henwood wrote:
And, if I'm remembering right, ME emphasize the *executive* branch, not
the whole of the state, because they thought parliaments were open to
popular democratic influence.
It is doubtful to me that Marx or Engels ever formulated anything in
According to other sources the US position was contradictory and the US did
provide humanitarian aid, in fact was one of Biafra's chief benefactors. No
doubt it wanted to have influence over oil resources no matter who won the
battle. The excerpt is from a review of a book on the Biafran conflict.
Choler Cox:
Lou, stop reading Doug. You make an ass of yourself everytimne you do.
(And he makes an ass of himself everytime he reads you.)
And you stop reading me, you old goat.
ME did assume legislatures could be influenced in a way that the
executive branch could not be. This habit of
Sorry of these have already
been dug out:
The state is a machine for
maintaining the rule of one class over another. Lenin, The State, 1975, p. 11.
The state is a product and manifestation
of the *irreconcilability* of class contradictions. Lenin, The State and Revolution, 1976, p.
- Original Message -
From: Carrol Cox [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hauling in Mouffe Laclau here shows the reading and analytic ability
of a english 101 student.
Carrol
===
Unilateralism lives
cool it boys.
On Wed, Feb 12, 2003 at 05:57:47PM -0500, Louis Proyect wrote:
Choler Cox:
Lou, stop reading Doug. You make an ass of yourself everytimne you do.
(And he makes an ass of himself everytime he reads you.)
And you stop reading me, you old goat.
ME did assume legislatures could
Verified by VisaHermann Goering
Claim: Hermann Goering proclaimed that although the people don't want
war, they can always be brought to the bidding of their leaders.
Status: True.
Example: [Collected on the Internet, 2002]
Of course the people don't want war. But after all, it's
[more on the no new things under the sun category]
[Washington Post]
No Bottom To This Barrel
By Anne Applebaum
Wednesday, February 12, 2003; Page A29
As I write these words, a dusty, year-old copy of the Budget of the United
States Government, Fiscal Year 2003 sits beside me on my desk. There
I would like to see a law that requires every representative to read and
pass a comprehension test on every bill which they vote on.
--
Michael Perelman
Economics Department
California State University
Chico, CA 95929
Tel. 530-898-5321
E-Mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Since you guys think
you are so hot, try this one:
Now I am prowling through the backyard and I am hiding under the car
and I've gotten out of everything I've gotten into so far and I eat when
I am hungry and I travel alone.
Hint, everybody: notice how a lot of the phrase rhymes, sort of
Virtue by Ani DiFranco
virtue is relative at best there's nothing worse than a sunset when you're driving due west and i'm afraid that my love is gonna come up short there is no there there i guess i'm scared cuz i want to have good news to !
report every time i come up for air now i'm
Would your hops be that it would pass because they wouldn't or couldn't read it? jks
Michael Perelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I would like to see a law that requires every representative to read andpass a comprehension test on every bill which they vote on.-- Michael PerelmanEconomics
that it would not pass.
On Wed, Feb 12, 2003 at 04:16:07PM -0800, andie nachgeborenen wrote:
Would your hops be that it would pass because they wouldn't or couldn't read it? jks
Michael Perelman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:I would like to see a law that
requires every representative to read and
Besides the peace resolution, unanimously Santa Monica City Council
late last night also passed the following resolution:
A RESOLUTION OF THE CITY OF SANTA MONICA AFFIRMING THE CITY'S STRONG
COMMITMENT TO CIVIL LIBERTIES, OPPOSING THE USA PATRIOT ACT AND
RELATED ORDERS AND DIRECTIVES, AND
At 12/02/03 10:41 -0600, Matthew wrote:
Jim wanted the source. Apparently it was from the Nuremburg trials,
although a very similar statement is in In War. Since you guys think
you are so hot, try this one:
Now I am prowling through the backyard and I am hiding under the car
and I've gotten out
At 12/02/03 13:52 -0500, Melvin wrote:
The executive of the modern
state is but a committee for managing the common affairs of the whole
bourgeoisie.
Or the state as the executive committee of the bourgeoisie,
in slang or Marxist short-speak.
IMO the shortened version is potentially risky. It
US opponents in NATO hold out for a third day. This looks like a signal
they will take their stand to the Security Council.
This could split NATO and the Atlantic Alliance.
We are moving to a world of the balance of power. A coalition of states
repeatedly bent on obstructing US power could
An assault on poverty is vital too
It's simple - we have to double aid to halve global suffering
Gordon Brown
Thursday February 13, 2003
The Guardian
In Africa the struggle that matters is the struggle for survival. With 14
million men, women and children in sub-Saharan Africa facing desperate
WTO calls for cuts in farm subsidies
Charlotte Denny
Thursday February 13, 2003
The Guardian
The World Trade Organisation put itself on a collision course with Brussels
yesterday when it demanded sweeping cuts in the common agricultural policy as
part of a package of measures to speed up global
Title: He should know
from VHeadline.com
US Central
Intelligence Agency (CIA) director forecasts more political violence
in Venezuela
Speaking to the
US Senate Intelligence Committee, CIA director George Tenet forecasts
a rise in political violence in Venezuela, owing to entrenched
positions
In a message dated 2/12/03 5:15:10 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
At 12/02/03 13:52 -0500, Melvin wrote:
"The executive of the modern state is but a committee for managing the common affairs of the whole bourgeoisie."
"Or the state as the executive committee of the
Scheduling War
By Michael T. Klare
Michael T. Klare is a professor of peace and world security studies at
Hampshire College in Amherst, Mass., and the author of Resource Wars: The
New Landscape of Global Conflict (2001 Owl Books / Henry Holt).
For months, the attention of much of the world has
Is there a white wage? Well whites generally make 1/3 more than blacks, but that is not the same as saying there is a white wage. What that says is that the result of racism is that less whites form the core of the working class. More whites are likely to be employed in professions, as managers,
Getting Paid in China: Matter of Life and Death
Suicide Threats Rise as Employers Deny Wages
By Philip P. Pan
Washington Post Foreign Service
Thursday, February 13, 2003; Page A16
GUANGZHOU, China -- Yao Xinde sat dazed on the roof of the student dormitory
he helped build, gazing into the dark
[New York Times]
February 13, 2003
Republicans Back Down on Raising Farm Aid
By ELIZABETH BECKER
WASHINGTON, Feb. 12 - Vice President Dick Cheney persuaded Congressional
Republicans today to drop plans for adding new farm subsidies, stepping into a
domestic political argument while trying to
I heard they are using the words Duck and cover in Iraqi schools, are ther any sources?Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Shopping - Send Flowers for Valentine's Day
Lenin wrote a lot of material in the year 1916, not just "Imperialism and the Split in Socialism." The passages below are from "A Caricature of Marxism and Imperialist Economism."
"Is the actual condition of the workers in the oppressor and in the oppressed nations the same, from the standpoint
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