Re: [Talk-cz] osmap.cz v0.20 + talkcz online

[Marián Kyral]

-- Původní e-mail --
Od: Pavel Zbytovský 
Komu: OpenStreetMap Czech Republic 
Datum: 8. 1. 2018 17:40:04
Předmět: [Talk-cz] osmap.cz v0.20 + talkcz online
"
Ahoj,



oznámený update verzí openstreetmap.cz(http://openstreetmap.cz) doběhl, zdá
se, úspěšně.




Nyní tedy máme osmcz-app v0.20, tj.:

- "tajný" marker (aka ten na osm.org(http://osm.org)) má navíc parametr &
mmsg= se zprávou

- gp-check - nový form pro chybějící rozcestník
- úpravy kódu viz [1]




Zároveň je spuštěn archiv konference talkcz na adrese https://osmap.cz/
talkcz/(https://osmap.cz/talkcz/)

(Podrobně viz [2], též proběhla úprava mergování app do website)




Případné chyby prosím hlašte :-)

Pavel




"



Ahoj,

dlouhé odkazy dělají krapet problémy:

https://openstreetmap.cz/talkcz/c2406#m8c112c









Nekoukal jsem, jak to zpracováváš, ale tipuji, že zalomené to už dostaneš
že?




Marián

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Re: [Talk-cz] Kvartální pivo v Praze

[Marián Kyral]

Ahoj,

-- Původní e-mail --
Od: Jiří Sedláček 
Komu: OpenStreetMap Czech Republic 
Datum: 1. 3. 2018 10:36:40
Předmět: Re: [Talk-cz] Kvartální pivo v Praze
"
Tak já bych se zase jednou stavil za cs Wiki, pokud nezapomenu, rád přijdu. 



Je někde přehledně napsáno, kdy a kde se to koná (nějakej web, nějaký
fejsbůky, twitter)? Dozvídám se to vždy dost náhodně, jako nepravidelný
čtenář. 



"



Jen nějaká wiki ( https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Cs:Kvart%C3%A1ln%C3%AD
_pivo ) ;-)

…plus tahle konference




Marián
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Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )

[Marián Kyral]

-- Původní e-mail --
Od: Marián Kyral 
Komu: OpenStreetMap Czech Republic 
Datum: 1. 3. 2018 23:20:19
Předmět: Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )
"
-- Původní e-mail --
Od: majka 
Komu: OpenStreetMap Czech Republic 
Datum: 1. 3. 2018 13:27:37
Předmět: Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )
"
Nová data už jsou, bohužel se starými chybami.
"



11 schránek zrušeno, 288 změněno a 2 nové ( 28000:245, 56707:105)




Jak rychle dokáže ČP zapracovat nahlášené chyby budeme muset ověřit v praxi
:-D




Marián


"



Tak i nějaká změna adresy se tam najde:

https://github.com/mkyral/POI-Importer_CP_pbox_tiles/commit/a35e03b0311df2f
196a6792f43dc0a0c0a4b2555




Marián
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Itinéraires et balisages randonnée

[Vincent Bergeot]

Bonjour,

Le 18/02/2018 à 16:38, David Marchal a écrit :


Qu’en est-il du Club Vosgien ? Ils ont des milliers de kilomètres de 
sentiers balisés, pas que dans le massif vosgien, et un balisage plus 
poussé et bien utile sur ces sentiers ? A-t-on eu des contacts avec 
eux ? Peut-on reprendre leur balisage et leurs itinéraires ?



à priori les vélos aussi ont quelques difficultés : 
https://statium.link/blog/2018/02/05/club-vosgien-et-vtt-lappropriation-des-communs/


Christophe Masutti y parle rapidement d'OSM (pas étonnant pour celles et 
ceux qui ne le connaissent pas : https://statium.link/blog/apropos/)


Bonne journée




--
Vincent Bergeot

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Re: [Talk-es] Importaciones catastro

[Matías h]

Hola. Yo ya tengo permisos.. Lo que no encuentro es  ¡¡TIEMPO.
:P


El 1 de marzo de 2018, 23:35, Javier Sánchez Portero 
escribió:

> Alejandro, dale permisos por favor. No se si Matías Taborda también estaba
> pendiente. Si quieres darme permisos a mi para administrar te puedo ayudar
> con esto.
>
> El 1 mar. 2018 18:21, "Joaquim"  escribió:
>
>> Hola
>>
>> Una vez preparado todo para crear un proyecto necesito permiso para poder
>> crearlo en el  administrador de tareas. Mi usuario para importaciones es:
>> puxan_importacions.
>>
>> Ya pediré que alguien con más experiencia lo revise antes de publicarlo.
>>
>> Gracias
>>
>> Joaquim
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> Talk-es@openstreetmap.org
>> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-es
>>
>
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>
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Re: [Talk-us] Help fight advertising

[Mike N]

On 3/1/2018 7:36 PM, OSM Volunteer stevea wrote:

Sent to Bright Valley Marketing via their website Contact text box:


  Since there are several SEOs out there doing this, it would also be 
interesting to talk to one of them to find out where they got this idea. 
 If there is some SEO blog that gives the recommendation to advertise 
in OSM, and if we could get that page corrected, it would cut off the 
idea at the source.


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Re: [Talk-us] Help fight advertising

[OSM Volunteer stevea]

Sent to Bright Valley Marketing via their website Contact text box:

How can you help me?  More like how can YOU help Bright Valley Marketing?!

OK:  you can stop putting advertising into your clients' OpenStreetMap (OSM) 
nodes.  Phone, website, opening_hours, addr: fields:  those are all OK.  The 
breezy text in the note: field that not only smacks of advertising but actually 
goes way too far and BECOMES advertising, especially in a volunteer and 
non-profit project like OSM:  No.  Absolutely, positively, no.  Also, the 
payment field should not say a single word about financing, especially 
business-offered financing.  This crosses the line into sleazy, many are 
watching what you are doing here.

We are asking you politely to stop doing this.  Starting right now.  Please 
reply to this so I know you have received this message.  I will likely accept 
your apology for abusing our project should you have the honor to offer one and 
it accompanies your understanding to cease and desist these practices.

SteveA
OpenStreetMap volunteer

(A little harsh?  Maybe.  Maybe not.)
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Re: [Talk-es] Importaciones catastro

[Jorge Sanz Sanfructuoso]

Hola.

Necesito que te loges primero en el gestor de tareas para poderte dar
permisos. http://tareas.openstreetmap.es/

En cuanto te loges una vez ya me sales y puedo darte permisos.

Un saludo.

El jue., 1 mar. 2018 a las 19:21, Joaquim () escribió:

> Hola
>
> Una vez preparado todo para crear un proyecto necesito permiso para
> poder crearlo en el  administrador de tareas. Mi usuario para
> importaciones es: puxan_importacions.
>
> Ya pediré que alguien con más experiencia lo revise antes de publicarlo.
>
> Gracias
>
> Joaquim
>
>
>
>
> ___
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> Talk-es@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-es
>
-- 
Jorge Sanz Sanfructuoso - Sanchi
Blog http://jorgesanz.es/
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Re: [Talk-us] Help fight advertising

[Mike N]

This is a good time to bring up the subject because the recent 
'locksmith' advertising was most bothersome: partly because the 
locksmith industry as a whole in the US is as shady as you can get while 
being barely legal, and partly because I'm sure the physical locations 
had no relevance; almost no one goes to a 'locksmith shop' to get their 
car door unlocked, and many of them just operate out of their residence.


On 3/1/2018 5:44 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote:

Advertising is often added to OSM in blatant disregard for what we want;
for those adding advertising to OSM, we are just another vehicle to
carry their marketing message across.


  Ironically, OSM in the US is nearly a black hole to advertisers.  As 
I last knew, adding something unique to OSM does not mean that it will 
ever show up in Google.   So I infer that we don't allow Google-bots to 
sniff the OSM changeset list.  If advertisers get things right, the best 
their client could hope for is to attract OSM app users.   If they get 
the factual part wrong, it goes nowhere.


  In this list for my region, I recognize at least 2 people who live in 
the area because they made additional relevant edits that only a local 
would know.   Otherwise, I haven't bothered to remove the advertising 
text because it's only space in the database, and a tiny percentage of 
the overall data.



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Re: [Talk-us] Help fight advertising

[OSM Volunteer stevea]

I phoned a local business owner from Frederik's list and learned he used 
"Bright Valley Marketing" (https://www.brightvalleymarketing.com) out of 
Sacramento, California:  it was they who apparently are the culprit.  The 
business owner was happy to recognize and vaguely seemed to understand the harm 
to both his business and OSM, then encouraged me to remove the ad "from 
whatever seems to be bothering you, Steve."  After I said that we're trying to 
get these kinds of SEO firms to change their business practices, he wished me 
"good luck with that."  Good, honest, done in sixty seconds, actionable and now 
you know, too.

One down.  (Who is going to call Bright Valley and chew their ear off?)  I put 
some good soul into this project (Frederik), what's the script for next?

SteveA

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Re: [OSM-talk] Privacy concerns - revive some sort of anonymous editing?

[Pierre Béland]

Note that contributors can use any character they want for user_name. This is 
more an anonymous Acronym with values such as "user_999",  "_ bp _", "_ laser 
_", "_ creamy _", "_ rifi _" " R1 ", etc.
 
Pierre 
 

Le jeudi 1 mars 2018 18:18:15 HNE, Toby Murray  a 
écrit :  
 
 Not to rain on your account deletion party... but it may be doing less
than you think. User names get replicated out to anyone who consumes
OSM data. It is in the weekly planet dump files as well as all the
minutely/hourly/daily replication diff files. So your old (now
deleted) user name and your edits are still recorded in thousands of
databases across the globe. I have one on my own computer at home
actually. I use it to help analyze potential vandalism edits as
Frederik talked about.

Toby


On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 3:35 PM, Jibix  wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> I've been a contributor of OpenStreetMap for a few year, with a couple of
> different accounts. I got them deleted today and I though it could be
> worthwhile talking about this here.
>
> In our current era of big data, I have been more and more concerned about
> having all my osm edits publicly linked to my profiles, and these profiles
> publicly listing all these positions and places where I've been, also with
> somehow time information and sometimes comments, etc... visible forever by
> anyone, or any bot. I've looked into making the link between all that data
> not publicly visible, but it seems the functionality there use to be for
> that (anonymous editing) is not possible since 2007/2009.
>
> I've read (a good few of the) related e-mails from that time [1], and I
> understand that there was an important ground and a general consensus for
> that decision, despite a minority of voice disappointed by this "security
> rather than freedom" direction being taken.
>
> My humble point of view is that with the important evolution that OSM has
> experienced since back then, it would be a very good thing, if not done
> already, to revisit this issue and find a middle point which possibly was
> not easily feasible at the time but would now be more achievable. For
> instance, if I had a tick box "do not publicly link changes to my account",
> either at account level or at changeset level, but that every user still had
> the possibility to send a message to the author of such edits, and to roll
> them back (even potentially with a procedure for banning users with too much
> anonymous changes rolled back by the community, as the edits-author link is
> not lost, it's just not visible to users, whether registered or not). Then,
> I think, everyone would be happy, or close to? I mean, I think this would
> address both the concerns that led to the decision of disabling anonymous
> editing back in 2007 and the privacy concerns I summarised above.
>
> (At the time it was also mentioned that OSM is all about being a community
> project, and that it was probably inconsistent to allow anonymous
> contributions in that context. In particular, a comparison with Wikipedia
> was made. My opinion on this is that location-related information are in
> general much more privacy-critical than Wikipedia edits are, in particular
> now that you have user-friendly mobile apps for mapping on the go, and
> therefore the comparison is inappropriate.)
>
> I've been looking a bit around to see if there was a plan for developing
> something like that anytime soon, or if it had been implemented already, but
> I couldn't find. I've mailed the support team, who confirmed there is
> currently no way (other than closing an account) to make edits become
> anonymous.
>
> Therefore I'm afraid the only way forward I see to address my concerns is
> the following:
> 1) on the one hand having my past accounts deleted, for the corresponding
> change-sets not to be linked any more to my name or pseudonym. I got that
> done today.
> 2) on the other hand, from now on, to periodically create and abandon
> accounts for keeping editing without a massive correlation of data being too
> easily possible (but even like that it's an unperfect tradeoff).
>
> I'm not sure how much of the community is having concerns similar to mine,
> but I would guess that these can only have gone bigger and bigger since back
> in 2007. As said above, I believe it would be worth having a think about it
> again. (But maybe it has already been discussed again recently, and I didn't
> find out?)
>
> What are your thoughts?
>
> Looking forward,
>
> Jibix
>
> [1]:
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2007-October/thread.html#18853
>
> --
> Jibix
> favourite webpage of the moment:
> https://degooglisons-internet.org/alternatives?l=en
>
>
>
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>

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Re: [Talk-us] Help fight advertising

[OSM Volunteer stevea]

Thank you Frederik, thank you Ian.  Yes!  To both of you.

I am glad to see Frederik encourages me to do what I (somewhat timidly, at 
first) already now do in earnest:  sweep up when I see some poop in our map.  
It took me many years to grow my confidence as an OSM volunteer as "somebody 
who knows what he is doing" and I still do this with very reserved pride and a 
touch of caution and trepidation that I might go too far, then I aim for the 
sweet spot of "this is how we map" and it is good.  Please, I encourage all of 
us to stand up straight (even on our tiptoes every once in a while if we must 
reach for mature editing skills) and screw up our courage and confidence to do 
this very important work.  It is vital to the future of OSM.

I would also like Ian to follow up (here, in a week or three) with what he 
learned about "real analytics-based research yielding excellent intelligence 
that this minor-to-moderate problem is N # of SEO firms, and we are watching 
certain IP addresses."  (Or something similar, like a newer wiki page like 
"region-based anti-vandalism skill development").  You know, what smart people 
with good tools do when "paint bombs are being thrown at our canvas."  Let's be 
those smart people and use those good tools, developing them with good dialog 
and documenting what we mean to do.

Happy mapping and have a great day!

SteveA
California
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Re: [Talk-us] Help fight advertising

[Ian Dees]

Hi Frederik,

I disagree that this is a "fight". Have we attempted to reach out to the
people running this operation? Have we asked the Operations team to
correlate IP address for the accounts that are created and used once? Have
we looked at what email addresses they use when signing up for clues? It
would be great to have these folks contributing the non-advertising parts
in a manner consistent with the rest of the community, and perhaps they'd
be willing to adjust their practices if we are able to ask them.

Also, your characterization of US mappers being more lax about this is a
little insulting. OpenStreetMappers in the US spend lots of time looking
for this kind of stuff and revert some of the most obvious stuff. Clifford
Snow, for example, has spent a lot of time researching who might be behind
these edits. I look forward to his feedback here, too.

I appreciate the time you've spent putting together this list of nodes.
I'll take a look at some of them, and maybe we can load them into
MapRoulette to help work through the list?

-Ian

On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 4:44 PM, Frederik Ramm  wrote:

> Hi,
>
> over the past year or so, I have recreationally hunted down advertising
> on OSM and removed it. In many cases it's a clear-cut situation (there
> were cases where advertising borders on vandalism, with whole streets
> being named after a business), but there have also been situations where
> a local mapper had diligently copied a business's sales slogan into the
> description tag and was then upset to see this removed.
>
> As more and more SEO firms start dumping their stuff onto OSM (and here
> I am not talking about those who actually talk to us and listen, but
> those who don't care), this is becoming a fight that needs to be fought
> by the community as a whole.
>
> With this posting I'd like to start a wider discussion about
> advertising; the reason it goes to talk-us is that the USA are more
> strongly targeted by SEO companies and at the same time the community
> there is still not as big and watchful as in other regions of interest
> to spammers, leading to a relatively high volume of unwanted advertising
> in the US.
>
>
> General rant about advertising
>
> I'll make this short as it's likely the most opinionated part of this
> message. Advertising illustrates a lot of what has gone wrong in western
> societies. There's a war on over attention, and most people are affected
> by it throughout their daily lives - even if you run an adblocker, you
> won't be immune to the attention-grabbing design of web sites and apps
> and games. The films you watch on TV will deliver content that fits
> snugly around the ad breaks. Advertising has crept into the home, into
> schools and kindergartens. Advertising calls you on the phone.
> Advertising's very mission is not to make your life better, but take
> your mind away from what matters, and making you want something.
> Advertising harms rational thought, self-determination, wellbeing, and
> the environment.
>
>
> Advertising != information
>
> It is information if you say "there's a supermarket here named
> so-and-so, and they are open at this time, and this is their telephone
> number, and they sell these products". It is advertising if the products
> or services are described in a way designed to make this particular
> vendor stand out, or designed to make you want to buy. A list of
> products or services can already venture into the world of advertising.
> Example: "Sells ice cream and milk shakes" - not advertising. "Sells
> chocolate ice cream, vanilla ice cream, homegrown blueberry ice cream,
> and caramel fudge ice cream" - this is getting dangerously close to
> advertising (do you taste it in your mouth already?). "City's premier
> spot for delicious organic ice creams, prepared on the premises by our
> Italian chef", well.
>
>
> Rant about advertising in OSM
>
> Advertising is often added to OSM in blatant disregard for what we want;
> for those adding advertising to OSM, we are just another vehicle to
> carry their marketing message across. More precisely, you will usually
> have a business crafting a marketing message, asking another business to
> "manage their online visibility" for a small fee, and that business then
> exploits cheap labour in a sweatshop somewhere on the planet to add the
> marketing message to OSM (and Google Plus, and Facebook, and all the
> yellow pages they can find). Data added to OSM this way consists of a
> factual part (name and type of business, address, opening hours), and an
> advertising part (usually in the "note" or "description" tag, and/or in
> changeset comments and user profiles).
>
> The advertising part itself has no place in OSM, but even the factual
> part is often buggy in a number of ways:
>
> * the address tags don't follow OSM conventions (suite/unit number added
> to addr:street, abbreviations in street names)
> * the placement of the node is wrong (in the middle of the road,
> 

Re: [OSM-talk] Privacy concerns - revive some sort of anonymous editing?

[Toby Murray]

Not to rain on your account deletion party... but it may be doing less
than you think. User names get replicated out to anyone who consumes
OSM data. It is in the weekly planet dump files as well as all the
minutely/hourly/daily replication diff files. So your old (now
deleted) user name and your edits are still recorded in thousands of
databases across the globe. I have one on my own computer at home
actually. I use it to help analyze potential vandalism edits as
Frederik talked about.

Toby


On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 3:35 PM, Jibix  wrote:
> Hello everyone,
> I've been a contributor of OpenStreetMap for a few year, with a couple of
> different accounts. I got them deleted today and I though it could be
> worthwhile talking about this here.
>
> In our current era of big data, I have been more and more concerned about
> having all my osm edits publicly linked to my profiles, and these profiles
> publicly listing all these positions and places where I've been, also with
> somehow time information and sometimes comments, etc... visible forever by
> anyone, or any bot. I've looked into making the link between all that data
> not publicly visible, but it seems the functionality there use to be for
> that (anonymous editing) is not possible since 2007/2009.
>
> I've read (a good few of the) related e-mails from that time [1], and I
> understand that there was an important ground and a general consensus for
> that decision, despite a minority of voice disappointed by this "security
> rather than freedom" direction being taken.
>
> My humble point of view is that with the important evolution that OSM has
> experienced since back then, it would be a very good thing, if not done
> already, to revisit this issue and find a middle point which possibly was
> not easily feasible at the time but would now be more achievable. For
> instance, if I had a tick box "do not publicly link changes to my account",
> either at account level or at changeset level, but that every user still had
> the possibility to send a message to the author of such edits, and to roll
> them back (even potentially with a procedure for banning users with too much
> anonymous changes rolled back by the community, as the edits-author link is
> not lost, it's just not visible to users, whether registered or not). Then,
> I think, everyone would be happy, or close to? I mean, I think this would
> address both the concerns that led to the decision of disabling anonymous
> editing back in 2007 and the privacy concerns I summarised above.
>
> (At the time it was also mentioned that OSM is all about being a community
> project, and that it was probably inconsistent to allow anonymous
> contributions in that context. In particular, a comparison with Wikipedia
> was made. My opinion on this is that location-related information are in
> general much more privacy-critical than Wikipedia edits are, in particular
> now that you have user-friendly mobile apps for mapping on the go, and
> therefore the comparison is inappropriate.)
>
> I've been looking a bit around to see if there was a plan for developing
> something like that anytime soon, or if it had been implemented already, but
> I couldn't find. I've mailed the support team, who confirmed there is
> currently no way (other than closing an account) to make edits become
> anonymous.
>
> Therefore I'm afraid the only way forward I see to address my concerns is
> the following:
> 1) on the one hand having my past accounts deleted, for the corresponding
> change-sets not to be linked any more to my name or pseudonym. I got that
> done today.
> 2) on the other hand, from now on, to periodically create and abandon
> accounts for keeping editing without a massive correlation of data being too
> easily possible (but even like that it's an unperfect tradeoff).
>
> I'm not sure how much of the community is having concerns similar to mine,
> but I would guess that these can only have gone bigger and bigger since back
> in 2007. As said above, I believe it would be worth having a think about it
> again. (But maybe it has already been discussed again recently, and I didn't
> find out?)
>
> What are your thoughts?
>
> Looking forward,
>
> Jibix
>
> [1]:
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2007-October/thread.html#18853
>
> --
> Jibix
> favourite webpage of the moment:
> https://degooglisons-internet.org/alternatives?l=en
>
>
>
> ___
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> talk@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk
>

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Re: [OSM-talk] Privacy concerns - revive some sort of anonymous editing?

[Frederik Ramm]

Hi,

On 03/01/2018 10:35 PM, Jibix wrote:
> I've read (a good few of the) related e-mails from that time [1], and I
> understand that there was an important ground and a general consensus
> for that decision, despite a minority of voice disappointed by this
> "security rather than freedom" direction being taken.

I think you're misrepresenting it when you say "security rather than
freedom". "Accountability rather than privacy" would probably be more
correct.

> if I had a tick box "do not publicly link
> changes to my account", either at account level or at changeset level,
> but that every user still had the possibility to send a message to the
> author of such edits, and to roll them back (even potentially with a
> procedure for banning users with too much anonymous changes rolled back
> by the community, as the edits-author link is not lost, it's just not
> visible to users, whether registered or not). Then, I think, everyone
> would be happy, or close to? 

Thing is, at OSM we depend very much on the community policing itself.
It would not be feasible to have just a small group dealing with problems.

Knowing about other edits made by the same user around the same time can
give important context to judge whether something is vandalism or an
honest mistake. If we take this information away from the community, we
lose their help in quality assurance which we desperately need.

However, I think it would be possible to limit this information to "the
OSM community" i.e. everyone who has an account, and to make these
people promise that they will not abuse the data for non-OSM purposes.

This means that I can still see what you did last summer, but I wouldn't
be allowed to use that information for non-OSM-related purposes.

This is a weak protection but I don't see how we can allow stronger
protection without employing a huge, privileged QA task force that has
access to user information and can therefore judge better.

Bye
Frederik

-- 
Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"

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[Talk-us] Help fight advertising

[Frederik Ramm]

Hi,

over the past year or so, I have recreationally hunted down advertising
on OSM and removed it. In many cases it's a clear-cut situation (there
were cases where advertising borders on vandalism, with whole streets
being named after a business), but there have also been situations where
a local mapper had diligently copied a business's sales slogan into the
description tag and was then upset to see this removed.

As more and more SEO firms start dumping their stuff onto OSM (and here
I am not talking about those who actually talk to us and listen, but
those who don't care), this is becoming a fight that needs to be fought
by the community as a whole.

With this posting I'd like to start a wider discussion about
advertising; the reason it goes to talk-us is that the USA are more
strongly targeted by SEO companies and at the same time the community
there is still not as big and watchful as in other regions of interest
to spammers, leading to a relatively high volume of unwanted advertising
in the US.


General rant about advertising

I'll make this short as it's likely the most opinionated part of this
message. Advertising illustrates a lot of what has gone wrong in western
societies. There's a war on over attention, and most people are affected
by it throughout their daily lives - even if you run an adblocker, you
won't be immune to the attention-grabbing design of web sites and apps
and games. The films you watch on TV will deliver content that fits
snugly around the ad breaks. Advertising has crept into the home, into
schools and kindergartens. Advertising calls you on the phone.
Advertising's very mission is not to make your life better, but take
your mind away from what matters, and making you want something.
Advertising harms rational thought, self-determination, wellbeing, and
the environment.


Advertising != information

It is information if you say "there's a supermarket here named
so-and-so, and they are open at this time, and this is their telephone
number, and they sell these products". It is advertising if the products
or services are described in a way designed to make this particular
vendor stand out, or designed to make you want to buy. A list of
products or services can already venture into the world of advertising.
Example: "Sells ice cream and milk shakes" - not advertising. "Sells
chocolate ice cream, vanilla ice cream, homegrown blueberry ice cream,
and caramel fudge ice cream" - this is getting dangerously close to
advertising (do you taste it in your mouth already?). "City's premier
spot for delicious organic ice creams, prepared on the premises by our
Italian chef", well.


Rant about advertising in OSM

Advertising is often added to OSM in blatant disregard for what we want;
for those adding advertising to OSM, we are just another vehicle to
carry their marketing message across. More precisely, you will usually
have a business crafting a marketing message, asking another business to
"manage their online visibility" for a small fee, and that business then
exploits cheap labour in a sweatshop somewhere on the planet to add the
marketing message to OSM (and Google Plus, and Facebook, and all the
yellow pages they can find). Data added to OSM this way consists of a
factual part (name and type of business, address, opening hours), and an
advertising part (usually in the "note" or "description" tag, and/or in
changeset comments and user profiles).

The advertising part itself has no place in OSM, but even the factual
part is often buggy in a number of ways:

* the address tags don't follow OSM conventions (suite/unit number added
to addr:street, abbreviations in street names)
* the placement of the node is wrong (in the middle of the road,
clustered in the desert or on another continent due to some geocoding
cock-up)
* the placement of the node violates the copyright of whatever gecoder
was used to generate it
* the node doesn't have a tag that describes what it is, in OSM terms
(no "shop" or "amenity" or "office" or anything - or at best some
generic office=company tag)
* the node doesn't actually signify any relevant walk-in business but is
just put there to publish an URL or phone number (witness recent
locksmith scam)
* the node uses other unsuitable tags like "Keywords", "Services
offered", "Category", or incorrect opening hours)

Such advertising is regularly added by accounts created solely for the
purpose of adding one single business, and the accounts will usually
have a name derived directly from the business name, and will never
reply to any attempt at contacting them. In very rare cases it might be
an actual business owner adding themselves to the map, but in the
overwhelming number of cases it's just professional spammers.

Advertising also distorts the quality of OSM. If a mapper maps an area,
they will most likely add *all* doctors they encounter and not just
those who happen to pay money to an online visibility enhancement firm.
If we allow advertisers to flood OSM 

Re: [Talk-es] Importaciones catastro

[Javier Sánchez Portero]

Alejandro, dale permisos por favor. No se si Matías Taborda también estaba
pendiente. Si quieres darme permisos a mi para administrar te puedo ayudar
con esto.

El 1 mar. 2018 18:21, "Joaquim"  escribió:

> Hola
>
> Una vez preparado todo para crear un proyecto necesito permiso para poder
> crearlo en el  administrador de tareas. Mi usuario para importaciones es:
> puxan_importacions.
>
> Ya pediré que alguien con más experiencia lo revise antes de publicarlo.
>
> Gracias
>
> Joaquim
>
>
>
>
> ___
> Talk-es mailing list
> Talk-es@openstreetmap.org
> https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/talk-es
>
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Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )

[Marián Kyral]

-- Původní e-mail --
Od: majka 
Komu: OpenStreetMap Czech Republic 
Datum: 1. 3. 2018 13:27:37
Předmět: Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )
"
Nová data už jsou, bohužel se starými chybami.
"



11 schránek zrušeno, 288 změněno a 2 nové ( 28000:245, 56707:105)




Jak rychle dokáže ČP zapracovat nahlášené chyby budeme muset ověřit v praxi
:-D




Marián






"



2018-03-01 11:01 GMT+01:00 Marián Kyral :
"
"
A taky je nový měsíc, budou nová data, příležitost vyzkoušet  ;-)
"
"


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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Osmose pour l'OpenData

[osm . sanspourriel]

Je vois que Frédéric va bientôt nous proposer :
- quelques catégories
- quelques niveaux d'importance
- deux méta catégories (AQ=qualité, DO=intégration)

pour revenir à l'intérêt de faire se côtoyer AQ et DO c'est que si on a 
des stats de distance moyenne/maxi sur des données intégrées on avise 
des intégrateurs des problèmes potentiels, sinon on va avoir plus de 
doublons, triplés...


Idées d'amélioration après avoir complété 
https://pic4review.pavie.info/#/mission/45/summary :
dans Osmose il était dit qu'il manquait le ref:FR:FINESS mais sans le 
proposer.
J'ai dû dézoomer pour voir toujours dans Pic4Review les noms de rue et 
de commune puis je suis allé sur https://annuaire.sante.fr trouver le 
code FINESS en question.

Pas exactement ce qui se fait de plus convivial et de plus trivial.

Pourtant on a des possibilités de faire mieux :
- sur clic trouver l'adresse (via OpenCage ? le formatage est fonction 
du pays et donne une adresse postale (sans affichage parasite des noms 
de chef lieux des arrondissements départementaux à la Nominatim).
- proposer a minima la source (ici https://annuaire.sante.fr voir mieux) 
et si possible comme c'est fait pour les boîtes-aux-lettres proposer 
l'intégration.

- éventuellement faire du géocodage sur la source.

Une idée d'amélioration c'est aussi de passer plus facilement d'un 
éditeur à l'autre (par exemple de Pic4Review à Osmose en se plaçant au 
même endroit et si possible le même thème).

Au fait Florian tu n'as même pas mis un lien vers OSM !

Car suivant les jours, les thèmes ou son humeur un éditeur est plus 
adapté ou préféré.


Jean-Yvon
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[OSM-talk] Privacy concerns - revive some sort of anonymous editing?

[Jibix]

Hello everyone,
I've been a contributor of OpenStreetMap for a few year, with a couple of 
different accounts. I got them deleted today and I though it could be 
worthwhile talking about this here.

In our current era of big data, I have been more and more concerned about 
having all my osm edits publicly linked to my profiles, and these profiles 
publicly listing all these positions and places where I've been, also with 
somehow time information and sometimes comments, etc... visible forever by 
anyone, or any bot. I've looked into making the link between all that data not 
publicly visible, but it seems the functionality there use to be for that 
(anonymous editing) is not possible since 2007/2009.

I've read (a good few of the) related e-mails from that time [1], and I 
understand that there was an important ground and a general consensus for that 
decision, despite a minority of voice disappointed by this "security rather 
than freedom" direction being taken.

My humble point of view is that with the important evolution that OSM has 
experienced since back then, it would be a very good thing, if not done 
already, to revisit this issue and find a middle point which possibly was not 
easily feasible at the time but would now be more achievable. For instance, if 
I had a tick box "do not publicly link changes to my account", either at 
account level or at changeset level, but that every user still had the 
possibility to send a message to the author of such edits, and to roll them 
back (even potentially with a procedure for banning users with too much 
anonymous changes rolled back by the community, as the edits-author link is not 
lost, it's just not visible to users, whether registered or not). Then, I 
think, everyone would be happy, or close to? I mean, I think this would address 
both the concerns that led to the decision of disabling anonymous editing back 
in 2007 and the privacy concerns I summarised above.

(At the time it was also mentioned that OSM is all about being a community 
project, and that it was probably inconsistent to allow anonymous contributions 
in that context. In particular, a comparison with Wikipedia was made. My 
opinion on this is that location-related information are in general much more 
privacy-critical than Wikipedia edits are, in particular now that you have 
user-friendly mobile apps for mapping on the go, and therefore the comparison 
is inappropriate.)

I've been looking a bit around to see if there was a plan for developing 
something like that anytime soon, or if it had been implemented already, but I 
couldn't find. I've mailed the support team, who confirmed there is currently 
no way (other than closing an account) to make edits become anonymous.

Therefore I'm afraid the only way forward I see to address my concerns is the 
following:
1) on the one hand having my past accounts deleted, for the corresponding 
change-sets not to be linked any more to my name or pseudonym. I got that done 
today.
2) on the other hand, from now on, to periodically create and abandon accounts 
for keeping editing without a massive correlation of data being too easily 
possible (but even like that it's an unperfect tradeoff).

I'm not sure how much of the community is having concerns similar to mine, but 
I would guess that these can only have gone bigger and bigger since back in 
2007. As said above, I believe it would be worth having a think about it again. 
(But maybe it has already been discussed again recently, and I didn't find out?)

What are your thoughts?

Looking forward,

Jibix

[1]: 
https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk/2007-October/thread.html#18853

--
Jibix
favourite webpage of the moment: 
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Osmose pour l'OpenData

[François Lacombe]

Bonsoir Vincent,

Le 1 mars 2018 à 20:25, Vincent Bergeot  a écrit :

> Bonjour,
>
> avec Frédéric Rodrigo nous avançons sur le fait de "séparer" la partie
> Analyse Qualité d'Osmose de la partie OpenData, déjà évoqué sur cette liste.
>

Je plussoie et pourrai vous apporter mon aide sur des points précis

Sur les catégories, je verrai plus Energie se transformer en Réseaux.
Ou bien penser à deux autres, Adduction d'eau et Télécoms
Il va y avoir du mouvement prochainement.

Peut-etre n'est-ce pas dans le scope ou  la roadmap, mais je pense que la
conflation linéaire - pour intégrer des chemins en plus des noeuds - est
une étape interessante pour intégrer encore plus de jeux de données.


Bon courage dans cette démarche :)

François
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Osmose pour l'OpenData

[Frédéric Rodrigo]

Le 01/03/2018 à 20:25, Vincent Bergeot a écrit :


Bonjour,

avec Frédéric Rodrigo nous avançons sur le fait de "séparer" la partie 
Analyse Qualité d'Osmose de la partie OpenData, déjà évoqué sur cette 
liste.


Les objectifs sont :

  * de ne plus avoir les catégorie 7 "À cartographier" et 8
"Intégration" sur http://osmose.openstreetmap.fr,
  * d'avoir un site http://opendata.osmose.openstreetmap.fr/ avec une
organisation plus "lisible" (actuellement vous y trouverez les
mêmes catégories "À cartographier" et 8 "Intégration"),

Pour cette lisibilité, voici notre proposition de catégories :

  * 1    Transports (vélo, parking, train, ..)
  * 2    Équipement sport, bornes, bal,
  * 3    Bâtiments, logements, patrimoines
  * 4    Education, formation, club sportif, ...
  * 5    Santé / Urgence / Soins / PEI /
  * 6    Services publics, services aux publics
  * 7    Énergie
  * 8    Commerce / banques / craft

Vous trouverez en PJ la proposition de correspondance entre les 
analyses et les catégories.


Nous aimerions bien évidemment avoir vos retours, que cela soit sur 
les catégories et/ou le fait de "basculer" la partie opendata sur un 
site à part (la partie opendata n'étant alors plus visible sur 
osmose.opendata.fr).




Je n'y avais pas pensé, mais on peut aussi utiliser les niveaux 
d'importances pour prioriser certains jeux de données.


Frédéric.


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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Osmose pour l'OpenData

[Magalie Dartus]

Merci pour ta réponse, ça fait déjà un peu de matière :)

Le 1 mars 2018 à 21:48,  a écrit :

> Bonsoir et bienvenue au club..
> Tu verras qu'à la fin de chaque message il y a un lien vers l'archive de
> la liste.
> Si tu n'as pas le titre ou pas la date, ce n'est pas très pratique pour
> retrouver la conversation en question.
> Voici le dernier message sur Osmose et l'OD.
>
> N. B. : simplifier l'interface Osmose oui, mais il me semble intéressante
> de pourvoir filtrer par l'un ou l'autre ou que l'on puisse passer
> facilement de l'OD transport à l'AQ transport et réciproquement.
> Il me semble même crucial que les gens se rendent compte que données
> ouvertes ne veut pas dire de qualité.
> La Poste met en OD des bureaux de poste en se trompant de centre
> commercial sachant qu'à priori La Poste n'est pas la société la plus
> mauvaise en géolocalisation.
>
> On a aussi parlé outils (JOSM), STIF, SIREN, BANO, RTE, SNCF. Je ne
> garantis pas l'exhaustivité.
>
> Jean-Yvon
>
>
>  Message transféré 
> Sujet : Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Interface Osmose, en particulier OpenData
> (osmose-OD)
> Date : Thu, 27 Jul 2017 16:52:59 +0200
> De : Florian LAINEZ - winnerflo@free.f
> Pour : Discussions sur OSM en français 
> 
>
> ah merde, je ne crois pas avoir de sauvegarde du pad :(
>
> je me souviens néanmoins y avoir ajouté les informations suivantes (que je
> recopie/colle du thread que tu as cité précédemment) :
>
> Besoin :
>
> 1. Un outil de QA permettant de comparer les données en Open Data aux
> données OpenStreetMap.
>  - Une partie située sur une carte pour les données géolocalisées
>  - Une partie sous forme de liste pour des données numériques (% données
> manquantes, erreurs etc...)
>
> 2. Enrichir cet outil pour les contributeurs, en leur permettant de
> contribuer les modifications directement dans la page, après s'être loggés
> sur leur compte OSM.
>  - Possibilité de conserver un historique (undo / redo) et d'appliquer un
> ensemble de changements d'un coup sous forme de changeset.
>  - Possibilité d'éditer des nodes, des ways, et des relations
>
> 3. Supporter la remontée d'anomalies sur les jeux de données métier
> Donner la possibilité à un visiteur de détecter et faire remonter une
> anomalie sur un des jeux de données métier.
> Typiquement: "votre arrêt xxx n'existe plus", ou "l'abribus yyy a été
> déplacé ici"
>
> 4. Création d'un dashboard permettant au producteur de données d'appliquer
> des décisions sur les remontées d'anomalies
>  - Possibilité d'accepter un changement, accepter certaines parties d'un
> changement, etc...
>  - Possibilité d'exporter les jeux de données une fois ceux-ci modifiés
>
> 5. Un outil de statistiques
>  - Comptage des flux de données (remontées d'erreurs, fix OSM, nombre de
> changements finaux dans chaque dataset)
>
>
> Je n'ai malheureusement plus le temps pour me consacrer à ce projet, mais
> vous avez tout mon soutien : c'est un outil indispensable à notre
> développement.
>
> Le 27 juillet 2017 à 09:56, Vincent Bergeot  a écrit
> :
>
>> Bonjour,
>>
>> en octobre septembre-octobre 2016, des discussions et recueils d'idées
>> sur l'interface d'osmose et en particulier de l'interface pour Osmose-OD
>> (opendata) se sont tenus (https://lists.openstreetmap.o
>> rg/pipermail/talk-fr/2016-September/082112.html), et un pad a été créé (
>> https://semestriel.framapad.org/p/refonte-interface-osmose). J'ai voulu
>> retourner sur le pad, sauf que c'était un semestriel et que nous n'avons
>> pas édité depuis 6 mois donc.
>>
>> A-t-on une sauvegarde du pad ?
>>
>>- Si oui peut-on la remettre sur le pad suivant :
>>https://annuel2.framapad.org/p/refonte-interface-osmose
>> ?
>>- Sinon, qui est partant pour relancer le chantier, en particulier
>>autour d'osmose-OD !
>>
>> Parmi les "priorités" pour pouvoir bénéficier d'une instance osmose-od
>> dédiée et suite à une discussion hier avec Frédéric Rodrigo, il apparaît
>> nécessaire de réorganiser le classement des données ouvertes pour pouvoir
>> faire apparaître des thématiques. Pour diverses raisons techniques ce
>> classement pourra comporter dans un premier temps 9 thématiques.
>>
>> Je propose de reprendre les 9 thématiques de data-gouv (j'ai tenté de
>> mettre quelques exemples de données traitées par osmose déjà aujourd'hui).
>>
>>- Agriculture et alimentation
>>   -
>>   - Culture
>>   - musées
>>   - Economie et emploi
>>- éducation et recherche
>>   - les écoles,
>>   - international et europe
>>   -
>>   - logement, développement durable et énergie
>>   - réseau rte et tutti power
>>   - santé et social
>>   - pharmacies
>>   - société
>>   -
>>   - territoires, transports et tourisme
>>   - déchets
>>   - arrêts de bus
>>   - ...
>>
>> C'est une 

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Osmose pour l'OpenData

[osm . sanspourriel]

Bonsoir et bienvenue au club..

Tu verras qu'à la fin de chaque message il y a un lien vers l'archive de 
la liste.
Si tu n'as pas le titre ou pas la date, ce n'est pas très pratique pour 
retrouver la conversation en question.

Voici le dernier message sur Osmose et l'OD.

N. B. : simplifier l'interface Osmose oui, mais il me semble 
intéressante de pourvoir filtrer par l'un ou l'autre ou que l'on puisse 
passer facilement de l'OD transport à l'AQ transport et réciproquement.
Il me semble même crucial que les gens se rendent compte que données 
ouvertes ne veut pas dire de qualité.
La Poste met en OD des bureaux de poste en se trompant de centre 
commercial sachant qu'à priori La Poste n'est pas la société la plus 
mauvaise en géolocalisation.


On a aussi parlé outils (JOSM), STIF, SIREN, BANO, RTE, SNCF. Je ne 
garantis pas l'exhaustivité.


Jean-Yvon


 Message transféré 
Sujet : 	Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Interface Osmose, en particulier OpenData 
(osmose-OD)

Date :  Thu, 27 Jul 2017 16:52:59 +0200
De :Florian LAINEZ - winnerflo@free.f
Pour :  Discussions sur OSM en français 



ah merde, je ne crois pas avoir de sauvegarde du pad :(

je me souviens néanmoins y avoir ajouté les informations suivantes (que 
je recopie/colle du thread que tu as cité précédemment) :


Besoin :

1. Un outil de QA permettant de comparer les données en Open Data aux
données OpenStreetMap.
 - Une partie située sur une carte pour les données géolocalisées
 - Une partie sous forme de liste pour des données numériques (% données
manquantes, erreurs etc...)

2. Enrichir cet outil pour les contributeurs, en leur permettant de
contribuer les modifications directement dans la page, après s'être loggés
sur leur compte OSM.
 - Possibilité de conserver un historique (undo / redo) et d'appliquer un
ensemble de changements d'un coup sous forme de changeset.
 - Possibilité d'éditer des nodes, des ways, et des relations

3. Supporter la remontée d'anomalies sur les jeux de données métier
Donner la possibilité à un visiteur de détecter et faire remonter une
anomalie sur un des jeux de données métier.
Typiquement: "votre arrêt xxx n'existe plus", ou "l'abribus yyy a été
déplacé ici"

4. Création d'un dashboard permettant au producteur de données d'appliquer
des décisions sur les remontées d'anomalies
 - Possibilité d'accepter un changement, accepter certaines parties d'un
changement, etc...
 - Possibilité d'exporter les jeux de données une fois ceux-ci modifiés

5. Un outil de statistiques
 - Comptage des flux de données (remontées d'erreurs, fix OSM, nombre de
changements finaux dans chaque dataset)


Je n'ai malheureusement plus le temps pour me consacrer à ce projet, 
mais vous avez tout mon soutien : c'est un outil indispensable à notre 
développement.


Le 27 juillet 2017 à 09:56, Vincent Bergeot > a écrit :


   Bonjour,

   en octobre septembre-octobre 2016, des discussions et recueils
   d'idées sur l'interface d'osmose et en particulier de l'interface
   pour Osmose-OD (opendata) se sont tenus
   (https://lists.openstreetmap.org/pipermail/talk-fr/2016-September/082112.html
   
),
   et un pad a été créé
   (https://semestriel.framapad.org/p/refonte-interface-osmose
   ). J'ai
   voulu retourner sur le pad, sauf que c'était un semestriel et que
   nous n'avons pas édité depuis 6 mois donc.

   A-t-on une sauvegarde du pad ?

 * Si oui peut-on la remettre sur le pad suivant :
   https://annuel2.framapad.org/p/refonte-interface-osmose
    ?
 * Sinon, qui est partant pour relancer le chantier, en particulier
   autour d'osmose-OD !

   Parmi les "priorités" pour pouvoir bénéficier d'une instance
   osmose-od dédiée et suite à une discussion hier avec Frédéric
   Rodrigo, il apparaît nécessaire de réorganiser le classement des
   données ouvertes pour pouvoir faire apparaître des thématiques. Pour
   diverses raisons techniques ce classement pourra comporter dans un
   premier temps 9 thématiques.

   Je propose de reprendre les 9 thématiques de data-gouv (j'ai tenté
   de mettre quelques exemples de données traitées par osmose déjà
   aujourd'hui).

 * Agriculture et alimentation
 o

 * Culture
 o musées
 * Economie et emploi
 * éducation et recherche
 o les écoles,
 * international et europe
 o

 * logement, développement durable et énergie
 o réseau rte et tutti power
 * santé et social
 o pharmacies
 * société
 o

 * territoires, transports et tourisme
 o déchets
 o arrêts de bus
 o ...

   C'est une proposition donc elle doit évoluer (par exemple société
   bof, international et europe, je ne vois pas trop / par 

Re: [OSM-talk-fr] Osmose pour l'OpenData

[Magalie Dartus]

Bonsoir,

Ceci est mon premier message sur le fil des discussions et mea culpa je
suis plutôt débutante en ce qui concerne Osmose (mais j'apprends auprès du
groupe toulousain).

Le thème de l'Open Data m'intéresse et visiblement vous avez une discussion
depuis un moment à ce sujet. Est-ce que quelqu'un pourrait m'indiquer où je
peux trouver le reste de la discussion?


Merci par avance
Magalie




Le 1 mars 2018 à 20:25, Vincent Bergeot  a écrit :

> Bonjour,
>
> avec Frédéric Rodrigo nous avançons sur le fait de "séparer" la partie
> Analyse Qualité d'Osmose de la partie OpenData, déjà évoqué sur cette liste.
>
> Les objectifs sont :
>
>- de ne plus avoir les catégorie 7 "À cartographier" et 8
>"Intégration" sur http://osmose.openstreetmap.fr,
>- d'avoir un site http://opendata.osmose.openstreetmap.fr/ avec une
>organisation plus "lisible" (actuellement vous y trouverez les mêmes
>catégories "À cartographier" et 8 "Intégration"),
>
> Pour cette lisibilité, voici notre proposition de catégories :
>
>- 1Transports (vélo, parking, train, ..)
>- 2Équipement sport, bornes, bal,
>- 3Bâtiments, logements, patrimoines
>- 4Education, formation, club sportif, ...
>- 5Santé / Urgence / Soins / PEI /
>- 6Services publics, services aux publics
>- 7Énergie
>- 8Commerce / banques / craft
>
> Vous trouverez en PJ la proposition de correspondance entre les analyses
> et les catégories.
>
> Nous aimerions bien évidemment avoir vos retours, que cela soit sur les
> catégories et/ou le fait de "basculer" la partie opendata sur un site à
> part (la partie opendata n'étant alors plus visible sur osmose.opendata.fr
> ).
>
> à vous lire,
>
> --
> Vincent Bergeot
>
>
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Re: [Diversity-talk] Code of Conduct & Moderation for this list

[Kristin Bott]

Hi all --

On the OSGeo side of things, we put a bunch of work into creating a CoC
(and related committee, private listserv, reporting structure, etc) a few
years ago. The text of the CoC itself was based off of a variety of things
from different online communities / tech groups / feminism groups / etc.

CoC is here:: http://www.osgeo.org/code_of_conduct/

... if you'd like more fodder for discussion. Happy to talk about any of
this more if that's helpful; feel free to reach out.

cheers -
-kristin/k.bott

portland, oregon, USA

On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 9:26 AM, Selene Yang  wrote:

> After having a share of the results from the international gender
> representation survey from Geochicas, we've come to a conclusion that at
> least 7 out of 10 contributors believe in the need of implementing a CoC in
> OSM in general, not only in specific lists.
>
> Sele.
>
> 2018-03-01 6:19 GMT-06:00 Ilya Zverev :
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> I'm a moderator on the Russian forum. A year ago I introduced CoC (called
>> "rules", but technically it's CoC). I based these on several examples, like
>> the Django one, translated and adapted to Russia. There was a huge backlash
>> from some members, angry posts on the OSM diary appear to this day. But
>> despite several reports to forum admins and to OSMF working groups, CoC
>> still stands.
>>
>> Obviously at first it lead to some temporary bans, but with time there
>> are zero users banned, and everyone is pretty polite and constructive.
>> Which is a visible difference to how the forum was before me. The amount of
>> discussions decreased, but the quality, in my opinion, rose.
>>
>> To me, there are two important conditions for CoC to succeed: cutting
>> users slack (we have "one warning" policy + these expire after a time) and
>> being strict in enforcing the CoC (banning multiple users at once if
>> needed).
>>
>> So, I think to install CoC the moderator should just go and do it, and
>> worry about technicalities later. If somebody does not like being in a
>> space with CoC, they can choose any of the remaining hundred of mailing
>> lists.
>>
>> Ilya
>>
>> > 1 марта 2018 г., в 15:04, Jo Walsh  написал(а):
>> >
>> > Hi folks. I'm glad of this forum to reboot this discussion.
>> >
>> > From my POV the Code of Conduct is boilerplate and should include the
>> minimum necessary in order to be both accepted and effective. For better or
>> worse the absence of a CoC has become a signpost that an online community
>> is not welcoming.
>> >
>> > When the CoC discussion blew up on the OSMF-talk list last year I tried
>> to read the background and liked what I saw at:
>> > https://github.com/gravitystorm/openstreetmap-carto/blob/
>> master/CODE_OF_CONDUCT.md
>> >
>> > It derives from the Go community, which lifted from Django and Rust,
>> which were inspired by GeekFeminism efforts. The wording is pretty minimal
>> and I like the initial emphasis on the positive.
>> >
>> >> We might even include something like "OpenStreetMap participation
>> style" in
>> >> that list so we do not have to tolerate disparaging remarks about
>> remote
>> >> mappers, craft mappers, newbie mappers or folks that participate
>> through
>> >> non-mapping contributions.
>> >
>> > Imo this would be walking into a minefield, encourage accusations of
>> tone policing.  The emphasis on having to spell out all kinds of
>> unacceptable behaviour, as you note below, is to avoid a lot of contentious
>> discussion about what is acceptable; it's the long discussion rather than
>> any initial incident which will repel people or burn them out.
>> >
>> > I think contribution styles are not in scope here. OSM friends have
>> wondered "why do we not include positive attributes that mappers should
>> have, such as emphasis on surveying, no trespassing, etc" but an effort to
>> get the wording right / get enough eyes and minds on the description of
>> values, would just further delay the sensible adoption of a baseline CoC
>> >
>> >> How many endless discussions
>> >> will there be (or have their been) about what is offensive as opposed
>> to
>> >> the somewhat easier to identify, disparaging or derogatory comment.
>> >
>> > Historically there has been a mailing list CoC but i dont think it had
>> enough input to get adoption, it's narrow in scope and overly specific, it
>> would be great if an effort here could trickle up into something OSMF as a
>> whole could adopt
>> > https://github.com/mvexel/CoC-mailing-lists/blob/master/code
>> _of_conduct.md
>> >
>> > Lots more to discuss but i'll leave it here :D
>> >
>> >
>> > Jo
>> >
>> > ___
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>> > Code of Conduct: TBD
>> > Contact the mods (private): diversity-talk-ow...@openstreetmap.org
>> > (_internal_name)s
>>
>>
>> ___
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>> Contact the mods (private): 

[OSM-talk-fr] Osmose pour l'OpenData

[Vincent Bergeot]

Bonjour,

avec Frédéric Rodrigo nous avançons sur le fait de "séparer" la partie 
Analyse Qualité d'Osmose de la partie OpenData, déjà évoqué sur cette liste.


Les objectifs sont :

 * de ne plus avoir les catégorie 7 "À cartographier" et 8
   "Intégration" sur http://osmose.openstreetmap.fr,
 * d'avoir un site http://opendata.osmose.openstreetmap.fr/ avec une
   organisation plus "lisible" (actuellement vous y trouverez les mêmes
   catégories "À cartographier" et 8 "Intégration"),

Pour cette lisibilité, voici notre proposition de catégories :

 * 1    Transports (vélo, parking, train, ..)
 * 2    Équipement sport, bornes, bal,
 * 3    Bâtiments, logements, patrimoines
 * 4    Education, formation, club sportif, ...
 * 5    Santé / Urgence / Soins / PEI /
 * 6    Services publics, services aux publics
 * 7    Énergie
 * 8    Commerce / banques / craft

Vous trouverez en PJ la proposition de correspondance entre les analyses 
et les catégories.


Nous aimerions bien évidemment avoir vos retours, que cela soit sur les 
catégories et/ou le fait de "basculer" la partie opendata sur un site à 
part (la partie opendata n'étant alors plus visible sur osmose.opendata.fr).


à vous lire,

--
Vincent Bergeot



mapping-opendata-talk-fr.ods
Description: application/vnd.oasis.opendocument.spreadsheet
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Re: [Talk-us] Satus CDP

[OSM Volunteer stevea]

Albert Pundt  writes
> Many towns and suburbs in my area are only CDPs, and having proper boundaries 
> for them seems like it'd be useful, especially in more densely populated  
> areas. It's not like there's any fuzziness with them either, since they're 
> defined by the Census Bureau and could only change once every 10 years. Only 
> one U.S. census has occurred in OSM history, so it's not like we'd be 
> constantly updating them. 

Thank you for your perspective Albert, and while you didn't ask a direct 
question, I am left with a couple myself after reading your observations:

Are these actually "towns" (or "cities") and so should be mapped 
boundary=administrative and admin_level=8?
Are these actually "suburbs" and so should be mapped as nodes tagged 
place=suburb inside of cities (which are mapped as the previous sentence)?

Noting in our United States admin_level wiki that a particular state SHOULD map 
with a particular "rungs on the ladder" hierarchy of particular admin_level 
values is useful, since by consensus we took our time to get those correct for 
that particular state.  THEN, there are assigning proper values on those proper 
entities, whether they came from the Census Bureau or need to be created/come 
from some other source.  If a census boundary exactly matches a city or town 
boundary, for example, (though it might prove challenging to discover or verify 
that), well, by all means:  rather than deleting that tagged polygon, we can 
simply change the tags from boundary=census to boundary=administrative, add an 
admin_level=8 tag (perhaps add a border_type=city tag) and be done until the 
next decennial census.

However, that's the tricky part: IS that Census Bureau-produced boundary truly 
the town or city boundary?  Or is it simply (and likely incorrectly) a "Census 
Bureau-produced boundary of census tract agglomerations" rather than a true 
corporate boundary as denoted by the city itself (or its parent state)?  Either 
might be correct, but as of now, data in our map are not sure.  In OSM, I'd 
like the data surely to be what it claims to be.  I don't believe we have that 
today with many Census Bureau boundaries, except that they denote a "boundary" 
of some sort:  sometimes correctly denoted "census" with no admin_level value 
(but should have one on a different and correct polygon), sometimes incorrectly 
denoted "administrative" with a questionable (maybe correct, maybe not) value, 
but on a polygon which is Census Bureau produced and possibly incorrect, 
possibly correct but we don't know that the Census Bureau exactly mapped a 
corporate boundary 

Locally speaking, they might appear to be "better than nothing, at least until 
the next decennial census," but ask yourself:  what are these really denoting?  
If the answer is "we don't know if this is a corporate boundary or not" then we 
must at a minimum change the boundary tag from administrative to census, 
deleting any admin_level tag.  (Taking note amongst ourselves that these 
boundaries are marginally useful at best, especially when there are entities 
like towns and cities that deserve to have their corporate boundaries in our 
map).

We've already achieved consensus that "CDPs are lesser entities."  I'm 
suggesting we go ahead and delete them as noise (except in truly useful 
circumstances absent any "better" data, as in Alaska).  Superseding them with 
better data:  I'm all for that where we can do so.

SteveA
California
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Re: [Diversity-talk] Code of Conduct & Moderation for this list

[Rory McCann]

Hi all,

I have put the GF one as a draft on the OSM wiki:

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Diversity/MailingList/CodeOfConduct

Feel free to edit it as appropriate. At some point I'll go through and
add the suggestions.

On 28/02/18 15:27, Blake Girardot wrote:
> From my perspective, and I am not sure why it is left out of 
> geekfeminism's policy is that item one under "Harassment includes" 
> should list "national origin, cultural affiliation" to address the
> issue of people making offensive comments about people from
> particular countries or cultures.

Agreed. "national origin" has been included in anti-racism laws in the
UK since the 1960s.

> We might even include something like "OpenStreetMap participation
> style" in that list so we do not have to tolerate disparaging remarks
> about remote mappers, craft mappers, newbie mappers or folks that
> participate through non-mapping contributions.

Broadly in favour. Ilya Zverik said:

> OpenStreetMap needs everything. More editors, more tutorials, more >
> rendering styles, more mappers, more software. Anyone has something
> to contribute, although most don’t know what to do.
http://blog.opencagedata.com/post/openstreetmap-interview-ilya-zverev-level0

Is there a chance a broad wording could be interpreted as "Don't
criticize reckless, bad faith, mapping *ever*"? 樂 I wouldn't want that.

> And I would change or add to the first line "Offensive or
> disparaging comments..." because "disparaging" or "derogatory" are
> open to much less debate than the very subjective "offensive". How
> many endless discussions will there be (or have their been) about
> what is offensive as opposed to the somewhat easier to identify,
> disparaging or derogatory comment.

Agreed. "offensive" is vague and can be used against marginalized people
(e.g. "LGBTQ rights are offensive my sincerely held religious beliefs").
Usually I use "harmful", but those work too.

On 01/03/18 19:13, Paul Norman wrote:
> A couple of issues I would consider if I were doing the selection
> again are readability and education or socioeconomic status.
Classism is a harmful thing, so I agree we should put that in.

Better readability makes it easier for non-native English speakers.


Rory

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Re: [Talk-it] sezione wiki per Protezione Civile . VVF - 118 ecc..

[liste DOT girarsi AT posteo DOT eu]

Il 01/03/2018 19:41, Alessandro Palmas ha scritto:
No no calma ... io parlavo di pagina wiki, vedi 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/CAI

non Yet Another Mailing List



Perdonami, sono troppo veloce alle volte, il pensiero sorpassa la 
ragione :)



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Re: [Talk-it] sezione wiki per Protezione Civile . VVF - 118 ecc..

[Alessandro Palmas]

Il 01/03/2018 19:31, liste DOT girarsi AT posteo DOT eu ha scritto:



propongo solo il titolo, visto comunque in emergenza/soccorso tutto fa 
protezione civile, propongo, "talk-it-protez-...@openstreetmap.org".





No no calma ... io parlavo di pagina wiki, vedi 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/CAI

non Yet Another Mailing List

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Re: [Talk-it] sezione wiki per Protezione Civile . VVF - 118 ecc..

[liste DOT girarsi AT posteo DOT eu]

Il 01/03/2018 18:54, Alessandro Palmas ha scritto:

Ciao lista,
ieri sera durante un giro veloce su http://welcome.openstreetmap.it/ ho notato
due nuovi utenti in zona Spoleto che mappavano aree di ricovero e zone simili
(es.: https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/564286135 ) ed ho inviato loro un
messaggio di saluto invitandoli a contattarmi (ma abbiamo il nostro uomo a
Spoleto ;-) che li conosce).
Penso sarebbe il caso aprire una pagina wiki per gli operatori del soccorso come
fu fatto a suo tempo col CAI https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/CAI così oltre
a raccogliere i tag a loro utili li si può indirizzare a quella pagina in modo
che la mappatura delle caratteristiche siano uniformi e non occorra fare il
lavoro due volte.

C'è qualcuno che ha voglia di farlo? Per il titolo da dare alla pagina mi terrei
sul generico senza nominare specificatamente un corpo o l'altro.

Discussione aperta ...

Alessandro Ale_Zena_IT




propongo solo il titolo, visto comunque in emergenza/soccorso tutto fa 
protezione civile, propongo, "talk-it-protez-...@openstreetmap.org".



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Re: [Talk-es] Importaciones catastro

[Joaquim]

Hola

Una vez preparado todo para crear un proyecto necesito permiso para 
poder crearlo en el  administrador de tareas. Mi usuario para 
importaciones es: puxan_importacions.


Ya pediré que alguien con más experiencia lo revise antes de publicarlo.

Gracias

Joaquim




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Re: [Diversity-talk] Code of Conduct & Moderation for this list

[Paul Norman]

On 2/28/2018 2:44 AM, Rory McCann wrote:

Hi all,

To follow up on the phone call, and waiting a little bit for people to
join. 

I think this list should have a Code of Conduct. I propose something
like Geek Feminism's one. Thoughts?

http://geekfeminism.wikia.com/wiki/Community_anti-harassment/Policy


I see nothing wrong with a mailing list deciding on rules for how they 
moderate themselves. Before setting rules, it's important to identify 
what behavior is an issue. With OpenStreetMap Carto's (osm-carto) Code 
of Conduct, I wanted to start with text that covered derailing topics, 
including by taking issues off-topic. osm-carto went with a CoC based on 
that of Go.[1]


The other codes of conduct that made my list for consideration were 
those from Debian, FreeBSD, Go, Joomla, Puppet, GNOME, Julia, and KDE. A 
downside to this list is that they're all software development related 
projects. OpenStreetMap Carto is similar to one[2], but OpenStreetMap 
isn't a software project. I would want to also consider what other 
non-software volunteer groups are doing. Some that kind to mine are 
cycling associations, ramblers, and other groups which OSM has a strong 
tie to.


A couple of issues I would consider if I were doing the selection again 
are readability and education or socioeconomic status. Readability is a 
big problem with many codes of conduct. The Go CoC comes with a score of 
11-13,[3] and I'd want 8-10 at most. This is better than the Geek 
Feminism one, which scores 13-15 and uses a lot of jargon.


For education and socioeconomic status, I can't say it any better than 
Richard Fairhurst did [4]:


Volunteer communities in general, and open source software in 
particular, can be unwelcoming places for people from poorer 
backgrounds or without a university/college education. Wealthy, 
educated people - which most open source contributors are - can easily 
dismiss contributions from such users through rhetorical skill, 
through sniping on grammar/spelling etc., and through belitting their 
concerns as not representative of the empowered, educated group.


Increasingly I have noticed that contributors from these [areas where 
residents have typically benefited from as good an education, and have 
less well-paying jobs] find it hard to articulate their views on the 
site without being shot down by the wealthier, more educated majority. 
This might take the form of the majority criticising minority 
contributors over minutiae (small sincerely-believed factual 
inaccuracies, grammar/spelling); or a deliberate unwillingness to 
tolerate assumptions that differ from the majority; or constructing 
means of engagement/consultation that are less open to those from 
poorer backgrounds (evening meetings arranged which are effectively 
closed to those unable to get childcare, etc.).


My open-source background is largely in the OpenStreetMap project 
where there has been a fair amount of academic research done into 
contributor biases (particularly, though not entirely, through the 
work of Professor Muki Haklay). The result of such bias is easy to 
visualise in OSM: wealthy areas such as London or San Francisco are 
mapped in much more detail than poorer areas such as the Welsh Valleys 
or the rural American Midwest. However, although the prevailing 
open-source narrative has led to a fair amount of (welcome) discussion 
as to how we can welcome and help those groups traditionally 
considered marginalised in technology, there has been little or no 
thought given to how we make ourselves more welcoming to poorer or 
less well educated people. Indeed, there are instances of where such 
contributors have received a hostile reception on the project's 
communication channels (mailing lists, on-site discussions).



[1]: The reporting mechanisms weren't suitable for a small project
[2]: It's style development, but we communicate over issues, pull 
requests, and similar means.
[3]: Sometimes called grade level, but that leads people to bad 
assumptions about what level of education is needed to understand a 
piece of text

[4]: https://github.com/ContributorCovenant/contributor_covenant/pull/491

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[Talk-it] sezione wiki per Protezione Civile . VVF - 118 ecc..

[Alessandro Palmas]

  
  
Ciao lista,
ieri sera durante un giro veloce su http://welcome.openstreetmap.it/
ho notato due nuovi utenti in zona Spoleto che mappavano aree di
ricovero e zone simili (es.:
https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/564286135 ) ed ho inviato loro un
messaggio di saluto invitandoli a contattarmi (ma abbiamo il nostro
uomo a Spoleto ;-) che li conosce).
Penso sarebbe il caso aprire una pagina wiki per gli operatori del
soccorso come fu fatto a suo tempo col CAI
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/CAI così oltre a raccogliere i
tag a loro utili li si può indirizzare a quella pagina in modo che
la mappatura delle caratteristiche siano uniformi e non occorra fare
il lavoro due volte.

C'è qualcuno che ha voglia di farlo? Per il titolo da dare alla
pagina mi terrei sul generico senza nominare specificatamente un
corpo o l'altro.

Discussione aperta ...

Alessandro Ale_Zena_IT
  


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[OSM-talk-fr] Projet du mois : toilettes accessibles

[PanierAvide]

Bonjour à tous,

Pour lancer ce mois de mars, nous vous proposons un projet du mois sur 
la thématique des toilettes accessibles !


Les toilettes sont des lieux de première nécessité, et leur recensement 
dans OSM a du sens. Bon nombre d'entre eux sont renseignés, mais on n'a 
pas forcément toujours l'information de leur accessibilité (notamment 
pour les personnes en fauteuil roulant). Or ce sont les personnes 
fragiles qui ont le plus besoin de cette donnée, donc autant qu'OSM soit 
une source de données de référence !


L'idée est donc d'ajouter les toilettes manquantes (que ce soit 
toilettes publiques ou dans des lieux types commerces, restaurants...) 
ou de décrire ceux existants en rajoutant des informations utiles. Il y 
a bien des façons de contribuer :


- Prendre une photo des toilettes et la mettre à dispo sur 
Mapillary/OpenStreetCam

- Ajouter une note sur la carte
- Ajouter les infos sur le terrain avec Wheelmap, Maps.me, MapContrib, 
Vespucci...
- Ajouter les infos de chez soi avec WheelMap, MapContrib, Osmose, ou 
n'importe quel éditeur


Toutes les infos du projet sont ici : 
https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/FR:Project_of_the_month/toilettes_accessibles


On compte sur vous pour relayer l'initiative, et pour recenser tous les 
toilettes de France et d'ailleurs ! :-)


Cordialement,

Adrien.

--
PanierAvide
Géomaticien & développeur


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Re: [Talk-ca] BC2020i Mapathon Event

[Jonathan Brown]

These tips are much appreciated. My apologies for the misinformation about your 
involvement with the folks at the Taskar Centre. We have the call out for local 
OSM Task Manager volunteers and are hoping to recruit them asap. Fleming 
College has an excellent GIS program as does Trent University. We are also 
hoping for support from the Toronto OSM folks. 

Jonathan 
From: Clifford Snow
Sent: Thursday, March 1, 2018 11:52 AM
To: Jonathan Brown
Cc: James; Rob Halko; Brock Baker ; 
sarah.r...@durham.ca; Talk-CA OpenStreetMap
Subject: Re: [Talk-ca] BC2020i Mapathon Event


 
one impotant take away from past experiences is to tell them not to map the 
same element twice. For example, someone else maps it first, dont add it on top 
as well(duplicate item mapping)

Using a Tasking Manager solve most of the duplicate editing issues. The TM 
breaks the the area into grids or a polygon shape you provide. Each mapper 
checks out a section which is then locked to prevent others from editing at the 
same time. You do need to remind people that the lock expires after 2 hours. 
All they need to do is exit from the task then reselect it to restart the timer.

Clifford 




-- 
@osm_seattle
osm_seattle.snowandsnow.us
OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch

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Re: [Talk-it] itWikiCon 2018 a Como

[Dario Crespi]

Ho preparato una pagina (ancora informale) per raccogliere idee sul
programma. La trovate qui:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/ItWikiCon/2018/Programma

Scrivete pure le vostre idee di presentazioni, workshop o altro. Più in là
apriremo invece una call più strutturata, ma almeno intanto raccogliamo le
buone idee :-)

Dario

Il giorno 1 marzo 2018 18:06, Dario Crespi  ha
scritto:

> Beh, grazie a tutti. Effettivamente parlare di programma adesso è un po'
> presto, però prossimamente apriremo una pagina su meta per sondare gli
> interessi e le disponibilità a tenere presentazioni o workshop da parte
> della comunità. Nel frattempo, se volete e se vi sembra un'iniziativa
> meritevole, potete dare il vostro endorsement in fondo alla pagina di
> richiesta del grant: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Conference/
> Tremej/itWikiCon2018#Endorsements
>
> Vi aggiornerò su tutti gli sviluppi futuri.
>
> Dario
>
> Il giorno 1 marzo 2018 17:17, Marco Minghini 
> ha scritto:
>
>> Ciao Dario, e grazie per le info!
>>
>> L'anno scorso in programma c'era una sessione su OSM tenuta da Maurizio
>>> Napolitano (che ringrazio ancora) e sarebbe auspicabile avere qualcosa di
>>> ambito mapparo anche quest'anno. Magari una sessione sull'uso di JOSM,
>>> prevista l'anno scorso, ma poi trasformata in una panoramica base su OSM,
>>> visto che il pubblico aveva poca dimestichezza con lo strumento. Oppure
>>> qualcosa sull'integrazione di informazioni OSM/Wikimedia. O magari
>>> organizzare un mapping party (o simili) a Como in quell'occasione. Ma per
>>> parlare del programma c'è ancora tempo :-)
>>>
>>> Abitando a Como, mi rendo disponibile a coprire la parte di OSM secondo
>> le necessità!
>>
>> Marco
>>
>>
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Re: [Talk-de] Dt. Kartenstil: Rendern von historic=fort

[Sven Geggus]

Christoph Hormann  wrote:

> Das Symbol wird traditionell aber nicht als Einzel-Symbol verwendet, 
> sondern eingebettet in eine Systematik von verschiedenen Symbolen wie 
> Kirche (Kreuz statt Fahne), Turm (nur ein Strich) und Windmühle 
> (Diagonalkreuz).

Ich finde das originaldokument grade nicht mehr. Dort sind die von Dir
genannten Symbole nämlich bestimmt auch mit drin.

Gruss

Sven

-- 
If we want hardware to work to its full potential, we need to claim to
be a recent version of Windows. (Matthew Garrett)

/me is giggls@ircnet, http://sven.gegg.us/ on the Web

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Re: [Talk-it] itWikiCon 2018 a Como

[Dario Crespi]

Beh, grazie a tutti. Effettivamente parlare di programma adesso è un po'
presto, però prossimamente apriremo una pagina su meta per sondare gli
interessi e le disponibilità a tenere presentazioni o workshop da parte
della comunità. Nel frattempo, se volete e se vi sembra un'iniziativa
meritevole, potete dare il vostro endorsement in fondo alla pagina di
richiesta del grant:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Conference/Tremej/itWikiCon2018#Endorsements

Vi aggiornerò su tutti gli sviluppi futuri.

Dario

Il giorno 1 marzo 2018 17:17, Marco Minghini 
ha scritto:

> Ciao Dario, e grazie per le info!
>
> L'anno scorso in programma c'era una sessione su OSM tenuta da Maurizio
>> Napolitano (che ringrazio ancora) e sarebbe auspicabile avere qualcosa di
>> ambito mapparo anche quest'anno. Magari una sessione sull'uso di JOSM,
>> prevista l'anno scorso, ma poi trasformata in una panoramica base su OSM,
>> visto che il pubblico aveva poca dimestichezza con lo strumento. Oppure
>> qualcosa sull'integrazione di informazioni OSM/Wikimedia. O magari
>> organizzare un mapping party (o simili) a Como in quell'occasione. Ma per
>> parlare del programma c'è ancora tempo :-)
>>
>> Abitando a Como, mi rendo disponibile a coprire la parte di OSM secondo
> le necessità!
>
> Marco
>
>
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Re: [Talk-ca] BC2020i Mapathon Event

[Clifford Snow]

>
>
>
>
> one impotant take away from past experiences is to tell them not to map
> the same element twice. For example, someone else maps it first, dont add
> it on top as well(duplicate item mapping)
>

Using a Tasking Manager solve most of the duplicate editing issues. The TM
breaks the the area into grids or a polygon shape you provide. Each mapper
checks out a section which is then locked to prevent others from editing at
the same time. You do need to remind people that the lock expires after 2
hours. All they need to do is exit from the task then reselect it to
restart the timer.

Clifford



-- 
@osm_seattle
osm_seattle.snowandsnow.us
OpenStreetMap: Maps with a human touch
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Re: [Talk-it] itWikiCon 2018 a Como

[Marco Minghini]

Ciao Dario, e grazie per le info!

L'anno scorso in programma c'era una sessione su OSM tenuta da Maurizio
> Napolitano (che ringrazio ancora) e sarebbe auspicabile avere qualcosa di
> ambito mapparo anche quest'anno. Magari una sessione sull'uso di JOSM,
> prevista l'anno scorso, ma poi trasformata in una panoramica base su OSM,
> visto che il pubblico aveva poca dimestichezza con lo strumento. Oppure
> qualcosa sull'integrazione di informazioni OSM/Wikimedia. O magari
> organizzare un mapping party (o simili) a Como in quell'occasione. Ma per
> parlare del programma c'è ancora tempo :-)
>
> Abitando a Como, mi rendo disponibile a coprire la parte di OSM secondo le
necessità!

Marco
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Re: [Talk-it] itWikiCon 2018 a Como

[Alessandro]

Il 01/03/2018 11:45, Dario Crespi ha scritto:

Ciao a tutti,

anche se questa lista è per OpenStreetMap, vi segnalo ugualmente che il 
gruppo impegnato ad organizzare la prossima itWikiCon a Como (novembre 
2018) ha pressoché ultimato la richiesta di conference grant a WMF 
(mancano alcuni dettagli minori che inseriremo tra oggi e domani).


Ciao Dario, ciao lista,

da qui a novembre c'è ancora un pò di tempo. Quest'anno vorrei 
partecipare (l'anno scorso durate itWikiCon eravamo in Calabria) anche 
per saldare maggiormente i legami con i vari progetti WM.


Alessandro

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[Talk-ca] Building_Canada_2020

[john whelan]

The wiki talks about grand ideas.

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/WikiProject_Canada/Building_Canada_2020

But what it doesn't do is give examples of how to enrich the building
outlines.

When I spoke to Stats Canada it was the enrichment that was the most
valuable  How many churches are there?  How many apartment buildings?  How
many levels (floors)?  How many care homes etc.  WiFi available?  Website?

I'd think in terms of streetcomplete an android app for filling a lot of
these gaps but there are other software packages around such as Vespucci on
android, iD on whatever iD runs on.  JOSM but you need someone present who
knows it.  It is excpetionally useful for accurately drawing building
outlines though.

I don't know what school students at various grades are capable of.

I think the wiki page would be more useful if it listed what enriching
details would be useful and how to tag them.

I would suspect that printing out a map with the buildings on it so notes
could be made in the field might be useful.

Thoughts?

Anyone with some expertise about what works for a mapathon with students?

Thanks John
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Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[Frederik Ramm]

Hi,

On 01.03.2018 16:00, john whelan wrote:
> These are all things that can be added with tools such as street
> complete.  Because you are adding tags to enrich the existing data you
> are unlikely to to draw a building in the wrong place.
> 
> I'd go after enriching the existing data first before thinking of
> importing more buildings.

My thinking here would be: 90% of the value of what you produce will be
in the surveyed stuff - as John said, number of levels, type of building
etc.; what he didn't mention but what certainly could also be
interesting to some is the 3D modeling tags like roof shape information
which will make the building look nicer on 3D maps.

If 90% of the value is in the "handmade" stuff anyway, why even depend
on an import for the remaining 10% - isn't there aerial imagery from
which you can trace the building? With proper tooling this is quick and
painless, and a student who has actually "drawn" the houses will feel
much more pride in the resulting map as one who has simply taken
existing data and uploaded it to OSM. One is a creative task, the other
just data mangling. I'm pretty sure students would warm more to the
creative task.

Best
Frederik

-- 
Frederik Ramm  ##  eMail frede...@remote.org  ##  N49°00'09" E008°23'33"

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Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[john whelan]

Looking at Brandon in OpenStreetMap many buildings are mapped but there
isn't much detail.

Stats was after things like the number of levels, house number, street
name, is the building commerical, residential, apartment.  There are some
70 or 80 different tags used for buildings in taginfo.  At the bit of
Brandon I looked at there were only two values used.  It was also after
amenties such as cafes etc.

These are all things that can be added with tools such as street complete.
Because you are adding tags to enrich the existing data you are unlikely to
to draw a building in the wrong place.

I'd go after enriching the existing data first before thinking of importing
more buildings.

Cheerio John

On 28 February 2018 at 10:31, keith hartley 
wrote:

> Hi OSM'ers
>
> I am working on adding buildings to OSM in Manitoba and have a few
> questions. I was just offered an updated building footprint and address
> shape file from the City of Brandon, and agreement that it can be used in
> OSM. I understand that the license needs to be compliant with the OSMs of
> course, and will email the licensing group. The City uses a open data
> license similar to Ottawa's (can be seen here
> http://opengov.brandon.ca/terms.aspx) I can get  written consent in an
> email if need be as well. Currently the buildings are from the Manitoba
> land initiative website (MLI) and I can see that the city of Brandon Data
> is much more accurate (in both attributes and position) I will review the
> current data. Is there anything else I should be doing before I upload
> this?
>
> The plan is to have high school students look at the map and using walking
> maps or equivalent data capture (android app) to find what is accessible
> for people with mobility issues around their schools. I'll write the
> results on a wiki to show our successes. Anyone else have good ideas how to
> get students to add to the map? (with teacher oversight of course!)
>
> Cheers,
> Keith
>
>
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Re: [Talk-es] Importación de Catastro. Posible conflicto en vías con dos nombres al importar direcciones con CatAtom2Osm

[Javier Sánchez Portero]

Hola

Con el programa no debería dar problema ya que busca el nombre más parecido
y en este caso no se parecen en nada.

En general, creo que ese nombre no debería estar en la ciclo-vía en
absoluto, solamente en la relación de ruta.

El 1 de marzo de 2018, 11:02, dcapillae  escribió:

> Hola,
>
> Estamos trabajando en la revisión del callejero de Málaga para publicar lo
> antes posible un proyecto de importación de edificios y direcciones. Me ha
> surgido una duda en calles que tienen dos vías «highway» trazadas a lo
> largo
> de la calle. En la calle Cruz del Molinillo, por ejemplo, existe una vía
> «highway» para la calle propiamente dicha, y una segunda vía
> «highway=cycleway» para un carril bici que discurre por encima de la acera,
> ambas  con nombre [1].
>
> Estos nombres de carriles bici no figuran en ningún sitio de la calle, son
> una denominación convencional que usa el Ayuntamiento para referirse a
> distintos tramos de carriles bici que discurren por la ciudad. En la calle
> no hay nada propiamente que los identifique, ni carteles, ni placas, ni
> nombres. Estas denominaciones sólo se pueden encontrar en la página web del
> Área de movilidad, y en Málaga nadie las usa. En todo caso, cuando quieres
> referirte a un tramo de carril bici lo designas por la calle donde esta:
> «el
> carril bici del Molinillo», por ejemplo.
>
> Me pregunto si a la hora de fusionar datos del Catastro y OSM estas vías
> con
> dos nombres puede ser un problema. ¿Existe el riesgo de que el programa
> tome
> el nombre del carril bici por el nombre de la calle al poner las
> direcciones
> en los portales? Si es así, entiendo que sería mejor quitar la etiqueta
> «name=*» de los carriles bici, o sustituirla quizás por «loc_name=*» o
> alguna otra. En otras ocasiones ya han dado problemas estos carriles bici
> con nombre a lo largo de la calle, personas que ven el nombre del carril
> bici en el mapa y piensan que se refiere a la calle, y crean una nota
> informando de que está mal el callejero [2].
>
> Lo que más me interesa en este momento es saber si el nombre del carril
> bici
> etiquetado junto al nombre de la calle puede suponer un conflicto para
> CatAtom2Osm a la hora de importar direcciones, no vaya a ser que le
> pongamos
> a los edificios la dirección a partir del nombre de un carril bici.
>
> [1] https://osm.org/go/b7CnzX6HI?m=
> [2] https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/1201559
>
>
>
> -
> Daniel Capilla
> OSM user: dcapillae
> --
> Sent from: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/Spain-f5409873.html
>
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Re: [Talk-ca] BC2020i Mapathon Event

[Jonathan Brown]

Got it. Thanks, James. On another note, we are still looking for 8-10 
facilitators for our March 29 mapathon in Durham Region. I approached the 
Toronto OSM and will follow-up with them at their next Meetup on Monday. I also 
let the Peterborough chapter of GoGeomatics. The challenge is that the colleges 
had a lengthy strike in the fall and have no time to participate in 
extra-curricular activities this year. 

Jonathan 

From: James
Sent: Thursday, March 1, 2018 5:36 AM
To: Jonathan Brown
Cc: Talk-CA OpenStreetMap; Rob Halko; Sterling Quinn
Subject: Re: [Talk-ca] BC2020i Mapathon Event

one impotant take away from past experiences is to tell them not to map the 
same element twice. For example, someone else maps it first, dont add it on top 
as well(duplicate item mapping)

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Re: [Talk-ca] Manitoba buildings, addresses and high school work

[Stewart C. Russell]

On 2018-02-28 11:59 AM, James wrote:
> Before Scruss comes out and says it:

… thanks, James! Been busy with the new job.

> After license is approved …

I'm not a lawyer, but the Brandon licence looks especially troublesome.
It's not based on any other licence I've seen. Most worryingly, it
requires that the person using/importing the data on behalf of a legal
entity has the capacity to legally bind that entity.

In short, it means that if we import the Brandon data, we agree that we
have the legal capacity to respond to anything that Brandon could choose
to throw at us. Not one of us has that.

 Stewart

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Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )

[majka]

Nová data už jsou, bohužel se starými chybami.

2018-03-01 11:01 GMT+01:00 Marián Kyral :

> A taky je nový měsíc, budou nová data, příležitost vyzkoušet  ;-)
>
>
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Re: [Talk-de] Dt. Kartenstil: Rendern von historic=fort

[Christoph Hormann]

On Thursday 01 March 2018, Stefan Keller wrote:
> Betreffend abstrakter und bildlich/ikonischer Symbole sind m.E. die
> Würfel im OSM Carto-Stil bereits zugunsten "bildlich/ikonisch"
> gefallen. Darum mein exemplarischer Hinweis auf Museum.

Die meisten der Symbole im Standardstil - insbesondere für 
amenities/shops - sind nicht bildlich in der Form, dass sie das Objekt 
für das sie stehen symbolisch abbilden, sondern sie illustrieren einen 
bestimmten Aspekt des jeweiligen Objektes.

Es gibt da keinen durchgehenden Plan dahinter, wohin die Entwicklung 
geht bestimmen diejenigen, die jeweils die Änderungen vornehmen.  Viele 
der derzeitigen Aspekte illustrierenden Symbole gehen auf die Arbeit 
von Michael Glanznig zurück.  Jüngere Änderungen von anderen 
Entwicklern sind häufig Versuche mit abstrakten Symbolen oder 
bildlichen Darstellungen des jeweiligen Objektes selbst - oft mit recht 
bescheidenen Ergebnissen (Beipiele: tourism=artwork, 
amenity=ferry_terminal)

Symbol-Design ist letztendlich halt eine enorm schwierige Aufgabe.

-- 
Christoph Hormann
http://www.imagico.de/

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Re: [Talk-it] itWikiCon 2018 a Como

[Volker Schmidt]

Potrei organizzare una presentazione su Mapillary, seguito da una mapping
party OSM con Mapillary
Volker


Virus-free.
www.avast.com

<#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

2018-03-01 11:45 GMT+01:00 Dario Crespi :

> Ciao a tutti,
>
> anche se questa lista è per OpenStreetMap, vi segnalo ugualmente che il
> gruppo impegnato ad organizzare la prossima itWikiCon a Como (novembre
> 2018) ha pressoché ultimato la richiesta di conference grant a WMF (mancano
> alcuni dettagli minori che inseriremo tra oggi e domani).
>
> Chi è interessato può leggerla (in inglese) su Meta a questo link [1],
> lasciare dei commenti, eccetera. Per qualsiasi domanda, usate per favore la
> pagina di discussione della richiesta su meta (anche in italiano va
> benissimo).
>
> L'anno scorso in programma c'era una sessione su OSM tenuta da Maurizio
> Napolitano (che ringrazio ancora) e sarebbe auspicabile avere qualcosa di
> ambito mapparo anche quest'anno. Magari una sessione sull'uso di JOSM,
> prevista l'anno scorso, ma poi trasformata in una panoramica base su OSM,
> visto che il pubblico aveva poca dimestichezza con lo strumento. Oppure
> qualcosa sull'integrazione di informazioni OSM/Wikimedia. O magari
> organizzare un mapping party (o simili) a Como in quell'occasione. Ma per
> parlare del programma c'è ancora tempo :-)
>
> Buona giornata,
>
> Dario
>
> [1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Conference/Tremej/itWikiCon2018
>
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[Talk-lt] Darbas IT specialistams

[Giedrius Vaivilavičius]

Laba diena,

Ieškome IT specialisto-admino. Daugiau info čia 
http://www.vstt.lt/VI/index.php#a/2039

Trumpai kokie pagrindiniai darbai:
1. Pakurti serverį
2. Įdiegti duombazę (PostgreSQL su PostGIS)
3. Sukurti duombazę pagal parengtą užduotį (lentelių, užklausų, trigerių 
kūrimas), vartotojus su prisijungimais.
4. Prižiūrėti, kad viskas gerai veiktų.
5. Kiti smulkūs darbeliai tiek su hardware tiek su software. Šitų darbelių 
tikrai nedaug.


Darbas pilnu etatu, nuotoliniu būdu. Atlygis apie 1320 į rankas, dešimčiai metų.

Bendrai darbo tik pradžioje startuojant, vėliau tik profilaktinė priežiūra ir 
gedimų šalinimas.

Galimos kuro ir amortizacijos kompensacijos jei tektų važiuoti.

-- 
Giedrius Vaivilavičius 

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Re: [Talk-gb-westmidlands] March Meeting

[Andy Robinson]

Suggest we strike it this month.

 

Cheers

Andy

 

From: Rob Nickerson [mailto:rob.j.nicker...@gmail.com] 
Sent: 01 March 2018 08:35
To: Ian Caldwell
Cc: talk-gb-westmidlands
Subject: Re: [Talk-gb-westmidlands] March Meeting

 

I'm stuck in Glasgow so won't be there either.

 

Rob

 

On 1 Mar 2018 7:03 a.m., "Ian Caldwell"  > wrote:

Given the forecast, I will not be there tonight.

Ian

 

On 21 Feb 2018 9:32 a.m., "Ian Caldwell"  > wrote:

I am hoping  to make it. 


Ian

 

On 20 February 2018 at 18:00, Rob Nickerson  wrote:

Enjoy.

 

I'm looking free at the moment. Anyone else able to make it?

 

Rob

 

On 20 Feb 2018 1:37 p.m., "Brian Prangle"  wrote:

Hi all

I shan't be at this meeting - I'll be in Scotland

Rgds

Brian

 

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Re: [Talk-de] Dt. Kartenstil: Rendern von historic=fort

[Stefan Keller]

Am 1. März 2018 um 11:46 schrieb Christoph Hormann :
> Zu den Vor- und Nachteilen abstrakter und weniger abstrakter Symbole
> lassen sich viele Argumente finden.  Bei internationalen Karten muss
> man aber bei nicht abstrakten Symbolen für von Menschen gemachte Dinge
> immer im Auge behalten, dass das was in einem Teil der Welt ein

Ganz einverstanden mit beiden Hinweisen.
Betreffend letzterem denke ich konkret z.B. an japanische Burgen, die
tatsächlich sichtliche architektonische Unterschiede haben zu
europäischen.
Betreffend abstrakter und bildlich/ikonischer Symbole sind m.E. die
Würfel im OSM Carto-Stil bereits zugunsten "bildlich/ikonisch"
gefallen. Darum mein exemplarischer Hinweis auf Museum.

:Stefan


Am 1. März 2018 um 11:46 schrieb Christoph Hormann :
> On Thursday 01 March 2018, Sven Geggus wrote:
>>
>> Es sind genau die Symbole, die auch schon im alten Shell Atlas (an
>> den der dt. Stil angelehnt ist) für Burgen und Schlösser verwendet
>> wurden.
>>
>> Das ist sowas ähnliches wie ein Standard in dt. Karten. Eventuell
>> tatsächlich rein deutsch wie auch die Symbole für Laub und Nadelwald.
>
> Das Symbol wird traditionell aber nicht als Einzel-Symbol verwendet,
> sondern eingebettet in eine Systematik von verschiedenen Symbolen wie
> Kirche (Kreuz statt Fahne), Turm (nur ein Strich) und Windmühle
> (Diagonalkreuz).
>
> Ich denk mal (aber das ist Spekulation) dass diese Symbole ihren
> Ursprung in der Funktion derartiger Bauwerke als trigonometrische
> Hochpunkte haben.
>
> Zu den Vor- und Nachteilen abstrakter und weniger abstrakter Symbole
> lassen sich viele Argumente finden.  Bei internationalen Karten muss
> man aber bei nicht abstrakten Symbolen für von Menschen gemachte Dinge
> immer im Auge behalten, dass das was in einem Teil der Welt ein
> anschauliches repräsentatives Beispiel darstellt anderswo auf der Welt
> recht wenig intuitiv oder gar irreführend sein kann.
>
> --
> Christoph Hormann
> http://www.imagico.de/
>
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Re: [Talk-es] Importación de Catastro. Posible conflicto en vías con dos nombres al importar direcciones con CatAtom2Osm

[dcapillae]

Hola,

Estamos trabajando en la revisión del callejero de Málaga para publicar lo
antes posible un proyecto de importación de edificios y direcciones. Me ha
surgido una duda en calles que tienen dos vías «highway» trazadas a lo largo
de la calle. En la calle Cruz del Molinillo, por ejemplo, existe una vía
«highway» para la calle propiamente dicha, y una segunda vía
«highway=cycleway» para un carril bici que discurre por encima de la acera,
ambas  con nombre [1].

Estos nombres de carriles bici no figuran en ningún sitio de la calle, son
una denominación convencional que usa el Ayuntamiento para referirse a
distintos tramos de carriles bici que discurren por la ciudad. En la calle
no hay nada propiamente que los identifique, ni carteles, ni placas, ni
nombres. Estas denominaciones sólo se pueden encontrar en la página web del
Área de movilidad, y en Málaga nadie las usa. En todo caso, cuando quieres
referirte a un tramo de carril bici lo designas por la calle donde esta: «el
carril bici del Molinillo», por ejemplo.

Me pregunto si a la hora de fusionar datos del Catastro y OSM estas vías con
dos nombres puede ser un problema. ¿Existe el riesgo de que el programa tome
el nombre del carril bici por el nombre de la calle al poner las direcciones
en los portales? Si es así, entiendo que sería mejor quitar la etiqueta
«name=*» de los carriles bici, o sustituirla quizás por «loc_name=*» o
alguna otra. En otras ocasiones ya han dado problemas estos carriles bici
con nombre a lo largo de la calle, personas que ven el nombre del carril
bici en el mapa y piensan que se refiere a la calle, y crean una nota
informando de que está mal el callejero [2].

Lo que más me interesa en este momento es saber si el nombre del carril bici
etiquetado junto al nombre de la calle puede suponer un conflicto para
CatAtom2Osm a la hora de importar direcciones, no vaya a ser que le pongamos
a los edificios la dirección a partir del nombre de un carril bici.
 
[1] https://osm.org/go/b7CnzX6HI?m=
[2] https://www.openstreetmap.org/note/1201559



-
Daniel Capilla
OSM user: dcapillae 
--
Sent from: http://gis.19327.n8.nabble.com/Spain-f5409873.html

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Re: [Talk-de] Dt. Kartenstil: Rendern von historic=fort

[Christoph Hormann]

On Thursday 01 March 2018, Sven Geggus wrote:
>
> Es sind genau die Symbole, die auch schon im alten Shell Atlas (an
> den der dt. Stil angelehnt ist) für Burgen und Schlösser verwendet
> wurden.
>
> Das ist sowas ähnliches wie ein Standard in dt. Karten. Eventuell
> tatsächlich rein deutsch wie auch die Symbole für Laub und Nadelwald.

Das Symbol wird traditionell aber nicht als Einzel-Symbol verwendet, 
sondern eingebettet in eine Systematik von verschiedenen Symbolen wie 
Kirche (Kreuz statt Fahne), Turm (nur ein Strich) und Windmühle 
(Diagonalkreuz).

Ich denk mal (aber das ist Spekulation) dass diese Symbole ihren 
Ursprung in der Funktion derartiger Bauwerke als trigonometrische 
Hochpunkte haben.

Zu den Vor- und Nachteilen abstrakter und weniger abstrakter Symbole 
lassen sich viele Argumente finden.  Bei internationalen Karten muss 
man aber bei nicht abstrakten Symbolen für von Menschen gemachte Dinge 
immer im Auge behalten, dass das was in einem Teil der Welt ein 
anschauliches repräsentatives Beispiel darstellt anderswo auf der Welt 
recht wenig intuitiv oder gar irreführend sein kann.

-- 
Christoph Hormann
http://www.imagico.de/

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[Talk-it] itWikiCon 2018 a Como

[Dario Crespi]

Ciao a tutti,

anche se questa lista è per OpenStreetMap, vi segnalo ugualmente che il
gruppo impegnato ad organizzare la prossima itWikiCon a Como (novembre
2018) ha pressoché ultimato la richiesta di conference grant a WMF (mancano
alcuni dettagli minori che inseriremo tra oggi e domani).

Chi è interessato può leggerla (in inglese) su Meta a questo link [1],
lasciare dei commenti, eccetera. Per qualsiasi domanda, usate per favore la
pagina di discussione della richiesta su meta (anche in italiano va
benissimo).

L'anno scorso in programma c'era una sessione su OSM tenuta da Maurizio
Napolitano (che ringrazio ancora) e sarebbe auspicabile avere qualcosa di
ambito mapparo anche quest'anno. Magari una sessione sull'uso di JOSM,
prevista l'anno scorso, ma poi trasformata in una panoramica base su OSM,
visto che il pubblico aveva poca dimestichezza con lo strumento. Oppure
qualcosa sull'integrazione di informazioni OSM/Wikimedia. O magari
organizzare un mapping party (o simili) a Como in quell'occasione. Ma per
parlare del programma c'è ancora tempo :-)

Buona giornata,

Dario

[1] https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:Conference/Tremej/itWikiCon2018
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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Rpnpif]

Bonjour,

Le 28 février 2018, Francois Gouget a écrit :

> On Wed, 28 Feb 2018, Erwan Salomon wrote:
> 
> > celui qui fait le rendu c’est F4map
> > petit exemple de rendu un peu travaillé
> > http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.7361783=-3.4271357=19 
> > 
> > l’église, mais aussi 100m au sud la médiathèque  
> 
> Ah. Bien.
> 
> Mais c'est bizarre que pour un rendu en 3D ils ne prennent pas en compte 
> le relief. Parce que bon, Montmatre plat ça fait un peu bizarre. Et 
> comme ça semble utilisé pour l'immobilier le relief devrait quand même 
> avoir une importance, y compris pour l'ensoleillement (y en a qui sont 
> jamais contents ;-).
> 
> C'est quand même une super utilisation des données OpenStreetMap et ça 
> donne envie d'aller se promener avec StreetComplete pour renseigner 
> toutes les hauteurs de bâtiments et formes de toits.
> 
> Ça donne aussi envie d'acheter une caméra 360 pour mieux voir les 
> façades et pouvoir compter le nombre d'étages.
> 
> 

Un truc marrant : sur les zones en construction, les grues de chantier
sont animées et même leurs ombres (!), mais au prix d'une utilisation
très importante du CPU (AMD A4-5300), près de 100% (sous Firefox 58 et
Debian-Linux).

Ici par exemple :
http://demo.f4map.com/#lat=47.5994475=-0.8329988=19

-- 
Alain Rpnpif

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Re: [Talk-ca] BC2020i Mapathon Event

[James]

one impotant take away from past experiences is to tell them not to map the
same element twice. For example, someone else maps it first, dont add it on
top as well(duplicate item mapping)
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Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )

[Marián Kyral]

-- Původní e-mail --
Od: Marián Kyral 
Komu: OpenStreetMap Czech Republic 
Datum: 1. 3. 2018 10:55:35
Předmět: Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )
"

Uvidím, jak to bude s časem. Aktuálně experimentuji s oauth. Přihlašování už
funguje, tak teď ještě nějak dodělat možnost přidávat poznámky.

A taky je nový měsíc, budou nová data, příležitost vyzkoušet  ;-)
"



... příležitost vyzkoušet import   (tam mělo být :-) )





Marián
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[Talk-cz] Kvartální pivo v Ostravě

[Marián Kyral]

Ahoj,
někdo z Ostravy nebo okolí Ostravy kdo by měl zájem skočit na pivko a
probrat věci kolem OSM? Zatím jsme dva a chtělo by to ještě pár lidí. Vítán
je každý. Matador nebo nováček, společná témata se jistě najdou.

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Re: [Talk-de] Dt. Kartenstil: Rendern von historic=fort

[Sven Geggus]

Stefan Keller  wrote:

> Die Symbole zu Burg/Ruine im aktuellen deutschen Stil sind mir etwas
> zu abstrakt und darum schlecht(er) (wieder-)erkennbar.

Es sind genau die Symbole, die auch schon im alten Shell Atlas (an den der
dt. Stil angelehnt ist) für Burgen und Schlösser verwendet wurden.

Das ist sowas ähnliches wie ein Standard in dt. Karten. Eventuell
tatsächlich rein deutsch wie auch die Symbole für Laub und Nadelwald.

Sven

-- 
"Thinking of using NT for your critical apps?
  Isn't there enough suffering in the world?"
   (Advertisement of Sun Microsystems in Wall Street Journal)
/me is giggls@ircnet, http://sven.gegg.us/ on the Web

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Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )

[Marián Kyral]

Ahoj,
-- Původní e-mail --
Od: Jan Dudík 
Komu: OpenStreetMap Czech Republic 
Datum: 1. 3. 2018 9:26:29
Předmět: Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )
"
Nešlo by trochu upravit POI importer, aby schránky v popisu měly vidět,
pokud mají FIXME? (a případně, aby takové schránky nebyly automaticky
hotové)



V oblastech dosud nepolíbených Panorama či Streetview (http://osm.kyralovi.
cz/POI-Importer-testing/#map=15/49.7280/14.2551=CZECPbox
(http://osm.kyralovi.cz/POI-Importer-testing/#map=15/49.7280/14.2551=CZECPbox)
) tak označuji schránky, u kterých jsem se snažil odhadnout správnou polohu
(např. na základě poznámky) ale mohl jsem se i zmýlit




"



Teoreticky by to možné bylo, už jsem nad tím uvažoval.




Budu muset přidat nový filtr "tagNotExists" do (interní poznámka ) https://
github.com/POI-Importer/POI-Importer.github.io/blob/master/compareData.js  ;
-)




Uvidím, jak to bude s časem. Aktuálně experimentuji s oauth. Přihlašování už
funguje, tak teď ještě nějak dodělat možnost přidávat poznámky.

A taky je nový měsíc, budou nová data, příležitost vyzkoušet  ;-)




Marián




"










---
Ing. Jan Dudík
projekce dopravních staveb
tel. 777082195



Dne 27. února 2018 21:02 majka  napsal(a):
"
Já bych byla taky pro lifecycle prefix, jen si nejsem úplně jistá tím
disused. Pokud budeme slovíčkařit, mělo by to znamenat, že schránka je na
místě (rozeznatelná jako poštovní schránka), jen se k jejímu účelu
momentálně nepoužívá. Lepší ve jmenovaných případech by odpovídal málo
používaný prefix removed:



Na druhou stranu: vzhledem k očekávanému počtu výskytů specificky u schránek
je mi jedno, na čem se dohodneme :)



2018-02-27 11:41 GMT+01:00 Jan Martinec :
"
Ahoj, 



Jo, jsem pro lifecycle prefix, to dává smysl. Přetagovat zpátky to jde
vždycky :)


"




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"


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Re: [OSM-talk-ie] OSM IRL Annual General Meeting

[Ciarán Staunton]

Rory, yes... snow blinded . The sentence should read as:  "The DAC
structure is limiting in the scope of things the company may want to do
which is why DAC is not recommended."

On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 8:57 AM, Rory McCann  wrote:

> Hi Ciarán
>
> Good to get proper legal details. Good job. 
>
> On 28/02/18 22:18, Ciarán Staunton wrote:
>
>> The DAC structure is limiting in the scope of things the company may want
>> to do which is why CLG is not recommended.
>>
>
> Did you word this the right way? 
>
> The OpenStreetMap Foundation is a Company limited by guarantee as well. In
> the UK, OSMUK is a "Community Interest Company", but I think that's a new
> legal structure in the UK https://osmuk.org/become-member/
>
> It's great to see all of yous getting the ball rolling on this. 
>
> Rory
>
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Re: [Talk-cz] Kvartální pivo v Praze

[Jiří Sedláček]

Tak já bych se zase jednou stavil za cs Wiki, pokud nezapomenu, rád přijdu.

Je někde přehledně napsáno, kdy a kde se to koná (nějakej web, nějaký
fejsbůky, twitter)? Dozvídám se to vždy dost náhodně, jako nepravidelný
čtenář.

Dík.

J.

2018-02-28 21:50 GMT+01:00 Matej Lieskovský :

> Tak aktuálně jsme na Prahu zapsaní tři.
>
> Ostatní pražáci by se měli přestat vymlouvat.
>
> 2018-02-28 16:37 GMT+01:00 Mikoláš Štrajt :
>
>> Zdar,
>> na Twitteru jsem zahlédnul, že se příští středu (7.3.) koná kvartální
>> pivo.
>>
>> Zapsal jsem se do Prahy a mám dva dotazy:
>>
>> 1) chystá se do Prahy ještě někdo další?
>> 2) mám zarezervovat stůl?
>>
>> Navrhuji zajít do Restaurace Oáza přímo na Smíchovském nádraží.
>>
>> --
>> Mikoláš Štrajt / Severák
>>
>> ___
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>>
>>
>
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>


-- 
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---
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Simone Saviolo]

Il giorno 1 marzo 2018 10:25, Martin Koppenhoefer 
ha scritto:

> 2018-03-01 10:21 GMT+01:00 Simone Saviolo :
>
>> Forse (*forse*) si potrebbe fare in un Comune. Ma significa che una o due
>> persone devono verificare way per way che la mappatura si conformi a certe
>> linee guida (chi le stabilisce? A livello comunale magari due si possono
>> mettere d'accordo, già in una regione la vedo dura), che siano presenti
>> *tutti* gli elementi di un certo tipo (non puoi dire "abbiamo i limiti di
>> velocità" se poi mancano in alcune strade) e che i valori mappati siano
>> corretti.
>>
>
>
> si, e dovrebbero approvare qualsiasi modifica successiva in questo luogo,
> nonchè aggiornare tutto sempre secondo i cambiamenti del posto reale.
>

Pensavo più a "edizioni" periodiche, che fotografano la situazione in un
certo istante. Anche Wikipedia ha fatto così: quando hanno fatto il DVD
offline, hanno congelato la versione attuale (delle pagine che intendevano
pubblicare), l'hanno rifinita (mentre la versione online continuava ad
essere modificata) e l'hanno pubblicata.

Però ovviamente la "prossima edizione" deve rifare tutti i controlli. È
vero che si potrebbero analizzare i changeset invece dell'intero dataset,
ma è comunque un lavoro enorme.

Ciao,

Simone
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Martin Koppenhoefer]

2018-03-01 10:21 GMT+01:00 Simone Saviolo :

> Forse (*forse*) si potrebbe fare in un Comune. Ma significa che una o due
> persone devono verificare way per way che la mappatura si conformi a certe
> linee guida (chi le stabilisce? A livello comunale magari due si possono
> mettere d'accordo, già in una regione la vedo dura), che siano presenti
> *tutti* gli elementi di un certo tipo (non puoi dire "abbiamo i limiti di
> velocità" se poi mancano in alcune strade) e che i valori mappati siano
> corretti.
>


si, e dovrebbero approvare qualsiasi modifica successiva in questo luogo,
nonchè aggiornare tutto sempre secondo i cambiamenti del posto reale.

Ciao,
Martin
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Re: [Talk-it] risposta a dichiarazione uso di GoogleStreetView

[Simone Saviolo]

Il giorno 28 febbraio 2018 17:32, Alessandro Sarretta <
alessandro.sarre...@gmail.com> ha scritto:

> Ma sarebbe veramente irrealizzabile per dataset ad es a livello regionale
> tipo per il citato Friuli Venezia Giulia?
>
Forse (*forse*) si potrebbe fare in un Comune. Ma significa che una o due
persone devono verificare way per way che la mappatura si conformi a certe
linee guida (chi le stabilisce? A livello comunale magari due si possono
mettere d'accordo, già in una regione la vedo dura), che siano presenti
*tutti* gli elementi di un certo tipo (non puoi dire "abbiamo i limiti di
velocità" se poi mancano in alcune strade) e che i valori mappati siano
corretti.

Non basta dire "la guardo tutti i giorni, la uso, ogni settimana mappo
qualcosa di nuovo": una procedura di validazione è forse più onerosa del
lavoro di mappatura che ha portato a creare quella mappa negli anni.

Ciao,

Simone
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Re: [OSM-talk-ie] OSM IRL Annual General Meeting

[Rory McCann]

Hi Ciarán

Good to get proper legal details. Good job. 

On 28/02/18 22:18, Ciarán Staunton wrote:
The DAC structure is limiting in the scope of things the company may 
want to do which is why CLG is not recommended.


Did you word this the right way? 

The OpenStreetMap Foundation is a Company limited by guarantee as well. 
In the UK, OSMUK is a "Community Interest Company", but I think that's a 
new legal structure in the UK https://osmuk.org/become-member/


It's great to see all of yous getting the ball rolling on this. 

Rory

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Re: [OSM-talk-fr] opendata : les batis et leur hauteur à Paris

[Nicolas Bétheuil]

Merci beaucoup pour ces contributions fleuves mais on pourrait revenir sur
le sujet que j'avais proposé ?

Comment utiliser la donnée en opendata de la ville de paris (l'urbanisme)
pour renseigner les hauteurs des bâtiments ?

merci

Le 28 février 2018 à 23:08, Philippe Verdy  a écrit :

>
>
> Le 28 février 2018 à 22:17,  a écrit :
>
>> *Sur la carte Google du concurrent, lui n'apparaissait carrément pas sur
>> la carte. Il ne doit pas payer son obole.*
>>
> Le plus gros problème de Google c'est surtout sa politique tarifaire
> complètement hors de contrôle (puisque soumise en permanence à son système
> d'enchères à la hausse pour le placement). Ceux qui font le choix de Google
> au début s'en mordent les doigts ensuite: c'est une course sans fin pour
> payer plus, seulement pour être référencé.
>
> Le problème étant que les alternatives sont mal connues pour ceux qui
> cherchent avant tout sur Google. Cependant pour qu'un site se développe et
> puisse afficher une carte avec ses données, il doit pouvoir maîtriser ses
> coûts (la rentabilité peut être très longue et si le site est trop
> déficitaire, soit il ferme, soit c'est la boite qui coûle faute de clients
> et de référencement).
>
> Il faut donc développer une alternative stable : Switch2OSM n'est pas
> suffisant. Certes il propose une solution technique pour faire héberger à
> coût raisonnable et avec une qualité de service acceptable (Mapbox ou
> autre) mais il manque le référencement web (ce n'est pas vraiment la
> mission d'OSM).
>
> Mais les fournisseurs de cartographie basée sur OSM pourraient aider en
> fournissant une plateforme collaborative de référencement pour que Google
> ne soit pas le seul outil de recherche mais qu'on puisse trouver facilement
> cette autre plateforme collaborative (pas Google, ni Bing, ni Facebook non
> plus) à coût maîtrisé (donc sans système d'enchères à la hausse, juste la
> couverture des couts d'explotiation et une petite marge permettant les
> investissements et les mises à jour la maintenance, le renouvellement, la
> mise à niveau de la plateforme).
>
> Cette plateforme serait adaptée aux PME, commerces de proximité, services,
> associations, collectivités. Et je pense qu'à ce niveau on devrait avoir
> une incitation publique de l'Etat, dans l'esprit de l'Open Data (car ces
> oboles dues aux gros moteurs de recherche ou réseaux sociaux américains
> finissent par coûter cher au commerce extérieur français ou même européen,
> donc avec l'aval de l'UE si elle est accessible à tout le monde avec une
> politique tarifaire stable et maîtrisée).
>
> Cette plateforme aurait des prestataires commerciaux (exemple MapBox) à
> condition qu'ils adhèrent à la charte de maîtrise tarifaire et respectent
> des règles en terme de protection de vie privée (donc pas comme Maze par
> exemple qui envoie sans le dire des données privées, et cryptées en plus, à
> Facebook même pour les utilisateurs de Maze, filiale de Google, n'ayant
> aucun compte chez Facebook et sans même avoir approuvé cette collecte par
> Maze/Google au profit d'un tiers qui n'est ensuite engagé à rien du tout,
> donc peut aussi bien tout refournir sans condition à n'importe qui qui veut
> l'acheter ou s'en saisir directement aux USA).
>
> Il faut réinventer le concept collaboratif du "webring" : il n'a pas
> marché au début car c'était juste un échange de liens désordonnés sans
> aucun classement sur une thématique assez floue. Mais avec l'appui d'une
> cartographie libre, on peut avoir des échanges de liens plus pertinents. La
> carte libre serait donc un nouveau moteur de recherche, plus équitable,
> adaptée aux activités locales (publiques, associatives, commerciales).
> Cette(ces) plateforme(s) nationale(s) pourrai(en)t faire ensuite des émules
> dans d'autres pays européens et ailleurs, et Google serait obligé de
> la(les) référencer simplement car elle aurait de nombreux liens un peu
> partout dans les web nationaux ou dans les réseaux sociaux: il y aurait de
> la demande et elle serait mieux qualifiée que les liens postés par
> placement publicitaire payant et de coût croissant ne profitant qu'aux plus
> gros.
>
> Ce serait donc une solution pour plein d'artisans, d'agences immobilières
> sur le web. Elles auraient un appui technique. Elle paieraient un peu (un
> prix juste qui serait même plutôt orienté à la baisse grâce aux économies
> d'échelle). Elle pourrait apporter des subsides à OSM pour soutenir cet
> effort de cartographie libre: en payant un peu ce service, l'agence
> immobilière ou l'artisan contribuerait un peu aussi à OSM qui disposerait
> alors de capacité financière pour consolider sa propre plateforme et
> grandir doucement mais surement face aux GAFA (Uber inclus) qui veulent
> tout prendre et parasitent de plus en plus l'économie du monde entier et
> tuent les petites activités aux profit de grosses majors américaines qui ne
> font que créer des "produits dérivés" (comme la bourse) 

Re: [Talk-in] Kerala PWD: GIS Based Road Information System

[Sajjad Anwar]

Hey Naveen,

ORMA could work. I'm leading the project for Development Seed (
http://developmentseed.org/). Happy to hear out what you have in mind and
see if it works for your usecase. At the moment, it's pretty tied to what
we use in the Philippines and Vietnam. Want to drop me a line off-list?

Sajjad

On Thu, Mar 1, 2018 at 7:20 AM, Naveen Francis  wrote:

> I had talked with him, he is looking for some open system which can add
> new data (SH and MDRs ) from the field.
>
> Is open roads a good option?
> https://github.com/orma
> Anyone knows how good open roads?
>
> On 1 March 2018 at 07:13, Naveen Francis  wrote:
>
>> Hi all,
>>
>> Kerala PWD Executive Engineer Mr. Biju G R had developed GIS Based Road
>> Information System.
>> http://103.35.198.65:8085/kpwd.gis/
>>
>> The website has the following data:-
>> NH, SH and MDR data.
>> Proposed Hill and Coastal HIghway for Kerala.
>> Excellent Water bodies data.
>> Junctions, Main centers, Bridges data.
>>
>> He developed the new application himself
>> He can be contacted through eeit@kerala.gov.in.
>> His Number is 9746097407 <097460%2097407>
>>
>> Data was developed during KSTP 2007 and it was in cold storage past 11
>> years.
>> It was not published publicly.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Naveen Francis
>>
>
>
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Re: [Talk-gb-westmidlands] March Meeting

[Rob Nickerson]

I'm stuck in Glasgow so won't be there either.

Rob

On 1 Mar 2018 7:03 a.m., "Ian Caldwell" 
wrote:

> Given the forecast, I will not be there tonight.
>
> Ian
>
> On 21 Feb 2018 9:32 a.m., "Ian Caldwell" 
> wrote:
>
>> I am hoping  to make it.
>>
>> Ian
>>
>> On 20 February 2018 at 18:00, Rob Nickerson 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Enjoy.
>>>
>>> I'm looking free at the moment. Anyone else able to make it?
>>>
>>> Rob
>>>
>>> On 20 Feb 2018 1:37 p.m., "Brian Prangle" 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Hi all

 I shan't be at this meeting - I'll be in Scotland

 Rgds

 Brian

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Re: [OSM-talk-ie] OSM IRL Annual General Meeting

[Brian Hollinshead]

Thanks for getting the advice Ciaran

I agree hold the meeting first then form the company

Delay the meeting until March 24th. I look forward to it.

On Wed 28 Feb 2018 at 21:18, Ciarán Staunton 
wrote:

> Hi All
> I am sorry if this is a longer than usual message and I will try to be
> brief as there is a lot of ground to cover. And 3 questions at the end.
>
> I have secured (free of charge) the services of Robert Tallent of Synergy
> Group. He is a sound person, he has a lot of experience of non-profit and
> charity company formation, and provides advice on registration and
> compliance for a range of different clients but usually small and
> formative. His website is available if your websearch for his name with
> "Synergy".
>
> As regards the conversations I have had with Bob I gave him the following
> brief (which was what was agreed at the last):
> - Which structure will protect the members and directors against legally
> liability, and will share the limited liability equally?
> - Which structure will closely match the requirements of the Foundation to
> be non-for-profit?
> - Which structure will allow for the eventual registration as a charity
> (enabling donations)
> - Which structure might in the future enable seeking a grant or employing
> someone
>
> Bob has outlined to me that a Limited Partnership is a dangerous option
> unless the lead partner is also a salaried executive director. The optimal
> structure to satisfy all these is a *Company Limited by Guarantee (CLG)*.
> The CLG once registered can then later seek charitable status from the
> regulator, and is also free to apply for grants or other funds. The
> understanding of non-for-profit with CLGs is simply to monitor that profit
> seeking is not the main objective of the majority of activities, and that
> when profits arise there is a plan to re-invest them. The DAC structure is
> limiting in the scope of things the company may want to do which is why CLG
> is not recommended.
>
>
>1. What I would like to clear up before the AGM is whether the members
>of this mailing list wish the nominated group to proceed to form the
>company before the AGM, or post the AGM. It may shape how the meeting
> takes
>place.
>2. Also Bob Tallent cannot attend on the 10th March and I think it would
>be better to have him there to facilitate questions. His real value to
> us
>is advising on what we need to assemble on us. Would the members be ok
> if
>we postpone the AGM until the 24th? I have checked with Tadeusz and it
>appears that Tog is available on that date.
>3. Also, can those guys who were working on a constitution and memos and
>articles bring these to some advanced stage and propose them for the
> AGM?
>
> I'm sorry again for the long email. Please speak up on all three. I know
> you are all snowbound, so no excuses :)
>
> Ciarán
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Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )

[majka]

V POI-importeru jsou hotové, ve statistikách ne :)

2018-03-01 9:24 GMT+01:00 Jan Dudík :

> Nešlo by trochu upravit POI importer, aby schránky v popisu měly vidět,
> pokud mají FIXME? (a případně, aby takové schránky nebyly automaticky
> hotové)
>
>
>
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Re: [Talk-cz] Schránky - statistiky (aka progress meter ;) )

[Jan Dudík]

Nešlo by trochu upravit POI importer, aby schránky v popisu měly vidět,
pokud mají FIXME? (a případně, aby takové schránky nebyly automaticky
hotové)

V oblastech dosud nepolíbených Panorama či Streetview (
http://osm.kyralovi.cz/POI-Importer-testing/#map=15/49.
7280/14.2551=CZECPbox ) tak označuji schránky, u kterých jsem se
snažil odhadnout správnou polohu (např. na základě poznámky) ale mohl jsem
se i zmýlit


---
Ing. Jan Dudík
projekce dopravních staveb
tel. 777082195

Dne 27. února 2018 21:02 majka  napsal(a):

> Já bych byla taky pro lifecycle prefix, jen si nejsem úplně jistá tím
> disused. Pokud budeme slovíčkařit, mělo by to znamenat, že schránka je na
> místě (rozeznatelná jako poštovní schránka), jen se k jejímu účelu
> momentálně nepoužívá. Lepší ve jmenovaných případech by odpovídal málo
> používaný prefix removed:
>
> Na druhou stranu: vzhledem k očekávanému počtu výskytů specificky u
> schránek je mi jedno, na čem se dohodneme :)
>
> 2018-02-27 11:41 GMT+01:00 Jan Martinec :
>
>> Ahoj,
>>
>> Jo, jsem pro lifecycle prefix, to dává smysl. Přetagovat zpátky to jde
>> vždycky :)
>>
>>
>
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