RE: NICET versus NFPA CFPS

It depends on your career path. NICET: Specializes industry and is required by almost every states to perform design and/or installation/service - Fire Alarm, Sprinkler Layout, I&T, and Special Hazard. NFPA CFPA: Overall generalization and is not required by state (but adds weight with fire ma

Re: NICET versus NFPA CFPS

I held both at one time. I let the CFPS lapse. Professionally, it really did nothing for me. I am, and will always be a sprinkler guy. The CFPS exam covers great breadth, but the depth is very shallow. NICET has a very narrow breadth, but the depth is extensive. I guess if I ever decided

Re: NICET versus NFPA CFPS

Being a holder of both, NICET is by far and away the recognized program for sprinkler design, ITM and alarm design nationwide. CFPS is generally most widely recognized by the insurance industry and fire service. CFPS focuses on fire protection as a end to end concern but in more general terms.

RE: NICET versus NFPA CFPS

It depends on your career path. NICET: Specializes industry and is required by almost every states to perform design and/or installation/service - Fire Alarm, Sprinkler Layout, I&T, and Special Hazard. NFPA CFPA: Overall generalization and is not required by state (but adds weight with fire ma

NICET versus NFPA CFPS

I have some management types confused on these certifications and what they represent in the industry. Does anyone have any info that spells out the differences between these two programs? I'm not looking for a debate of value here. I need an outside party's opinion and evaluation. My opinio

RE: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

FM Global data sheet 8-9 gives you options for the ceiling and storage arrangements you describe. Nicky Marshall Southern Regional Manager PROTECH DESIGN LIMITED Specialist Fire Protection Consultants Phone: +64 (0)3 579 5577 Mobile: +64 (0)21 433 488 Email: ni...@protechdesign.co.nz

Re: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

That was my next trick, but I think I convinced them to move it out of the building. Todd G Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, CT 860-535-2080 (ofc) 860-608-4559 (cell) Sent using CloudMagic [https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=ti&cv=6.0.64&pv=8.2] On Thu, Jun 23, 2016

Re: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

remember too look at the FM criteria since they have had guidance on exposed expanded for some time Roland Roland Huggins, PE - VP Engineering American Fire Sprinkler Assn. --- Fire Sprinklers Saves Lives Dallas, TX http://www.firesprinkler.org > On

RE: Two Backflows

Perfect. John Irwin Critical System Solutions Sprinkler Construction Manager 813-618-2781 jir...@criticalsystemsolutions.com Sent from a mobile device. Please forgive brevity, spelling errors and punctuation gaffes. Original message ---

RE: Two Backflows

>From the Florida Plumbing Code: 608.16.4 Connections to automatic fire sprinkler systems and standpipe systems. The potable water supply to automatic fire sprinkler and standpipe systems shall be protected against backflow by a double check backflow prevention assembly, a double check fire prot

Re: Two Backflows

Laws can be hilarious (when you're outside looking in), perplexing, or downright stupid. I'll give you a Washington for instance. On a private fire service main the sprinkler contractor can run the line from the tap to the entry flange but if a back flow device is within the building footprint then

RE: Two Backflows

This answer I like. Time to dig in to AWWA. Thanks John Irwin Critical System Solutions Sprinkler Construction Manager 813-618-2781 jir...@criticalsystemsolutions.com Sent from a mobile device. Please forgive brevity, spelling errors and punctuat

RE: Two Backflows

The AWWA has requirements for Backflow Prevention and Cross Connection mitigation which are followed by the water purveyors. It sounds like you have a deficiency and coordination issue in the plans you were given. I would be drafting an RFI to the GC asking them to contact the EOR for clarific

RE: Two Backflows

Yes I understand what I should do, but it's not my place to go around the general contractor, engineer, owner and architect. Only to advise. We have an approved site plan and I have an approved sprinkler shop drawing. If viewed at the same time the issue becomes apparent. When viewed and permitt

RE: Two Backflows

Fire Sprinkler systems are served off of domestic potable water lines all over the place. Very common. Your requirement to protect the potable water is coming from the local water purveyor or health department not from NFPA 13. This protection of the potable system has been around for decades

RE: Two Backflows

Another concern would be that if it is a shared line you need to add the plumbing demand to you calculations From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of John Irwin Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2016 11:16 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subj

Re: Two Backflows

RPs listed (USC and UL, amongst others) for fire service exist in 2 ½ to 10 from Ames (that's just what i looked up quickly). I don't understand the why the RP on the incoming line at all, but maybe there's info you didn't share. The health department in most places determines back flow locations a

RE: Two Backflows

Water company requires BFP not NFPA 13, 24. Art Tiroly From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of John Irwin Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2016 11:16 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Two Backflows I use RPZ as a generic

RE: Two Backflows

I use RPZ as a generic term. Also I am going under the assumption that I MUST separate my sprinkler from the domestic at the point of connection. However it was brought to my attention that this may not be required in NFPA anyway. While the thought of sprinkler water and domestic water sickens

RE: Two Backflows

I don't think there's any prohibition and we've been asked to do this before. I would check with serving water and fire departments to be sure that both devices satisfy the requirement of their respective masters. RPZ's are not UL classified for fire service and usually configured with non-ind

RE: Two Backflows

I've had that come up before. Could not find anything against it. Matt Grisé PE*, LEED AP, NICET II Sales Engineer Alliance Fire Protection 130 w 9th Ave. North Kansas City, MO 64116 *Licensed in KS & MO 913.888.0647 ph 913.888.0618 f 913.526.7443 cell www. AFPsprink.com From: Sprinklerforum [

Two Backflows

I am working on a project where the developer and site contractor have decided that fire and domestic should share an underground line around the site and to the building. At the street there is a meter assembly and a Wilkins 375A RPZ. I would need to install an additional backflow at my point o

Re: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

Precisely my thoughts. I'm trying to get them to at least box it. Todd G Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, CT 860-535-2080 (ofc) 860-608-4559 (cell) Sent using CloudMagic [https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=ti&cv=6.0.64&pv=8.2] On Thu, Jun 23, 2016 at 9:47 AM, Scott F

RE: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

So you have a couple of questions and a couple of issues. I'm guessing, and one of our committee members can confirm, that the K25's haven't been tested in that specific scenario. Exposed and expanded is a bigger concern. Until the 2016 issue there wasn't a protection scheme for rack storage o

Re: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

Up to 2016 (2013 adopted in jurisdiction). Could be both cartooned and exposed. That is a debate as well. Todd G Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, CT 860-535-2080 (ofc) 860-608-4559 (cell) Sent using CloudMagic [https://cloudmagic.com/k/d/mailapp?ct=ti&cv=6.0.64&pv=8.2

Re: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

Ceiling height needs to be the Highest point within Storage area(example I have is 2/12 pitch roof) 25'6" will have a different psi starting PSIthan 24'6"just taking a quick glance,using NFPA 13 2013 edtiontable 17.2.3.1   may get a starting point. On Thursday, June 23, 2016 6:27 AM, Todd

RE: K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

Todd, Which edition are you using and are the commodities cartoned or exposed? Scott Office: (763) 425-1001 x 2 Cell: (612) 759-5556 From: Sprinklerforum [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Todd Williams Sent: Thursday, June 23, 2016 8:26 AM To: sprinklerforum@

K25 ESFR and plastic storage.

I am working on a location with existing K25 ESFR sprinklers. This is an existing building where a new client is moving in. The ceiling height is approximately 25 ft and there will be rack storage of plastics (both expanded and unexpanded) to 20 ft. Looking through the chart in 13, there are so