Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

[Doug Langley]

this is something I've been pondering for the last 2 weeks after a 
conversation with onj
the Asterisk pbx uses a bounty system to get stuff done. So, basically 
you take donations for 3-9 months, then offer the money to developers to 
complete
the project. and the project that I invision is an open source product 
based on google maps that's multi plat form. pc, and winmo/symbian.  WX 
widgits

are availible for all our major platforms.

In theory this isnt hard to setup but I can smell the headaches from a 
thousand miles away.  People want donations back, people dont like the 
finished
product etc.  I'm not sure I want the project but It does leave me 
tempted to do it.


On 3/2/2010 8:40 AM, Brandon Hicks wrote:
block quote
That would be the best, and if I had the knowledge I'd do it or talk to 
them about it. Hopefully someone will, because Loadstone could be good 
if it just
streamlined the process of getting maps and POIs and got access to the 
better maps from Google.





Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.

Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

[Doug Langley]

Has anyone approached loadstone about adding the googlemaps/earth api's? 
street view and directions are availible in many countrys. you add the 
loadstone user POIS to the google maps api and poi's and you actually 
have something going.  google maps is the best source for free maps. if 
people dont want to pay mobile geo prices then implement google maps in 
to something like loadstone or build a completely open source cross 
platform app in either python or java and talk to the appropriate screen 
reader API's.



On 3/2/2010 8:27 AM, Brandon Hicks wrote:
Not to mention most of those people aren't in countries Vodaphone 
serve. So there's another lack of insentive. Now if you had 700 blinks 
who were going to break contracts with them over it they might think 
again but as it is that's not going to happen. Vodaphone have nothing 
to gain and everything to lose by doing something about this, but the 
blinks feel entitled. Instead of putting the tallent to work for 
Loadstone they're just bitching. Typical.


Brandon

Doug Langley wrote:
Also, the WFA concept of free life time upgrades also put a nail in 
its coffin.  Wheres the insentive for Vodaphone to develop a program 
which wont bring them any sort of positive cash flow? This is a gps 
program and it needs updated data on a regular basis and wheres the 
insentive for vodaphone to do *anything* that wont bring them at 
least the ability to break even? First and formost its about money 
and 777 blind people that signed a petition who arent obligated (by 
the license agreement) to ever give them another penny arent going to 
be insentive enough to do anything about it.



On 3/2/2010 7:03 AM, Doug Langley wrote:
I'm glad to see someone else with a brain. No one ever takes these 
internet petitions seriously. I signed it but only because it can 
only help more than hurt. That being said, if people spent as much 
time working on a new solution instead of trying to save an old 
dieing one we would probably all be better off.  This is vodaphone. 
they hear from more people in a single hour than they will in this 
hole petition.  And all this petition is doing is asking for a 
reason why. so we can spend 3 months getting 778 signatures so they 
can say, "because it didnt make business sense." Thank you for 
contacting vodaphone we hope we can service you in the future.


On 3/2/2010 6:57 AM, Amanda Rush wrote:

K this is a record. I was turned off by about the second line of this
guy's message. I totally get being angry about accessibility or the 
lack
thereof, but begging for signatures is like begging for charity. 
Neither
one works very well, and getting angry with the people you're 
trying to

get signatures/charity from isn't a good thing either. Also, IMO, (and
it's probably only my opinion, and we know what those are like, but 
this
is the crux of the entire accessibility fight), companies like this 
one
and every other one ignore these sorts of petitions because, even 
if every

single blind user were to call their bluff, we're not a big enough of
their market to matter as far as sales or whatever. And in the case 
of the
FS petition, we can all bitch and whine till we're out of breath, 
but the
fact is that 90% of their clientel is government contracts. So they 
can

pretty much do whatever, and the other AT companies will eventually go
along or go out of business, and so there's no real insentive for 
FS to do
anything positive. Note: I'm not a huge FS fan. At all. So I hope 
no one

takes this as rooting for them.

And wow, DJ Patty, haven't heard from you in *ages. I was wondering 
what

had happened to you. Good to see you're still around.

Amanda



-Original Message-
From: mai...@andrelouis.com [mailto:mai...@andrelouis.com] On 
Behalf Of Dj

Paddy
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 17:35
To: talk2
Subject: RE: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

Guys just displaying understandable anger over loss of access.

Barry

-Original Message-
From: mai...@andrelouis.com [mailto:mai...@andrelouis.com] On 
Behalf Of

Brandon Hicks
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:45 PM
To: talk2
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

Agreed. This message speaks of childish tantrums. Even the Freedom
Scientific petition didn't get much over a thousand signatures, if 
even
that. This one's not going to get much more. I thought about it 
until I

got to about the third line of the message.

Brandon

Stephen Clower wrote:

So... he wants more signatures, but the only way he feels he can get
them is to insult everybody? I won't sign now simply because of the
author's attitude, despite his good intentions.

Steve

On 3/1/2010 2:12 PM, Onj wrote:

I haven't seen a message on this list for months.  Why not let the
content of this message speak for itself?

From: Neil Barnfather - TalkNav
on Monday, March 01, 201

Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

[Doug Langley]

Also, the WFA concept of free life time upgrades also put a nail in its 
coffin.  Wheres the insentive for Vodaphone to develop a program which 
wont bring them any sort of positive cash flow? This is a gps program 
and it needs updated data on a regular basis and wheres the insentive 
for vodaphone to do *anything* that wont bring them at least the ability 
to break even? First and formost its about money and 777 blind people 
that signed a petition who arent obligated (by the license agreement) to 
ever give them another penny arent going to be insentive enough to do 
anything about it.



On 3/2/2010 7:03 AM, Doug Langley wrote:
I'm glad to see someone else with a brain. No one ever takes these 
internet petitions seriously. I signed it but only because it can only 
help more than hurt. That being said, if people spent as much time 
working on a new solution instead of trying to save an old dieing one 
we would probably all be better off.  This is vodaphone. they hear 
from more people in a single hour than they will in this hole 
petition.  And all this petition is doing is asking for a reason why. 
so we can spend 3 months getting 778 signatures so they can say, 
"because it didnt make business sense." Thank you for contacting 
vodaphone we hope we can service you in the future.


On 3/2/2010 6:57 AM, Amanda Rush wrote:

K this is a record. I was turned off by about the second line of this
guy's message. I totally get being angry about accessibility or the lack
thereof, but begging for signatures is like begging for charity. Neither
one works very well, and getting angry with the people you're trying to
get signatures/charity from isn't a good thing either. Also, IMO, (and
it's probably only my opinion, and we know what those are like, but this
is the crux of the entire accessibility fight), companies like this one
and every other one ignore these sorts of petitions because, even if 
every

single blind user were to call their bluff, we're not a big enough of
their market to matter as far as sales or whatever. And in the case 
of the
FS petition, we can all bitch and whine till we're out of breath, but 
the

fact is that 90% of their clientel is government contracts. So they can
pretty much do whatever, and the other AT companies will eventually go
along or go out of business, and so there's no real insentive for FS 
to do

anything positive. Note: I'm not a huge FS fan. At all. So I hope no one
takes this as rooting for them.

And wow, DJ Patty, haven't heard from you in *ages. I was wondering what
had happened to you. Good to see you're still around.

Amanda



-Original Message-
From: mai...@andrelouis.com [mailto:mai...@andrelouis.com] On Behalf 
Of Dj

Paddy
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 17:35
To: talk2
Subject: RE: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

Guys just displaying understandable anger over loss of access.

Barry

-Original Message-
From: mai...@andrelouis.com [mailto:mai...@andrelouis.com] On Behalf Of
Brandon Hicks
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:45 PM
To: talk2
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

Agreed. This message speaks of childish tantrums. Even the Freedom
Scientific petition didn't get much over a thousand signatures, if even
that. This one's not going to get much more. I thought about it until I
got to about the third line of the message.

Brandon

Stephen Clower wrote:

So... he wants more signatures, but the only way he feels he can get
them is to insult everybody? I won't sign now simply because of the
author's attitude, despite his good intentions.

Steve

On 3/1/2010 2:12 PM, Onj wrote:

I haven't seen a message on this list for months.  Why not let the
content of this message speak for itself?

From: Neil Barnfather - TalkNav
on Monday, March 01, 2010 6:02 PM


A quick note to all of you who have, and those who as of yet have
not signed
the WFA user protest site.

Before I start my message the link right here and now is
www.talknav.com/protest

Firstly, a note to all of you who have signed, thank you, but I have
to at
this stage say that it is way too few who have made this effort. We

are

nearing 700, yet for Vodafone to take this seriously we need

thousands.

To date we've not even got close to even the number of users of the
application signing, let alone additional support.

Can I especially ask those of you who either work with or for the
organizations that supposedly represent us as blind folk, yes you
lot, those
of you at the RNIB, CNIB, AFB, NFB, etc, etc, you lot really have
made me
rather upset and irritated.

To date I've posted two messages via each of your web-sites
informing you
all of our protest, has any one of you got back to me to ask for more
detail, have you mass mailed your members, have you lobbied in our
favour,
have you, no sir. Is this an outrage, is this a complete lack of
competence
when it come

Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

[Doug Langley]

I'm glad to see someone else with a brain. No one ever takes these 
internet petitions seriously. I signed it but only because it can only 
help more than hurt. That being said, if people spent as much time 
working on a new solution instead of trying to save an old dieing one we 
would probably all be better off.  This is vodaphone. they hear from 
more people in a single hour than they will in this hole petition.  And 
all this petition is doing is asking for a reason why. so we can spend 3 
months getting 778 signatures so they can say, "because it didnt make 
business sense." Thank you for contacting vodaphone we hope we can 
service you in the future.


On 3/2/2010 6:57 AM, Amanda Rush wrote:

K this is a record. I was turned off by about the second line of this
guy's message. I totally get being angry about accessibility or the lack
thereof, but begging for signatures is like begging for charity. Neither
one works very well, and getting angry with the people you're trying to
get signatures/charity from isn't a good thing either. Also, IMO, (and
it's probably only my opinion, and we know what those are like, but this
is the crux of the entire accessibility fight), companies like this one
and every other one ignore these sorts of petitions because, even if every
single blind user were to call their bluff, we're not a big enough of
their market to matter as far as sales or whatever. And in the case of the
FS petition, we can all bitch and whine till we're out of breath, but the
fact is that 90% of their clientel is government contracts. So they can
pretty much do whatever, and the other AT companies will eventually go
along or go out of business, and so there's no real insentive for FS to do
anything positive. Note: I'm not a huge FS fan. At all. So I hope no one
takes this as rooting for them.

And wow, DJ Patty, haven't heard from you in *ages. I was wondering what
had happened to you. Good to see you're still around.

Amanda



-Original Message-
From: mai...@andrelouis.com [mailto:mai...@andrelouis.com] On Behalf Of Dj
Paddy
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 17:35
To: talk2
Subject: RE: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

Guys just displaying understandable anger over loss of access.

Barry

-Original Message-
From: mai...@andrelouis.com [mailto:mai...@andrelouis.com] On Behalf Of
Brandon Hicks
Sent: Monday, March 01, 2010 8:45 PM
To: talk2
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

Agreed. This message speaks of childish tantrums. Even the Freedom
Scientific petition didn't get much over a thousand signatures, if even
that. This one's not going to get much more. I thought about it until I
got to about the third line of the message.

Brandon

Stephen Clower wrote:
   

So... he wants more signatures, but the only way he feels he can get
them is to insult everybody? I won't sign now simply because of the
author's attitude, despite his good intentions.

Steve

On 3/1/2010 2:12 PM, Onj wrote:
 

I haven't seen a message on this list for months.  Why not let the
content of this message speak for itself?

From: Neil Barnfather - TalkNav
on Monday, March 01, 2010 6:02 PM

   

A quick note to all of you who have, and those who as of yet have
not signed
the WFA user protest site.

Before I start my message the link right here and now is
www.talknav.com/protest

Firstly, a note to all of you who have signed, thank you, but I have
to at
this stage say that it is way too few who have made this effort. We
 

are
   

nearing 700, yet for Vodafone to take this seriously we need
 

thousands.
   

To date we've not even got close to even the number of users of the
application signing, let alone additional support.

Can I especially ask those of you who either work with or for the
organizations that supposedly represent us as blind folk, yes you
lot, those
of you at the RNIB, CNIB, AFB, NFB, etc, etc, you lot really have
made me
rather upset and irritated.

To date I've posted two messages via each of your web-sites
informing you
all of our protest, has any one of you got back to me to ask for more
detail, have you mass mailed your members, have you lobbied in our
favour,
have you, no sir. Is this an outrage, is this a complete lack of
competence
when it comes to supporting those who you claim to represent? This
individual thinks so. So if you represent, or have a contact at your
local
blind organization please forward this message, we, or certainly I,
am very,
very disappointed in you all.

As for those private individuals who have not yet signed, even if
you do not
own Access or a Symbian phone, your name should be on this list, the
list
says something about who we are and what we stand for as blind
folks, it
says that we will not lay down and be ignored whilst our tools to
freedom
and mobility are stolen from us. It says we have a voice and we are
prepared
to use it when necessary.

This protest is about more than just Wayfinder Access, it is a
symbo

Re: The Talk2 List Fw: [access] WFA User Protest

[Doug Langley]

and, symbian is changing the UI to a better GUI which is visually 
appealing and doesnt look like a dos app from 1996. Tthe problem with 
this new GUI is its very lacking in the accessibility department. and 
will probably take screen reader venders several years to redesign 
things to work with the new UI.


The s60 UI sucks and symbian knows it cant compete if they dont make it 
more visually apealing and more user friendly. They realize for example 
that it shouldnt take 12 taps/keystrokes just to create the email 
account on the phone.



On 3/1/2010 2:13 PM, Stephen Clower wrote:
It's open source, but to release it that way, Nokia had to remove a 
lot of closed-source components that are critical to the platform 
itself. If you compiled and installed what's on the internet right 
now, you'd end up with a brick.


Steve

On 3/1/2010 5:11 PM, shaun everiss wrote:

hmph.
thought symbian was opensource.
oh well what  exactly will we all use after all that goes away.
not that I care much there will probably be for the forseeable future 
old phones mine still works.
I suppose we will have to use all the broken windows and simlinux 
systems then.

android looks promising though the google nexus was a joke really was.
Its a pitty we can't just have a version of win7 or xp on a mobile.
Its a shame that the only phone that is mac is an iphone.
Would like to have hmm a mac powerphone imagine what cool things I 
would be able to do with that.

At 10:54 a.m. 2/03/2010, you wrote:
Given what's out there right now, it can't be done. Platforms are 
very, very different, and a lot of what products like Orca or NVDA 
need to operate aren't present on handsets. Android is based on 
Linux, by the way. A screen reader is in the works, and while it's 
not very useful now, it may be great given another year or two of 
development. Nokia is abandoning Simbian as we all know it in loo of 
a Linux/Simbian hybrid which is just as broken as Windows Phone 7 
will be


Steve


On 3/1/2010 4:51 PM, shaun everiss wrote:

hmph.
well I myself think simbian rocks.
win mobile, well from what I hear it crashes like no one's business.
On that note wander why  no one has designed something around a 
linux distro, ubuntu, maybe nvda and something else.

could probably work to.
and you could run linux apps on your mobile.
At 10:35 a.m. 2/03/2010, you wrote:

I suspect everyone on that list has already signed. He needs to 
get the word out through additional channels without trying to 
guilt trip the reader into signing it. Frankly though, I don't 
think there will be much luck. A telecomm company that has 
hundreds of thousands of customers doesn't care about a thousand 
blind people, no matter how angry they get. Just look at what 
Microsoft is doing to Windows Mobile; yanking the rug out from 
under everyone with no regards to keeping products like 
MobileSpeak functional. Why petition? Microsoft obviously doesn't 
give a flip, and neither do these guys.


As much as I like MobileSpeak and especially Mobile Geo, I'll be 
banking on the Android platform in a few years when both WM and 
Simbian are dead.


Steve


On 3/1/2010 3:39 PM, Onj wrote:

you're not head of a large blindy organisation, though.  And 
though I agree with your standpoint, to a point, if I ask you, 
will you sign instead?  I'm asking as someone who, unless 
Loadstone really decides to do something useful, will have no GPS 
undder his platform.  You have Mobile Geo and you are lucky for 
that, however it shall be a cold day in hell I switch to Windows 
smart.  Especially with all the incredibly um, interesting? 
changes they are trying to implement at this time.
So, ignoring that message, which to be fair the guy did have a 
point, he wasn't saying it to individuals but to large 
organisations, please sign it. I can't ask more than that really.


From: Stephen Clower
on Monday, March 01, 2010 7:20 PM


So... he wants more signatures, but the only way he feels he can 
get

them is to insult everybody? I won't sign now simply because of the
author's attitude, despite his good intentions.

Steve

On 3/1/2010 2:12 PM, Onj wrote:


I haven't seen a message on this list for months.  Why not let the
content of this message speak for itself?

From: Neil Barnfather - TalkNav
on Monday, March 01, 2010 6:02 PM


A quick note to all of you who have, and those who as of yet 
have not

signed
the WFA user protest site.

Before I start my message the link right here and now is
www.talknav.com/protest

Firstly, a note to all of you who have signed, thank you, but 
I have

to at
this stage say that it is way too few who have made this 
effort. We are
nearing 700, yet for Vodafone to take this seriously we need 
thousands.


To date we've not even got close to even the number of users 
of the

application signing, let alone additional support.

Can I especially ask those of you who either work with or for the
organizations that supposedly represent us as blind folk, yes you
lot, those
of y

Re: The Talk2 List FW: an expensive cookie recipe

[Doug Langley]

I tried that recipe, and if you dont like crunchy cookies dont make it. 
they always come out too crunchy for my liking


On 7/12/2009 4:58 PM, S. Nicole Campbell wrote:

I saw a snipes article claiming the same thing.
But in any case, have some awesome sounding cookies.


*From:* mai...@andrelouis.com [mailto:mai...@andrelouis.com] *On 
Behalf Of *Venison88a

*Sent:* Sunday, July 12, 2009 6:11 PM
*To:* talk2
*Subject:* Re: The Talk2 List FW: an expensive cookie recipe

Unfortunately, its an "urban legend", but the recipe is valid.


The store is featured in an urban legend involving a supposed recipe 
for its popular chocolate chip cookie.[30] In the legend, a woman and 
her daughter enjoy a cookie while shopping at Neiman Marcus in Dallas, 
Texas, and ask for the recipe. The waiter informs her there will be a 
"two-fifty" charge, which the woman interprets as a modest $2.50. Upon 
receiving her VISA statement, she is shocked to discover she has been 
charged $250.00 instead. In revenge, she photocopies the recipe and 
urges her friends to distribute it for free to everyone they know so 
that the store will make no further profit on its sale. Because the 
story typically was passed along as a photocopy, it falls in the 
legend subcategory of Xeroxlore.


Folklorists have pointed out three chief holes in the story:

* Prior to the emergence of the legend, the store did not have a 
chocolate chip cookie;[31]
* A similar story has been around since the 1940s, originally 
involving a red velvet cake recipe from the Waldorf-Astoria Hotel. It 
wasn't until the 1980s that the story's focus shifted to cookies. The 
cookie version of the story originally was attached to Mrs. Fields 
cookies, causing that company eventually to post disavowals of the 
notices at all its stores.


Although the story is untrue, Neiman Marcus nonetheless published the 
cookie recipe to quell rumors. It was perfected in 1995 by Kevin 
Garvin and is featured on the company's website for free. It also is 
in the Neiman Marcus Cookbook (Clarkson Potter, $45) by Mr. Garvin and 
John Harrisson.




--- On *Sat, 7/11/09, S. Nicole Campbell //* 
wrote:



From: S. Nicole Campbell 
Subject: The Talk2 List FW: an expensive cookie recipe
To: "talk2" 
Date: Saturday, July 11, 2009, 11:23 PM



*From:* ravenia [mailto:rave...@charter.net]
*Sent:* Saturday, July 11, 2009 3:37 PM
*To:* Coco; Lorie Allen; prbrow...@charter.net; carmelo >; GF
Portable:; Mario; monique; Sharon Hales; Jenkins, Audrey
*Subject:* an expensive cookie recipe



   When decent people get screwed over, this is the result!

   A little background:
   Neiman-Marcus, if you don't know already, is a very expensive
store;
I.e., they sell your typical $8.00 T-shirt for
   $50.00.

   THIS IS A TRUE STORY !

   My daughter and I had just finished a salad at a Neiman-Marcus Cafe
In Dallas, and we decided to have a small dessert. Because both of
us are
such cookie lovers, we decided to try the 'Neiman-Marcus cookie..'
It was So
excellent that I asked if they would give me the recipe, and the
waitress
said with a small frown, 'I'm afraid not, but you can buy The
Recipe.' Well,
I asked how much, and
   she responded, ' Only two fifty - it's a Great deal!' I agreed to
that, and told her to just add it to my Tab.

   Thirty days later, I received my VISA statement, and the
Neiman-Marcus Charge was $285.00! I looked again, and I remembered
I had
only spent $9.95 for two salads and about $20.00 for a scarf.

   As I glanced at the bottom of the statement, it said, 'Cookie
Recipe-$250.00.' That was Outrageous! I called Neiman's Accounting
Department and told them the waitress said it was 'two-fifty',
which clearly
does not mean 'two hundred and fifty dollars' by any reasonable
interpretation of the phrase.

   Neiman-Marcus refused to budge. They would not refund my money
because, according to them, 'What the waitress told you is not our
problem.
You have already seen the Recipe. We absolutely will not refund
your money
at this point.'

   I explained to the Accounting Department lady the criminal statutes
which govern fraud in the State of Texas. I threatened to report
them to the
Better Business Bureau and the Texas Attorney General's office for
engaging
in fraud.

   I was basically told, 'Do what you want. Don't bother thinking of
how you can get even, and don't bother trying to get any of your money
Back.'

   I just said, "Okay, you folks got my $250, and now I'm going to
have
$250 worth of fun." I told her that I was going to see to it that
every
   Cookie Lover in the United States with an e-mail account

RE: The Talk2 List new facebook is a pile

[Doug Langley]

 > So, I'm going to ask the same question that many have asked around the
net;  anyone manage to get the old facebook back?
 
 
I havent bothered since I sort of like the new one.  The profile page is a
bit nasty and deleting apps is a huge pain but doable, but as for the news
feed I like that its more chronological, and that you can comment on stuff
now.  the comment system has been needed for a long time.
 
if you want something that's easier and quicker, you can go to
m.facebook.com in firefox, but you wont be able to access alot of the apps
from that page.

RE: The Talk2 List the snowman radio broadcast

[Doug Langley]

Were those only a half hour? I could have swarn they were much longer at the
time.

 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Patrick Perdue
Sent: Sunday, April 13, 2008 5:00 PM
To: talk2
Subject: The Talk2 List the snowman radio broadcast

Until someone tells us to stop, we're going to be broadcasting two episodes
of the Snowman Radio Broadcast every weekday from 2:00 PM to 3:00 PM EDT,
starting tomorrow, April 14.
Each episode is roughly 30 minutes long, thus, you get two of them per day.
However, too much of the Snowman at once is a bad, addictive thing, so we
are limiting this to one hour, rather than two or three.

. From the website:
The SnowMan Radio Broadcast is a conversational, satirical series of
programs, recorded between August 1999, and May 2001. People describe it as
being presented by a man with a smooth delivery, an unusually ironic sense
of humor, and a master's touch at audio production. But, what do they know.
Some things you hear here are true; some are not; and YOU will have to be
the judge of which is which. But, at any event, it's a great way to pass the
time.

As this was done before the era of podcasting, one episode of this program
was uploaded per week, and aired across a few internet radio stations in
Real Audio format. Fear not, however, because we won't be bringing you those
boring low-quality versions of the show. We've got better ones!

You may be asking yourself: "Who is this Snowman person, and why would I
want to listen to him?" Well, to answer your question, he's a strange
individual by the name of Jim Snowbarger, who hales from Marshaltown Iowa.
With many years of experience in both life in general, and audio production,
you will find out all sorts of things that you might never have discovered
otherwise.
I suppose that's not enough reason, though, unless you already know who this
person is, and what he's all about. If you don't, tune into tbrn every
weekday from 2:00 PM to 3:00 PM EDT, and you'll find out for yourself.

You can check out the Snowman's official website at www.snowmanradio.com.

To listen, point your media player of choice to any of the following:
Ogg, best quality: http://tbrn.net:/tbrn.ogg
mp3 128k: http://tbrn.net:/tbrn.mp3
48k mp3 (for really nice dial-up or use with mobile devices):
http://tbrn.net:/tbrn48.mp3
24k mp3 (there's probably still someone who needs it somewhere):
http://tbrn.net:/tbrn24.mp3
If you find yourself in a position where none of these streams work, or if
you're too lazy to install or configure a media player, fear not! We've got
a web player at http://www.tbrn.net/play. This will also work if you have
access to port 80, such as in the workplace or university where access is
restricted.

Have fun, and we hope to see you 'round.




Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.



Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.

RE: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain

[Doug Langley]

There was absolutely no editing going on. I kept all the words exactly as
written and in the same order.


 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mary
Ann
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 2:40 PM
To: talk2
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain

Oh god. Editing Words in e-mail now as well as editing what people say in
their innocently-stated shows on TBRN? What next?
- Original Message -
From: "Doug Langley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "talk2" 
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 5:34 PM
Subject: RE: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain


> With the wonders of message quoting we can make amy say the following:
>>In my musical opinion, he doesn't have much talent as a vocalist
>>  Ok, so lots of his stuff is pure cheese...
>
> I would just like to say that I couldn't agree more.  Good going, amy!
>
>
>
> Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
> http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
> has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.
>
> __ NOD32 2619 (20071026) Information __
>
> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
> http://www.eset.com
>
> 



Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.



Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.

RE: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain

[Doug Langley]

With the wonders of message quoting we can make amy say the following:
>In my musical opinion, he doesn't have much talent as a vocalist 
>  Ok, so lots of his stuff is pure cheese...

I would just like to say that I couldn't agree more.  Good going, amy!



Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.

RE: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain

[Doug Langley]

The only problem I see with a barry fest, is that the goal of any station,
online or not is to atract listeners.  I know, some people are concerned
with the quality of such listeners and well, if were going to be concerned
with listener quality, barry fans are either to old, or just young and
strange. Face it, if you like barry and your under 50, there's something
badly wrong, right?

In another 30 years, Josh groben will also be demoted to this status all
though some say he already is.
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amy
Billman
Sent: Friday, October 26, 2007 3:53 AM
To: talk2
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain

*laughing*

I couldn't have said it any better myself!

Cluck, cluck, cluck!

Oh--and Doug,
perhaps as punishment for your--hen-hater personality of late, we should set
up a Mani-marathon on TBRN.  I'm talking an extremely long Barry Manilow
music playing fest!  All Barry, all, the, time!
Before avid listeners begin grumbling, be quiet, or the hens" will peck at
you!
Listeners of Mary Ann's show and knowledge of Doug's hehheh  "liking" not,
for Barry Manilow will understand.
That'll teach ya to be a hen hater!

In closing, may I say:
Cluck, cluck to all, and have a clucking awesome day!
I'm getting the cluck out of here!



"Follow your bliss, and the universe will open doors where there were only
windows."
Joseph Campbell
Amy Billman
Email:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Messenger ID:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]


- Original Message - 
From: "Mary Ann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "talk2" 
Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 7:44 PM
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain


>I saw the following comment in my LiveJournal today. So take, this you 
>hen-make-funner-ofers!
>
> The following is a well-meaning and all-in-good-fun example of an Amy or 
> Mary Ann post.
>
> Aww, dat's so sad. hehhehhehhah. WOW! 
> hehhehhehhahhahahahahahahahahaahahahahahah! That's fantabalamalous! 
> hehhehhehhah!
>
> You two add a warmth and spirit that has re-invigorated the TBRN-o-verse. 
> We're all blessed to have your banterings. They make Kung Fu Docta smire 
> rong
> time.
>
>
> So shut the cluck up! Heheheheh.
>
> Amy? Anything to add or did that pretty much sum it up?
>
> - Original Message - 
> From: "Mary Ann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "talk2" 
> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 5:43 PM
> Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain
>
>
>> Patrick,
>>
>> Two things. First, I noticed you changed your quoty thing so it says, 
>> "Mary Ann," instead of "Mary." Aww. That makes me feel special. Thanks.
>>
>> Second, that is the only thing that has saved you from the wrath of one 
>> said hen.
>>
>> We, *cluck*, are, *cluck*, not, *cluck*, hens! *cluck*
>>
>> You're lucky I like ya. Hah!
>> - Original Message - 
>> From: "Patrick Perdue" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "talk2" 
>> Sent: Thursday, October 25, 2007 5:07 PM
>> Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain
>>
>>
>>> On 10/25/2007, 1:18:17 PM EDT, Mary Ann wrote in the dirt:
>>>
 I appreciate your speaking for me the words that I did not get to speak

 for myself.
>>>
>>> Let's setup an alias for this list:
>>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> now points to
>>> talk2@andrelouis.com
>>>
>>>
>>> -- -- 
>>> Patrick Perdue (MCP, CNA)
>>> KE4DYI
>>> Greensboro, NC
>>> website: http://www.pdaudio.net
>>> home: +1(336)698-4417
>>> Mobile phone and SMS: +1(336)509-5583
>>> e-mail and .net messenger: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> aim: noaptiva
>>>
>>> This message originally sent in reply to [EMAIL PROTECTED] on Thursday, 
>>> October 25, 2007 at 5:06 PM EST.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
>>> has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.
>>>
>>> __ NOD32 2617 (20071025) Information __
>>>
>>> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
>>> http://www.eset.com
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
>> has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.
>>
>> __ NOD32 2617 (20071025) Information __
>>
>> This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
>> http://www.eset.com
>>
>>
>
>
>
> Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
> http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
> has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again. 



Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.



Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.

RE: The Talk2 List Amy KeyChain

[Doug Langley]

>Let's setup an alias for this list:
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>now points to
>talk2@andrelouis.com

I'm so glad my little off air joke is going to stick around forever and ever
and ever.



Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
http://www.mail-archive.com/talk2%40andrelouis.com/
has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.

RE: The Talk2 List Sending test message.

[Doug Langley]

hens are not permitted on this list.
 
 
 

  _  

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Mary
Ann
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 12:33 PM
To: talk2
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Sending test message.



I'll cluck to that. 
 
Glad you're here, Amy. Yay.
 
Mary Ann
 
- Original Message - 
From: Amy Billman   
To: talk2   
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:27 PM
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Sending test message.

Yay!
Thanks, Mary Ann!
You, absolutely, rock!  You're awesome!
 
I'd try to do it but people's pc speech wouldn't do it justice because you
couldn't make the rhythms be in time or anything like that.
So no, for once in our lives, I really can't do it on command for you cuz
you want me to!  hahahahahahah
Oh, and Doug?  I'll take the whole "hen" comment as a total complement!  If
I have to be a part of a hen party, at least I get to hang out in company of
one of the more cooler people in the universe.
Besides, despite the whole calling us hens, we provide lots and lots of
amusement.  We can't be hens in email though, but if we could I'm sure we
would find a way!
 
Ok.  Back to work for me!
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is
invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, The Little Prince
Amy Billman
Email:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
 

 

- Original Message - 
From: Mary Ann   
To: talk2   
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 3:12 PM
Subject: Re: The Talk2 List Sending test message.


Look! It's an Amy!
 
Hey Amy, I dare you to try to sing that march via e-mail. I dare ya I dare
ya I dare ya.
 
Oh and Doug? Hens only come out on the phone and potentially on my show; not
in e-mail.
 
Amy, I do believe you're in. And it's only taken two months to get your spam
filter unmad at you wow!
 
Welcome to this strange world. Enjoy your stay? Hmm. 

- Original Message - 
From: Amy Billman   
To: talk2   
Sent: Wednesday, October 17, 2007 2:55 PM
Subject: The Talk2 List Sending test message.

Hello!
It would be awesome if some really nice soul would respond so that I know
that my attempts to stop the stupid spam filtering have worked.
 
Much appreciated!  *smiles*
"It is only with the heart that one can see rightly; what is essential is
invisible to the eye."
--Antoine de Saint-Exupéry, The Little Prince
Amy Billman
 
 
 
 


__ NOD32 2599 (20071017) Information __

This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
http://www.eset.com




__ NOD32 2599 (20071017) Information __

This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system.
http://www.eset.com

RE: The Talk2 List [Fwd: Re: [MSP] mobile speak questions]

[Doug Langley]

I think steve is feeling a bit angry tonight.
 

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
Stephen Clower
Sent: Monday, October 15, 2007 9:01 PM
To: talk2
Subject: The Talk2 List [Fwd: Re: [MSP] mobile speak questions]

This guy's an idiot!
- Steve

 Original Message 
Subject:Re: [MSP] mobile speak questions
Date:   Mon, 15 Oct 2007 22:59:36 -0500
From:   Stephen Clower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: MSP List <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
References: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>



hank smith wrote:
> hello I just got a motorola q from verizon am using 30 day trial of 
> mobile speak smart phone have 4 questions 1. this thing ios really 
> loud, how do I turn it down?
>   
With the volume controls in phone settings. If MobileSpeak, use the MS
control panel.

> 2. there a way to get keytones back eg hear the touch tone when I dial
numbers?
>   
Probably a bug with the Q. Check Google.

> 3. how much is smart phone odission,
>   
Look on the CodeFactory site.

 and are payment plans available?

Look on the CodeFactory site.

> 4. is there a keychart on the motorola q?
Yes. In the manual.

> if so where can I get it at?
In the manual.

> this phone is really different.
> Sure is. Google is your friend.

[Note: If you wish to post your reply to the list, use the "Reply All",
rather than the "Reply", option of your email client.]
___
msp_mailing list
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://list.codefactory.es/mailman/listinfo/codefactory.es.msp_mailing



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The Talk2 List FW: Wish I could take credit for this!

[Doug Langley]

 This is rather funny.

-Original Message-
From: Raquel Gomez [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
Sent: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 9:28 PM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Wish I could take credit for this!

THE EVOLUTION OF A PRODUCT:
STREAM, trickle, OR DRIP

Please regard this post as just one person's opinion.  It is not intended in
any way to disparage HumanWare as the fine company that it has the potential
to be.  But given recent events with this product named the "Stream", I
can't help but make comparisons to the drugs developed to treat a variety of
urinary problems.

Given the history of the this product - its anticipated climactic release,
and its constant adjustment timetable in order to meet anticipated
performance expectations, alogy may be all to accurate.

Perhaps, its the choice of the product name, which means steady and regular,
but whose current status as to its availability can only be described as
premature.  I'm not blaming HumanWare for this - all the blindness tech
companies have this "need" to just "get ux up" for the summer conventions,
regardless of the ultimate performance that follows.
Clearly, given the still unsatisfied and performance anxious customer base,
the company needs to consider changing the name of this product. 
The question for the day is whether it should be renamed the "Drip", or the
"Trickle", the state of affairs with this product having characteristics in
common with both alternatives.

A "drip" is a sporadic release, and that certainly has characterized this
product's history.  A "trickle" on the other hand usually is due to a forced
slow down in delivery, which can often be quite painful, again anticipating
pent up demand.  So I think that either name would suffice, but a new one
definitely has to be chosen.

Perhaps, what this product needs, rather than just fixing the part of a
defective headphone jack socket, is to borrow some products from the
pharmaceutical industry.  Maybe, FloMax just cure the problem of our newly
named Drip or Trickle and rescue it from its state of anticipation, finally
satiating the demand of customers.  I think that the FloMax family is
preferred to the Viagra product family as a possible help for production
problems, however, because viagra is only a thirty-six hour remedy, and our
supplier of the goods the problem that's going to reach almost three months
very soon.

All of this is meant to point out that what blindness tech companies do in
the name of product releases and upgrades needs to be compared to similar
situations with sighted companies making high tech products.  Perhaps
because the market is bigger and because there are more choices, the
behavior we experience as a blind consumer group seems to be far worse than
that which we would get from companies whose products have larger markets
and whose customers greater variety.  If you can't swim down one stream
because it is blocked or polv can always find another one.  Not so with
blind tech.  It's just something for the manufacturers of products for our
marketplace to ponder as they consider their own highly anticipated and well
delayed product climax.





Did you miss a message?  Well, don't.
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has it for you.  Never miss a Talk2 message again.

The Talk2 List good deal on iriver H10's

[Doug Langley]

For anyone on the list that is interested in a good deal on an mp3 player
which can have rockbox installed on it I just found a good deal on the 20
gig iriver H10's.  I know this port isn't as far along as the h100's h300's
and ipods are but I'm sure they will get it there in time.
 
http://www.woot.com
 
iRiver H10 20GB MP3 Player & Recorder - Remix Blue
$99.99+ $5 shipping
condition: Refurbished 
product(s): 1 iRiver H10 20GB MP3 Player/Recorder 

this deal is only good until midnight central time today sunday march 18 so
if your reading it later then your out of luck.
 

RE: The Talk2 List how do you stop miranda from giving up?

[Doug Langley]

I'm using an old plugin called alwaysonline.  It works well, I haven't
touched it in  a bit over 2 years now.
 
 

  _  

From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
derek Lane
Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 6:28 PM
To: talk2
Subject: The Talk2 List how do you stop miranda from giving up?


Every time their is a slight fluctuation in connectivity, I'm obviously
signed out of messengers.  I know some of you have your mirandas, or
whatever the ploral form is, to wordlessly keep trying to log back on.
I've looked through all of the options and can't find anything.
So question is, how is this done?