Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: no power out of duplexer SOLVED with more questions
Hi, 70 watts out sounds OK. Duplexer's usually have about a 1 - 2db loss depends how they are set up, size of cavities etc and the model type. Duplexer loss = 10log(Pin/Pout) Duplexer Loss = 10Log(70/100)= -1.54dB. Peter On Mon, Sep 6, 2010 at 10:54 AM, W3ML w...@arrl.net wrote: Thanks Joe. We did most of those and then found the problem. The T-connector center pin had broken off when we apparently hooked up some test equipment and did not notice it. I still have one question though. Is it normal to have 100 watts coming out of radio and only 70 watts coming out of duplexer? Wacom 6 can type duplexer. That seems to be quite a loss. Again I appreciate all the help. 73 John, W3ML --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com, Joe k1ike_m...@... wrote: What make and model is the duplexer? I know of one instance that the loop inside the duplexer can come disconnected due to a bad solder joint, but can't remember what one it was. A search on this list should find it, as it was discussed recently. The first thing would be to check all connections for tightness. Do not over-tighten the connections! Just make sure that they are snug. If your knuckles are turning white, your tightening too much. N connectors need to be snug, UHF connectors need to be a little tighter, but not cranked down tight, but not until they break. What you can do is take the connecting cables off the transmit side cans and test the first one for power out. Then connect the next can in series and see if there is output from that can. This process should isolate the bad can(s). Disconnect the receiver while doing this just to be safe. MARK all the cables as to where they came from. Do not mix them up. It may be a bad cable, so if you find a problem make sure that it is not the interconnecting cable. If all the cans and cables test OK, their may be a problem on the receive side of the duplexer. Keep it simple, don't fool with the cans unless you prove that one is bad. This process is to eliminate the obvious before you go tinkering with the duplexer. Check the tightness of connections first, cables second, and lastly the cans. The process above will help you isolate the bad can so you hopefully only have to tinker with one can. The real fix would involve some test equipment. What do you have available? Service monitor, tracking generator? Others will probably have some good suggestions, these ideas are just off the top of my head. On 9/6/2010 9:37 AM, W3ML wrote: Hi, First, let me say that we are still new to the repeater business and learning as we go. This the first time in 30 ham years that I have been involved with a VHF repeater system. Our repeater was working okay at 80 watts out of GE Mastr II and 60 watts out of Duplexer. When I turn the power up to 100 out of radio and 80 out of duplexer it seemed to be working okay. But, now a few hours later there is no power coming out of duplexer at all. Radio still shows power coming out. Nothing was touch on the duplexer. Any ideas? 73 John, W3ML
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Micor Pin Gunk
FYI; Many years ago when I worked for Hewlett Packard in their Test Equipment division, we used to use a UK contact cleaner called Eletrolube, it was sold by Radiospares in UK. It was the only spray or drip contact cleaner we could use on the HP DC Standard as others would cause micro volt calibration errors due to minute leakages. In its day it was the Rolls Royce of contact cleaners. Don't know if its still available. I think they even had a paste for heavy duty switch contacts. Peter On Sun, Sep 5, 2010 at 11:12 AM, Eric Lemmon wb6...@verizon.net wrote: Tom, Any statements made on the Caig website regarding a comparison of DeOxit and Stabilant, could hardly be judged as unbiased. Legitimate, real-world comparisons of contact enhancement compounds have already been made, many times, by Motorola, IBM, Bendix-King, Hewlett-Packard, Tektronix, and other major manufacturers. I remember an article in Radio-Electronics Magazine, some 30 years ago, where the excellent performance of Stabilant was documented. Many moons ago, I cured a problem with my Apple II+ using Stabilant 22- the plug-in expansion and memory cards had a tendency to walk out of their motherboard sockets and cause intermittent contact. A thorough cleaning with an alcohol-soaked Q-Tip, followed by an application of Stabilant 22A, completely cured the intermittent contact. Don't be concerned about Stabilant 22 becoming hard; it dries into a waxy film that remains pliable for years. 73, Eric Lemmon WB6FLY -Original Message- From: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com [mailto:Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of TGundo 2003 Sent: Saturday, September 04, 2010 9:27 PM To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com Subject: Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Micor Pin Gunk Thanks Lou, Bob, Eric, John and the rest! I have a bunch of techs around here that all swear by Deox-it as long as its used sparangily, and Caig seems to hit all concern points in their website vs.22. Has anyone had any specific issues directly related to using Deox-it? I want to do the right thing and will order the 22 if necessary, but not only because it is what Circle M recommends...maybe Deox-it was not around when they made the recommendation? From reading the Caig website I think it may be a better choiceI worry a little about the 22 drying into a rigid form. What happens over time as the pins heat up and expand/contract, especially in a non-climate controlled environment? Tom W9SRV --- On Sat, 9/4/10, wa6epd lme...@cox.net lmeiss%40cox.net wrote: From: wa6epd lme...@cox.net lmeiss%40cox.net Subject: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Micor Pin Gunk To: Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Repeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com Date: Saturday, September 4, 2010, 10:57 PM Bob, NO6B, wrote:- This looks like the same stuff: http://www.micro-tools.com/store/P-22/Stabilant-22-5ml-Kit-Makes-30ml-Of-22 a.aspx The description of how Stabilant 22 works reads very similar to the Caig Labs DeOxIt products. A performance comparison between the 2 products would be interesting. Bob NO6B Take a look at:- http://store.caig.com/s.nl/ctype.KB/it.I/id.1977/KB.215/.f The do the comparison. -Lou- WA6EPD Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Circular polarization for VHF repeaters?
Hi, I remembered circular polarization was used for FM broadcast due to FM car radios, but when I looked it up I found out some interesting facts, see the link below, https://www.digitaltraders.com/index.php/index.php/components/com_kunena/template/default_ex/templates/ja_edenite/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=57Itemid=134 https://www.digitaltraders.com/index.php/index.php/components/com_kunena/template/default_ex/templates/ja_edenite/index.php?option=com_contentview=articleid=57Itemid=134Interesting white paper on FM Broadcast and why they had historically had circular polarization and why they are now changing to vertical polarization. Peter On Thu, Sep 2, 2010 at 1:22 AM, burkleoj joeburk...@hotmail.com wrote: Gary, I am in Southern Oregon and I understand exactly what you are experiencing. We have very similar problems down here with our club's repeater. I have often talked about and even done some serious looking at remodeling a set of broadcast loops and harness for 2 Meters. I know there was a southern California repeater back in the 70's that used circular polarization with excellent results. They were able to provide much better coverage in their main service area, but did loose some long distance coverage outside their main coverage area. We have had the best success by using a lower gain antenna. We have been using the Telewave broadband two loop antennas with 2 - 4 degrees of downtilt, for both our 2 Meter and 440 MHz repeaters. I have found much better close in (0-30 Miles) coverage, less muti-path, and they cost quite a bit less than a Super Stationmaster. Good Luck and keep us posted with what you find for results. Joe - WA7JAW --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com, Gary - K7EK gary.k...@... wrote: Greetings, I am in a particularly sticky situation with one of my two meter repeaters in Lakewood, WA (Tacoma). I have generally great coverage, however there is a very annoying problem with multipath and raspy signals in a large portion of my coverage area. Since the Puget Sound area of Western Washington is very hilly and mountainous, multipath is very damaging to all forms of VHF communication.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] ariels
Actually the correct spelling of the UK term for Antenna is Aerial not Ariel. Ariel was the name of a now defunct UK Motorcycle maker which closed around 1967. Ex Brit. On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 11:27 AM, Kevin Custer kug...@kuggie.com wrote: On 8/29/2010 1:15 PM, Doug Hutchison wrote: Ariel? Antenna maybe? C'mon guys. Be careful Doug. The poster is from the United Kingdom, where they use the term Ariel, not Antenna. You know what it means, so let it go. This list is not just for Americans, as we have many members from other Countries. Kevin Custer List Owner
Re: [Repeater-Builder] ariels
The spirit of air is mentioned in the Ariel Motocycle on Wiki as the source of their name based on the fact they implemented very light (as air) wire spoked wheels on cycles in the late 1890's. In this case I think it seems to come from a character in Shakespeare's plays, notably The Tempest. This also seems to be the nearly same dictionary definition for Aerial (of the air) as well. So it seems we owe this UK term for Antenna to Shakespeare. Funny I didn't realize that until I was Wiki checking my reply to this thread. The other Ariel is a Hebrew name meaning Lion of God. ie. as in Ariel Sharon, Israeli General Politician. Peter On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Steve steve.m1...@tiscali.co.uk wrote: correct, wasn't he also a greek god ? Steve(M1SWB) UK - Original Message - *From:* petedcur...@gmail.com *To:* Repeater-Builder Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Sent:* Monday, August 30, 2010 6:44 PM *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] ariels Actually the correct spelling of the UK term for Antenna is Aerial not Ariel. Ariel was the name of a now defunct UK Motorcycle maker which closed around 1967. Ex Brit. On Mon, Aug 30, 2010 at 11:27 AM, Kevin Custer kug...@kuggie.com wrote: On 8/29/2010 1:15 PM, Doug Hutchison wrote: Ariel? Antenna maybe? C'mon guys. Be careful Doug. The poster is from the United Kingdom, where they use the term Ariel, not Antenna. You know what it means, so let it go. This list is not just for Americans, as we have many members from other Countries. Kevin Custer List Owner
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: Seeking emergency system design help
If you chose to go digital, like P25 then you could also measure BER in your coverage test? This maybe more meaningful. Although many public safety customers will still ask for voice checks as well. On Sat, Aug 28, 2010 at 12:52 PM, Matthew Kaufman matt...@matthew.atwrote: On 8/28/2010 8:38 AM, nj902 wrote: Because a mobile radio really has no way to provide a meaningful delivered audio quality indication, coverage acceptance testing of analog systems is usually done by measuring carrier level at [mobile] locations throughout the system's service area and using DAQ equivalence as defined in TSB-88 to determine whether the values measured meet coverage requirements. During these coverage acceptance tests, the system base station carrier is unmodulated, thus the measured values have no relationship to the bandwidth of the system and would be identical for a given base station transmit power - regardless of which mode it is programmed for. Correct. Which is also why measuring DAQ equivalent this way is pretty much useless for anyplace that has substantial terrain (hills and mountains) or even reflective urban structures that aren't in the center of the coverage area (highrise buildings in a suburban area that is some ways away from the transmitter). Most of the audio quality problems that result in unintelligible signals at the edge of the coverage are caused by flutter and multipath, neither of which is detectable by looking at the level of an unmodulated carrier. Matthew Kaufman
Re: [Repeater-Builder] DC Electrical Systems
Actually DC is the latest thing in power transmission. The gigantic Itaipu Hydroelectric plant is located on the River border between Paraguay Brazil and thus a shared project. Paraguay is 50HZ and Brazil is 60HZ. As such half the Alternators are 50HZ and the other half are 60HZ. But most of the generated power goes to Brazil. The 50HZ 60HZ AC is converted to DC and sent by a 1 million volt DC transmission line to Brazil then converted back to 60HZ in Brazil. Peter On Thu, Aug 26, 2010 at 11:27 AM, skipp025 skipp...@yahoo.com wrote: Mike Morris wa6i...@... wrote: And actually the DC distribution system was more common than you think. So is live steam... In large cities like San Francisco you can still find utility supplied DC and steam. Most of the Hydro Plants I've ever worked in were operated off/from a very large bank of series connected station size lead-acid batteries. The plant can start under its own 120 Vdc bank of batteries if the grid source is unavailable. There's a lot of DC and Steam still out there... I recently was up at the Mt. Wilson observatory and was inside the 100-inch telescope dome. ALL of the controls for the telescope, the dome slit motors (the ones that slide the panel open the telescope to look through), the dome rotation motor (which is surprisingly small for the load), everything but the overhead lighting is 120v DC. And has been since about 1918. Even the ballast tubes for the control are original carbon filament bulbs. I have alot of photos/ Mike WA6ILQ At 02:13 AM 08/24/10, you wrote: We had our fill of those here, too. The hot side of the AC line (if you were lucky, polarized plugs were rare in those days) was connected directly to a 35W4 or some such half wave rectifier tube and later to a selenium half wave rectifier with the other side of the AC line being connected as the negative lead (fortunately NOT to the chassis). Usually, there were a couple of 0.01uf capacitors from each side of the line to the chassis, however. Doubt I need to explain the joys one could experience with that arrangement! And, to top it off, each and every one of those radios proudly bore our UL stamp of approval! They used to call them AC/DC radios because, if you lucked out and got the polarity right, the radio didn't care what the source was as long as it was somewhere near 100 volts DC or RMS. Tom --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com, Gordon Cooper zl1kl@ wrote: Another quirk. Sixty plus years ago in England, power factor was not the main concern. Many of the domestic radio receivers were transformerless and used half-wave rectification to obtain D.C. for the tubes. A consequence was a fair dose of D.C. flowing in the street power mains. Gordon ZL1KL Tauranga N.Z. Yahoo! Groups Links
Re: [Repeater-Builder] made a rpt
Translation from Brazilian Portuguese to English: Hello to all, Anyone have a circuit diagram of a simple Link - Repeater controller PC Board. The controller would interface a VHF Repeater made up of two GM300 mobiles to a third interface port for a UHF Link using a Motorola Maxtrac mobile radio. Rodrigo Lima 2010/8/22 Rodrigo Lima limoidefilho...@itelefonica.com.br ola a todos alguem teria um esquema simples de uma placa controladora de repetidora que pudesse controlar dois radios de vhf e mais um link em uhf, sendo 2 gm300 e um maxtrac da motorola .obrigado (moderators note:) Can someone post a translation so that the non-spanish peakers can help this gentleman?
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Polyphaser Question
If you have a problem with a ground due to terrain issues, you might want to look into using Lyncole grounding rods. These are hollow copper tubes with a chemical crystal compound inside. The rod has some tapes around breather holes which you remove prior to burying in betonite clay etc.. The top of the rod is left just above ground in a round housing / inspection cover. These create temperature differential between top and bottom and create moisture condensation which leaches out and creates a better ground over time. There is also a L shaped grounding rod which is laid in a trench in case you can't dig down 8ft or so. Usually only one or two rods are required to achieve the 4 ohms. Peter On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 12:01 AM, Tim tahr...@swtexas.net wrote: This has been a very interesting thread to watch, and most of the installations that I've done have been 'add-ons' to existing well designed systems. On a different note, I'm now working on a solar powered system, and was wondering about the grounding there. Everything will be mounted on a single pole, which will be several feet in the ground. I had planned to make a ground system in a 3 or 4 'spoke' design, with a ground rod at each end of the spoke. There will also be a ground rod within several inches of the pole. Each spoke and the pole will be tied together at a common point. I haven't put any of the rods into the ground here... I use the term 'ground' somewhat loosely.. there is a LOT of rock on the tops of these hills here. Not sure I'll be able to get them all the desired depth. Anyhow, suggestions and comments are welcome. The pole will not be the tallest thing on the hill, there are several Oak trees that will be higher. Provide any cover? Thanks, Tim
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Motorola Radius GM600 HELP
Hi, This is a European MPT1327 trunked radio. Needs a specific GM600 version of RSS to program it. I saw that the RSS seemed to be available on the web at some HAM sites. Do a web search for Motorola GM600 RSS, OK? Peter On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 7:03 AM, dxhunters dxhunt...@yahoo.com wrote: Hi I cant find the software on the internet cps for programing this radio Can I use the gm350 software ?? Help need,, link to soft? or somthing ? Best Regards from Nico in Norway
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Polyphaser Question
You might like to look at the latest Motorola R56 Installation standards manual. It's very comprehensive. Has good section on grounding and protective devices. Yes, a good grounding system and a full lightning and surge protection of an RF site doesn't come cheap. But if you live in Florida the lightning capital of USA or similar location then every step you can take can save really big bucks in system damage and give you more system up time. Back in the mid 1990's I did a R56 installation of a 800MHZ trunking system in Manaus, Amazonas in Brazil.This was co-located with a 50KW TV and 20KW FM radio site and also at the same site he was running the local ISP vial dial in landlines. The customer initially thought we were really overdoing the trunking installation by following R56.But after a massive direct strike which took out both broadcast transmitters and burnt out every one of his hundred or so Modems, but thanks to our following the R56 installation guidelines the 800Mhz site kept on happily trunking. He then read with great interest the R56 manual and applied it to his whole installation. Peter On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 8:34 AM, Joe k1ike_m...@snet.net wrote: I don't think that you have necessarily wasted your time, but you have severely limited your chances of decreasing lightning damage. It's like replacing 3 tires on your car that has 4 bad tires, you've bettered your odds but it is not the best fix. I have a site that the owner would throw me off if I started installing single;e point grounding and all kinds of wiring. I use a grounded Polyphasor in hopes that it will decrease my odds of lightning damage. Yes, the purist will say that this is wrong, but it's not my site and I'm a guest. That's the deal and I accept it. It's a case of something is better than nothing. 73, Joe, K1ike On 8/17/2010 10:42 PM, Chuck Kelsey wrote: Leave one unprotected path available and you've wasted your time. Chuck WB2EDV
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Celwave CC460-A circulator
Hi, Harold Kinley wrote an excellent article in MRT magazine a few years ago on aligning circulators. Maybe they still have re-prints. I have old contact details for Harold Kinley taken from MRT magazine. See below. You should also buy his *Standard Radio Communications Manual, with Instrumentation and Testing Techniques. * Contributing editor Kinley, *MRT's* technical consultant and a certified electronics technician, is regional communications manager, South Carolina Forestry Commission, Spartanburg, SC. He is the author of *Standard Radio Communications Manual, with Instrumentation and Testing Techniques,* which is available for direct purchase. Write to 204 Tanglewylde Drive, Spartanburg, SC 29301. His email address is halkin...@charter.net. On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 3:18 PM, cruizzer77 atlant...@gmx.ch wrote: Does anyone have a datasheet or tuning instructions for this kind of circulator? It's a single stage with 3 adjustment screws and right now the sticker says it's on 420 MHz and I would like to know how I get a working range from 430 to 440 MHz. If somebody can explain without the doc this is fine as well. 73 Martin
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Polyphaser Question
I agree totally with Gary. Common grounding point is essential to avoid voltage differences between equipment during a strike. When you get a strike the grounding point will rise, so you want to make sure everything that is grounded goes up together. As the leading edges of the voltages strikes are very sharp, low inductance grounding is important, so a large size cable or strip, smooth curves from the expected strike source to ground point and definitely no loops in those equipment ground cables. Covering every possible strike source, so ground kits on the transmission lines, surge protectors on tower light wiring, a main surge arrestor located at the incoming AC breaker or if you have a generator set at the AC entry before the Transfer panel. All Telephone lines or external T1's or control lines should have suitable grounded surge protectors. Transtector has a great line of AC Telephone, T1 protectors and they have just merged with Polyphasor. They even have a web page with items approved for Motorola R56 installations. The coax Polyphasor are really there to stop a high voltage developing between the center and shield. Thats just a small part of the problem. You need ground kits along the transmission lines, one at the top, one in the middle and one just before it enters the building, AC protectors, and a well grounded tower. All that will connect to common point to a good buried external grounding system using Exothermic Cadwelded connections with hopefully a less than 4 ohms ground resistance. A now you are all set to take on those strikes :) Peter On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 8:39 PM, Gary Schafer gascha...@comcast.net wrote: Here is a little primer on lightning: Having your antenna grounded does not drain off any charge that helps prevent a strike. As a matter of fact grounding the antenna makes it slightly more prone to a strike but not grounding it is much worse as you have no control over what path the energy will take if not grounded. When a storm cloud moves over the area charge builds on objects on the ground. The ground items, towers etc start to emit streamers. When a strike is imminent step leaders come down from the charged cloud and move in approximately 150 foot steps. Changing directions with each step. When a step leader gets close enough to a streamer a connection is made. What follows is a plasma trail which is a very low impedance path that the lightning charge follows. Lightning can be thought of as a current source. In other words if there is a 10 KA strike it is going to develop that much current into whatever it strikes. If for example it hits your tower and the total impedance to ground is quite low then the voltage developed across the tower will be relatively low. But if the ground system is not a good one then the voltage will rise higher. It will still develop the 10 KA current. Bonding all equipment to a common point is one of the first steps to take. Just adding a polyphaser coax protector to the coax line will only equalize the current between center conductor and shield. If power is not protected and everything bonded together the coax protector will do little good. Even without a coax protector, just bonding everything is a great first step. The whole idea is to keep everything at the same voltage level when a strike occurs. 73 Gary K4FMX -- *From:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto: repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *Tony KT9AC *Sent:* Wednesday, August 18, 2010 9:25 AM *To:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com *Subject:* Re: [Repeater-Builder] Polyphaser Question Remember the objective is not to take the brunt of a lightning strike, but to drain off any static that would attract that strike. Lightning is just a spark looking to close the gap, and if your antenna is closer to DC ground, it will find something closer to its potential (i.e. static charged) to hit. Any protection is better than nothing, and don't scrimp on buying the cheapest used protector. Its your equipment your protecting and potentially avoiding liability. I buy new Polyphasers for our site and sleep just fine. On 08/18/2010 08:56 AM, wd8chl wrote: On 8/17/2010 11:55 PM, Ray Brown wrote: What do you do when you want to install a small UHF linking repeater on a 4-story building that has no lightning protection on its' roof? (this is to link an ambulance at a hospital to its' base repeater 40 miles away) From what I've heard, it may not be a good idea to hook it to the HVAC, either. (sigh) Ray, KB0STN No. I would find the nearest copper pipe from either the in-house water system or the sprinkler system, and clamp to that (making sure you don't crimp the pipe!!!) using #6 or maybe #8 wire if it's REALLY close (less then 5') Again, not as good as a dedicated system, but MUCH better then nothing.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Polyphaser Question
Hi Michael, Probably for 220MHZ choose between VHF50HN-ME for high powered TX or multiple TX'sand a IS-B50LN-C0-MA is for a single normal power TX. These have the N connectors sexed as you want.Check the power rating of each device at your frequency. Peter On Tue, Aug 17, 2010 at 2:51 AM, Michael Ryan mryan...@tampabay.rr.comwrote: I notice when looking at the Polyphaser website, there are a wide range of products, even a wide variety of items that on the surface appear to be suited to my particular needs. I want to put a Polyphaser on my 220 repeater. There are DC blocked and unblocked. I don’t suppose it matters in that area as there is no DC going up the coax. There are freq ranges, 1.5-400 and 100 – 700 mhz, etc, etc.. Is it best to select a model that places my operating freq somewhere in the middle of the unit’s operating range or does that matter as long as it IS WITHIN the range of the device someplace? I need the protected end to be an N-female and the antenna end to be and N-Male. Suggestions? - Mike __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 5371 (20100816) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Digital repeater sidebands??
I guess you say what type of modulation and bandwidth are you using for the new Digital Repeater? Should not be any problem. The digital modulation mask are getting more efficient in the use of the spectrum as channel bandwidth get narrower. The name of the game is to get more spectrum efficiency. Just because you go digital the RF rules of the game should not change. They say Digital modulation is less inclined to discernible interference than analog FM. I have not seen any problems when taking trunked systems from Analog FM to Digital P25. I have several mixed mode systems and again have never seen any inter-modulation issues come up when going to digital mode. In general I think the Digital P25 mode gives much better quality audio over a larger part of the coverage area. Something commercial especially public safety users want. Peter On Sun, Aug 15, 2010 at 10:46 AM, Burt Lang b...@gorum.ca wrote: Hi folks We have a digital repeater in the 420-430 MHz subband that is being installed shortly on our site. I am concerned about the possible interference to systems in the 440-450Mhz subband on the same site. What experience have you folks had with similar systems and installations? What is the typical sideband levels from commercial digital repeaters at 10MHz+ spacing? FYI this site is owned by our club and we have full control over the installations on it including the commercial customers who lease space on it. I just want to know what to look for when this new system is installed. Burt VE2BMQ
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Stolen Equipment Alert
Hi, FYI: I find that EBAY has the most HP Test Equipment for sale. I'll keep an eye out for that model. Peter On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 7:59 AM, Chuck Kelsey wb2...@roadrunner.com wrote: From another list: Last Thursday , 8-5-2010 We had a Agilent model E4405B Spectrum Analyzer boosted (Stolen) from our transmitter Facility (Chalet Building) here on Delta College Campus Near Bay City Michigan .No forcible entry and no other items taken other then a box of coax adaptors for the analyzer. This happen during the day between 9 am and 6 pm . The serial number is MY41440418. Our thoughts are that someone knew the entry code and knew what the Agilent was . If for some chance you hear of a spectrum analyzer for sale please inquire on it or just contact me and let me know so I can forward it on to the police . The replacement cost is 31,000 dollars . I have contacted Agilent and notified them of the theft and I have a E-bay search out also ...I will check Craig's list as time allows . If you have any other sources that deal's with used equipment for sale .I would appreciate if you would forward this information on to them or keep your eyes open for it . I am hoping the insurance will cover this as I will sorely miss this wonderful Diagnostic tool . Ours had a built in signal generator option and had a grey protection cover for the front . Thanks David Nuechterlein Q-TV , WDCQ TV 15 PBS , WUCX 90.1 NPR Delta College / Delta Broadcasting , Engineering Dept A045 Frank N. Andersen Broadcast Building 1961 Delta Rd. University Center Michigan 48710 989 686 9341 Office 989 326 0051 Mobile Office
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Dissasembly of msr 2000 continuous duty amp. How?
Have you swept the Antenna and Transmission Line with a Site analyzer or a Comms Analyzer / RF Bridge? Peter On Tue, Aug 10, 2010 at 8:35 AM, radi...@aol.com wrote: I don't think there are any drain plugs on this antenna. connection seals were checked and re-done. I am not familiar with the desense tests, but both repeater and duplexer were replaced. New duplexer tested at more than 100 db isolation and power is about 75 watts .Problem must be with hard line (replaced already), tower or antenna. In a message dated 8/10/2010 12:09:39 A.M. Eastern Daylight Time, petedcur...@gmail.com writes: Hi, Juts a thought: Sometimes certain antennas have a drain plug at the bottom and sometime one at the top. You should remove the drain plug at the bottom for normal mounting or the one at the top for inverted mounting.If you don't water can ingress, then can't escape and build up.Another thing to check is the connector sealing. Peter On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 4:49 PM, Kevin Custer kug...@kuggie.com wrote: radi...@aol.com wrote: Hi Kevin, The desense is a staticy reception of weaker signals( ie an HT at 25 miles) It had gotten worse as it started to affect strong signals too. If the transmitter was turned off, the repeater could hear just fine. Problem is intermittent and often followed a rainy day. We replaced EVERYTHING A UHF repeater on the same tower is unaffected. At this point we think the new antenna is failing. Tower sections have been bonded grounds improved etc etc To know whether or not the problem is the antenna system, do a desensitization test directly at the antenna port of the duplexer using a good load and a lossy tee or other acceptable method like a coupler slug installed into the Bird Watt meter. If you don't know how to perform a desense test, there are several articles on the website that will assist you. If this proves good, then you have more work to do on the outside. Let us know... Kevin
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Dissasembly of msr 2000 continuous duty amp. How?
Hi, Juts a thought: Sometimes certain antennas have a drain plug at the bottom and sometime one at the top. You should remove the drain plug at the bottom for normal mounting or the one at the top for inverted mounting.If you don't water can ingress, then can't escape and build up.Another thing to check is the connector sealing. Peter On Mon, Aug 9, 2010 at 4:49 PM, Kevin Custer kug...@kuggie.com wrote: radi...@aol.com wrote: Hi Kevin, The desense is a staticy reception of weaker signals( ie an HT at 25 miles) It had gotten worse as it started to affect strong signals too. If the transmitter was turned off, the repeater could hear just fine. Problem is intermittent and often followed a rainy day. We replaced EVERYTHING A UHF repeater on the same tower is unaffected. At this point we think the new antenna is failing. Tower sections have been bonded grounds improved etc etc To know whether or not the problem is the antenna system, do a desensitization test directly at the antenna port of the duplexer using a good load and a lossy tee or other acceptable method like a coupler slug installed into the Bird Watt meter. If you don't know how to perform a desense test, there are several articles on the website that will assist you. If this proves good, then you have more work to do on the outside. Let us know... Kevin
Re: [Repeater-Builder] HP3551A Service manual
Thanks for the tip, I'll try re-seating the flat cable connectors. Already cleaned the multi turn noisy freq pot with success by drilling a small hole and injecting suitable contact cleaner / lubricant inside. Peter On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 9:20 PM, Randy Fisher wb9...@indianadata.com wrote: Hi Peter, I had my 3551 failed sometime ago, was intermittent connections in the unit, just cleaned and reseated connectors and IC’s, unit has worked fine since? You may want to try it and see if it works. *From:* Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com [mailto: repeater-buil...@yahoogroups.com] *On Behalf Of *petedcur...@gmail.com *Sent:* Saturday, August 07, 2010 11:18 AM *To:* Repeater-Builder *Subject:* [Repeater-Builder] HP3551A Service manual Hi, I saw someone had used a HP3551A TIMS to set up repeater audio levels. I have a used HP3551A also, but it recently stopped working. Wonder if anyone had schematics? The manual I found online had everything but no schematics. A good high resolution Jpeg photo of the schematics would be greatly appreciated. Peter Ex. G8DCB. Now resident in FL.USA.
[Repeater-Builder] HP3551A Service manual
Hi, I saw someone had used a HP3551A TIMS to set up repeater audio levels. I have a used HP3551A also, but it recently stopped working. Wonder if anyone had schematics? The manual I found online had everything but no schematics. A good high resolution Jpeg photo of the schematics would be greatly appreciated. Peter Ex. G8DCB. Now resident in FL.USA.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] Re: HP3551A Service manual
Thanks for the HP Bulletin. Long time since I''ve seen one of those (Used to work for HP in the 1970's to 1980's). I have already fixed the 5V Power supply and that was a shorted 390uf 20V Electrolytic cap. But the digital display does not display either level or frequency, although the audio level out is just fine. Did the loop tests in the part of the manual I have and still nothing obvious, so really need a schematic to understand what's is going on. Peter On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 8:02 PM, Fuggitaboutit mikew...@hotmail.com wrote: http://www.hparchive.com/Bench_Briefs/HP-Bench-Briefs-1980-07-08.pdf bulletin from hp says the product may have had incorrect line fuse if you want to fix it take the cover off and check some basics many of the hp test equipment of this vintage needed power supply caps --- In Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.comRepeater-Builder%40yahoogroups.com, petedcur...@... wrote: Hi, I saw someone had used a HP3551A TIMS to set up repeater audio levels. I have a used HP3551A also, but it recently stopped working. Wonder if anyone had schematics? The manual I found online had everything but no schematics. A good high resolution Jpeg photo of the schematics would be greatly appreciated. Peter Ex. G8DCB. Now resident in FL.USA.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] HP3551A Service manual
Thanks Ralph, On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 8:26 PM, Ralph S. Turk w7...@comcast.net wrote: I will try to remember tomorrow to look. If you don't hear from me in a day, send me a email Ralph - Original Message - From: petedcur...@gmail.com To: Repeater-Builder Repeater-Builder@yahoogroups.com Sent: Saturday, August 7, 2010 8:18:27 AM Subject: [Repeater-Builder] HP3551A Service manual Hi, I saw someone had used a HP3551A TIMS to set up repeater audio levels. I have a used HP3551A also, but it recently stopped working. Wonder if anyone had schematics? The manual I found online had everything but no schematics. A good high resolution Jpeg photo of the schematics would be greatly appreciated. Peter Ex. G8DCB. Now resident in FL.USA.
Re: [Repeater-Builder] AGM Batteries
Correction, Error, I meant the normal float charging voltage is usually about 13.65V NOT 12.65 V. On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 9:42 PM, petedcur...@gmail.com wrote: Hi, Sealed Lead Acid Gel batteries do not vent under normal conditions. Referring to 12 V batteries: Just make sure the maximum charging voltage is as per the batteries spec. (usually about 12.65V at 25deg C) My experience is that even when they have been left erroneously charging continuously in equalization mode at 14.4V they bulge, dry out loose capacity pretty quickly but they don't gas and they don't leak. Sealed Gel cells generally should not be equalized at a higher charging voltage. So if you have an equalization setting disable it. Some chargers may have a temp sensor which should be placed on the batteries casing, this helps to adjust the chargers batteries charging voltage to match changes in temperature. As such they are safe to have in the same room as your equipment. I have not yet used AGM type sealed batteries, but they are supposed to be much more durable under repeated deep discharge cycles, a batteries worst enemy in reducing their lifetime. For this reason they are highly recommended for Solar systems. Peter On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 5:05 PM, tahrens301 tahr...@swtexas.net wrote: Hi Folks, I got a couple of the large AGM batteries for a solar installation, and was wondering if there is any condition that will lead them to vent inside the enclosure? They are sealed, but probably have one-way valves. Can I put the solar controller in the same enclosure? Figured some of you folks have done solar stuff before. Thanks, Tim
Re: [Repeater-Builder] AGM Batteries
Hi, Sealed Lead Acid Gel batteries do not vent under normal conditions. Referring to 12 V batteries: Just make sure the maximum charging voltage is as per the batteries spec. (usually about 12.65V at 25deg C) My experience is that even when they have been left erroneously charging continuously in equalization mode at 14.4V they bulge, dry out loose capacity pretty quickly but they don't gas and they don't leak. Sealed Gel cells generally should not be equalized at a higher charging voltage. So if you have an equalization setting disable it. Some chargers may have a temp sensor which should be placed on the batteries casing, this helps to adjust the chargers batteries charging voltage to match changes in temperature. As such they are safe to have in the same room as your equipment. I have not yet used AGM type sealed batteries, but they are supposed to be much more durable under repeated deep discharge cycles, a batteries worst enemy in reducing their lifetime. For this reason they are highly recommended for Solar systems. Peter On Sat, Aug 7, 2010 at 5:05 PM, tahrens301 tahr...@swtexas.net wrote: Hi Folks, I got a couple of the large AGM batteries for a solar installation, and was wondering if there is any condition that will lead them to vent inside the enclosure? They are sealed, but probably have one-way valves. Can I put the solar controller in the same enclosure? Figured some of you folks have done solar stuff before. Thanks, Tim
