Re: [Talk-hr] Napokon pravi routing!

2010-08-19 Thread Valent Turkovic
2010/8/18 Marko Dimjasevic ma...@dimjasevic.net: 2010/8/18 Valent Turkovic valent.turko...@gmail.com: Meni najbolji feature je to što podržava zabrane skretanja (turn restrictions) pa vas routing neće navoditi preko duple crte i na slične loše route tamo gdje se ne smije skrenuti, ako ste

[Talk-hr] oznacavanje uskih ulica

2010-08-19 Thread Valent Turkovic
Ako idete na godišnji pogledajte malo kako su označene ulice u mjestima u kojima boravite. Vidio sam par grešaka koje stranci prave kada označavaju neke ceste, npr. uske pješačke ulice koje ćete naći po skoro svim mjestima na jadranu svakako označavaju (footpath, residential, itd...), dok je

Re: [Talk-hr] oznacavanje uskih ulica

2010-08-19 Thread Janko Mihelić
2010/8/19 Valent Turkovic valent.turko...@gmail.com Ako idete na godišnji pogledajte malo kako su označene ulice u mjestima u kojima boravite. Vidio sam par grešaka koje stranci prave kada označavaju neke ceste, npr. uske pješačke ulice koje ćete naći po skoro svim mjestima na jadranu

Re: [OSM-talk-be] [Merkaartor] Wallonie PPNC wms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
I don't think we can trace on those (or at least nobody asked). They are top notch quality, though. Would someone from talk-be know something about it? - Chris - On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 18:18, Rémi Letot hob...@poukram.net wrote: Hello, I'm a new contributor to OSM and new user of

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] ODbL and duration of IP protection

2010-08-19 Thread Simon Ward
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 12:17:15AM +0200, Frederik Ramm wrote: Yup. But then again, by the time data has lapsed it is very likely to be utterly useless. I am 99% certain that in 10 years time you *will*, for most use cases, be able to get data that is more current than OSM and has less

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, Emilie Laffray wrote: While I am not a legal expert, I will try to answer that one. Companies can already make money from OpenStreetMap: there are plenty of examples around (Skobbler, Cloudmade, Geofabrik, etc). There is nothing preventing a company from using the data. However, they

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
(moving this thread to legal-talk) Valent: AFAIK with new Contributor Terms [1] all data entered into OSM can be taken by some company, closed and they could create a product made profit on it. Grant: No, they have to make the data available. The data is share-alike.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] New contributors and some data sources are not allowed under the CTs but too easy to access.

2010-08-19 Thread Kai Krueger
JohnSmitty wrote: In any case going forward unless something changes with the CTs many many many more people will be effected by this, does the OSM APIs have the ability to indicate if the account has agreed to the CTs and then update editors to prevent certain layers from being shown.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 August 2010 06:05, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: Sure, but who employed them and are repeating it, and going along with it? The same questions have been asked about OSM-F, with more or less the same answers... In their original email. I wasn't quite sure of the context, thus I wrote

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 August 2010 06:29, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: I think we're all at fault here because when NearMap images became availalbe for tracing, the whole license change process was already in motion and the This is a symptom of a much larger problem in OSM, I wasted time asking for

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] New contributors and some data sources are not allowed under the CTs but too easy to access.

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, Kai Krueger wrote: That however does still leave the substantial portion of mappers who have ticked the I declare my edits to be PD option, which surely makes them no longer compatible with these sources. These mappers therefore then presumably can not use those sources without being in

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 August 2010 06:32, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: Sure, but the OSMF's legal remit is very, very different to NearMaps. At this point in time we could be told anything by OSM-F and it has to be taken on good faith that it was an actual opinion by a lawyer, which can't be quoted directly.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] New contributors and some data sources are not allowed under the CTs but too easy to access.

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 August 2010 06:35, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: 388 users have declared their edits to be PD on the Wiki for a long time, and I don't think any of them have restricted their editing to PD sources exclusively. On the other hand I know some mappers that only ever map from their

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread SteveC
On Aug 19, 2010, at 2:43 PM, John Smith wrote: On 20 August 2010 06:40, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: On Aug 19, 2010, at 2:35 PM, John Smith wrote: On 20 August 2010 06:32, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: Sure, but the OSMF's legal remit is very, very different to NearMaps. At

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Liz
On Fri, 20 Aug 2010, SteveC wrote: Maybe it's fine to publish advice as public opinion in Australia. I don't know. If I, as a company director, in Australia, receive legal advice obtained for that company, I can share it with the entire Board, and then the Board makes the decision on with whom

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread SteveC
On Aug 19, 2010, at 2:51 PM, John Smith wrote: On 20 August 2010 06:48, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: Where did I question it's accuracy? You said ... Sure, but who employed them and are repeating it, and going along with it? That's not me questioning their accuracy. You were saying

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread andrzej zaborowski
On 19 August 2010 22:05, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: I don't think they're being unreasonable about the future, we all have points to make about the process, the CT's etc. It's holding the past data hostage I don't personally feel is very cool. That's just another words to say not

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread SteveC
On Aug 19, 2010, at 4:20 PM, 80n wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 10:55 PM, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: On Aug 19, 2010, at 3:37 PM, 80n wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 9:40 PM, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: On Aug 19, 2010, at 2:35 PM, John Smith wrote: On 20 August 2010

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread SteveC
On Aug 19, 2010, at 4:33 PM, SteveC wrote: On Aug 19, 2010, at 4:20 PM, 80n wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 10:55 PM, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: On Aug 19, 2010, at 3:37 PM, 80n wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 9:40 PM, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: On Aug 19, 2010, at 2:35

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Anthony
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 3:23 PM, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: NearMap is the only company I'm aware of attempting to hold a lot of data hostage in this way. I sure hope you've tried your best to listen to their points and explain yours, and come to an absolute impasse, before accusing them

[OSM-legal-talk] Size of NearMap Contribution

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, to give some perspective to the debate about whether or not existing NearMap-derived objects will have to be deleted, I have summed up the number of edits in all changesets that said anything about NearMap in any tag (comment, source, etc). I arrived at a sum of 1,057,549, slightly

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Size of NearMap Contribution

2010-08-19 Thread Anthony
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 9:09 PM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: That obviously explains why NearMap is very important to the community in Australia. But for the project as a whole, one million objects is really not something we should make a big fuss about. I think that the people

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Size of NearMap Contribution

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 August 2010 11:09, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: I arrived at a sum of 1,057,549, slightly over 1 million. The total number of objects in Australia is 10,234,567. That means that roughly 10% of data in Australia might be affected by NearMap. How much will be effected that has

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Size of NearMap Contribution

2010-08-19 Thread andrzej zaborowski
Hi, On 20 August 2010 03:09, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: one million objects is really not something we should make a big fuss about. [...] After the Haiti earthquake, 1 million objects were traced by 300 people in two weeks. So 300 mappers' work is not something we should make

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Size of NearMap Contribution

2010-08-19 Thread Andrew Harvey
On Fri, Aug 20, 2010 at 11:09 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: My statistics are of course flawed - they do not capture objects individually tagged source=nearmap rather than on the changeset, and if an object has been modified more than once in a nearmap changeset, it has been

Re: [OSM-talk] collection/street relation: which one to use?

2010-08-19 Thread Ed Loach
Anthony: Ugh, another point: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relations/Relations_are_not_ Categories Putting all the elements which have addresses referencing a street into a relation seems to me to violate that principle. No. There is a relation between the houses and the street. You

[OSM-talk] State of the Map U.S. Conference Report by Directions Magazine

2010-08-19 Thread Michael Collinson
http://www.directionsmag.com/article.php?article_id=3573 Congratulations to the organisers, speakers and everyone involved. Mike ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [OSM-talk] Beaches at lower zoom levels

2010-08-19 Thread Malcolm Herring
Alan Mintz wrote: Are coastlines supposed to be on the low-tide position, high-tide position, or middle of the beach? I've been gluing the low-tide side of beaches to coastline on the few I've edited, since their position suggested that was the intent. The usual convention (Ordnance

Re: [OSM-talk] collection/street relation: which one to use?

2010-08-19 Thread Peter Wendorff
On 19.08.2010 01:05, John F. Eldredge wrote: When you say process a nearby-search for the street name, how broadly is nearby interpreted? ...it depends ;) At first: Of course you're right. Nashville, TN, USA, where I live, has a number of instances of streets that were split by later

[OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Ben Last
Hi all As you may have noticed, if you follow the mailing lists, there's been a certain amount of discussion about using NearMap aerial imagery (which we call PhotoMaps) as a source for generating OSM data, in the light of the current Contributor Terms (CTs, as currently shown at

Re: [OSM-talk] Beaches at lower zoom levels

2010-08-19 Thread Stephen Hope
On 19 August 2010 17:27, Malcolm Herring malcolm.herr...@btinternet.com wrote: The usual convention (Ordnance Survey for example) for land maps is to use Mean High Water. (Marine charts usually use Mean High Water Springs as their dry land datum.) There are exceptions. If a given area is

Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik render queue stuck

2010-08-19 Thread Kai Krueger
JohnSmitty wrote: make the changes and see if the tiles are refreshed in a reasonable time period. The way updates and rerenders work can be a bit complex its full detail. A better explanation can be found at

[OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Valent Turkovic
AFAIK with new Contributor Terms [1] all data entered into OSM can be taken by some company, closed and they could create a product made profit on it. Yes or no? Please just answer this for start. I have no problem with companies making a profit, just go ahead and do it. I have a problem

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Felix Hartmann
On 19.08.2010 12:07, Valent Turkovic wrote: AFAIK with new Contributor Terms [1] all data entered into OSM can be taken by some company, closed and they could create a product made profit on it. Yes or no? Please just answer this for start. I have no problem with companies making a profit,

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
However, there are a couple of problems with the CTs. First: paragraph 2 of the CTs requires that an OSM user grants the OSMF a very wide ranging licence (a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive, perpetual, irrevocable license to do any act that is restricted by copyright over anything

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Grant Slater
On 19 August 2010 11:07, Valent Turkovic valent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: AFAIK with new Contributor Terms [1] all data entered into OSM can be taken by some company, closed and they could create a product made profit on it. Yes or no? Please just answer this for start. No, they have to make

Re: [OSM-talk] proposal: rental=*

2010-08-19 Thread colliar
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA256 Am 17.08.2010 15:31, schrieb John Smith: On 17 August 2010 23:13, Peter Wendorff wendo...@uni-paderborn.de wrote: It's the same question in other cases, too: - post offices as service of normal shops vs. selling office stuff as service of post

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Emilie Laffray
On 19 August 2010 11:07, Valent Turkovic valent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: AFAIK with new Contributor Terms [1] all data entered into OSM can be taken by some company, closed and they could create a product made profit on it. Yes or no? Please just answer this for start. I have no problem

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Peter Körner
Am 19.08.2010 12:23, schrieb Chris Browet: I, as a OSM contributor, am looking to allow free and unrestricted access to map data to everybody. Thank you, Ben, to announce this on OSM-talk. I'd like to invite everybody that wants to discuss on this topic to come over to Legal-talk at

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
Let's keep the Talk-List clean from Legal discussions. Anybody is welcome to join it on Legal-talk. Sorry, but I've seen those kind of invitations, too. I'm not subscribed to Legal-talk and have no interest in the obscure legal details. General discussion about the new License/CT belongs to

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 13:01, Grant Slater openstreet...@firefishy.comwrote: You are missing the problem that OSMF needs those rights to be able to publish the data and ensure that someone cannot come back later and take a lawsuit against OSM for publishing their contributed data or demands

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Grant Slater
On 19 August 2010 12:18, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: It might very well be true. I still think a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive, perpetual,snip free. Basically, the OSMF asks us to trust it because it doesn't trust us, right? No. The OSMF is protecting itself from being

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
Felix Hartmann extremecar...@googlemail.com wrote: It is true, (they just need to seperate it in two databases, which can be anyhting), I also think the new license because of this clause is utter rubbish and if it goes through there needs to be a fork. Is openfreemap.org still available?

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Felix Hartmann
On 19.08.2010 12:24, Grant Slater wrote: On 19 August 2010 11:07, Valent Turkovicvalent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: AFAIK with new Contributor Terms [1] all data entered into OSM can be taken by some company, closed and they could create a product made profit on it. Yes or no? Please just

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: I, as a OSM contributor, am looking to allow free and unrestricted access to map data to everybody. Those clauses would mean that, potentially, I wouldn't be mapping for humanity but for the OSMF. You don't really map for humanity now, but for yourself.

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Nic Roets
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: Let's keep the Talk-List clean from Legal discussions. Anybody is welcome to join it on Legal-talk. Sorry, but I've seen those kind of invitations, too. I'm not subscribed to Legal-talk and have no interest in the

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Liz
On Thu, 19 Aug 2010, Grant Slater wrote: OSMF is just a legal entity to do things. OSM is the project. There are people behind. I was a part of the OSM project as soon as I contributed and I am not part of OSMF. Those are thus 2 different things. You access OSMF paid for resources

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
It is possible to change the legal status of something without affecting the community. For example the gold standard was removed making the dollar a Fiat currency without an economic meltdown. Might be a bad example ;-) Some argue the disappearance of the gold standard (and subsequently

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Brendan Morley
On 19/08/2010 9:37 PM, Nic Roets wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 12:43 PM, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com mailto:c...@semperpax.com wrote: Let's keep the Talk-List clean from Legal discussions. Anybody is welcome to join it on Legal-talk. Sorry, but I've seen those kind of

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 13:29, Pierre-Alain Dorange pdora...@mac.comwrote: Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: I, as a OSM contributor, am looking to allow free and unrestricted access to map data to everybody. Those clauses would mean that, potentially, I wouldn't be mapping for

Re: [OSM-talk] [OSM-legal-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, Emilie Laffray wrote: While I am not a legal expert, I will try to answer that one. Companies can already make money from OpenStreetMap: there are plenty of examples around (Skobbler, Cloudmade, Geofabrik, etc). There is nothing preventing a company from using the data. However, they

Re: [OSM-talk] Tagging Seamarks

2010-08-19 Thread Bernhard R. Fischer
On Wednesday 18 August 2010 12:41:55 you wrote: Hi Bernhard, thanks for your reply. This message has become longer than I initially expected, as I added some general thoughts of mine. Please do feel free to ignore those and concentrate on open questions. :) Hi Arne, I'll answer your mail

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Nic Roets
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Brendan Morley morb@beagle.com.auwrote: Um, what happened in October 2008? If you look at the percentage change in US GDP and you compare it to the 1800s and the early 1900s, then you will come to the conclusion that nothing happened. The economic

[OSM-legal-talk] Restricting future licenses

2010-08-19 Thread Richard Weait
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 7:58 AM, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: They definitely need to define that, it would help. an OSI endorsed free and open license, maybe... OSI don't endorse Open Data Licenses as far as I know. Open Data Commons do and they even consulted with the OSM

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Brendan Morley
On 19/08/2010 9:58 PM, Chris Browet wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 13:29, Pierre-Alain Dorange pdora...@mac.com mailto:pdora...@mac.com wrote: Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com mailto:c...@semperpax.com wrote: I've seen often that the reply to this argument is that we must

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
They definitely need to define that, it would help. an OSI endorsed free and open license, maybe... - Chris - Then you'd be trusting OSI rather than OSMF. As to define what a free and open source licence is? Absolutely. ___ talk mailing list

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 14:15, Nic Roets nro...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 1:51 PM, Brendan Morley morb@beagle.com.auwrote: Um, what happened in October 2008? If you look at the percentage change in US GDP and you compare it to the 1800s and the early 1900s, then you

Re: [OSM-talk] collection/street relation: which one to use?

2010-08-19 Thread Anthony
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 2:38 AM, Ed Loach e...@loach.me.uk wrote: Anthony: Ugh, another point: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Relations/Relations_are_not_ Categories Putting all the elements which have addresses referencing a street into a relation seems to me to violate that

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] Restricting future licenses

2010-08-19 Thread Rob Myers
On 08/19/2010 01:17 PM, Richard Weait wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 7:58 AM, Chris Browetc...@semperpax.com wrote: They definitely need to define that, it would help. an OSI endorsed free and open license, maybe... OSI don't endorse Open Data Licenses as far as I know. Open Data Commons

Re: [OSM-talk] Restricting future licenses

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 14:17, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 7:58 AM, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: They definitely need to define that, it would help. an OSI endorsed free and open license, maybe... OSI don't endorse Open Data Licenses as far as

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
Felix Hartmann extremecar...@googlemail.com wrote: [...] Nope, they don't have to. Only if they use it as one database. If they use it to publish maps, or create a product that afterwards uses two databases seperately, they don't have to publish their own data under Odbl. Yes, no licence

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: You don't really map for humanity now, but for yourself. The actual licence grant YOU rights on the data you put in OSM database, the change is to give those rights the the OSMF that would represent the OSM community. Agreed, but given the

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, this discussion must move to legal-talk. Bye Frederik ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, this discussion must move to legal-talk. Bye Frederik ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Browet
Then you don't want OSMF to be granted for rights on contributors contributions but you're perfectly OK if a compagny take OSM data and use it for a commercial product without sharealike or copyrights... So it seems you prefer a private compagny stole our works than a foundation (you can

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Anthony
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 8:54 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:   this discussion must move to legal-talk. If we don't change the contributor terms, then we lose NearMap. That's not a legal discussion. ___ talk mailing list

Re: [OSM-talk] Bretton Woods (was NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms)

2010-08-19 Thread SomeoneElse
http://www.openstreetmap.org/?lat=44.25812lon=-71.44119zoom=15layers=M Looks like it could do with someone visiting to add some POIs? (trying to bring this back on topic) ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Valent Turkovic
On Thu, 19 Aug 2010 13:29:55 +0200, Pierre-Alain Dorange wrote: With the actual licence it's exactly the same. Compagny can use OSM data and make profit (CCBYSA do not exclude commercial uses). I have no problem with companies taking OSM data and making a profit, I do have a problem if they

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
(moved over from talk) Pierre-Alain Dorange wrote: So it seems you prefer a private compagny stole our works than a foundation (you can below to) represent the community ? It would be good if we could refrain from using the word stealing, it now occurs for the second time today. The word

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Restricting future licenses

2010-08-19 Thread Anthony
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 8:42 AM, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 14:17, Richard Weait rich...@weait.com wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 7:58 AM, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: They definitely need to define that, it would help. an OSI endorsed free

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, Valent Turkovic wrote: I do have a problem if they take our data and close it I have written something about this on legal-talk. Bye Frederik ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Restricting future licenses

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, Anthony wrote: I've contacted Angela Beesley and Benjamin Mako Hill from freedomdefined.com ... which is about free cultural works, and so I'm surprised that they should answer we have not yet evaluated the ODbL rather than free and open data is out of scope for us. Bye Frederik

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread 80n
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 12:29 PM, Grant Slater openstreet...@firefishy.comwrote: On 19 August 2010 12:18, Chris Browet c...@semperpax.com wrote: It might very well be true. I still think a worldwide, royalty-free, non-exclusive, perpetual,snip free. Basically, the OSMF asks us to

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Restricting future licenses

2010-08-19 Thread Anthony
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 9:13 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote: Hi, Anthony wrote: I've contacted Angela Beesley and Benjamin Mako Hill from freedomdefined.com ... which is about free cultural works i.e. works or expressions which can be freely studied, applied, copied and/or

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Robert Kaiser
1) Please go to legal-talk for topics such as that. 2) Please don't refer to something as stealing where it's not a process of the previous owner unrightfully losing something and not having access to it any more. That might be misuse or whatever, but it's not stealing. Robert Kaiser

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] Restricting future licenses

2010-08-19 Thread Rob Myers
On 08/19/2010 02:08 PM, Anthony wrote: I've contacted Angela Beesley and Benjamin Mako Hill from freedomdefined.com, and they say they have not yet evaluated the ODbL. I was, however, referred by them to http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/ODbL_comments_from_Creative_Commons and invited to

Re: [OSM-talk] moderation going forward

2010-08-19 Thread 80n
On Wed, Aug 18, 2010 at 10:28 PM, Ed Avis e...@waniasset.com wrote: We haven't had any problems before the controversy over licences, and I expect that once these troubles are resolved one way or another, there won't be further eruptions. So I'd suggest not setting up any elaborate

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread Anthony
On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 9:20 AM, Robert Kaiser ka...@kairo.at wrote: Please don't refer to something as stealing where it's not a process of the previous owner unrightfully losing something and not having access to it any more. Unless it's stealing someone's idea, stealing a kiss, stealing

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Robert Kaiser
Frederik Ramm schrieb: (moved over from talk) Pierre-Alain Dorange wrote: So it seems you prefer a private compagny stole our works than a foundation (you can below to) represent the community ? It would be good if we could refrain from using the word stealing, it now occurs for the second

Re: [OSM-talk] collection/street relation: which one to use?

2010-08-19 Thread Jukka Rahkonen
Anthony osm at inbox.org writes: So I prefer to add the street name to the street (as name) and addr:street to the building/shop etc. I think for now that's probably the best solution. And just hope there aren't too many instances of Main Street on the addr vs. Main St on the way. And

Re: [OSM-talk] I don't want companies stealing OSM data that I contribute!

2010-08-19 Thread andrzej zaborowski
Hi, On 19 August 2010 12:07, Valent Turkovic valent.turko...@gmail.com wrote: AFAIK with new Contributor Terms [1] all data entered into OSM can be taken by some company, closed and they could create a product made profit on it. How did you come to this conclusion? Cheers

Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Live Ticker

2010-08-19 Thread Norbert Hoffmann
bernhard zwischenbrugger wrote: Sometimes it's a bit delayed because of a problem with delayed minute diffs (http://planet.openstreetmap.org/minute-replicate/) Perhaps the replay could be a bit faster. I think, that as it is now the delay will never get smaller again. Norbert

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Brad Neuhauser
If it's about NearMap, then talk-au seems more appropriate. On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 7:59 AM, Anthony o...@inbox.org wrote: On Thu, Aug 19, 2010 at 8:54 AM, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:   this discussion must move to legal-talk. If we don't change the contributor terms, then we

Re: [OSM-talk] OSM Live Ticker

2010-08-19 Thread bernhard zwischenbrugger
hi Sometimes it's a bit delayed because of a problem with delayed minute diffs (http://planet.openstreetmap.org/minute-replicate/) Perhaps the replay could be a bit faster. I think, that as it is now the delay will never get smaller again. Now one hour has 54 minutes at

[OSM-talk] Place of worship

2010-08-19 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
I got a question about religious tags. There is amenity=place_of_worship (1) for church, temple, mosque, synagogue... (adding the religion and denomination if needed) For convent, monestary and generally religious place but not open to the public there is no official tag. I just found a

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 August 2010 00:59, Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com wrote: If it's about NearMap, then talk-au seems more appropriate. While that may currently be true, they claim to be planning to image some European cities on a monthly basis, I've asked for a rough time line indication.

Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik render queue stuck

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 19 August 2010 18:34, Kai Krueger kakrue...@gmail.com wrote: But what is imo most likely happening is that the rendering server is at capacity and thus can't deal with rerenders fast enough, so you won't see the updates as quickly as you would hope. Also, when it reaches capacity, it It's

Re: [OSM-talk] Mapnik render queue stuck

2010-08-19 Thread Lennard
On 19-8-2010 20:10, John Smith wrote: It's not a case of tiles not being regenerated in a few minutes, it a case of them not updating in a few days even. If they are dropped from the rendering queue, they are only readded when you actively look at them again. When the server load at that

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Peteris Krisjanis
It is not only about NearMap, we have tens of goverment sources which requires attribution. It *is* talk list issue. It is about future of the project. Cheers, Peter. 2010/8/19 Brad Neuhauser brad.neuhau...@gmail.com: If it's about NearMap, then talk-au seems more appropriate. On Thu, Aug

Re: [OSM-talk] Place of worship

2010-08-19 Thread Frank Fesevur
2010/8/19 Pierre-Alain Dorange: For convent, monestary and generally religious place but not open to the public there is no official tag. I just found a proposition (2) to tag building=convent, building=monastery, buiding=seminary and even a building=church (?)... There is also a

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread John Smith
On 20 August 2010 05:23, SteveC st...@asklater.com wrote: I think the bigger issues is NearMap mistaking the intention and the word of the license. We can debate for the next millennia the meaning of a future free and open license under the specific wording of what that might mean. These

Re: [OSM-talk] Place of worship

2010-08-19 Thread Ulf Lamping
Am 19.08.2010 21:39, schrieb Frank Fesevur: 2010/8/19 Pierre-Alain Dorange: For convent, monestary and generally religious place but not open to the public there is no official tag. I just found a proposition (2) to tag building=convent, building=monastery, buiding=seminary and even a

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, SteveC wrote: It's holding the past data hostage I don't personally feel is very cool. Agree that it isn't cool but then again everyone is doing it - i mean how often have read I am against the license, if you go ahead then prepare to delete X. Makes me want to go there and throw the

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
Peteris Krisjanis pec...@gmail.com wrote: It is not only about NearMap, we have tens of goverment sources which requires attribution. Yes but not really sure of the kinf of attribution. For example here in France, the fiscal administration allow us (OSM contributors) to use the cadastre (1)

[OSM-talk] Pre-disaster imagery of Pakistan Floods now available from SPOT

2010-08-19 Thread Mikel Maron
HOT, all, Positive news from SPOT that their pre-disaster imagery of the flood affected area of Pakistan is now available for use in OSM. The WMS url is http://www.geodatawork.net/__streaminguid.e30dcaa3-5929-4902-9834-12e6f51e1e7b/wms.ashx? Before using the imagery, please review the legal

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Peteris Krisjanis
2010/8/19 Pierre-Alain Dorange pdora...@mac.com: Peteris Krisjanis pec...@gmail.com wrote: It is not only about NearMap, we have tens of goverment sources which requires attribution. Yes but not really sure of the kinf of attribution. For example here in France, the fiscal administration

[OSM-talk] I quit

2010-08-19 Thread Chris Hill
OK, this stupidity has gone too far. Now the 'moderator' is arguing with the trolls on a 'moderated' list. I quit this list. -- Cheers, Chris user: chillly ___ talk mailing list talk@openstreetmap.org http://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Pierre-Alain Dorange
Peteris Krisjanis pec...@gmail.com wrote: I don't see incompatibility here, or do i miss something ? Do OSM have to put the name of all the attribution for the maps displayed ? Do the new licence/CT require that we do not use the source tag anymore ? Anyone can remove source tag

Re: [OSM-talk] NearMap Community Licence and OSM Contributor Terms

2010-08-19 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, Peteris Krisjanis wrote: Cheers and have nice copyright violation day, The legal-talk list is an excellent place to discuss about copyright and its applicability to geodata, and indeed has been for the last few years. Bye Frederik -- Frederik Ramm ## eMail frede...@remote.org ##

Re: [OSM-talk] I quit

2010-08-19 Thread Liz
On Fri, 20 Aug 2010, Chris Hill wrote: OK, this stupidity has gone too far. Now the 'moderator' is arguing with the trolls on a 'moderated' list. I quit this list. I see you use Thunderbird. I'm sure you can filter off any correspondents whose posts annoy you and not have to leave the

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