Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-27 Thread PJ Eby
On Mon, Mar 26, 2012 at 11:23 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull step...@xemacs.orgwrote: On Tue, Mar 27, 2012 at 1:35 AM, PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com wrote: On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 2:56 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull step...@xemacs.org wrote: But since he's arguing the other end in the directory

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-27 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
On Wed, Mar 28, 2012 at 4:45 AM, PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com wrote: [ body { width: 65em; } ] won't work - it'll make the entire page that width, instead of just text paragraphs. True (I realized that might be bad in many cases later -- should have tested first rather than posting something

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Matt Joiner
FWIW it doesn't hurt to err on the side of what worked. i have generally have issues with low contrast, the current stable design is very good with this. i've just built the docs from tip, and the nav bar issue is fixed, nicely done i also don't see any reason to backport theme changes, +0

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Scott Dial
On 3/26/2012 1:00 AM, Greg Ewing wrote: This seems to be another case of the designer over-specifying things. The page should just specify a sans-serif font and let the browser choose the best one available. Or not specify a font at all and leave it up to the user whether he wants serif or

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Zvezdan Petkovic
On Mar 26, 2012, at 12:22 AM, Terry Reedy wrote: Does the css specify Courier New or is this an unfortunate fallback that might be improved? Perhaps things look better on max/*nix? I just checked pydoctheme.css and Courier New is not specified there. It only specifies monospace. That's a

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Matt Joiner
the text in the nav bar is too small, particularly in the search box. ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe:

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread R. David Murray
On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 08:44:40 -0400, Scott Dial scott+python-...@scottdial.com wrote: Why even bother formatting the page? The web started out as *content markup*. Functional declarations, not style declarations. I wish it had stayed that way, but it was inevitable that it would not. The

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Terry Reedy
On 3/26/2012 8:46 AM, Zvezdan Petkovic wrote: On Mar 26, 2012, at 12:22 AM, Terry Reedy wrote: Does the css specify Courier New or is this an unfortunate fallback that might be improved? Perhaps things look better on max/*nix? I just checked pydoctheme.css and Courier New is not specified

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread PJ Eby
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 2:56 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull step...@xemacs.orgwrote: But since he's arguing the other end in the directory layout thread (where he says there are many special ways to invoke Python so that having different layouts on different platforms is easy to work around), I

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread Andrea Crotti
On 03/24/2012 03:30 AM, PJ Eby wrote: Weird - I have the exact *opposite* problem, where I have to resize my window because somebody *didn't* set their text max-width sanely (to a reasonable value based on ems instead of pixels), and I have nearly 1920 pixels of raw text spanning my screen.

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread PJ Eby
On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 8:41 PM, Ben Finney ben+pyt...@benfinney.id.auwrote: PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com writes: On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Greg Ewing greg.ew...@canterbury.ac.nz wrote: If you don't want 1920-pixel-wide text, why make your browser window that large? Not

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread R. David Murray
On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 12:55:42 -0400, PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com wrote: On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 8:41 PM, Ben Finney ben+pyt...@benfinney.id.auwrote: So, again, why make your browser window *for reading text* that large? Because I have one browser window, and it's maximized. And I can do

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread Glenn Linderman
On 3/26/2012 10:19 AM, R. David Murray wrote: Like Philip, I have*one* window. My window manager (ratpoison) is more like 'screen' for X: you*can* split the window up, but it is*much* more useful to have only one window visible at a time, most of the time. I'm amazed at the number of

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread Ethan Furman
Glenn Linderman wrote: On 3/26/2012 10:19 AM, R. David Murray wrote: Like Philip, I have *one* window. My window manager (ratpoison) is more like 'screen' for X: you *can* split the window up, but it is *much* more useful to have only one window visible at a time, most of the time. I'm

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Ethan Furman
Georg Brandl wrote: On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback. I've committed the new design to 3.2 and 3.3 for now, and it will be live for the 3.3 docs momentarily (3.2 isn't rebuilt at the moment until 3.2.3

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Ethan Furman
Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you collapse it and expand it again, the content is shown

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread Glenn Linderman
On 3/26/2012 10:58 AM, Ethan Furman wrote: Glenn Linderman wrote: On 3/26/2012 10:19 AM, R. David Murray wrote: Like Philip, I have *one* window. My window manager (ratpoison) is more like 'screen' for X: you *can* split the window up, but it is *much* more useful to have only one window

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 12:25:20 -0700 Ethan Furman et...@stoneleaf.us wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback. I've committed the new design to 3.2 and 3.3 for now, and it will

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Ethan Furman
Antoine Pitrou wrote: On Mon, 26 Mar 2012 12:25:20 -0700 Ethan Furman et...@stoneleaf.us wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback. I've committed the new design to 3.2 and 3.3 for

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Ethan Furman
Antoine Pitrou wrote: On Sun, 25 Mar 2012 08:34:44 +0200 Also I think there should be some jquery animation when collapsing/expanding. Please, no. I don't need my technical web pages singing and dancing for me. ;) ~Ethan~ ___ Python-Dev mailing

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-26 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
On Tue, Mar 27, 2012 at 1:35 AM, PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com wrote: On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 2:56 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull step...@xemacs.org wrote: But since he's arguing the other end in the directory layout thread (where he says there are many special ways to invoke Python so that having

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-26 Thread Éric Araujo
Hi, Le 25/03/2012 15:25, Georg Brandl a écrit : On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: I think it would be better to leave 2.7 with the old theme, to keep it visually distinct from the nifty new theme used with the nifty new 3.2 and 3.3 versions. Hmm, -0 here. I'd like more opinions on

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-25 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 1:41 AM, Ben Finney ben+pyt...@benfinney.id.au wrote: PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com writes: Not every tab in my browser is text for reading; some are apps that need the extra horizontal space. So, again, why make your browser window *for reading text* that large?

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Ben Finney
Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net writes: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ Great! You've improved it nicely. I especially like that you have

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Eli Bendersky
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 08:34, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Glenn Linderman
On 3/24/2012 11:34 PM, Georg Brandl wrote: I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you collapse it and expand it again, the content is shown at your current scroll location). It would be educational to see how you pulled that trick! I will look if I get time.

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Peter Otten
Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ Nice! Lightweight and readable. From the bikeshedding department: * Inlined code doesn't need the gray background. The

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
25.03.12 09:34, Georg Brandl написав(ла): Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: It may be worth now the line-height reduce too? I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you collapse it and expand it

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
25.03.12 11:06, Peter Otten написав(ла): * Inlined code doesn't need the gray background. The bold font makes it stand out enough. I believe that the gray background is good, but it should make it lighter. * Instead of the box consider italics or another color for [New in ...] text. Yes,

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Andrew Svetlov
I like to always see Quick search widget without scrolling page to top. Is it possible? Or maybe you can embed some keyboard shortcut for quick jump to search input box? On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 11:44 AM, Serhiy Storchaka storch...@gmail.com wrote: 25.03.12 11:06, Peter Otten написав(ла): *

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
In the header next to Python v3.3a1 documentation there is a » symbol, which suggests something can be expanded. Knowing that there are many versions of the documentation, I thought it might bring up a menu of versions. But clicking does nothing. Is that intentional? I guess it's supposed to

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Serhiy Storchaka
25.03.12 09:34, Georg Brandl написав(ла): I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you collapse it and expand it again, the content is shown at your current scroll location). I'm not sure if this is possible, and how good it would look like, but I have one crazy

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Stefan Krah
Andrew Svetlov andrew.svet...@gmail.com wrote: I like to always see Quick search widget without scrolling page to top. Is it possible? Do you mean a fixed search box like this one? http://coq.inria.fr/documentation Please don't do this, I find scrolling exceptionally distracting in the

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Andrew Svetlov
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 12:04 PM, Stefan Krah ste...@bytereef.org wrote: Andrew Svetlov andrew.svet...@gmail.com wrote: I like to always see Quick search widget without scrolling page to top. Is it possible? Do you mean a fixed search box like this one? http://coq.inria.fr/documentation

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Hynek Schlawack
Hi Georg, Am 25.03.2012 um 08:34 schrieb Georg Brandl: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ I really like it! Only one nitpick: If a header follows on a “seealso”, the vertical

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Peter Otten
Serhiy Storchaka wrote: * Maybe the Next/Previous Page headers on the left could link to the respective page. Do you mean next/previous links in header/footer? No, I mean the two sections in the sidebar on the left, below Table of Contents. ___

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 11:04 AM, Stefan Krah ste...@bytereef.org wrote: Do you mean a fixed search box like this one? http://coq.inria.fr/documentation Please don't do this, I find scrolling exceptionally distracting in the presence of fixed elements. Does it bother you when the header is

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Oleg Broytman
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 08:34:44AM +0200, Georg Brandl wrote: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ Perfect! I like it! Oleg. -- Oleg Broytmanhttp://phdru.name/p...@phdru.name Programmers don't die, they just GOSUB without RETURN.

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Matt Joiner
Is nice yes?! When I small the nav bar, then embiggen it again, the text centers vertically. It's in the wrong place. The new theme is very minimal, perhaps a new color should be chosen. We've done green, what about orange, brown or blue? ___ Python-Dev

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Sun, 25 Mar 2012 08:34:44 +0200 Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Stefan Krah
Stephen J. Turnbull step...@xemacs.org wrote: Do you mean a fixed search box like this one? http://coq.inria.fr/documentation Please don't do this, I find scrolling exceptionally distracting in the presence of fixed elements. Does it bother you when the header is fixed and contains

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 2:34 PM, Stefan Krah ste...@bytereef.org wrote: Stephen J. Turnbull step...@xemacs.org wrote: Does it bother you when the header is fixed and contains the search box?  I prefer that arrangement, anyway. Do you have an example website? Not with just a header.

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Michael Urman
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 07:07, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you collapse it and expand it again, the content is shown at your current scroll location). The gimmick is buggy (when you collapse then expand it in

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Ned Batchelder
On 3/25/2012 2:34 AM, Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ Georg, thanks so much for taking on this thankless task with grace and skill. It can't be easy dealing

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Tim Golden
On 25/03/2012 16:26, Ned Batchelder wrote: Georg, thanks so much for taking on this thankless task with grace and skill. It can't be easy dealing with the death by a thousand tweaks Seconded. I'm constantly edified by the way in which people in the community respond to even quite abrupt

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Terry Reedy
On 3/25/2012 2:34 AM, Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast Untrue. You still changed the high contrast dark blue to the same low contrast light blue for builtin names, etc. What problem do you think you are trying to solve by making the

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Stefan Krah
Stephen J. Turnbull step...@xemacs.org wrote: Not with just a header. http://turnbull.sk.tsukuba.ac.jp/Teach/IntroSES/ is a (very primitive and not stylistically improved in years) example of a frame-based layout that I use some of my classes. I would put a search field in the top frame (if

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 09:19, Ben Finney wrote: Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net writes: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ Great! You've improved it nicely. I especially like that you

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 17:26, Ned Batchelder wrote: On 3/25/2012 2:34 AM, Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ Georg, thanks so much for taking on this thankless task

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 10:06, Peter Otten wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ Nice! Lightweight and readable. From the bikeshedding department: *

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 17:54, Terry Reedy wrote: On 3/25/2012 2:34 AM, Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast Untrue. You still changed the high contrast dark blue to the same low contrast light blue for builtin names, etc. What problem do you

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 13:09, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 11:04 AM, Stefan Krah ste...@bytereef.org wrote: Do you mean a fixed search box like this one? http://coq.inria.fr/documentation Please don't do this, I find scrolling exceptionally distracting in the presence of

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 08:34, Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast and collapsible sidebar again: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html2/ I've also added a little questionable gimmick to the sidebar (when you collapse it and expand it

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Matt Joiner
Not sure if you addressed this in your answers to other comments... Scroll down the page. Minimize the nav bar on the left. Bring it back out again. Now the text in the nav bar permanently starts at an offset from the top of the page. On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 7:44 PM, Matt Joiner

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Steven D'Aprano
Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback. I've committed the new design to 3.2 and 3.3 for now, and it will be live for the 3.3 docs momentarily (3.2 isn't rebuilt at the moment until 3.2.3 final goes out). I'll transplant to 2.7 too, probably after the

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 21:09, Matt Joiner wrote: Not sure if you addressed this in your answers to other comments... Scroll down the page. Minimize the nav bar on the left. Bring it back out again. Now the text in the nav bar permanently starts at an offset from the top of the page. Yes, that was

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Georg Brandl
On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback. I've committed the new design to 3.2 and 3.3 for now, and it will be live for the 3.3 docs momentarily (3.2 isn't rebuilt at the moment until 3.2.3 final goes out).

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Andrew Svetlov
I like to see new schema only for 3.3 as sign of shiny new release. On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 10:25 PM, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback.  I've committed the new

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Maciej Fijalkowski
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 9:25 PM, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback.  I've committed the new design to 3.2 and 3.3 for now, and it will be live for the 3.3 docs

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Brian Curtin
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 14:50, Andrew Svetlov andrew.svet...@gmail.com wrote: I like to see new schema only for 3.3 as sign of shiny new release. Please don't do this. It will result in endless complaints. ___ Python-Dev mailing list

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Ben Finney
Brian Curtin br...@python.org writes: On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 14:50, Andrew Svetlov andrew.svet...@gmail.com wrote: I like to see new schema only for 3.3 as sign of shiny new release. Please don't do this. It will result in endless complaints. Complaints of what nature? Do you think those

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Terry Reedy
On 3/25/2012 12:32 PM, Georg Brandl wrote: On 25.03.2012 17:54, Terry Reedy wrote: On 3/25/2012 2:34 AM, Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast Untrue. You still changed the high contrast dark blue to the same low contrast light blue for

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Steven D'Aprano
Terry Reedy wrote: On 3/25/2012 12:32 PM, Georg Brandl wrote: On 25.03.2012 17:54, Terry Reedy wrote: On 3/25/2012 2:34 AM, Georg Brandl wrote: Here's another try, mainly with default browser font size, more contrast Untrue. You still changed the high contrast dark blue to the same low

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Mon, Mar 26, 2012 at 7:42 AM, Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote: Can anyone tell me the best way to do that with FireFox? For general webbrowsing, I'm reasonably impressed by the effectiveness of www.readability.com. It's a sign-up service however, and I've never tried it on technical

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Scott Dial
On 3/25/2012 8:37 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: E.g. change the font-family from font-family: 'Lucida Grande',Arial,sans-serif; to font-family: 'Lucida Grande','Lucida Sans Unicode','Lucida Sans',Tahoma,Verdana,Arial,sans-serif; or similar. +1 To providing other fallbacks. As Steven

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Terry Reedy
On 3/25/2012 8:37 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Terry Reedy wrote: I ran the following experiment: I put old and new versions of the buitin functions page side-by-side in separate browser windows. I asked my teenage daughter to come into the room, approach slowly, and say when she could read one

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Eli Bendersky
On Sun, Mar 25, 2012 at 21:25, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: On 25.03.2012 21:11, Steven D'Aprano wrote: Georg Brandl wrote: Thanks everyone for the overwhelmingly positive feedback.  I've committed the new design to 3.2 and 3.3 for now, and it will be live for the 3.3 docs

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Terry Reedy
On 3/25/2012 8:37 PM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: For what it's worth, it wouldn't surprise me if the problem is the fallback font. If I'm reading the CSS correctly, the standard font used in the new docs is Lucinda Grande, with a fallback of Arial. Unfortunately, Lucinda Grande is normally only

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs, iteration 2

2012-03-25 Thread Greg Ewing
Steven D'Aprano wrote: While I sympathize with the ideal of making the docs readable, particular for those of us who don't have 20-20 vision, must be readable from halfway across the room is setting the bar too high. The point is that reducing contrast never makes anything more readable, and

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-24 Thread Gregory P. Smith
On Tue, Mar 20, 2012 at 3:55 PM, John O'Connor jxo6...@rit.edu wrote: On Tue, Mar 20, 2012 at 6:38 PM, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: recently I've grown a bit tired of seeing our default Sphinx theme, especially as so many other projects use it. I think regardless of the chosen

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-24 Thread PJ Eby
On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Greg Ewing greg.ew...@canterbury.ac.nzwrote: PJ Eby wrote: Weird - I have the exact *opposite* problem, where I have to resize my window because somebody *didn't* set their text max-width sanely (to a reasonable value based on ems instead of pixels), and I

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-24 Thread Ben Finney
PJ Eby p...@telecommunity.com writes: On Sat, Mar 24, 2012 at 1:32 AM, Greg Ewing greg.ew...@canterbury.ac.nzwrote: If you don't want 1920-pixel-wide text, why make your browser window that large? Not every tab in my browser is text for reading; some are apps that need the extra

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-24 Thread Glenn Linderman
On 3/24/2012 5:41 PM, Ben Finney wrote: It's madness to expect web designers to hobble the flexibility of a web page to cater preferentially for one minority over others. But largely, the 99% that makes the rest of them look bad, do, in fact, do exactly that.

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-23 Thread Greg Ewing
Glyph Lefkowitz wrote: do I have to resize my browser every time I visit a new site to get a decent width for reading. If all sites left the width to the browser, then I would be able to make my browser window a width that is comfortable for me with my chosen font size and leave it that way.

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-23 Thread PJ Eby
On Mar 23, 2012 9:16 PM, Greg Ewing greg.ew...@canterbury.ac.nz wrote: Glyph Lefkowitz wrote: do I have to resize my browser every time I visit a new site to get a decent width for reading. If all sites left the width to the browser, then I would be able to make my browser window a width

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-23 Thread Greg Ewing
PJ Eby wrote: Weird - I have the exact *opposite* problem, where I have to resize my window because somebody *didn't* set their text max-width sanely (to a reasonable value based on ems instead of pixels), and I have nearly 1920 pixels of raw text spanning my screen. If you don't want

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Georg Brandl
On 21.03.2012 20:39, Guido van Rossum wrote: Guido, you encouraged us to use science, but only after describing my science-based maximum line-length suggestion as coddling, then said we should let Georg get on with it, but only after reiterating your personal favorite tweak (which I happen to

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Glyph Lefkowitz
On Mar 21, 2012, at 6:28 PM, Greg Ewing wrote: Ned Batchelder wrote: Any of the tweaks people are suggesting could be applied individually using this technique. We could just as easily choose to make the site left-justified, and let the full-justification fans use custom stylesheets to

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Steven D'Aprano
Fred Drake wrote: On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 3:13 PM, Ned Batchelder n...@nedbatchelder.com wrote: There are bad designers, or more to the point, designers who favor the overall look of the page at the expense of the utility of the page. That doesn't mean all designers are bad, or that design is

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Russell E. Owen
In article 4f6b5b33.9020...@pearwood.info, Steven D'Aprano st...@pearwood.info wrote: ... My first impression of this page: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html/index.html was that the grey side-bar gives the page a somber, perhaps even dreary, look. First impressions count, and

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Russell E. Owen
In article rowen-edfa17.11495422032...@news.gmane.org, Russell E. Owen ro...@uw.edu wrote: In article 4f6b5b33.9020...@pearwood.info, Steven D'Aprano st...@pearwood.info wrote: ... My first impression of this page: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html/index.html was that

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Georg Brandl
On 22.03.2012 20:05, Russell E. Owen wrote: I like the overall design, but one thing seems to be missing is an overview of what Python is (hence what the page is about). Naturally we don't need that, but a one-line overview with a link to more information would be helpful. -- Russell

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Glenn Linderman
On 3/22/2012 10:02 AM, Steven D'Aprano wrote: As they say, the 99% who are lousy designers give the rest a bad name. *wink* :) My first impression of this page: http://www.python.org/~gbrandl/build/html/index.html was that the grey side-bar gives the page a somber, perhaps even dreary,

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Chris Angelico
On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:50 AM, Glenn Linderman v+pyt...@g.nevcal.com wrote: 3. Make the sidebar separately scrollable, so that it stays visible when scrolling down in the text.  This would make it much easier to jump from section to section, if the TOC didn't get lost in the process. -1. The

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Guido van Rossum
Georg, please start a new thread when you have a new design for review. I'm muting this one... -- --Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido) ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe:

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread R. David Murray
On Fri, 23 Mar 2012 07:57:18 +1100, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote: On Fri, Mar 23, 2012 at 6:50 AM, Glenn Linderman v+pyt...@g.nevcal.com wrote: 3. Make the sidebar separately scrollable, so that it stays visible when scrolling down in the text.  This would make it much easier to

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Ethan Furman
Glenn Linderman wrote: After looking at both a while, my suggestions would be: 1. Preserve the collapsability of the TOC, but possible enhance its recognizability with an X in the upper right of the TOC sidebar, as well as the in the middle. 2. Make the header fixed, so that the bread

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Łukasz Langa
Wiadomość napisana przez Ethan Furman w dniu 22 mar 2012, o godz. 22:18: Glenn Linderman wrote: After looking at both a while, my suggestions would be: 1. Preserve the collapsability of the TOC, but possible enhance its recognizability with an X in the upper right of the TOC sidebar, as

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Greg Ewing
Can we please get rid of the sidebar, or at least provide a way of turning it off? I don't think it's anywhere near useful enough to be worth the space it takes up. You can only use it when you're scrolled to the top of the page, otherwise it's just a useless empty space. Also, I often want to

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-22 Thread Stephen J. Turnbull
On Thu, Mar 22, 2012 at 11:56 PM, Greg Ewing greg.ew...@canterbury.ac.nz wrote: Can we please get rid of the sidebar, or at least provide a way of turning it off? I don't think it's anywhere near useful enough to be worth the space it takes up. +1. It seems to mostly duplicate the headline

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Georg Brandl
On 21.03.2012 00:17, R. David Murray wrote: On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 23:38:53 +0100, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Hi all, recently I've grown a bit tired of seeing our default Sphinx theme, especially as so many other projects use it. I decided to play around with something clean this

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Georg Brandl
On 21.03.2012 01:57, Raymond Hettinger wrote: On Mar 20, 2012, at 5:37 PM, Antoine Pitrou wrote: Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net mailto:g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Hi all, recently I've grown a bit tired of seeing our default Sphinx theme, especially as so many other projects use it. I

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Dirkjan Ochtman
On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 07:00, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: OK, that seems to be the main point people make... let me see if I can come up with a better compromise. Would it be possible to limit the width of the page? On my 1920px monitor, the lines get awfully long, making them harder

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Matt Joiner
Turn your monitor portrait or make the window smaller :) ___ Python-Dev mailing list Python-Dev@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-dev Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/python-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Jonathan Hartley
On 21/03/2012 08:25, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 07:00, Georg Brandlg.bra...@gmx.net wrote: OK, that seems to be the main point people make... let me see if I can come up with a better compromise. Would it be possible to limit the width of the page? On my 1920px monitor,

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Oleg Broytman
On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 09:33:13AM +, Jonathan Hartley wrote: On 21/03/2012 08:25, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 07:00, Georg Brandlg.bra...@gmx.net wrote: OK, that seems to be the main point people make... let me see if I can come up with a better compromise. Would it

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Ben Finney
Dirkjan Ochtman dirk...@ochtman.nl writes: On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 07:00, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: OK, that seems to be the main point people make... let me see if I can come up with a better compromise. Would it be possible to limit the width of the page? On my 1920px

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 21:39:41 -0400 Terry Reedy tjre...@udel.edu wrote: On 3/20/2012 6:38 PM, Georg Brandl wrote: The current green on the front page is too heavy. Green? hmm... you mean blue, right? :) Antoine. ___ Python-Dev mailing list

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Tue, 20 Mar 2012 21:58:57 -0400 Ned Batchelder n...@nedbatchelder.com wrote: On 3/20/2012 6:38 PM, Georg Brandl wrote: Let me know what you think, or play around and send some improvements. (The collapsible sidebar is not adapted to it yet, but will definitely be integrated before I

Re: [Python-Dev] Playing with a new theme for the docs

2012-03-21 Thread Chris Withers
On 21/03/2012 09:33, Jonathan Hartley wrote: On 21/03/2012 08:25, Dirkjan Ochtman wrote: On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 07:00, Georg Brandlg.bra...@gmx.net wrote: OK, that seems to be the main point people make... let me see if I can come up with a better compromise. Would it be possible to limit

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