Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On 24.11.2015 17:21, Clifford Snow wrote: > Thanks everyone for the input. As much as I like the concept of using > the sidewalk attribute to the road, it doesn't seem like it is all that > useful for adding kerb slope. Sure, but the sidewalk attribute is essential for other, much more basic use

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, 2015-11-24 at 15:22 -0800, Clifford Snow wrote: > > On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 2:12 PM, Tobias Knerr > wrote: > > Sure, but the sidewalk attribute is essential for other, much more > > basic > > use cases that separate ways fail to serve. > > > Can you elaborate on

Re: [Tagging] amenity=bicycle_repair_station

Here's another confusion along these lines: http://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/30749887 ___ Tagging mailing list Tagging@openstreetmap.org https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 4:14 PM, Philip Barnes wrote: > They are not matching reality, can cause long detours and poor routing > unless the mapper provides a lot of connections to the road. Remember > normal pedestrians can cross wherever they want. > That is true, but

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

> On Nov 25, 2015, at 9:14 AM, Philip Barnes wrote: > > Remember > normal pedestrians can cross wherever they want People with vision impairments or wheelchairs can't - so directing them to crosswalks with kerb cuts/slopes and assisted signals (sounds, etc) sounds like

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 2:12 PM, Tobias Knerr wrote: > Sure, but the sidewalk attribute is essential for other, much more basic > use cases that separate ways fail to serve. > Can you elaborate on why separate ways fail to serve? > > > I don't think relations are the

Re: [Tagging] Relevance or otherwise of the wiki

I found this explanation "I propose to replace highway=ford with ford=yes (or perhaps barrier=ford?) on nodes as well, simply to de-clutter the highway tag and to be more consistent." here http://gis.19327.n5.nabble.com/highway-ford-vs-ford-yes-tp5178509p5178527.html I'd use the same argument

Re: [Tagging] Relevance or otherwise of the wiki (was: improve tagging of traffic_calming)

Gerd Petermann wrote > > Andy Townsend wrote >> On 20/11/2015 18:49, Gerd Petermann wrote: >>> >>> What am I getting wrong here? Did someone remove the >>> preferred way of tagging from the wiki and nobody noticed >>> it for years? >>> >> >> It doesn't surprise me that something documented with

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

Thanks everyone for the input. As much as I like the concept of using the sidewalk attribute to the road, it doesn't seem like it is all that useful for adding kerb slope. It wasn't pointed out, but one additional problem with using the sidewalk attribute is that a new mapper will likely not look

Re: [Tagging] Relevance or otherwise of the wiki

On 24/11/2015 16:47, Gerd Petermann wrote: Gerd Petermann wrote Andy Townsend wrote On 20/11/2015 18:49, Gerd Petermann wrote: What am I getting wrong here? Did someone remove the preferred way of tagging from the wiki and nobody noticed it for years? It doesn't surprise me that something

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Wed, Nov 25, 2015 at 12:09:23AM +0900, johnw wrote: > having the man_made=bridge share layers with the roads and sidewalks does > work for all but a handful of bridges (I like that tag) - but assuming the > bridge is a single layer really makes things difficult for large/iconic/odd >

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On 24/11/2015 6:28 PM, John Willis wrote: On Nov 24, 2015, at 1:22 PM, Marc Gemis wrote: The problem with separate ways, is that none of the current routers will tell you that you have to cross the street to reach a house on the other side of the road. Most likely, they

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

In Belgium several primary/secondary roads go through town centers (e.g. [1], [2]), where the maximum speed is reduced to 50 km/h (same as for residential roads). Most people will cross the street where it is most suitable (especially near [2] where the road is even pretty narrow), not

Re: [Tagging] highway=crossing not rendered on Mapnik (& others)

On Sun, Nov 22, 2015 at 4:24 PM, Richard Mann < richard.mann.westoxf...@gmail.com> wrote: > You may or may not know, but mid-block signalled crossings are a bit of a > UK-specific phenomenon. In many other countries (in Europe, anyway), > signalled crossings are part of junctions. > Eeh, it's

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 2:01 AM, Marc Gemis wrote: > And what about the obligation to walk on the left side of the road > when there is no sidewalk ? Should a router take that into account and > let you walk to the next road crossing to switch sides ? Would be > pretty

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

As a co-developer of mkgmap, a software that convert OSM data to Garmin map format, I've looked at this problem quite often now. I think routing itself is not the big problem here, unless we talk about the additional resources needed for the additional ways and junctions. Both tagging schemes

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 9:38 AM, Gerd Petermann wrote: > One of the problems that is not well solved is the switch > between both tagging schemes. When I start to draw > extra ways for the sidewalk, where do i stop this and how > do I connect the sidewalk with the

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

And this problem is not easy to solve by programs. Up to now I don't know any efficient algo that allows to find the nearest named road that goes parallel to a selected unnamed way. It would be of great help here. Gerd Von: Martin Koppenhoefer

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

2015-11-24 11:30 GMT+01:00 Gerd Petermann : > And this problem is not easy to solve by programs. > > Up to now I don't know any efficient algo that allows to > > find the nearest named road that goes parallel > > to a selected unnamed way. It would be of great

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

So has the "street" relation just been born? It could solve some other puzzles as well: dual carriageways, cycle tracks, bridges... On 2015-11-24 11:40, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: > 2015-11-24 11:30 GMT+01:00 Gerd Petermann : > >> And this problem is not

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

John Willis wrote: > Perhaps we can have a routing engine at will interpret > a sidewalk with residential road junctions as being > along a residential road and route for Jay Walking. > [...] > I would rather the router always error on the side of > crosswalks Jaywalking is a North American

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

2015-11-24 10:40 GMT+01:00 Richard Fairhurst : > Another issue with routing along pavements ("sidewalks") as separate ways > is > the name tag. IME pavement-mappers rarely add the street name to the > pavement/sidewalk, but in fact the name applies to the pavement/sidewalk

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

2015-11-24 13:48 GMT+01:00 Philip Barnes : > A pedestrian simply needs to be told to follow > the road, they are quite capable of deciding which side to walk, where > to cross and whether it is simply easier to walk on the road. > that's partly true, but there are groups

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

There is already a page on the wiki, especially section [1]. Those properties are used by the wheelchair navigation tool mentioned at the top of that page. regards m [1] http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Wheelchair_routing#Sidewalks_and_properties On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 3:02 PM,

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

> On Nov 24, 2015, at 9:20 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer > wrote: > > yes, it would eventually create problems in case e.g. a bridge spirals around > itself (guess improbable case) similar to spiral stairs (maybe these wouldn't > be called bridges but ramps). It worked for

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

2015-11-24 16:09 GMT+01:00 johnw : > Speaking of layers & bridges.. actually, layers and bridges do not pose a problem, as long as it's all the same bridge. One object is ok. In the case of the spiral bridge you might need a relation to make it clear. Cheers, Martin

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

2015-11-24 11:45 GMT+01:00 Colin Smale : > So has the "street" relation just been born? It could solve some other > puzzles as well: dual carriageways, cycle tracks, bridges... bridges have been solved by introducing a revolutionary concept: a dedicated object for an

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

One issue with dual carriageways (and now I think about it, also railway lines) is about generalisations at certain zoom levels. If you zoom out beyond a certain level, both halves of a DC (or the individual tracks of a railway) would be better modelled as a single line. The renderer/consumer

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

It already exists for that but is rarely used, probably because of the ususal problems: - Sometimes roads are split to give one part a different name, the type=street relations are typically ignored. - Since it is not often used mappers will forget to add a new sidewalk to such a relation.

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

2015-11-24 12:43 GMT+01:00 Colin Smale : > One issue with dual carriageways (and now I think about it, also railway > lines) is about generalisations at certain zoom levels. If you zoom out > beyond a certain level, both halves of a DC (or the individual tracks of a >

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Mon, 2015-11-23 at 19:14 -0500, Bryan Housel wrote: > Current preference seems to be map sidewalks as separate ways tagged as > `highway=footway + footway=sidewalk`. > > 1. As you mentioned, you can use sidewalk-specific tags (slope, surface) > without affecting the adjacent highway. > 2.

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 1:48 PM, Philip Barnes wrote: > > Sidewalks, unless they are physically separated in some way are an > integral part of the highway. Sidewalk tags can allow a router to, maybe > prefer, roads with sidewalks but there a lot of cases where this would >

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On 2015-11-24 13:20, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: > 2015-11-24 12:43 GMT+01:00 Colin Smale : > >> One issue with dual carriageways (and now I think about it, also railway >> lines) is about generalisations at certain zoom levels. If you zoom out >> beyond a certain

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, 2015-11-24 at 09:01 +0100, Marc Gemis wrote: > In Belgium several primary/secondary roads go through town centers > (e.g. [1], [2]), where the maximum speed is reduced to 50 km/h (same > as for residential roads). Most people will cross the street where it > is most suitable (especially

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue Nov 24 13:40:38 2015 GMT, Marc Gemis wrote: > On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 1:48 PM, Philip Barnes wrote: > > > > Sidewalks, unless they are physically separated in some way are an > > integral part of the highway. Sidewalk tags can allow a router to, maybe > > prefer,

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

> On Nov 24, 2015, at 6:40 PM, Richard Fairhurst wrote: > > Jaywalking is a North American concept. Jaywalking will get you a bored policeman giving you a ticket in Tokyo. They pride themselves in people who follow the rules and wait for crosswalks and such. However

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

> On Nov 24, 2015, at 11:32 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer > wrote: > > the road, they are quite capable of deciding which side to walk, where > to cross and whether it is simply easier to walk on the road. TL;DR: Although I care more about the rendering than the routing,

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue Nov 24 15:39:45 2015 GMT, johnw wrote: > > > On Nov 24, 2015, at 11:32 PM, Martin Koppenhoefer > > wrote: > > > > the road, they are quite capable of deciding which side to walk, where > > to cross and whether it is simply easier to walk on the road. > > >

Re: [Tagging] Sidewalk Tagging for Routing

On Tue, Nov 24, 2015 at 5:24 AM, John Willis wrote: > Jaywalking will get you a bored policeman giving you a ticket in Tokyo. > > They pride themselves in people who follow the rules and wait for > crosswalks and such. > Seattle is one of the few cities in the US that actively