Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-04-26 Thread Tony DeFilippo
Pictures?


On Fri, Apr 25, 2014 at 6:36 PM, eric wallacker ewallac...@gmail.comwrote:

 Went to BBH on Main Street on rode the prototype. According to the
 employee, it is an updated Hunqapillar. Was a nice riding bike.


 On Friday, April 11, 2014 9:42:56 AM UTC-7, eric wallacker wrote:

  My assumption is that the proto-blue bike is the not-officially-named
 but aforementioned one-size-for the tall-guy (ME!) Clem Smith, Jr.

 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-04-26 Thread eric wallacker
I didn't take a pic, if that is what you mean...
I had a particular interest in this protovelo due to my height (6'5.5) and as 
I previously posted was kinda hoping that it was one-size tall-guy off roady 
touring bike which has been lightly alluded to and discussed. Exactly the kind 
of bike I like and would ride everywhere/always.
I also had my PBH measured by GP. IIRC it was ~98cm. The bike felt pretty nice 
but Grant was dubious and said that likely just relative, and he had a point. 
Long story short: nice bike. Want one.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-04-26 Thread Abcyclehank
Can anyone compare the 62cm Prototype to a 60cm Cheviot from their test rides 
of each bike. 
Is this the maximum size the prototype is expected to come in or has anyone 
heard about a larger size also.
I think just 1 longer chain stay frame is in order as my n+1.
I had preordered the latter but now am thinking of waiting for a potential new 
model.  I am 6'6 230lbs, own a 71cm non lugged custom Nobilette country bike, 
a 68cm Quickbeam, and a 64 cm Bombadil.  

Thanks,
Ryan Michigander who struggles to find large enough bikes for test rides 
Hankinson

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-04-25 Thread eric wallacker
Went to BBH on Main Street on rode the prototype. According to the 
employee, it is an updated Hunqapillar. Was a nice riding bike.

On Friday, April 11, 2014 9:42:56 AM UTC-7, eric wallacker wrote:

  My assumption is that the proto-blue bike is the not-officially-named 
 but aforementioned one-size-for the tall-guy (ME!) Clem Smith, Jr.

 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-04-12 Thread eric wallacker
 My assumption is that the proto-blue bike is the not-officially-named but 
aforementioned one-size-for the tall-guy (ME!) Clem Smith, Jr.

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-04-09 Thread blakcloud
Sorry to dredge an older thread but I thought I would share a photo that I 
took at the Bicycle Museum in Sakai City, Japan that I too last week. I had 
earlier commented on how it looked like an older 80's mountain bike and 
after seeing the bike below I am even more convinced. 

The bike in the photo is 1 of 10 original Breezer mountain bikes built. 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/87106495@N07/13749049105/in/photostream/

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread Matthew J
An additional point about wheel and tire changes - the variety and quality 
of  700c tires has never been better.

It is fairly simple to duplicate the suggestions above with one wheel set 
and multiple tires.  For instance, rather than having separate 700, 650B 
and 26 wheel sets for fast, daily and OR riding, one could have a 700C 
wheel set built around medium width rims that would easily accommodate 
Compass Barlow Pass for fast road riding, Soma Xpress for every day (and 
even gravel road for that matter) riding, and after pulling off the 
fenders, the Bruce Gordon Rock n' Road for off road riding.

These tires all work well with cantis, v-brakes, or even the extended reach 
side pulls.  

Tires take up a lot less space than rims.

In the end I expect 95% or maybe more of the Riv market will ultimately 
decide on one type of tire they like best and not bother swapping no matter 
how easy it is to do so.  

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 11:18:28 PM UTC-5, cyclot...@gmail.com wrote:

 Cantilevers don't have a limit to the size of rims they work with :-) As 
 long as the frame is built with the right tolerances, cantis are pretty 
 darn adjustable!

 Cheers,
 David

 it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride. - Seth Vidal





 On Wed, Mar 12, 2014 at 12:37 PM, clayton bailey 
 treef...@yahoo.comjavascript:
  wrote:

 Someday, disc brakes will be old school and Rivendell will embrace 
 them. I might be dead then, but if Rivendell lives on, it will 
 happen...[image: 
 *;) winking] Seriously, If I remember correctly, Grant has not ruled 
 them out. He just hasn't found a need for them yet as the bikes they 
 currently sell don't NEED them. A 29+ would need them as the rims are 
 really wide.[image: *:D big grin]
  



  

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread Leslie
On Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:00:25 AM UTC-4, Matthew J wrote:


 In the end I expect 95% or maybe more of the Riv market will ultimately 
 decide on one type of tire they like best and not bother swapping no matter 
 how easy it is to do so.  


Or, end up w/ another bike for the other tire... (N+1, right?)  

Similar bikes, but one's rolling on Hetres for most road work, the other on 
MSO's for mixed, and another on Rumpkins...   any one of the bikes could be 
set up more like a road bike, a rando bike, a gravel bike, or a tourer...  
but each are now nuanced, so I can grab the one suitable for a particular 
ride (truth be told, any are good for most anything that the others are... 
but, if I had a long road ride planned and wanted to be quick, I'd not take 
the Bomba, but take the Ram instead  if I wanted to camp, I'd take the 
Bomba instead of the Ram if I wanted to be quick on decent trails, 
probably use the canti-Rom

So... the Appaloosa...
I like it.  But, w/ a tentacular Bomba, I don't see there being a 'need' 
for me to add one of these to the stable.  I did pick the Bomba over the 
Hunq, but there were things I liked about the Hunq; if I didn't have the 
Bomba, the Appaloosa might have been a good bike, a bit closer to the 
Hunq... They're all good.  


 

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread RJM
Maybe stability...I don't really know. I am a shorter dude so ride smaller 
bikes and the longer chainstays like on my Sam Hillborne (compared to my 
older bikes) seem to make the bike feel more stable. 
 
On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 11:06:41 PM UTC-5, Tony DeFilippo wrote:

 Other than pannier clearance, what exactly are the benefits of the longer 
 chainstays? 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread RJM
I really would much rather have several bikes than one do it all with 
wheel swaps. I just don't think the wheel swap thing works as well in 
practice as in theory. 
 
I tried it on my Sam with Paul moto brakes, going from 650b to 700. It was 
a little pointless; the 650b wheels with 38 tires does just fine. 
 
Does anybody know if the Appaloosa is built to be more mountain bike like 
than the Yves or Betty?  Meaning a little stronger to take some bumps 
better?  Just curious because my next rive will be mostly for trail riding. 
I got the fast roadeo, the comfy long distance Sam, now I need a mountain 
bike. 
 

On Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:48:42 AM UTC-5, Leslie wrote:

 On Thursday, March 13, 2014 9:00:25 AM UTC-4, Matthew J wrote: 


 In the end I expect 95% or maybe more of the Riv market will ultimately 
 decide on one type of tire they like best and not bother swapping no matter 
 how easy it is to do so.  


 Or, end up w/ another bike for the other tire... (N+1, right?)  

 Similar bikes, but one's rolling on Hetres for most road work, the other 
 on MSO's for mixed, and another on Rumpkins...   any one of the bikes could 
 be set up more like a road bike, a rando bike, a gravel bike, or a 
 tourer...  but each are now nuanced, so I can grab the one suitable for a 
 particular ride (truth be told, any are good for most anything that the 
 others are... but, if I had a long road ride planned and wanted to be 
 quick, I'd not take the Bomba, but take the Ram instead  if I wanted to 
 camp, I'd take the Bomba instead of the Ram if I wanted to be quick on 
 decent trails, probably use the canti-Rom

 So... the Appaloosa...
 I like it.  But, w/ a tentacular Bomba, I don't see there being a 'need' 
 for me to add one of these to the stable.  I did pick the Bomba over the 
 Hunq, but there were things I liked about the Hunq; if I didn't have the 
 Bomba, the Appaloosa might have been a good bike, a bit closer to the 
 Hunq... They're all good.  

   


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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread Matthew J
 Other than pannier clearance, what exactly are the benefits of the longer 
chainstays? 

I restored and toured twice on this Trek 728:  
http://cyclofiend.com/cc/2008/cc484-joelmatthews0508.html 

The long chain stays paired with the right wheelset and tires of course 
foster a very smooth and stable ride.  Optimal for the long back road 
X-country tours that were popular in the late '70s with the people then 
buying Treks.

That bike was not the best on roads with sharp turns, however.

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 11:06:41 PM UTC-5, Tony DeFilippo wrote:

 Other than pannier clearance, what exactly are the benefits of the longer 
 chainstays? 

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RE: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread Allingham II, Thomas J
Completely subjective response (and thus subject to skepticism if not 
dismissal), but my Riv Mystery Bike (a sort of pre-Appaloosa, pic here: 
http://www.flickr.com/photos/37542512@N04/8367710962/in/set-72157630957672582  
), which has 55cm chainstays, has the smoothest ride I've ever experienced, 
without sacrificing much if anything in sure-footedness or responsiveness, 
relative to my other Rivs without the long stays.  It's a wonderful bike.

-Original Message-
From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Tony DeFilippo
Sent: Thursday, March 13, 2014 12:07 AM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

Other than pannier clearance, what exactly are the benefits of the longer 
chainstays? 

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RE: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread Kellie Stapleton
So will smaller frame sizes be 650b?

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-13 Thread cyclotourist
Are the seat tubes slacker to go with the longer stays? It sorta looks like
that on the prototype, but can't really tell.

Cheers,
David

it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride. - Seth Vidal





On Thu, Mar 13, 2014 at 3:12 PM, Kellie Stapleton 
kellie.staple...@gmail.com wrote:

 So will smaller frame sizes be 650b?

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Tom Harrop
Yes please! It looks like a long Bombadil to me. Same fork crown as my 
Bombadil, canti/v-brake posts, room for big tyres. Wonder what sizes 
they'll offer...?

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Chris Lampe 2
Looks like an MTB to me as well.  Bullmoose handlebar (I thinkgoing 
from memory because I can't access the blog from work), canti-studs and 
29'er knobbies
 

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 10:29:31 PM UTC-5, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Matthew J
 Looks like a new version of the Hunq to me. 

Much longer chain stays though.  

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 11:26:23 PM UTC-5, Jim M. wrote:

 Looks like a new version of the Hunq to me.

 jim m
 wc ca


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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread James Warren

Longer chainstays were reported to be the plan last summer for upcoming Hunqs.

I can't see the full clearance in the photos and the fact that they are calling 
it a prototype is still confusing me though. If they hadn't said prototype, I 
would be guessing that this is the new version of the Taiwanese Hunqs.


On Mar 12, 2014, at 6:38 AM, Matthew J wrote:

  Looks like a new version of the Hunq to me. 
 
 Much longer chain stays though.  
 
 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 11:26:23 PM UTC-5, Jim M. wrote:
 Looks like a new version of the Hunq to me.
 
 jim m
 wc ca
 
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James Warren
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- 700x55





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RE: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Allingham II, Thomas J
Superfluous?

From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Kevin Mulcahy
Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 11:52 PM
To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com
Subject: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

A little superfluous for my tastes...Not my favorite RBW design.

Kevin
Chicago, IL
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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Clayton
 I love Rivendell, but ick. I don't get it. I'd rather see a lugged, disc 
brake equipped 29+ for bikepacking. With a high enough BB to run 29er 2.0s. 
The ultimate touring bike, by Rivendell, as it should be. I'd have two 
wheel sets, one super fat and one not so fat. Quick change with discs. I 
will wait, patiently, for it is inevitable that Rivee will make such a 
bike. ;)

Clayton

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Bill Lindsay
That's got Keven all over it.  There was a provocative reference to 
forthcoming long-chainstayed model(s) in the Riv People movie that Jay 
produced (search Riv People on Vimeo).  Grant attributed all of that to 
Keven.  The Cheviut and now this one both have that attribute.



On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread RJM
I hope they make smaller models and they don't have the diagonal tube, 
which is not needed when going smaller. 
 
 
I don't see this bike as a mountain bike, but rather a 
cruiser/commuter/rails to trails bike. They make an excellent mountain bike 
in the Hunqapillar and Bombadil already. 
 

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 10:29:31 PM UTC-5, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness! 

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com 

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread RJM
I don't ever see Riv embracing disk brakes. 
On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 10:48:31 AM UTC-5, Clayton wrote: 

  I love Rivendell, but ick. I don't get it. I'd rather see a lugged, disc 
 brake equipped 29+ for bikepacking. With a high enough BB to run 29er 2.0s. 
 The ultimate touring bike, by Rivendell, as it should be. I'd have two 
 wheel sets, one super fat and one not so fat. Quick change with discs. I 
 will wait, patiently, for it is inevitable that Rivee will make such a 
 bike. ;) 

 Clayton

 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote: 

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness! 

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Scott Henry
What is nice about disk brakes is simply their versatility.   Build that
frame for disk brakes and you give the most go anywhere, do anything bike
on the road.   Run 700 narrow, 29'er wide, 650b, 26 by-anything.   All on
the same frame and all without having to adjust anything.

I see versatility as an inherently Rivish / Bobish ideal.   Old ways aren't
always the best ways and change isn't always bad.  The next custom anything
of mine will absolutely have disk mounts.
Right now leaning towards a Shamrock Cycles Fluid Druid.

Scott


On Wed, Mar 12, 2014 at 1:49 PM, RJM crccpadu...@gmail.com wrote:

 I don't ever see Riv embracing disk brakes.
 On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 10:48:31 AM UTC-5, Clayton wrote:

  I love Rivendell, but ick. I don't get it. I'd rather see a lugged, disc
 brake equipped 29+ for bikepacking. With a high enough BB to run 29er 2.0s.
 The ultimate touring bike, by Rivendell, as it should be. I'd have two
 wheel sets, one super fat and one not so fat. Quick change with discs. I
 will wait, patiently, for it is inevitable that Rivee will make such a
 bike. ;)

 Clayton

 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Shoji Takahashi
Here's a link to the video Rivendell People:
https://vimeo.com/57271334

The reference from Grant on chain-stay length is ~28 minutes.



On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 1:03:39 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:

 That's got Keven all over it.  There was a provocative reference to 
 forthcoming long-chainstayed model(s) in the Riv People movie that Jay 
 produced (search Riv People on Vimeo).  Grant attributed all of that to 
 Keven.  The Cheviut and now this one both have that attribute.



 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread oldmangabe
It reminds me of the Breezer bikes that Joe built way back. Particularly 
the ones he and Steve Potts used when touring in New Zealand. 

I've always really liked those bikes and the design, it is smart overall 
design if the materials used allow for the design. Otherwise it just seems 
to be visual flair. In this case I don't understand why the rear midstays 
curve up to the seatstays as they do. It appears to negate any possible 
triangulation/structural benefits of the midstays which may be wanted with 
the long chainstays. Ultimately I don't know, I didn't design the bike or 
spec the materials so this is all just my personal opinion and speculation. 
Sorry for sounding overly critical, not my intention. 

It's an interesting bike and I like how Riv built it up to reference the 
older rough stuff touring bikes. Iterations on a theme. Dirt Cruiser 
Bruiser Bike.

Gabe

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Matthew J
 Run 700 narrow, 29'er wide, 650b, 26 by-anything.   All on the same frame 
and all without having to adjust anything 

Possible in theory but certainly not something a bike company such as Riv 
would want to do.  

Wheel diameter tire width has a significant impact on a bike's ride quality 
and handling.  There is no way a frame can be designed to work well with 
multiple wheel diameters.  A bike designed with a specific wheel size range 
in mind will work best with that wheel size range and design.  

GP would sooner not have the sale if it means a bike that does a lot but 
nothing well.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Scott Henry
Wheel diameter tire width has a significant impact on a bike's ride
quality and handling.  There is no way a frame can be designed to work well
with multiple wheel diameters.

To an extent, yes.  To an extent, this is also the man who gave the XO-1
the ability to take a 26x1slick to a 26x2 knobby and was helpful in
the reemergence of the 650b wheel to stick in all those 27 and 700c
frames.

Yes, the bikes will ride different.  No, it doesn't mean they will ride
badly.
Scott


On Wed, Mar 12, 2014 at 2:58 PM, Matthew J matthewj...@gmail.com wrote:

  Run 700 narrow, 29'er wide, 650b, 26 by-anything.   All on the same
 frame and all without having to adjust anything

 Possible in theory but certainly not something a bike company such as Riv
 would want to do.

 Wheel diameter tire width has a significant impact on a bike's ride
 quality and handling.  There is no way a frame can be designed to work well
 with multiple wheel diameters.  A bike designed with a specific wheel size
 range in mind will work best with that wheel size range and design.

 GP would sooner not have the sale if it means a bike that does a lot but
 nothing well.

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Garth
Disc brakes for Riv ?   Me thinks not also.   

They have their cons too, just like every brake. This does not make it the 
best brake for all conditions, let alone the best brake.   

This article expresses some cons  
http://www.rodbikes.com/articles/brakes.html




On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 1:49:38 PM UTC-4, RJM wrote:

 I don't ever see Riv embracing disk brakes. 
 On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 10:48:31 AM UTC-5, Clayton wrote: 

  I love Rivendell, but ick. I don't get it. I'd rather see a lugged, disc 
 brake equipped 29+ for bikepacking. With a high enough BB to run 29er 2.0s. 
 The ultimate touring bike, by Rivendell, as it should be. I'd have two 
 wheel sets, one super fat and one not so fat. Quick change with discs. I 
 will wait, patiently, for it is inevitable that Rivee will make such a 
 bike. ;) 

 Clayton

 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote: 

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness! 

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread clayton bailey
Someday, disc brakes will be old school and Rivendell will embrace them. I 
might be dead then, but if Rivendell lives on, it will happen... Seriously, If 
I remember correctly, Grant has not ruled them out. He just hasn't found a need 
for them yet as the bikes they currently sell don't NEED them. A 29+ would need 
them as the rims are really wide.



On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 10:49 AM, RJM crccpadu...@gmail.com wrote:
 
I don't ever see Riv embracing disk brakes. 

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 10:48:31 AM UTC-5, Clayton wrote: 
 I love Rivendell, but ick. I don't get it. I'd rather see a lugged, disc brake 
equipped 29+ for bikepacking. With a high enough BB to run 29er 2.0s. The 
ultimate touring bike, by Rivendell, as it should be. I'd have two wheel sets, 
one super fat and one not so fat. Quick change with discs. I will wait, 
patiently, for it is inevitable that Rivee will make such a bike. ;) 


Clayton

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote: 
Check it out in all it's blue-ness! 
http://rivbike.tumblr.com
Cheers!
Chris
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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread iamkeith


On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 12:58:00 PM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:

   There is no way a frame can be designed to work well with multiple wheel 
 diameters.  A bike designed with a specific wheel size range in mind will 
 work best with that wheel size range and design.  


Well as I see it, that's exactly the benefit of disc brakes.  You can 
achieve the exact same overall diameter using any two distinct, given rim 
sizes, just by varying tire casing sizes.  That's why fat 650b conversions 
work on frames that originally ran skinny 700c. Another cool recent 
development and example (this week, in fact) was the announcement by 
V-Rubber that they will be releasing a 650b tire called the trax fatty, 
which will be about 3 wide and roughly the same diameter as a 2.1 29er 
tire which is, in turn, about the same diameter as a 26 x 4.5 tire.   
This means that I'll be able to run all three on my fat bike (the bike I 
ride more than any other) *without* changing the geometry!!!


The Atlantis is specifically sold as being versatile enough to take a 
skinny road tire or a fat mountain bike tire - but in entirely different 
diameters!   I could sort of see where Riv could eventually embrace the 
idea of a bike that had this versatility, but by varying tire width alone, 
rather than by varying width WITH diameter as happens now.  

(Of course I say this as someone who still prefers cantis and who doesn't 
really expect it to happen either.  Fun to think about, though)

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Matthew J
 this is also the man who gave the XO-1 the ability to take a 26x1slick to 
a 26x2 knobby 

Many mountain bikes of that era could do this.

 helpful in the reemergence of the 650b wheel to stick in all those 27 
and 700c frames.

Yes.  But I recall in his articles on the process GP had a checklist for 
finding the appropriate conversion candidate.  It was not just a matter of 
finding a bike and changing the wheel set.

 No, it doesn't mean they will ride badly. 

Nor does it mean they will ride well.

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 2:10:07 PM UTC-5, Skenry wrote:

 Wheel diameter tire width has a significant impact on a bike's ride 
 quality and handling.  There is no way a frame can be designed to work well 
 with multiple wheel diameters.

 To an extent, yes.  To an extent, this is also the man who gave the XO-1 
 the ability to take a 26x1slick to a 26x2 knobby and was helpful in 
 the reemergence of the 650b wheel to stick in all those 27 and 700c 
 frames.   

 Yes, the bikes will ride different.  No, it doesn't mean they will ride 
 badly.
 Scott


 On Wed, Mar 12, 2014 at 2:58 PM, Matthew J matth...@gmail.comjavascript:
  wrote:

  Run 700 narrow, 29'er wide, 650b, 26 by-anything.   All on the same 
 frame and all without having to adjust anything 

 Possible in theory but certainly not something a bike company such as Riv 
 would want to do.  

 Wheel diameter tire width has a significant impact on a bike's ride 
 quality and handling.  There is no way a frame can be designed to work well 
 with multiple wheel diameters.  A bike designed with a specific wheel size 
 range in mind will work best with that wheel size range and design.  

 GP would sooner not have the sale if it means a bike that does a lot but 
 nothing well.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Matthew J
(Of course I say this as someone who still prefers cantis and who doesn't 
really expect it to happen either.  Fun to think about, though) 

  My skepticism is coming from the perspective of owning an Atlantis type 
bike with discs and not finding the wheel change optimal at all.   I also 
was not too keen on the Avid mechanicl discs, but acknowledge there has 
been advances since 2006

https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-g5pR8ylujS8/UyDAqA7W-zI/AD0/btGMh226tGY/s1600/mjolwhole.jpg


On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 2:55:39 PM UTC-5, iamkeith wrote:



 On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 12:58:00 PM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:

   There is no way a frame can be designed to work well with multiple 
 wheel diameters.  A bike designed with a specific wheel size range in mind 
 will work best with that wheel size range and design.  


 Well as I see it, that's exactly the benefit of disc brakes.  You can 
 achieve the exact same overall diameter using any two distinct, given rim 
 sizes, just by varying tire casing sizes.  That's why fat 650b conversions 
 work on frames that originally ran skinny 700c. Another cool recent 
 development and example (this week, in fact) was the announcement by 
 V-Rubber that they will be releasing a 650b tire called the trax fatty, 
 which will be about 3 wide and roughly the same diameter as a 2.1 29er 
 tire which is, in turn, about the same diameter as a 26 x 4.5 tire.   
 This means that I'll be able to run all three on my fat bike (the bike I 
 ride more than any other) *without* changing the geometry!!!


 The Atlantis is specifically sold as being versatile enough to take a 
 skinny road tire or a fat mountain bike tire - but in entirely different 
 diameters!   I could sort of see where Riv could eventually embrace the 
 idea of a bike that had this versatility, but by varying tire width alone, 
 rather than by varying width WITH diameter as happens now.  

 (Of course I say this as someone who still prefers cantis and who doesn't 
 really expect it to happen either.  Fun to think about, though)


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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread iamkeith
Funny you should mention that.  From what I understand, the technology of 
the Avid mechanical brakes hasn't changed a bit since they were released, 
and the BB7 is still always held as the benchmark.   However another rumor 
I'd heard recently - yet again fueled by fat bikes - is that TRP is 
releasing a dual-caliper mechanical disc brake soon, that will hopefully 
have better performance.  Polished silver finish, too!

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 2:17:54 PM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:


   My skepticism is coming from the perspective of owning an Atlantis type 
 bike with discs and not finding the wheel change optimal at all.   I also 
 was not too keen on the Avid mechanicl discs, but acknowledge there has 
 been advances since 2006


 https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-g5pR8ylujS8/UyDAqA7W-zI/AD0/btGMh226tGY/s1600/mjolwhole.jpg




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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Matthew J
 From what I understand, the technology of the Avid mechanical brakes 
hasn't changed a bit since they were released, and the BB7 is still always 
held as the benchmark.   

Haven't followed Avid since selling the Oswald.  I was thinking about the 
new SRAM and Shimano road hydraulics which are getting mainly good reviews 
(but there have been some raspberries as well).  I've seen a few positive 
blurbs on the TRP.  Not a whole lot out there yet.

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 3:28:22 PM UTC-5, iamkeith wrote:

 Funny you should mention that.  From what I understand, the technology of 
 the Avid mechanical brakes hasn't changed a bit since they were released, 
 and the BB7 is still always held as the benchmark.   However another rumor 
 I'd heard recently - yet again fueled by fat bikes - is that TRP is 
 releasing a dual-caliper mechanical disc brake soon, that will hopefully 
 have better performance.  Polished silver finish, too!

 On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 2:17:54 PM UTC-6, Matthew J wrote:


   My skepticism is coming from the perspective of owning an Atlantis 
 type bike with discs and not finding the wheel change optimal at all.   I 
 also was not too keen on the Avid mechanicl discs, but acknowledge there 
 has been advances since 2006


 https://lh3.googleusercontent.com/-g5pR8ylujS8/UyDAqA7W-zI/AD0/btGMh226tGY/s1600/mjolwhole.jpg




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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Kellie Stapleton
I'm fairly new to RBW; I've had my Sam just over a year. So how does this 
go?…. an unnamed prototype? Does this mean it IS going into production and 
will be a new model? Or is interest garnered from HQ rides and reading all 
our posts?

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Tony DeFilippo
Other than pannier clearance, what exactly are the benefits of the longer 
chainstays? 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread cyclotourist
Cantilevers don't have a limit to the size of rims they work with :-) As
long as the frame is built with the right tolerances, cantis are pretty
darn adjustable!

Cheers,
David

it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride. - Seth Vidal





On Wed, Mar 12, 2014 at 12:37 PM, clayton bailey treefir...@yahoo.comwrote:

 Someday, disc brakes will be old school and Rivendell will embrace them.
 I might be dead then, but if Rivendell lives on, it will happen...[image:
 *;) winking] Seriously, If I remember correctly, Grant has not ruled them
 out. He just hasn't found a need for them yet as the bikes they currently
 sell don't NEED them. A 29+ would need them as the rims are really 
 wide.[image:
 *:D big grin]






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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-12 Thread Joe Bernard
Kellie, there isn't much precedent for the process this particular bike has 
been through. Usually there's a prototype, it gets a name, it gets put into 
production. This Appaloosa started as a Mystery Bike which several folks 
signed up for sight unseen, then was revealed (original name, Rosco Bubbe) 
as a very long bike with the extra tubes, and no expectation that a front 
derailer would be fitted. It then went through a long gestation involving 
much name crunching; the extra rear stays developing the moniker 
'tentaculer' (my claim to fame: I brought up tentacles first, then Grant 
named them); and a front derailer appearing. Now we have Appaloosa, and 
several versions of the bike have been built. We await further developments.
 
Joe anyone correct me if I have any of this wrong Bernard
Vallejo, CA.

On Wednesday, March 12, 2014 5:50:48 PM UTC-7, Kellie Stapleton wrote:

 I'm fairly new to RBW; I've had my Sam just over a year. So how does this 
 go?…. an unnamed prototype? Does this mean it IS going into production and 
 will be a new model? Or is interest garnered from HQ rides and reading all 
 our posts?

 On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread Kevin Mulcahy
A little superfluous for my tastes...Not my favorite RBW design.

Kevin
Chicago, IL

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread cyclotourist
Nice, but doesn't quite compare to Mark's Knobby Custom Cross a few blug
posts down.

Cheers,
David

it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride. - Seth Vidal





On Tue, Mar 11, 2014 at 8:51 PM, Kevin Mulcahy kpmulc...@gmail.com wrote:

 A little superfluous for my tastes...Not my favorite RBW design.

 Kevin
 Chicago, IL

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread Peter Morgano
Looks like stock Sam and Betty lugs which are great but not Homer and
Atlantis fancy. If it takes big rubber it could be a winner.
On Mar 11, 2014 11:55 PM, cyclotourist cyclotour...@gmail.com wrote:

 Nice, but doesn't quite compare to Mark's Knobby Custom Cross a few blug
 posts down.

 Cheers,
 David

 it isn't a contest. Just enjoy the ride. - Seth Vidal





 On Tue, Mar 11, 2014 at 8:51 PM, Kevin Mulcahy kpmulc...@gmail.comwrote:

 A little superfluous for my tastes...Not my favorite RBW design.

 Kevin
 Chicago, IL

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread Jim M.
Looks like a new version of the Hunq to me.

jim m
wc ca

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread Jeremy Till
Of course, in Alabama, the Hunqaloosa.

Anyone? Anyone?

But oh yeah, the bikeWANT WANT WANT.  Makes me want to sell my new 29er 
and relatively new Long Haul Trucker, save up even more money, and buy one 
of these.  And 62cm would be just my size.  Even the color is perfect.  I'd 
keep the blue VP-001's (AKA Thin Gripsters) off my 29er and put them right 
on.  

Must get over to WC soon to ride this beast.  

On Tuesday, March 11, 2014 8:29:31 PM UTC-7, Christopher Murray wrote:

 Check it out in all it's blue-ness!

 http://rivbike.tumblr.com

 Cheers!
 Chris



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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread Coconutbill
some similar lugs to my Toyo Homer top (tube/headtube).
does the current Sam have the same fork details? 
gorgeously understated.

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[RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread Michael
The stays look tentacular. But not opposing tentaculation. Maybe it's a 
coordinated swim stroke.

That's a different fork crown lug than my 2013 blue Sam.

Cool that they have those rack mounting holes.

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Re: [RBW] Re: Appaloosa Prototype on Blug?

2014-03-11 Thread Peter Morgano
I am having a brain cramp. Is that lower lug the new one or the same off of
the Betty?
On Mar 12, 2014 1:22 AM, Michael john11.2...@gmail.com wrote:

 The stays look tentacular. But not opposing tentaculation. Maybe it's a
 coordinated swim stroke.

 That's a different fork crown lug than my 2013 blue Sam.

 Cool that they have those rack mounting holes.

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