Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
No I mean EDIT DELTE. After that you get a other cursor, and you can click on different tracks or so to delete. Mark E Witherite [EMAIL PROTECTED] 08.02.2002 15:13 Please respond to Protel EDA Forum To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject:Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks You Mean Edit CUT don't you. At 06:55 AM 2/8/02 +0100, you wrote: Do you try EDIT-DELETE ? Harald Bryn Wolfe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07.02.2002 17:42 Please respond to Protel EDA Forum To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject:[PEDA] Removing virtual tracks I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. Any ideas? Bryn Wolfe Mark Witherite C.I.D. Assistant Research Engineer Astronomy Astrophysics Penn State University 2565 Park Center Blvd Suite 200 State College, PA. 16801 email [EMAIL PROTECTED] telephone 814 865 9839 fax 814 865 9100 * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
I just tried EDIT-DELETE, and drawing a track beginning at the virtual point - highlight - delete, and they both worked if the begin-end points were on-grid. -Original Message- From: Mark E Witherite [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 6:14 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks You Mean Edit CUT don't you. At 06:55 AM 2/8/02 +0100, you wrote: Do you try EDIT-DELETE ? Harald * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
As I mentioned previously, editing and deleting zero-length track is not difficult *if* you can find the track, unless it is small compared to snap. The difficulty is finding it. Right now the only comprehensive way I would know to find all zero-length track is to copy a spreadsheet dump of track coordinates into Excel and subtract the starting coordinates from the corresponding end coordinates. If both results are zero, then the track is zero-length. If the difference is even 1 microinch or 10 nanometers, the track will display. I did not test smaller differences One of the coordinates can then be altered, even if only slightly, which will cause the track to display. But if you want to find and get rid of such track easily, I'd suggest editing one coordinate pair to 0,0 (in the spreadsheet) and then update the PCB from the spreadsheet. (Using the spreadsheet to change the PCB is a fairly obscure process, especially if the data is coming from outside, as it might be in this case; we have described at length how to do it in other recent posts.) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Abdulrahman Lomax Easthampton, Massachusetts USA * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
It was quite simple in these cases (including the original post) as there was a net assigned, and so a rats nest going to that point. Yes, if there is a no-net version, there would be little way of knowing without some utility. -Original Message- From: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, February 08, 2002 12:20 PM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks As I mentioned previously, editing and deleting zero-length track is not difficult *if* you can find the track, unless it is small compared to snap. The difficulty is finding it. Right now the only comprehensive way I would know to find all zero-length track is to copy a spreadsheet dump of track coordinates into Excel and subtract the starting coordinates from the corresponding end coordinates. If both results are zero, then the track is zero-length. If the difference is even 1 microinch or 10 nanometers, the track will display. I did not test smaller differences One of the coordinates can then be altered, even if only slightly, which will cause the track to display. But if you want to find and get rid of such track easily, I'd suggest editing one coordinate pair to 0,0 (in the spreadsheet) and then update the PCB from the spreadsheet. (Using the spreadsheet to change the PCB is a fairly obscure process, especially if the data is coming from outside, as it might be in this case; we have described at length how to do it in other recent posts.) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Abdulrahman Lomax Easthampton, Massachusetts USA * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
[PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. Any ideas? Bryn Wolfe * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. Any ideas? Hi Bryn, If you know where it exists on the board, maybe doing a delete all inside around that area would work? --- Phil mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
If its assigned to a net, and it must be if its got a ratnest:- XA to un-select all. use the net browse box to select the offding net by double clicking on the net name and checking the selected box. then shift delete delete to delete selected items. -Original Message- From: Bryn Wolfe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: 07 February 2002 16:43 To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. Any ideas? Bryn Wolfe * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
Bryn Wolfe wrote: I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. What you should do is to move endpoint any other track segments that join to the troublesome track. Then, you should be able to see the bad one as a 'dot'. You should then be able to select it and delete it. I'm assuming this is a zero-length track of finite width. If you have made a zero-width track, you may need a different way to get rid of it. I'd select the net, and global edit all selected tracks to the correct width, then you should be able to see and alter the segment in question. Jon * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
I have not tried this but select any track and then do a global to select if the track width matches 0. Then only the 0 width stuff will be selected. Ctrl Delete kills it. Add a net name to the selection criteria if you want but I would figure you want to kill any zero width tracks regardless of net association. Charlie -Original Message- From: Bryn Wolfe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Thursday, February 07, 2002 11:43 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. Any ideas? Bryn Wolfe * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
Bryn, Lots of good ideas are getting posted on this one, I was wondering can you draw a track with the same characteristics somewhere you can easily get at it and select it with global? Then you should be able to delete it and the offending track. Just a thought. Jim McGrath CAD Connections, Inc. Bryn Wolfe wrote: I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. Any ideas? Bryn Wolfe * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
At 04:01 PM 2/7/2002 -0500, Jenkins, Charlie wrote: I have not tried this but select any track and then do a global to select if the track width matches 0. Then only the 0 width stuff will be selected. The track in this case was zero length, not zero width. Global edit will not catch this. Protel (incorrectly, in my opinion, does not display a zero length track. This is particularly anomalous because zero-length draws in gerber *are* drawn (and the result is as if the aperture were flashed). So if you import a gerber file with a zero-length track, that is, a draw with the same starting and ending point, it will become a zero-length track in Protel that does not display. [Zero width track, incidentally, *does* display with a single pixel from whatever zoom, and it can readily be selected. And it plots, with a zero diameter aperture. I consider this correct behavior.] There should be an option (under Preferences) to automatically delete zero-length track when it is created by an edit. Existing zero-length track should be respected, display, plotted, DRC'd, etc. There are various methods to select zero-length tracks. It is not necessary to go to the ASCII database and, in fact, it would not be completely straightforward to find such track, (It would not be difficult in Excel or other spreadsheet, including the Protel spreadsheet, one could calculate track length and sort the records on that basis. The Protel spreadsheet, unfortunately, does not allow the setting of the selection field, as I recall. But you could give the track some length by changing one coordinate to a weird value, like 99.999, which could then be the object of a global edit, if one was still necessary) As to the behavior of zero-length track: When moving the endpoint of a track, the track disappears as the cursor is moved to the endpoint of the track. I find that the track will edit normally, but because it is invisible, it may be difficult to place the cursor on the track to select and edit it. The Query Manager cannot be used to select this track because the Query Manager does not allow formulas or variables in the selection fields, nor is track length one of the allowed variables. I was able to make the track visible in the following way: I placed a large pad on the track, which took on the track's net. Immediately when the pad was released, the pad became visible, because primitives of the same net as a primitive with the focus display highlighted. If the pad is No Net, however, this does not work directly. A new pad of a different net, violating against the No Net pad, shows a DRC error, but the zero-length track does not display the error. The Violations Browse gives (in Details) the coordinates of the zero-length track, which could then be used by the Query Manager to select it. There may well be a fast way to find this track and select it for deletion. If it were easy to use formulas in the spreadsheet, that might cut it. Any clues? (I know I could do it in Excel, but it would be much faster if the native spreadsheet could be used.) The problem is that the spreadsheet includes units in the coordinates, so a direct subtraction does not work. I could not find a *simple* way to convert the coordinate text to an actual number. Sure, I could parse the strings, but, hey, if you are going to feed us numbers with units, fix the spreadsheet so that it will do math on numbers with units!!! (All is forgiven if there is a simple function I overlooked. Some forms of Basic will evaluate strings to numbers by ignoring any text characters beyond the numbers. That's all that would be needed. On the other hand, if there is a function, no kudos to the documentation people (does Protel have documentation people?) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Abdulrahman Lomax Easthampton, Massachusetts USA * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
Slightly to the side of the topic, but... I have had in the past, great problems with connections (in the ratsnest layer) going off to a point, that probably had a track in the past. Based on what you've said below, I guess the track became zero length in the process of cleaning up, but then later, adjacent tracks were deleted. I'm then left with zero length track on the net, that I can't delete, select, or even see! I'd love to be able to clean this up. Till later, Scott. ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø Scott May. Hydrographic Support 1345 Ipswich Road Rocklea. Ph +617 3892 5610 Fax +617 3848 5191 Mob 0417 195 018 [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] ¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø,¸¸,ø¤º°`°º¤ø -Original Message- From: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] Sent: Friday, 8 February 2002 10:45 AM To: Protel EDA Forum Subject:Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks At 04:01 PM 2/7/2002 -0500, Jenkins, Charlie wrote: I have not tried this but select any track and then do a global to select if the track width matches 0. Then only the 0 width stuff will be selected. The track in this case was zero length, not zero width. Global edit will not catch this. Protel (incorrectly, in my opinion, does not display a zero length track. This is particularly anomalous because zero-length draws in gerber *are* drawn (and the result is as if the aperture were flashed). So if you import a gerber file with a zero-length track, that is, a draw with the same starting and ending point, it will become a zero-length track in Protel that does not display. [Zero width track, incidentally, *does* display with a single pixel from whatever zoom, and it can readily be selected. And it plots, with a zero diameter aperture. I consider this correct behavior.] There should be an option (under Preferences) to automatically delete zero-length track when it is created by an edit. Existing zero-length track should be respected, display, plotted, DRC'd, etc. There are various methods to select zero-length tracks. It is not necessary to go to the ASCII database and, in fact, it would not be completely straightforward to find such track, (It would not be difficult in Excel or other spreadsheet, including the Protel spreadsheet, one could calculate track length and sort the records on that basis. The Protel spreadsheet, unfortunately, does not allow the setting of the selection field, as I recall. But you could give the track some length by changing one coordinate to a weird value, like 99.999, which could then be the object of a global edit, if one was still necessary) As to the behavior of zero-length track: When moving the endpoint of a track, the track disappears as the cursor is moved to the endpoint of the track. I find that the track will edit normally, but because it is invisible, it may be difficult to place the cursor on the track to select and edit it. The Query Manager cannot be used to select this track because the Query Manager does not allow formulas or variables in the selection fields, nor is track length one of the allowed variables. I was able to make the track visible in the following way: I placed a large pad on the track, which took on the track's net. Immediately when the pad was released, the pad became visible, because primitives of the same net as a primitive with the focus display highlighted. If the pad is No Net, however, this does not work directly. A new pad of a different net, violating against the No Net pad, shows a DRC error, but the zero-length track does not display the error. The Violations Browse gives (in Details) the coordinates of the zero-length track, which could then be used by the Query Manager to select it. There may well be a fast way to find this track and select it for deletion. If it were easy to use formulas in the spreadsheet, that might cut it. Any clues? (I know I could do it in Excel, but it would be much faster if the native spreadsheet could be used.) The problem is that the spreadsheet includes units in the coordinates, so a direct subtraction does not work. I could not find a *simple* way to convert the coordinate text to an actual number. Sure, I could parse the strings, but, hey, if you are going to feed us numbers with units, fix the spreadsheet so that it will do math on numbers with units!!! (All is forgiven if there is a simple function I overlooked. Some forms of Basic will evaluate strings to numbers by ignoring any text characters beyond the numbers. That's all that would be needed. On the other hand, if there is a function, no kudos to the documentation people (does Protel have documentation people?) [EMAIL PROTECTED] Abdulrahman Lomax Easthampton, Massachusetts USA The information in this e-mail together with any attachments is intended only for the person or entity
Re: [PEDA] Removing virtual tracks
Do you try EDIT-DELETE ? Harald Bryn Wolfe [EMAIL PROTECTED] 07.02.2002 17:42 Please respond to Protel EDA Forum To: Protel EDA Forum [EMAIL PROTECTED] cc: Subject:[PEDA] Removing virtual tracks I've got a track on my PCB that has zero size that I'm having trouble deleting from the board. It's the result of accidentally grabbing one end of a track and placing it at the same location as the other end of the track. The ratsnest shows the connectivity but it isn't selectable and thus, not deletable. I would have done an undo to fix it, but apparently my undo history wasn't big enough. Any ideas? Bryn Wolfe * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * To post a message: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * To leave this list visit: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/leave.html * * Contact the list manager: * mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] * * Forum Guidelines Rules: * http://www.techservinc.com/protelusers/forumrules.html * * Browse or Search previous postings: * http://www.mail-archive.com/proteledaforum@techservinc.com * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
