Re: [Texascavers] Related to reddit web service

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

What the hell is redit?

On Wed, Jan 17, 2018 at 5:38 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
>
> I decided to tinker with reddit today for the first time.   My quest to
> teach myself Linux has stagnated, and it appears there are quite a few
> Linux nerds on reddit, that might can maybe point me in the right
> direction.
>
> So while on reddit, I looked around and joined 2 of the caving pages:
>  r/caving and r/Speleology. Both of which have active post, but mostly
> second-hand articles that re-direct to another web source.
>
> I did not see any Texas caving activity on reddit, although some Austin
> caver appears to have experimented with it 2 years ago.
>
> If any of you are using reddit, what do you use it for ?
>
> My 2017 resolution to stay off the internet was a super epic failure.
>
> Seems unlikely I will succeed at that, or anything in 2018.
>
> My reddit handle is u/dlocklear01, but not sure what that means yet.
>
>
> On a different note,
>
> The link below shows some icicles I made in the grass by leaving the
> faucet dripping.
> ( This was our first hard-freeze in almost 15 years in Arcola, Texas.
>  Certainly the coldest. )
>
> https://www.dropbox.com/s/yocvodg43vpoird/Icicles.jpg?dl=0
>
>
> I got a question for you old-timers:
>
> I hit my elbow funny-bone very lightly last week.  I heard a odd crunching
> sound.  But no immediate pain.   The pain I have been experiencing is like
> the pain of a staph infection, but under the skin.  Is this something that
> heals on its own ?  The pain has been consistent for 8 days.  But I do not
> see any sign of injury, nor feel any bumps under the skin.
>
> As super clumsy as I am, I have never broken a bone, except stubbing my
> toes really bad several times.
>
>
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] NYE photos

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

So: Bockbeer what was all that? It made no sense at all. Perhaps we need
Brutus to join you in the forum to see what will become of Rome?


On Tue, Jan 2, 2018 at 6:44 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Here are some random photos from NYE. There is at least 4 T3xas cavers in
> the photos
>
> https://photos.app.goo.gl/d4wNtTyw2L6GIRvA2
>
> I am purposely being vague here, as I do not know if the people in these
> photos want the photos published.
>
> But somebody else was also taking photos and videos.
>
> Meaning, these photos are not approved by the host or GFB, etc. and should
> be erased upon viewing.
>
> I guess you have to have a Google account to view them ?
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Pelican cases

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

So, a Pelican Case. Do I have to go to the coast to catch one and then How
do I make it get in the Pelican case. and why do we need to carry around
Pelicans?

On Tue, Dec 26, 2017 at 3:34 PM, Lee H. Skinner via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Amazon Deal of the Day today is Pelican cases in case anyone is interested.
>
>
> https://is.gd/v5DKaH
>
>
> Regards,
>
> Lee
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Ammo can - Part 2

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Mine are all metal and old. 30 cal. I think. What calibre are you using in
your caves?


On Fri, Dec 22, 2017 at 5:17 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear,
>
> I shopped hard and analyzed each ammo can that I could find in stores, and
> the winner was the one shown below:
>
> Kobalt # 0666039
>
> For $ 9.98 ( $ 10.80 with tax in Texas )
>
> The other reasonable choices were the metal can, the olive-green
> heavy-duty plastic one ( sold at Northern Tool ), or the white or orange
> heavy-duty plastic ( sold in the marine section of Academy ).
>
> I had a fancy one already, (made of aluminum ), but did not see that in
> stores, and that was not what I was looking for this time.
>
> This one is strictly for road-trips, and will have all those small things
> you need on a road-trip, similar to a caver's pack.   In fact this ammo can
> is suitable for caving, where you need to protect something from dust and
> humidity.
>
> I expect this ammo can to last many years.  The plastic hinge on the lid
> should be the first thing to fail.
>
> This ammo can will eventually get covered in Gorilla duct-tape and then
> some caving stickers.
>
> Cheers
>
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Re: [Texascavers] The Elf

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

He is too portly.


On Thu, Dec 21, 2017 at 12:01 PM, Dwight via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I don't think David would look very good in a diminutive little green elf
> suit . Though it is an interesting vision.
>
> Dirtdoc
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] 2017 related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Youse may not know it but I actually have broken bread and shared wine with
Bockbeer. The bread was not his body and wine wasn't his blood... Xmas BS
here... but... Oh crap it was not bread but a tortilla and the wine was
tequila. GEE..I pulled a Trump on you. Damn!


On Tue, Dec 12, 2017 at 1:42 PM, Geary Schindel via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Folks,
>
> I enjoy reading most posts by David and have come to admire him for his
> eccentric personality and heart felt writing. David has some time on his
> hands because of the nature of his work. This allows him to explore topics
> and ponder questions many of us never think about. David is an important
> part of our caving community and deserves some respect.
>
> His posts reminds me of the monograph from Squire Lewis titled Chronicles
> of the Old Reading Grotto which was published some years ago. It is about a
> trip Squire and other cavers from Pennsylvania took to the 1968? NSS
> Convention in California. The book wasn't so much about caving, though they
> did some as they traveled to California and then back again by way of
> Mexico, Texas, TAG, etc. but more about the road less traveled and
> personifies what it meant to be a caver (and maybe still does).
>
> David is a kind and gentle soul and would do anything in his power to help
> you out if you needed it. He has no ill will towards anyone. He sometimes
> scrapes by in life and yet has one of the most positive attitudes of anyone
> I know.
>
> The internet is a big and sometimes ugly place. Some people hide behind
> their computer screens and write all kinds of nasty things about others,
> distortions and even outright lies, play passive aggressive games, and
> bully people. It can also be used to bridge cultural gaps, make friends
> you'll never meet, educate yourself or hide from society, and it lets you
> explore the world from your desktop.
>
> Charlie loves to tease David in a good natured way and I also enjoy his
> posts but others go out of their way to harass and even bully. Maybe a
> little more respect for others would be in order.
>
> Geary
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Texascavers [mailto:texascavers-boun...@texascavers.com] On Behalf
> Of JAMES JASEK via Texascavers
> Sent: Sunday, December 10, 2017 6:46 PM
> To: texascavers@texascavers.com
> Cc: JAMES JASEK 
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] 2017 related
>
> such crap
>
> > On Dec 10, 2017, at 5:49 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > This post is just an off-topic commentary, and probably is totally
> irrelevant, but I think some of it will affect caving in 2018 and beyond.
> >
> >
> >
> > 2017 is starting to look like 2016 - just a faded memory.
> >
> > There are just 21 days until the big New Year's Eve parties.  The NSS
> > is having one.  [  contact:  fennig...@gmail.com ]
> >
> > So it is almost time to reflect on the past 12 months, and ponder the
> future of 2018.
> >
> > Some of you may recall movies and books in the 1970s and 1980s about
> what 2018 would be like.   Some of us, are about to find out for ourselves,
> in person.
> >
> > https://images.gr-assets.com/books/1289962600l/4339742.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> > Do not believe the media.   There are things to look forward to in
> 2018.   The computer and tech world is rapidly changing.   Tiny computers
> called SBC's ( like the RaspberyPi ) are going to be a huge opportunity for
> the folks that are into that.  Linux on the desktop computer is going to
> more user-friendly and work on more hardware.  [  I am working on a blog
> about that:
> >
> >
> > http://david-locklear.blogspot.com/2017/12/linux-opinions.html?m=1.  ]
> >
> > Space companies are going to impress us with launches landings and
> videos.
> >
> > Sophia the Robot and her counterparts at Boston Dynamics  are going to
> do more fascinating stuff - probably baton-twirling while doing cartwheels,
> or tap-dancing with Fred Astaire moves, or moonwalking like Michael
> Jackson, or doing the splits while jiving like James Brown.
> >
> > Talking computers is going to be a big deal in 2018.
> >
> > The internet will continue to degrade with so many advertisments and
> censorship that it will be almost worthless.
> >
> > A million people will spend over $ 1,000 on their cell-phone plus
> accessories.
> >
> > Millions of people will waste money on a 4K tv in 2018.
> >
> > 2018 will be the end of 720p.
> >
> > Thousands of people are going to die un-naturally in The Middle East in
> 2018, but the same thing can be said of Texas just in car accidents.
> >
> > It is possible the first 100 feet of Trump's Wall will be built in 2018.
> I would favor a different approach, but my idea would be way too
> expensive.   My idea is an artificial wildlife refuge barrier that is
> off-limits to all humans.
> >
> > The self-driving car will be seen by more people in 2018, and many rich
> folks will get a brief chance to ride in one.
> >
> > Banks are 

Re: [Texascavers] 2017 related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

*Things to look forward to. David getting a sex robot to keep him occupied.
Maybe one that goes on imaginary caving trips and isn't estranged.*

*I've for one never had a beloved celebrity.*
*I do not care one wit about virtual reality. Real, reality is bad enough.*
*Video games are a waste of time. I do like the internet a lot but if it
dies and goes away my world won't collapse.*

*Let us look forward to more and bigger fires.*
*Let us look forward to more and bigger and better hurricanes.*
*Let us look forward to earthquakes.*
*Let us look forward to droughts.*
*Let us look forward to starvation.*
*Let us look forward to really big blizzards.*
*Let us look forward to **tornado and severe storms with flash flood.*
*Let us look forward to hundreds of extinctions of animals.*
*Let us look forward to dead oceans, killed by plastic trash.*
*Let us look forward to wars and terrorist attacks.*
*Let us look forward to a huge solar flare that destroys the grid.*
*Let us look forward to a pandemic.*
*Let us look forward to a nuclear attack and world War III*
*Let us look forward to the re-election of Donald Trump.*


*And my  1995 13 inch TV still works well as does my Mac G-4.. hell my 128K
still works.*
*Not a nickel for a cell phone from my house. I do not need any aps.*

*And how do you die unnaturally?*

*Anyway there are a lot of fun things to look forward to.*


On Sun, Dec 10, 2017 at 6:45 PM, JAMES JASEK via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> such crap
>
> > On Dec 10, 2017, at 5:49 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > This post is just an off-topic commentary, and probably is totally
> irrelevant, but I think some of it will affect caving in 2018 and beyond.
> >
> >
> >
> > 2017 is starting to look like 2016 - just a faded memory.
> >
> > There are just 21 days until the big New Year's Eve parties.  The NSS is
> having one.  [  contact:  fennig...@gmail.com ]
> >
> > So it is almost time to reflect on the past 12 months, and ponder the
> future of 2018.
> >
> > Some of you may recall movies and books in the 1970s and 1980s about
> what 2018 would be like.   Some of us, are about to find out for ourselves,
> in person.
> >
> > https://images.gr-assets.com/books/1289962600l/4339742.jpg
> >
> >
> >
> > Do not believe the media.   There are things to look forward to in
> 2018.   The computer and tech world is rapidly changing.   Tiny computers
> called SBC's ( like the RaspberyPi ) are going to be a huge opportunity for
> the folks that are into that.  Linux on the desktop computer is going to
> more user-friendly and work on more hardware.  [  I am working on a blog
> about that:
> >
> >  http://david-locklear.blogspot.com/2017/12/linux-opinions.html?m=1.
> ]
> >
> > Space companies are going to impress us with launches landings and
> videos.
> >
> > Sophia the Robot and her counterparts at Boston Dynamics  are going to
> do more fascinating stuff - probably baton-twirling while doing cartwheels,
> or tap-dancing with Fred Astaire moves, or moonwalking like Michael
> Jackson, or doing the splits while jiving like James Brown.
> >
> > Talking computers is going to be a big deal in 2018.
> >
> > The internet will continue to degrade with so many advertisments and
> censorship that it will be almost worthless.
> >
> > A million people will spend over $ 1,000 on their cell-phone plus
> accessories.
> >
> > Millions of people will waste money on a 4K tv in 2018.
> >
> > 2018 will be the end of 720p.
> >
> > Thousands of people are going to die un-naturally in The Middle East in
> 2018, but the same thing can be said of Texas just in car accidents.
> >
> > It is possible the first 100 feet of Trump's Wall will be built in 2018.
> I would favor a different approach, but my idea would be way too
> expensive.   My idea is an artificial wildlife refuge barrier that is
> off-limits to all humans.
> >
> > The self-driving car will be seen by more people in 2018, and many rich
> folks will get a brief chance to ride in one.
> >
> > Banks are going to fight for survival in 2018.  There will be far less
> human tellers, and none by 2020.
> >
> > Grocery stores will become more automated to.
> >
> > Hundreds of brick-n-mortar stores will close nationwide in 2018.
> >
> > Millions of people will make minimum wage working for on-line retail
> stores and doing home deliveries.
> >
> > Millions of young poeple will become obssesed with playing video games
> and social media on their gadgets.   Some of that will be exploring the new
> trends in Virtual Reality ( VR ).
> >
> > There will be sadness in 2018.  We may lose a close friend, and likely
> there will be a beloved celebrity pass away.  Probably not Dick Van Dyke.
> That guy will probably live to see 2025.
> >
> > I can only hope that I go in a fun cave in 2018, and make it to the TSA
> Spring Convention, the NSS Convention, TCR, and my quest to drive my
> Sequioa in the Sierra Madres and to see The Real Milky 

Re: [Texascavers] Interesting images

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Excellent!


On Fri, Dec 8, 2017 at 6:49 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
>
>
> It is my hope that by clicking on the link below you will find dozens of
> interesting images,
>
> and clicking on those images may lead to more interesting images.
>
> I do not know how to condense the link.  Sorry.
>
> This should pull up "Google Images" and have mostly cave related artwork,
> some vintage, maybe.
>
>
>
>
> https://www.google.com/search?safe=active=ms-android-
> metropcs-us=360=271=isch=1=hTErWvzjBpCwjwOj3qfoBw=
> classic+poster+art+and+cavern+and+-beatles+and+-concert+and+
> -doors+and+-indiana+and+-matterhorn+and+-forbidden+and+
> -emile+and+-rome+and+-quebec+and+-tauntaun+and+-huntington+
> and+-cafe+and+-progress+and+-dishonored+and+-verde+and+-
> tomb+and+-frontierland+and+-shadow+and+-ant-man+and+-
> monster+and+-dracula+and+-seger+and+-goldilocks+and+-
> club+and+-game=classic+poster+art+and+cavern+and+-
> beatles+and+-concert+and+-doors+and+-indiana+and+-
> matterhorn+and+-forbidden+and+-emile+and+-rome+and+-quebec+
> and+-tauntaun+and+-huntington+and+-cafe+and+-progress+and+-
> dishonored+and+-verde+and+-tomb+and+-frontierland+and+-
> shadow+and+-ant-man+and+-monster+and+-dracula+and+-
> seger+and+-goldilocks+and+-club+and+-game_l=mobile-
> gws-img.12...73666.84189.0.85421.21.20.0.0.0.0.0.0..0.0..
> ..0...1c.1j4.64.mobile-gws-img..21.0.0314.C2yy2umGHh0
>
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Re: [Texascavers] more cavepearls on Mars

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Holy crap Bockbeer is signing on with Musk to go to Mars.

On Wed, Dec 6, 2017 at 12:17 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> One researcher alleged that they believed it to composed of
> calcium-sulfate, sodium and magnesium.
>
> My guess is that it rolled to this spot, pushed by wind, or was uplifted
> by wind or both from the dry pool where it was originally created in a
> liqueous environment.
>
> My bet is that there will be millions of these found.
>
> Size is allegedly only 5 mm
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] LED Flashlight review

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

That was where Clark said Santa left presents in all the tents. And when we
went back to get the trucks they were surrounded by these narcos with lots
of guns but they were amazeed to find a bunch of gringos in the jungle in
wet suits. Too loco to kill or hold for ransom.

On Sun, Dec 3, 2017 at 6:25 PM, Charles Loving  wrote:

> Ahh and I tested a box of birthday cake candles in Dumbkopf Cave and found
> that the burned my fingers.
> Old Man Wisdom... And I was in that Chonta video with a Ceiling Burner.
>
> On Sat, Dec 2, 2017 at 8:58 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> From David Locklear
>> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>>
>>
>> The flashlight described below was purchased by me tonight at
>> Fry's Store.
>>
>> There was a near full moon so I could not find a good spot to properly
>> test it.
>>
>> However, there were 3 aspects of this flashlight that caught my eye and
>> may or may not separate this flashlight from others on the shelf.
>>
>> The main aspect of this light is its advertised brightness versus the
>> price.
>> Most of the flashlights seem to cheat on the max light numbers by adding
>> up the value of several of the LED's in the chip.   I have no idea if
>> this one
>> does that.Supposedly you are getting 2000 lumens for $ 40 plus tax.
>>
>> The 2nd feature is the advertised beam with, suggesting it is not a spot
>> light
>> but a real floodlight - something that almost no LED products excel at.
>>
>> And the 3rd feature was the dim value being much higher than other lights
>> at 1000 lumens.
>>
>> Meaning this light has a very specific purpose.You would use it at
>> the low setting
>> in a big frickin cave passage, and only use the 2000 lumen setting on
>> some special
>> occasion.
>>
>> Promier is not a leading brand and many of their products are sort of on
>> the low
>> end scale compared to Coast or Pelican, however, they seem to be better
>> than the
>> really cheap stuff.
>>
>> So here is what I learned.
>>
>> The flood beam is wide enough for when you really need a flood beam.
>> There is just a very
>> faint outer ring of light that only a light critic would notice.As
>> you slide the lens forward ( by rotating the
>> headpiece ), the light pattern begins to slightly concentrate and become
>> slightly brighter, but in the end the final
>> patter is a rhombus or diamond, like most of these kind of flashlights.
>> Since the mid-rage
>> pattern is the one you would use most often, I found it to be almost
>> circular, or sort of a square
>> with very rounded corners, or more like circle with some 4 flat edges.
>> Only slightly annoying.
>>
>> The heavy weight and large size of this flashlight would discourage you
>> from carrying it in most cases.
>> However, I would assume that it would come in handy if you were filming
>> in a large borehole passage.
>>
>> [  Sidenote:  On a trip to Sumidero del Rio Chonta, around 1993, some
>> Austin cavers filmed the trip
>> with a giant train engine headlight.I doubt I am in that video, and I
>> have never seen it.I was way
>> downstream of the filming.   ]
>>
>> Now there are dozens of brighter flashlights on the market ( but few on
>> the shelf ), and you can
>> probably find slightly better quality. But not for $ $ 40 plus tax.
>>
>> The switch feels rugged.The battery pack looks well-engineered.
>> The light could probably be
>> made more water-resistant, by putting sealant on the threads, and
>> blocking the focusing mechanism
>> with sealant.   The lens cover looks like a solid chunk of rounded glass
>> ( for dispersing the beam into
>> a flood pattern ).
>>
>> The three sharp tactical edges can be covered with tape, or maybe sawed
>> off.   They are not too
>> sharp and might could even be grinded smoother with a hand-file.
>>
>> As is, I would not call this flashlight water resistant.   So you would
>> want to carry it in some kind of protective
>> cover ( a DUREX Magnum RipnRoll ??? ).
>>
>> Model No.  P2000FL-8/16
>>
>> www.promierproducts.com
>>
>> Promier has a nearly identical model that is $ 6 cheaper and slightly
>> smaller, and probably more
>> practical for a large cave.   Fry's has carried that flashlight for over
>> a year.
>>
>> I hope I don't have to take this back to the store.I plan to use it
>> when I am driving my Sequoia
>> in dark areas looking for a camp-spot, or things along the side of the
>> road, or for blinding a
>> car-jacker, etc.
>>
>>
>>
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>> xascav...@texascavers.com/
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>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Charlie Loving
>



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Re: [Texascavers] LED Flashlight review

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Ahh and I tested a box of birthday cake candles in Dumbkopf Cave and found
that the burned my fingers.
Old Man Wisdom... And I was in that Chonta video with a Ceiling Burner.

On Sat, Dec 2, 2017 at 8:58 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>
>
> The flashlight described below was purchased by me tonight at
> Fry's Store.
>
> There was a near full moon so I could not find a good spot to properly
> test it.
>
> However, there were 3 aspects of this flashlight that caught my eye and
> may or may not separate this flashlight from others on the shelf.
>
> The main aspect of this light is its advertised brightness versus the
> price.
> Most of the flashlights seem to cheat on the max light numbers by adding
> up the value of several of the LED's in the chip.   I have no idea if this
> one
> does that.Supposedly you are getting 2000 lumens for $ 40 plus tax.
>
> The 2nd feature is the advertised beam with, suggesting it is not a spot
> light
> but a real floodlight - something that almost no LED products excel at.
>
> And the 3rd feature was the dim value being much higher than other lights
> at 1000 lumens.
>
> Meaning this light has a very specific purpose.You would use it at the
> low setting
> in a big frickin cave passage, and only use the 2000 lumen setting on some
> special
> occasion.
>
> Promier is not a leading brand and many of their products are sort of on
> the low
> end scale compared to Coast or Pelican, however, they seem to be better
> than the
> really cheap stuff.
>
> So here is what I learned.
>
> The flood beam is wide enough for when you really need a flood beam.
> There is just a very
> faint outer ring of light that only a light critic would notice.As you
> slide the lens forward ( by rotating the
> headpiece ), the light pattern begins to slightly concentrate and become
> slightly brighter, but in the end the final
> patter is a rhombus or diamond, like most of these kind of flashlights.
> Since the mid-rage
> pattern is the one you would use most often, I found it to be almost
> circular, or sort of a square
> with very rounded corners, or more like circle with some 4 flat edges.
> Only slightly annoying.
>
> The heavy weight and large size of this flashlight would discourage you
> from carrying it in most cases.
> However, I would assume that it would come in handy if you were filming in
> a large borehole passage.
>
> [  Sidenote:  On a trip to Sumidero del Rio Chonta, around 1993, some
> Austin cavers filmed the trip
> with a giant train engine headlight.I doubt I am in that video, and I
> have never seen it.I was way
> downstream of the filming.   ]
>
> Now there are dozens of brighter flashlights on the market ( but few on
> the shelf ), and you can
> probably find slightly better quality. But not for $ $ 40 plus tax.
>
> The switch feels rugged.The battery pack looks well-engineered.
> The light could probably be
> made more water-resistant, by putting sealant on the threads, and blocking
> the focusing mechanism
> with sealant.   The lens cover looks like a solid chunk of rounded glass (
> for dispersing the beam into
> a flood pattern ).
>
> The three sharp tactical edges can be covered with tape, or maybe sawed
> off.   They are not too
> sharp and might could even be grinded smoother with a hand-file.
>
> As is, I would not call this flashlight water resistant.   So you would
> want to carry it in some kind of protective
> cover ( a DUREX Magnum RipnRoll ??? ).
>
> Model No.  P2000FL-8/16
>
> www.promierproducts.com
>
> Promier has a nearly identical model that is $ 6 cheaper and slightly
> smaller, and probably more
> practical for a large cave.   Fry's has carried that flashlight for over a
> year.
>
> I hope I don't have to take this back to the store.I plan to use it
> when I am driving my Sequoia
> in dark areas looking for a camp-spot, or things along the side of the
> road, or for blinding a
> car-jacker, etc.
>
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Sierra Madres related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Different area I guess. The Area in Coahuila is fairly safe since i go
there with the rancher. Different from the early days. Call him up and meet
him at the gate kind of stuff. Still the roads are pretty bad. Heck the
road on my own place here in Texas cracked the motor mounts on my Ford just
last week.

On Fri, Dec 1, 2017 at 11:19 PM, MJ Gibbs via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Pardner, I hate to be the one to break the news to you, especially because
> I only know you from these emails but here it is.
> You can't find that logging road because it no longer exists. You won't be
> able to find anything following instructions laid to paper 40 to 50 years
> ago because there are villages, towns, cities, farms, ranches, offices,
> buildings, parking lots and tourism surround any of those caves that are
> truly spectacular. They are show caves with gate fees, paid parking gift
> shops and cave tours. For big bucks you take the adventure trip. The less
> spectacular but worth while to visit are on now private, fenced and posted
> land. Attention prohibito el paso
> Los violadores serán fusilados
> The really remote destinations have the same "roads" leading to them which
> are now overgrown and more closely resemble game trails than they do roads.
> To attempt to visit them will certainly result in tire failure or worse.
> Broken shock, failed brakes, overheating, torn up transmission,  broken
> axle.
> The only destination that sounds promising is the serria madres and that
> needs to be researched to locate guerrillas,  safe and free camping.
> If disaster be falls us and we become stranded, Im
>  Walking out of there)
>
> On Dec 1, 2017 4:41 PM, "David via Texascavers" <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> From David Locklear
>>
>>
>> Below is just some opinions and thoughts about YouTube videos related to
>> things that
>> sparked my interest this week.   I am just reminiscing here.
>>
>> Background:
>>
>> In December of 1985, I fell in love with the east face of the Eastern
>> Sierra Madres.
>>
>>  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sierra_Madre_Oriental
>>
>> Times were much different then.   There was no public internet, nor
>> cell-phones, nor
>> Facebook, nor even YouTube.There was
>> much less traffic in the Sierra Madres, especially in the backcountry,
>> much less city-folk in the back-country, far less
>> people owning 4x4 vehicles, and no ATV's.   There was allegedly less
>> crime, and lots of cavers
>> worldwide were looking for caves there.   There was far less info
>> available.We had to just go on rumors and
>> talk to local "campesinos."
>>
>> Ever since, I have longed to spend
>> my vacations there. But things have drastically changed for me.   I
>> became
>> more interested in attending NSS Conventions, which ate up all of my
>> expendable income ( and credit ), I got a mortgage ( way above my means
>> ), an extremely difficult wife,
>> a much crappier job, and a far more expensive car, and the responsibility
>> of parenting a teenage girl, an more
>> recently a distorted interest in Linux desktop computers, and just lots
>> more debt.
>>
>> So I am now reduced to a lethargic couch-potato watching YouTube drinking
>> Dr. Pepper and eating
>> Doritos, and day-dreaming.   As Mr. Minton
>> subtly said - my goals of a road-trip there involving a real caving
>> experience, are not practical.
>> But nevertheless, I dream and reminisce.
>>
>> There are hundreds of videos on YouTube about the Sierra Madres.I
>> mean no
>> offense to my Mexican friends and colleagues, but 90% of those are not of
>> interest
>> to "norte-americanos." It is my opinion, that many of the places that
>> I once enjoyed
>> still do not have a video explaining what is so special about the place.
>> For example,
>> a newbie could take the publication, "Caves of the InterAmerican
>> Highway," and by just following
>> the log from the highway up to "Joya de Salas," they could locate the
>> pits mentioned and record
>> their GPS and make a video that would be of interest to cavers. In
>> 1989, I was on a similar
>> trip with Brian Burton ( R.I.P. ), Rolf Adams ( R.I.P. ), and 2 Austin
>> cavers who are still around,
>> ( names withheld to protect their identity ). Rolf bopped one of the
>> pits without us even getting
>> out of the car.   He just tied a rope to the bumper and went down and
>> came right back up and said
>> it was a blind pit about 40 meters deep.It was right where the log
>> said it was from 1967.Somewhere
>> just north of the village of Julilo ( just one tiny cabin ), about 1/4
>> mile walk is a large shelter cave with
>> potentially a virgin skylight drop of about 30 meters. I can not even
>> find the logging road on Google Earth, or
>> any landmarks, such as Julilo.
>>
>> Anyways, back to the main story here.
>>
>>
>> Here is a short video of a zip-line in the Sierra Madres.
>>
>> Has anybody here done that ?
>>
>>   

Re: [Texascavers] Sierra Madres related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Poor Bockbeer. I drive to those place even today in my two wheel drive
piece of crap Ford and have nary a problem. Bock wants tomake everything
more dramatic. Hell my Mazada car could make it most places I go in the
Sierra del Burro. I even cross creeks. Bock is somewhat of a drama queen.
Soon to be seen in the adventures of Bockbeer. He was captured by the
underground folks who are trying to feed him to the monster to apeasea the
gods. Wether or not Mull and Doon can save him is up to Karst Walker who is
imeshed in  a battle with the Red Rock Eaters.

On Fri, Dec 1, 2017 at 4:40 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
>
>
> Below is just some opinions and thoughts about YouTube videos related to
> things that
> sparked my interest this week.   I am just reminiscing here.
>
> Background:
>
> In December of 1985, I fell in love with the east face of the Eastern
> Sierra Madres.
>
>  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sierra_Madre_Oriental
>
> Times were much different then.   There was no public internet, nor
> cell-phones, nor
> Facebook, nor even YouTube.There was
> much less traffic in the Sierra Madres, especially in the backcountry,
> much less city-folk in the back-country, far less
> people owning 4x4 vehicles, and no ATV's.   There was allegedly less
> crime, and lots of cavers
> worldwide were looking for caves there.   There was far less info
> available.We had to just go on rumors and
> talk to local "campesinos."
>
> Ever since, I have longed to spend
> my vacations there. But things have drastically changed for me.   I
> became
> more interested in attending NSS Conventions, which ate up all of my
> expendable income ( and credit ), I got a mortgage ( way above my means ),
> an extremely difficult wife,
> a much crappier job, and a far more expensive car, and the responsibility
> of parenting a teenage girl, an more
> recently a distorted interest in Linux desktop computers, and just lots
> more debt.
>
> So I am now reduced to a lethargic couch-potato watching YouTube drinking
> Dr. Pepper and eating
> Doritos, and day-dreaming.   As Mr. Minton
> subtly said - my goals of a road-trip there involving a real caving
> experience, are not practical.
> But nevertheless, I dream and reminisce.
>
> There are hundreds of videos on YouTube about the Sierra Madres.I mean
> no
> offense to my Mexican friends and colleagues, but 90% of those are not of
> interest
> to "norte-americanos." It is my opinion, that many of the places that
> I once enjoyed
> still do not have a video explaining what is so special about the place.
>   For example,
> a newbie could take the publication, "Caves of the InterAmerican Highway,"
> and by just following
> the log from the highway up to "Joya de Salas," they could locate the pits
> mentioned and record
> their GPS and make a video that would be of interest to cavers. In
> 1989, I was on a similar
> trip with Brian Burton ( R.I.P. ), Rolf Adams ( R.I.P. ), and 2 Austin
> cavers who are still around,
> ( names withheld to protect their identity ). Rolf bopped one of the
> pits without us even getting
> out of the car.   He just tied a rope to the bumper and went down and came
> right back up and said
> it was a blind pit about 40 meters deep.It was right where the log
> said it was from 1967.Somewhere
> just north of the village of Julilo ( just one tiny cabin ), about 1/4
> mile walk is a large shelter cave with
> potentially a virgin skylight drop of about 30 meters. I can not even
> find the logging road on Google Earth, or
> any landmarks, such as Julilo.
>
> Anyways, back to the main story here.
>
>
> Here is a short video of a zip-line in the Sierra Madres.
>
> Has anybody here done that ?
>
>   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=neJdO10qbGw
>
> There is only one video on YouTube that I can find
> of Joya de Salas.It shows some men throwing large rocks
> into the pit about 2 years ago, and yelling "p*nd*jo."   it is
> not even a very good video
>
> I did not provide the link, due to poor quality.
>
> The video below shows one of the popular swimming holes
> near Gomez Farias ( but during high water flow ).I have been
> here 3 times, and never found the cave.Does anybody have some
> tips on how to find the cave ?
>
>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7So_DciJD0=67s
>
>
> The video below shows the exact place the A.S.S. went to in 1987 (
> probably
> Christmas ). In those days we had little information as to where we
> were
> going ( usually just an outdated topo map of the whole mountain range,
> with little detail. )
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hogp2B8T3Vc
>
>
> Here is a good swimming hole, ( but after a good rain )
>
>  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ew_JOQZYAfs
>
> The link below shows a 4x4 vehicle with snorkel fording a stream.I
> know that I will not be intentionally
> fording a stream like that in my
> Sequoia. I can't 

Re: [Texascavers] Tentative road-trip

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Lots of ticks at El Abra

On Fri, Dec 1, 2017 at 11:05 AM, Mark Minton via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Those are pretty ambitious goals for a guy who hasn't done much caving
> lately, especially vertical. Even getting to either of those would take
> significant effort and time. Both are long drops. Good luck!
>
>
> Mark Minton
>
> mmin...@caver.net
>
>
> On Thu, 30 Nov, 2017 at 4:38 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> From David Locklear
>
> I hope to re-attempt the road-trip that I had hoped to do over
> Thanksgiving.
>
> 
>
> Possible destination ideas:
>
> Bop the entrance of La Joya de Salas.
>
> Bop the top pit in Cueva del Abra.
>
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>


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[Texascavers] A TRIBUTE TO BOCKBEER

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

*The game the five caver dogs are playing is "BARK".  Whenever something
moves anywhere-a leaf in the wind, a bird flying by, a triceratops charging
out of the garage-the first one to bark gets five points. The second one to
bark gets four points, the third barker gets three points and so on.
Whoever has the most points at the end of the game is the winner. WHENEVER
YOU SEE TWO OR MORE DOGS BARKING SOMEWHERE, ODDS ARE PRETTY GOOD THEY ARE
PLAYING "BARK." *


*One of the dogs is shaped like a Frankfurter so it must belong to Edgier.*

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[Texascavers] Shadow...Mull and Doon

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Purification no longer works what  is e-mail now?

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[Texascavers] Where is she?

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Bev Purificacion is no longer working. Need to keep up so I can continue
her adventures with Karst Walker?

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Re: [Texascavers] Eyes of Texas - sort of

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Be sure to read Bockbeer Comics

On Sat, Nov 25, 2017 at 3:38 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
>
> Hit delete button now
>
>
>
> I just finished up my Thanksgiving frolicking road-trip in the tiny
> central Texas town of Moody.
>
> Earlier, I had attempted to check out the screened shelters at a park on
> the northern shoreline of Lake Belton, called "Cedar Ridge Park,"
>
> The shelters had been torn down, and they were building new ones for next
> season.  It is a very tiny park operated by the Army Corps of Engineers.
> It is an ideal place for a small boat and an RV.
>
> There are a few small limestone creekbeds covered in fallen cedar trees.
> There appeared to be very limited hiking but looked like you have a
> machete.
>
> The park is surrounded by a residential sudivision, and you can see
> people's backyards from the park.  Not the kind of place to get away from
> it all.
>
> I had not planned on touring Lake Belton and did not have any idea what to
> look for.
>
> The rest of my weekend revolves around the tedious obligation of getting
> my teenage daughter safely from Arlington to Arcola in the hectic
> Thanksgiving traffic.  Part of that task revolves dealing with the wacko
> dysfunctional Locklear clan - a group that I have little contact with.
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Ammo can question ??

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Have never carried an ammo can since Viet Nam. Never needed ammo in Mexico.
I just used those old army surplus packs.

On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 4:01 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> This is for you real road-trippers:
>
> Do you travel with a metal or plastic ammo can ?  Or both ?
>
> How many ?   And what do you organize in them ?
>
>
> I have a fancy aluminum one, and keep most of my small flashlights
> batteries, leatherman-tool, etc.  I have a smaller plastic one that I keep
> small medical ointments, Blistex lip balm, or Carmex, eye-drops, anti-itch
> cream, Q-tips, tweezers, etc.
>
> I can't remember if I have a metal one.  If so, I bought it at army
> surplus.
>
> Now they are on sale at Harbor Freight Tools, Sam's Club, and Northern
> Tool, etc.   So I am tempted to buy one.  I just can not think of why I
> need it.
>
> David Locklear
>
> P.S.
>
>
> I have upgraded my Sequoia's scissor jack and stocked up on zinc-chloride
> AA and AAA batteries.
>
> I will be ready when the next road-trip opportunity reveals itself..
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] The speleo-blues

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Nico is correct. The border at Christmas and New Year is always a real
mess. I thought the Amistad crossing would be easier than the bridge. Hah!
It took three hours at walking speed.

On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 8:56 AM, Nico Escamilla via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> David,
>
> You mentioned 88 hrs of freedom.. Im pretty sure you'll spend a good 20
> of'em waiting in line at the border both ways. I wouldnt even try, but
> thats just me.
>
> Nico
>
> El 23 nov. 2017 12:05 AM, "Jenny Holt via Texascavers" <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> escribió:
>
>> Yes-we all have! You make everything harder than it needs to be & you
>> can't afford it anyway so why do you try so hard?  There are sooo many
>> other, safer, and closer road trips you could do. Come to Dripping Springs
>> & spend TG with Fritz, June, me & others-you're welcome. No drama, easy
>> peasy! Take the logical trip.
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On Nov 22, 2017, at 11:08 PM, David via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > From David Locklear
>> >
>> > Have you ever had to back out of trip at the last minute after you put
>> your heart and soul into making trip preparations ?
>> >
>> > I call it the speleo-blues.  Or in this case, just the road-trip-blues.
>> >
>> > It is Wednesday night. 10 p.m., and my 4x4 vehicle is packed ready to
>> pull out of the driveway prepped for an adventure into lower parts of The
>> Sierra Madres.  The ice chest is already loaded and packed.  I just have a
>> cot and some blankets and my boots.  I am ready to to see shooting stars
>> fly across The Milky Way.
>> >
>> > I have 4 new all-terrain tires installed and balanced and locked to my
>> new junk-yard 18 inch steel rims with lug nut locks.  I have test-driven
>> the new tires 40 miles.  That project ended up costing $ 700.
>> >
>> > Meanwhile, my beloved wife arrived safely at the house that she owns in
>> Monterrey, Mexico all by herself about an hour ago.
>> >
>> > I am now in Arcola at home, sitting on the couch, realizing the reality
>> that I need to blow off the road-trip and hunker down.  I am free as a bird
>> for the next 88 hours.  In my younger days, I would be passing thru Nuevo
>> Laredo Mexico by 5 a.m.  But the wiser old geezer cumurdgeon in me warns me
>> of the realities if things do not go as planned.  Even just a few months
>> ago, I would have said to myself "ah, to H*'ll with it all, and just drove
>> off blindly into the wind."
>> > But not this time, the realties of life have beaten me down to be more
>> cautious.  There are just way too many logistical 'what-if" scenarios to
>> pull out of the driveway.  For example, what if I can not get my daughter
>> home on time ?  She is in Arlington and has to be in Arcola Sunday night.
>> >
>> > As far as trip alternatives,
>> >
>> > I would like to watch the launch of the Flat-Earth Research Rocket on
>> Saturday.  I have only been to the Mojave Desert once.  Watch that live
>> on-line if you can.
>> >
>> > Happy Thanksgiving.
>> > ___
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>
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Re: [Texascavers] Backcountry preps - part 2

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

That was the caving trip we ate all the tort as at the stand in Xilitla.
And got locked out of our hotel for staying out after curfew or some such.

On Wed, Nov 22, 2017 at 10:20 PM, Chris Vreeland via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Yeah, we left your little truck about a mile from Potrero Redondo in ‘95
> when it would go no further, & it was all still there when we got back to
> it several days later.
>
> That was the trip that the Grey Pendejo got its name. The Holly carb on
> that thing was crap & the linkage kept slipping out of low gear rolling
> downhill. The water literally boiled off of my brakes at one of the river
> fords. I was lucky the disks didn’t crack.
>
> Chris Vreeland
>
> On Nov 22, 2017, at 7:35 AM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> Amzing. I drive to the Sierra del Burro with one spare and no wheel locks
> in my 2002 Pickup on Firestone tires that are at least a year old and a
> spare that has never been on the ground and my mechanic says is dangerous.
> So far I havemade three four or five day trips and two out to Alpine and
> the desert out there. Bockbeer is a strange critter but I will soon post
> the new cartoon series the boring adventures of Bockbeer and his estranged
> Sequoia.
>
> On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 4:46 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> From David Locklear
>>
>> An irrelevant story about tires:
>>
>>
>>
>> I continued my quest today to prepare for a 3 day road-trip into the
>> rural roads of northern Mexico.
>>
>> I went to about 20 used tire shops in search of a very specific
>> all-terrain tire that I wanted for my 18 inch junkyard steel rims.
>>
>> So far I have spent today on 3 tires, ( only installing 2 ) was $ 360.
>>
>> The size is 265/70R18 which is an odd rare size but common on the
>> internet.  It is 5 narrower and 5 taller that the street tires pictured.
>>
>> One is a Falken Rocky Mountain ( not pictured ).  The other identical but
>> different name, Falken Wild Country, and the 3rd a B.F. Goodrich, all new
>> in never used condition.
>>
>> I also bought the cheap PepBoy's wheel locks for $ 14 that can be knocked
>> off with any sledge hammer, if you hit them just right.
>>
>> I did all of this in Spanish - probably saving about $ 75, but I also
>> spent $ 20 on gas searching for the tires.
>>
>> I am done with work until the 28th.
>>
>> I just have to find some money, and if it ain't in the mailbox when I get
>> home late tonight, then I will have to wait another day to check the mail,
>> and then possibly cancel my road-trip, after all that wacky hoopla.
>>
>> Then there is an ordeal beyond words, dealing with the sweet lady
>> mentioned in previous post.  She claims that she is going solo on her own
>> to Monterrey from our house in her P.O.S. car with crappy tires ( yelling
>> in a very loud deranged tone of voice interjected with colorful Spanish
>> words like  super-c*brone," and "inutil." ).
>>
>> At the moment, I have 3 functioning spare tires, but I only hope to take
>> one of them.
>>
>>
>>
>> I mentioned about previous trips being clusterph*cks.   Yesterday, I
>> finally learned where the tool is hidden on the Sequoia that lowers the
>> spare tire.   I also learned that the lug-wrench did not match the lug nuts
>> and that the hidden jack looks like it has never been used and I never knew
>> it was hidden there.   I did not even know it had a jack, and the jack that
>> I had been carrying was a tiny one off my old Camry and was probably
>> worthless for changing a tire on a big 2008 Sequoia on the side of the
>> road.  I have had this vehicle 17 months and put 65,000 miles in it, I
>> think.
>>
>> ___
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>> xascav...@texascavers.com/
>> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Charlie Loving
>
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>
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] Backcountry preps - part 2

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Amzing. I drive to the Sierra del Burro with one spare and no wheel locks
in my 2002 Pickup on Firestone tires that are at least a year old and a
spare that has never been on the ground and my mechanic says is dangerous.
So far I havemade three four or five day trips and two out to Alpine and
the desert out there. Bockbeer is a strange critter but I will soon post
the new cartoon series the boring adventures of Bockbeer and his estranged
Sequoia.

On Tue, Nov 21, 2017 at 4:46 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
>
> An irrelevant story about tires:
>
>
>
> I continued my quest today to prepare for a 3 day road-trip into the rural
> roads of northern Mexico.
>
> I went to about 20 used tire shops in search of a very specific
> all-terrain tire that I wanted for my 18 inch junkyard steel rims.
>
> So far I have spent today on 3 tires, ( only installing 2 ) was $ 360.
>
> The size is 265/70R18 which is an odd rare size but common on the
> internet.  It is 5 narrower and 5 taller that the street tires pictured.
>
> One is a Falken Rocky Mountain ( not pictured ).  The other identical but
> different name, Falken Wild Country, and the 3rd a B.F. Goodrich, all new
> in never used condition.
>
> I also bought the cheap PepBoy's wheel locks for $ 14 that can be knocked
> off with any sledge hammer, if you hit them just right.
>
> I did all of this in Spanish - probably saving about $ 75, but I also
> spent $ 20 on gas searching for the tires.
>
> I am done with work until the 28th.
>
> I just have to find some money, and if it ain't in the mailbox when I get
> home late tonight, then I will have to wait another day to check the mail,
> and then possibly cancel my road-trip, after all that wacky hoopla.
>
> Then there is an ordeal beyond words, dealing with the sweet lady
> mentioned in previous post.  She claims that she is going solo on her own
> to Monterrey from our house in her P.O.S. car with crappy tires ( yelling
> in a very loud deranged tone of voice interjected with colorful Spanish
> words like  super-c*brone," and "inutil." ).
>
> At the moment, I have 3 functioning spare tires, but I only hope to take
> one of them.
>
>
>
> I mentioned about previous trips being clusterph*cks.   Yesterday, I
> finally learned where the tool is hidden on the Sequoia that lowers the
> spare tire.   I also learned that the lug-wrench did not match the lug nuts
> and that the hidden jack looks like it has never been used and I never knew
> it was hidden there.   I did not even know it had a jack, and the jack that
> I had been carrying was a tiny one off my old Camry and was probably
> worthless for changing a tire on a big 2008 Sequoia on the side of the
> road.  I have had this vehicle 17 months and put 65,000 miles in it, I
> think.
>
> ___
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>
>


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Re: [Texascavers] Backcountry preparations 101

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Incredible. I drove my Land Rover for years in Mexico and noone ever stole
a thing and I even parked it near a hotel in DF. I drove my Bronco all over
Mexico and it was my vehicle when I lived in Real de Catorce whihc is in
the boonies and Zacateca desert and nary a problem. I maybe had a two flats
in Mexico in 30 years of traveling. One require a Vulcanazador in SLP to
rebuild the tire and vucanize the sidewall after it got ripped out on a
trip into the Valle de Fantasmos near Rio Verde. The US doesn't allow that
these days. I also drove my Mazada pickup to Nuevoe Mecurico a few times
which is about 65 miles from highway 57 between Concepcion de Oror and
Allende. A very bad road. And the road to Salado was pretty rough too, they
palce where those dumb Texans were forced to pick black beans from that pot
and got shot.

On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 1:42 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> A very famous and very wise caver stated publically in 1987 during a
> formal presentation to a group of young potential cavers ( me included )
> that
>
> "For every hour underground...you need to spend 16 hours preparing for
> that."
>
> At the moment that I first heard that concept, I thought to myself,
>
> "If I ever end up like that...just shoot me."
>
> In the 30 years since, many if not all of my road-trips were in some way
> clusterph*cks.   And that same guy even had to rescue me all by himself
> once, either due to my ineptness or carefree attitude, or both.  My excuse
> was always lack of time and lack of money.
>
> I once said,
>
> "You don't go on a road-trip with the gear that you want, but instead you
> go with the gear you have."
>
>
> So today, I took off work from my imaginary job and combed the junk
> yards.   I now have 4 steel wheels for my Sequoia ( 3 plus the spare ).
> Meaning, it would be nice to get another, but ai probably won't for this
> trip.
>
> For you young'uns that don't know what I am talking about, the factory
> aluminum wheels suck on road-trips on the rugged roads in the Sierra
> Madres.   And I am not even talking about off-roading.
>
> and those shiny light-weight wheels appeal to car thieves and scrap-metal
> thieves and are easy to steal.  And replacement wheels in your unique size
> can be hard to find if you lose them down there, especially if you are in
> some really remote cool place like
>
> El Popoca ( see YouTube )
>
> However,
>
> now my dillema is getting rubber on those wheels before I leave town.
> That alone may put an end to the dream of a road-trip.My fr*ckin
> beloved jerk customers are not returning my calls, as if they already
> fr*ckin left town for a Thanksgiving.
>
> David Locklear
>
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>
>


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Re: [Texascavers] Mexican vehicle permit related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Ed Alexander went through a year or two of trying to legally own a house
there. Lots and lots of paper work and going back and forth to SLP from
Real. He finally had a baby in Mexico and the kid now owns the place
legally. Red tape is wonderful.

On Mon, Nov 20, 2017 at 8:40 AM, MJ Gibbs via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> and your not even applying for citizenship.
>
> On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 8:27 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> From David Locklear
>> Hit delete button now, please.
>>
>>
>>
>> I am posting this here because someone might have had some vague
>> intangible interest.
>>
>>
>> This post is only for U.S.A. people wanting to drive their car deep into
>> Mexici, and who do not live near a bordertown, nor want to have vehicle
>> importation problems at the "aduana" slow down their trip.
>>
>>
>> In Houston, in order to get a "vehicle" permit it is a huge hassle.
>>
>> But before I get to that, you first need to have a car title, or an
>> official letter from the leinholder.   It is helpful if that is a credit
>> union, and that process of getting them to provide such a letter for the
>> first time takes about 24 hours.  They will not give you the letter unless
>> you first purchase Mexico insurance.   That really sucks, because you are
>> throwing all that time and money down the toilet, if you change travel
>> plans.
>>
>> So once you have all that, here is what I had to do:
>>
>> Step 1:call Mexico long-distance and apply over the phone for a
>> formal interview appointment.
>>
>> # 011-52-55-5626-0500 <+52%2055%205626%200500>
>>
>> You get a complicated voice menu and you enter a 4-digit extension.
>>
>> This has to be done at least 24 hours in advance.
>>
>> The operator will tell you which appointment slots are available with the
>> Mexican Consulate Office in the mid-town area of Houston
>> ( Hwy 59 and Fannin St. ).
>>
>> Step 2:   Then you have to drive there the following weekday ( or later)
>> arriving exactly 5 minutes before the appointment.  You stand in a
>> complicated line outside on Caroline St. ( very reminiscent of the movie
>> "Soylent Green," waiting for your Soylent Green ration. )  you feel there
>> like you are no longer in the USA, nor even in the 21st Century.
>>
>> You have to be careful here for pickpockets and scammers and muggers from
>> your parking spot to the line.  There is one security guard at the main
>> pedestrian gate which is the only way to enter.
>>
>> Once in line, you do a bizarre childish ritual of musical chairs for an
>> hour with some scary looking guys that resemble Enrique Penya Nieto.  In my
>> case, there was a super gorgeous lady sitting next to me and so I gave her
>> my number and asked her to please forward it to her younger sister who she
>> said was single in Mexico.  While in line they pull you out for 5 minutes
>> for an interview with person of low IQ.  You have to formally declare your
>> religion to them, along with other bizarre questions.
>>
>> Fortunately, I read the fine print of my initial interview form while
>> sitting in the line, because the clerk typed that I was from Aruba.
>>
>> At the end of the line - the window ( Banjercito ), you begin the vehicle
>> stuff.   It is chaotic - 2 clerks and 2 tourist using the same window.
>> There are no holes in the window for speaking, so you have to yell and
>> listen carefully. You want to say to yourself, WTF !Nothing is
>> logical.   All they ever asked for was a copy of the Texas Vehicle
>> Registration paper that you get when you apply for a state registration
>> window sticker.  I do not recall seeing them look at the credit union
>> letter, nor my insurance.   But I would not have done all that without
>> first assuring myself that I could get my credit union permission.
>>
>> Then you hand them a credit card, and they charge $ 470.   The $ 400 part
>> is a deposit, and there are more bizarre questions, the rest is a standard
>> processing fee.They did not ask about my former vehicle papers, but it
>> has been 13 years.
>> I assume I get the deposit back in July ??   I have never ever done
>> anything that stupid, that I recall.
>>
>>
>>
>> In addition to all that,
>>
>> in my case, I also spent money on gas driving there, as I do not live in
>> Harris County, and also paying to park in a place my car could have easily
>> been broken into.
>>
>> I will say, that after leaving the Consulate Office with the permit in
>> hand that it gives one a warm fuzzy feeling - until you receive the text
>> message your charge card was hit with $ 470.
>>
>> My permit is good until May 19th, and my credit union says they will
>> amend the letter next time I want to go again.AAA clerk said that that
>> was too much of a hassle and hope I don't have to do that insurance again.
>>
>>
>>
>> As far as other expenses getting ready for a road-trip, so far
>>
>> All I did to the Sequoia was change the oil, but Jiffy Lube 

Re: [Texascavers] Mexican vehicle permit related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

My Mexican insurance is for a whole year and it is pretty cheap. I go to
the office in Acuna and get my sticker. Piece of cake really. You just need
your papers in order. And estranged |iˈstrānjd| adjective(of a person) no
longer close or affectionate to someone; alienated: Harriet felt more
estranged from her daughter than ever | her estranged father.• (of a wife or
 husband) no longer living with their spouse.

On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 8:50 PM, AC via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> David,
>
> You can also apply for the Temporary Importation Permit online.
>
> http://sat.gob.mx/BienvenidoaMexico/Paginas/permiso_vehiculo_eng.html
>
> You can buy Mexico insurance online and print it out immediately. I use
> Baja Bound. Www.bajabound.com
>
>
> Smart phone, stupid autocorrect
>
> On Nov 19, 2017, at 8:27 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> From David Locklear
> Hit delete button now, please.
>
>
>
> I am posting this here because someone might have had some vague
> intangible interest.
>
>
> This post is only for U.S.A. people wanting to drive their car deep into
> Mexici, and who do not live near a bordertown, nor want to have vehicle
> importation problems at the "aduana" slow down their trip.
>
>
> In Houston, in order to get a "vehicle" permit it is a huge hassle.
>
> But before I get to that, you first need to have a car title, or an
> official letter from the leinholder.   It is helpful if that is a credit
> union, and that process of getting them to provide such a letter for the
> first time takes about 24 hours.  They will not give you the letter unless
> you first purchase Mexico insurance.   That really sucks, because you are
> throwing all that time and money down the toilet, if you change travel
> plans.
>
> So once you have all that, here is what I had to do:
>
> Step 1:call Mexico long-distance and apply over the phone for a formal
> interview appointment.
>
> # 011-52-55-5626-0500 <+52%2055%205626%200500>
>
> You get a complicated voice menu and you enter a 4-digit extension.
>
> This has to be done at least 24 hours in advance.
>
> The operator will tell you which appointment slots are available with the
> Mexican Consulate Office in the mid-town area of Houston
> ( Hwy 59 and Fannin St. ).
>
> Step 2:   Then you have to drive there the following weekday ( or later)
> arriving exactly 5 minutes before the appointment.  You stand in a
> complicated line outside on Caroline St. ( very reminiscent of the movie
> "Soylent Green," waiting for your Soylent Green ration. )  you feel there
> like you are no longer in the USA, nor even in the 21st Century.
>
> You have to be careful here for pickpockets and scammers and muggers from
> your parking spot to the line.  There is one security guard at the main
> pedestrian gate which is the only way to enter.
>
> Once in line, you do a bizarre childish ritual of musical chairs for an
> hour with some scary looking guys that resemble Enrique Penya Nieto.  In my
> case, there was a super gorgeous lady sitting next to me and so I gave her
> my number and asked her to please forward it to her younger sister who she
> said was single in Mexico.  While in line they pull you out for 5 minutes
> for an interview with person of low IQ.  You have to formally declare your
> religion to them, along with other bizarre questions.
>
> Fortunately, I read the fine print of my initial interview form while
> sitting in the line, because the clerk typed that I was from Aruba.
>
> At the end of the line - the window ( Banjercito ), you begin the vehicle
> stuff.   It is chaotic - 2 clerks and 2 tourist using the same window.
> There are no holes in the window for speaking, so you have to yell and
> listen carefully. You want to say to yourself, WTF !Nothing is
> logical.   All they ever asked for was a copy of the Texas Vehicle
> Registration paper that you get when you apply for a state registration
> window sticker.  I do not recall seeing them look at the credit union
> letter, nor my insurance.   But I would not have done all that without
> first assuring myself that I could get my credit union permission.
>
> Then you hand them a credit card, and they charge $ 470.   The $ 400 part
> is a deposit, and there are more bizarre questions, the rest is a standard
> processing fee.They did not ask about my former vehicle papers, but it
> has been 13 years.
> I assume I get the deposit back in July ??   I have never ever done
> anything that stupid, that I recall.
>
>
>
> In addition to all that,
>
> in my case, I also spent money on gas driving there, as I do not live in
> Harris County, and also paying to park in a place my car could have easily
> been broken into.
>
> I will say, that after leaving the Consulate Office with the permit in
> hand that it gives one a warm fuzzy feeling - until you receive the text
> message your charge card was hit with $ 470.
>
> My permit is good until May 19th, and my credit 

Re: [Texascavers] Kanchanaburi: Part 4, Khao Laem National Park

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Bob Simmons

November 19 at 11:48am

How could anyone get the wrong idea about this woman?


On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 2:10 PM, Sleazeweazel via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> ___
> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
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> texascavers@texascavers.com/
> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: bmorgan...@aol.com
> To: texascavers@texascavers.com
> Cc:
> Bcc:
> Date: Sun, 19 Nov 2017 15:10:26 -0500
> Subject: Kanchanaburi: Part 4, Khao Laem National Park
> Wherein the Weazel acquires his own personal Nun as a cave guide.
>
> http://weazelwise.com/2017/11/19/kanchanaburi-part-4-khao-
> laem-national-park/
>
>


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Re: [Texascavers] Cuatro Cienagas question

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

There are also swimming holes west of Carisal. The town not the cave. went
there with Fito and Plemons. Nice river there and lots of big swimming
holes as well as a few caves up on the cliffs. Site of a famous battle
between the Caranzistas and Villa. The old trench is still visible.

On Sun, Nov 19, 2017 at 4:12 PM, Mark Minton via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> You don't need to go far from Bustamante for good swimming. Just go out
> Bustamante Canyon to one of the swimming holes in the semi-developed park
> at the headwaters, or pull off at any one of many unofficial pools
> downstream of the park.
>
>
> There is also a commercialized swimming hole on the road from Villaldama
> (just south of Bustamante) to Sabinas Hidalgo called, I believe, Ojo de
> Agua. Another swimming hole is in Lampazos to the north, also imaginatively
> called Ojo de Agua, but it was sort of a dump last time I was there
> (admittedly quite some time ago).
>
> Mark Minton
> mmin...@caver.net
>
> On Sat, 18 Nov, 2017 at 2:41 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> To: CaveTex
> Cc: dlocklea...@gmail.com
> Could someone who has been to Cuatro Cienagas in the past 5 years please
> email me privately
> any travel tips or suggestions in that area.
>
> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>
> I heard swimming is no longer permitted there.  If so, what else is there
> to do ?
>
> I am just daydreaming at the moment wondering if a quickie adventure is
> feasible.
>
> What is the best swimming hole within 100 miles of Bustamante ?
>
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>
>


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[Texascavers] I found all the Karstt Walker comic.

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I am rescanning it. It makes no sense at all, But it does have Karst and
Bockbeer in the adventure. I am drawing a cover cartoon. The adventures of
Bockbeer. No estranged wives or children just Bockbeer.

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Re: [Texascavers] Doug Allen

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

The adventures of Bockbeer continue. A real life telenovela with no
commercials.

On Wed, Nov 8, 2017 at 7:36 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I met Doug around 1985 at several TSA related functions.   I called him a
> few times to invite him to go caving and probably once mailed a letter or
> post card.
>
> I am pretty sure we poked around in some passages in Powell's Cave once,
> or some small Hill Country caves.
>
> Sometime in the fall of 1989 ( I think ), I was down on my luck and
> semi-homeless wondering where destiny would take me.
>
> At some function ( maybe TCR ), Doug said, "Hey, David, Why don't you come
> rent a room at my house."
>
> So I left Houston and went to his house in east Austin to see the room.
>
> At that point in my life, I was a hippie by Aggie standards, but I was not
> anything like the lifestyle Doug was living.  I was not even a quasi-hippie
> by Austin standards.
> I seriously considered moving in there, as I had a bizarre job interview
> with a 2-man architectural firm on Mopac Freeway where they were allegedly
> designing a giant resort in The Canary Islands.My memory is that I
> purposely did not show them any interest in the job as I thought the 2
> architects were involved in some weird scheme.   So I thanked Doug for the
> invitation and turned it down.  I think the architects offered me a job,
> but I declined thinking it was too good to be true, so it must be fishy.
>
> I ended up going down to Grutas de Eloxchitlan, Oaxaca with 2 Aussie
> cavers meeting up with Joe Ivy and his crew.
>
> I never really heard much from Doug after that.
>
> I thought I had made contact with him a year ago online.  But I can't find
> a record of it.
>
> My memory is bad and I just remember a small skinny guy with a big beard
> and he was quiet and about 8 years older than me.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Sort of related to Gunnel's Cave

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Once again what is the relevance to this report?

On Mon, Nov 6, 2017 at 2:18 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> http://www.shelbycountytexashistory.net/neuvillecave.htm
>
> The error in the height of the only room should read 20 feet.   However
> the room is acute-trapezoid shaped with the top base being 3 feet, so there
> is only head-room for about 20 standing people in that room.
>
> Whatever trees they are referring to must have been removed.   It is a
> pine-tree farm with about 15 year old trees all in rows.
>
> One serious cave trip took place in 1999.  ( Which was the first attempt
> at The East Texas Caver's Cookout. )
>
> A.S.S. had 4 trips in the late 80s, mostly just me and another caver.
>
> One of the few caves that my estranged-brother ever went in with me.
>
> I bet locals frequent this cave monthly and drink beer and smoke in it.
>
> 7 miles due south of the town of Center, just a 1/2 mile west of the
> highway to San Augustine.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] The Proposed Texas Speleological Foundation Headquarters

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Goodwill? Salvation Army?

On Mon, Nov 6, 2017 at 5:58 PM, Fritz Holt via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Foundation headquarters/
> museum/storage.
> Can anyone or group take David's treasures? until a permanent home can be
> found. It would be a shame for the storage facility to dispose of the stuff
> should David not be able to continue keeping it. I can't as my storage
> buildings are full from recently cleaning
> out two Houston PS storage rooms for my 94 year old aunt thereby saving
> her the $650. monthly rental fee which she couldn't afford. Fritz Holt
> fritz...@gmail.com
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Nov 6, 2017, at 11:01 AM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > In the event, such a structure were to ever be built, I am currently
> able to offer the following. 30 plus items for donation to be used there.
> >
> > 1)  1 bookshelf
> > 2 ) 1 respectable speleo-library
> > 3 )  old office furniture and equipment for a small office
> > 4 )  old furniture ( coffee table, end table, loveseat-bed )
> > 5 ) 1 metal storage rack
> > 6 ) 3 plastic tote boxes.
> > 7 ) a tool box with some tools
> > 8 ) a vinyl LP and cassette and CD collection of 70's music
> > 9 ) a white-gas lantern
> > 10 ) plastic folding table and plastic folding chair
> > 11 ) a nice work-bench
> > 12 ) 100 plastic drinking glasses for a fancy party ( used once in 2001 )
> > 13 ) various decorative antiques such as a 1950-ish brass backpacker
> stove
> > 14 ) a decorative old picture of the UT campus from 1949.
> > 15 ) some vertical gear to put on display ( inchworm system used by Carl
> Philip Fromen in Precipicio 1991 )
> > 16 ) items owned by caver Jim McLane
> > 17 ) a small dormitory refrigerator
> > 18 ) a small cot
> > 19 ) large stainless steel serving plates ( XXL turkey-size )
> > 20 ) a bottle of wine
> > 21 ) a small kid-size bed, an oak futon,
> > 22 ) a rope owned by Oren Tranbarger
> > 23 ) a rare un-used GHG patch circa 1992
> > 24 ) a rare unused TSA patch from 1987
> > 25 ) a heavily worn TSA shirt from 1987
> > 26 ) various caving shirts to display including a never opened Bob
> soda-straw shirt from 1988.
> > 27 ) lots of miscellaneous garage-sale-type cr*p.
> > 28 ) a decent National Geographic collection ( every issue from to 1955
> to 2003, and a few antique issues )
> > 29 ) various books and magazines
> > 30 ) Coleman camp stove.
> > 31 ) tarp
> > 32 ) large metal storage box
> >
> > David Locklear
> >
> >
> > P.S.  This is all assuming I live that long and can continue to pay the
> monthly rent on my storage unit.
> >
> > ___
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Re: [Texascavers] RAM Prospector

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Mileage? How daft do you have to be to even think about such a vehicle and
why would anyone care?

On Sun, Nov 5, 2017 at 4:36 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> This machine is so incredible.
>
> Dodge wants $ 76,660 for it.
>
> 37 inch all-terrain tires, full-size spare, engine-snorkel, front and rear
> differential lockers, 4.10 gear, all sorts of upgraded lights, Warn 16.5
> winch,  retractable side steps winch,
>
> The picture shoes my Sequoia in the background. Plus another $ 14,000 of
> numerous upgrades, 3 inch suspension lift,  upgraded bumper, etc.
>
> Base truck is The Powerwagon package with 6.4 liter Hemi.  6 speed, 4x4,
> MDS, alarm, navigation, Sirius, etc
>
> I have never seen such a beautiful truck.  I would only add a large
> custom-built camper shell, and someday a bigger rear bumper.
>
> This one is in Lufkin.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Texas Tourist Traps

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Question? Why would anyone plan to ever go to Houston if they didn't have
to?

On Sun, Nov 5, 2017 at 11:03 AM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Next time you are in the piney woods of deep east Texas,
>
> Check out
>
>  Billy Bob's Zip-line
>
> On Hwy. 79 at the Sabine River Bridge
>
> A few miles northeast of the town of Carthage
>
> This road-trip is the first time thar I have experienced the Fall season
> in 3 decades .  It makes it even harder to return to The Concete Valley.
>
>
>
> Sidenote:
>
> If any of you plan to come to Houston soon, I believe TXDOT will have
> opened 2 new lanes Hwy. 290 at Loop 610 up to 43rd St. ( next week )   That
> will slightly ease congestion in this area while they demolish the
> remaining parts of old 290 in that area.Old 290 was built in 1981 in my
> junior year of high-school and has been under continuos construction for 36
> years.   This major interchange should be good for another 10 years at the
> present growth rate. ( Once it is finished in about 2 years.)
>
> Unfortunately there will be a huge bottleneck at the Gessner overpass
> north to Jones Road.   So the average result is it will still take a long
> time to drive that route to and from Austin and College Station for several
> more years.   Once that phase finishes, TXDOT will move the bottleneck to
> the future overpass at the Harris County line where the new giant Buccee's
> is.
>
> So it will be at least 10 years before an interstate quality highway
> reaches the town of Praire View.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] sort of TCR related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

WHAT THE HELL DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING?

On Mon, Oct 30, 2017 at 9:30 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> For those of you all that missed the evening rock concert on the porch of
> The Paradise Canyon Lodge.
>
> it sounded far better than the sound in the music video in the link below:
>
> https://youtu.be/TsOCQFRWUng
>
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] A photo of Mars

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Does anyone thing a Sequoia could make it to Mars? Perhaps with the help of
NASA Bockbeer could be the first to drive to Mars? We could contact the
Mars candy company to furnish him with enough Mars bars to make the trip.

On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 2:24 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> This very fuzzy photo is the latest released by NASA of the rover
> Curiosity's ridge-walking trip.
>
> Still no caves found, nor much of anything that the general public would
> be enthusiastic about.
>
> However, if you zoom in to the cracks of each rock, you can see thousands
> of years of erosion by a variety of forces.  Probably from sandstorms,
> heating and cooling, and maybe even some find of chemical erosion, and
> maybe even a liquid compound from a eon or even eons ago.
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Langtry caving

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I went to Langtry Leads twice. And to a sink out there somewhere. Did some
caving on the Alamo Village Ranch for Happy Shahan looking for guano to
mine. All a long time ago.

On Thu, Oct 19, 2017 at 11:43 AM, Fritz Holt via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> David,
> Good information. What are the names of the other two caves? I have made
> the drop into the main cave in the Hwy. 90 cut at Langtry some years ago
> with Preston McMichael and other friends.
> Fritz Holt
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Oct 19, 2017, at 10:53 AM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > I mentioned last month that I had discovered that the landowner of the 3
> big caves out at the big ranch north of the town of Langtry had passed away.
> >
> > I made a diligent effort to contact his large family and offer
> condolences.
> >
> > They are now aware of my intentions.
> >
> > I can only hope that someday one of them will contact me expressing
> interest in assistance with visiting the caves or reach out on their own to
> another caver.
> >
> > I have guided several trips into each of the 3 caves, but the last time
> was at about 19 years ago.  I am not in good enough health to do it any
> time soon.
> >
> > These caves are warmer and dustier and drier than caves in the Hill
> Country.Emerald Sink probably has a huge bat population.
> >
> > Proper gear is just a caving quality headlamp ( $ 30 to $ 70 from Frys
> ), jeans and t-shirt, plenty of water or Gatorade and some lightweight
> cotton gloves and any kind of helmet.
> >
> > Thin kneepads for those who can not tolerate occasional crawling.
> >
> > Maybe something new will happen in 2018 in the Langtry Caves.
> >
> > But as of October 19, I do not know if they want cavers to contact them,
> or who in their family wants to be the cave contact, or even if any of them
> still own the ranch.
> >
> > I do not plan to ever reach out to them again.   The ball is in their
> court.
> >
> > If my effort fails, then another caver should try, or attempt a
> different approach method, but at least wait a few months.
> >
> > David Locklear
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Re: [Texascavers] [TCR 2017 Success!]

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Sorry I missed it but my truck caught fire and burned so it wasn't there to
use. Anyway maybe next year?

On Tue, Oct 17, 2017 at 3:38 PM, Denise P via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Great TCR, you have ended your reign on a high note, Don! Thanks for all
> you have done to make TCR so much fun and a bonding event for cavers!
>
>
> I wanted to offer a special shout out to Pete Strickland and crew for the
> always fantastic hot tub and sauna! It's a ton of work and we really
> appreciate it!
>
>
> Cheers,
> Denise
>
>
> --
> *From:* Texascavers  on behalf of
> Don Arburn via Texascavers 
> *Sent:* Sunday, October 15, 2017 11:25 PM
> *To:* TSA Cavers List
> *Cc:* Don Arburn
> *Subject:* [Texascavers] [TCR 2017 Success!]
>
> Hey everyone, another successful Texas cavers reunion is behind us now,
> well done! Good job everybody! It was awesome! IT WAS!
>
> Not much to report in the Lost & Found Department this year, for once, yay!
>
> The owner is happy, the park is clean. Next years deposit is paid, no date
> set yet.
>
> THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR HELP!!!
>
> I didn’t want to harsh your mellow, on Saturday night, but 2017 was my
> last TCR as Director. I did six TCRs. I’m sorry folks, it was fun,
> rewarding and an adventure! My resignation is on a high point, I feel, with
> TCR is in good shape with a head start on 2018, with a year to solve my
> absence.
>
> The music was very very good!
> The food was very very good! Great job!!
> We had INTERNATIONAL Cavers visit from Mexico!
> We had David Locklear!
> The NSS represented!
> The Texas Contingent represented!
> The Aggies had a challenging Speleolympics course!
> There was a REBELAY course!
> We had a hot tub, sauna AND spring water!
> There was a SLIDESHOW!
> There were POWERWAGONS in service!
> There was a HUGE board game.
> There were barbarian Viking HOARDS!!
> We had MUD GLADIATORS!!
> There was schmoozing, I SAW IT!
> People smiled!
> What more can you ask for?
> I’m happy!
>
> Thank you
> —Don
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Re: [Texascavers] Ride offer

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Fascinating stuff.

On Fri, Oct 13, 2017 at 6:03 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
>
> I am in the tiny town of Round Top heading west towards LaGrange  It is
> 6:00 p.m. on Friday.  I am in my Sequoia.  I only have room for one person,
> as I am hauling some irrelevant junk.
>
> 281-995-8487 <(281)%20995-8487> ( text me )
>
> I will go to TCR if I find a rider.
>
> If not, I will probably still go.  I should be passing Seguin around 9 p.m.
>
> If anybody is still packing and has an extra pair of size 13 or XXL beach
> shoes, I will buy them.  Otherwise, I will stop at Walmart and get some.
>
> All I am bringing is a cot and one caving boot.  I could not find the
> other one, nor any of my camping gear, nor even an ice-chest.  I dug around
> in my cluttered storage unit, but it was 140 degrees in there, and I
> finally just said ph**k it.
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Facebook related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I read them.

On Wed, Oct 11, 2017 at 4:39 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> From David Locklear
> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>
> I have started some off-topic venting about current news related events in
> the media. (on my private Facebook page) at:
>
> https://www.facebook.com/dlocklear01
>
> I have been trying hard to stay off the internet for 2 months, but
> Facebook seems to be best for venting.
>
> There is a public Facebook page for cavers to vent
>
> https://www.facebook.com/groups/Venting.Cavers/
>
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Re: [Texascavers] A personal intimate story

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

A good tale of woe. David ought to write a book about all the cares and
woes he has suffered. He seems to be followed by that dark cloud the
character in L'l Abner had. Nothing ever works out in the end and life
usually turns out miserable. I think I read a book similar to that once
about a guy in New Orleans.

On Sun, Oct 8, 2017 at 6:28 AM, Nancy Weaver via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> pretty amazing view into a border family   way different from any
> experiences I’ve had.  thanks for sharing
> Nancy
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Re: [Texascavers] not Loose at all

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Mexico near Mante. Richard Smith stayed up top and went into a pueblo for a
beer. The covers were in the pit. Along came a capesino saw the rope and
pulled it up and took it home. Thankfully Richard returned and there was
more rope in the truck.

On Fri, Sep 22, 2017 at 10:29 PM, Dwight via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Ah yes!.  Rich was NOT loose!
>
> DirtDoc
>
>
> --
> *From: *"Linda Starr" 
> *To: *"Logan McNatt" 
> *Cc: *"Lee H. Skinner" , "New Mexico Cavers" <
> swrcav...@googlegroups.com>, "Texas Cavers" 
> *Sent: *Friday, September 22, 2017 2:20:51 PM
> *Subject: *Re: [SWR CAVERS] Indiana University freshman found after
> surviving three days in a cave
>
> I remember an incident many years ago in the '70s, my first trip to Fort
> Stanton Cave, maybe, where we locked one of our cavers in the cave.  We
> didn't go anywhere and were all camped at the cave when we noticed Rich
> Loose was not with us.  We hollered for him with no answer and went to the
> cave and there he was at the gate, slightly disgruntled. This was a
> different situation with a supervised youth group.  It sounds like a major
> screw-up in the leadership.
>
> Linda Starr
>
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Re: [Texascavers] "Drone" use in Mexico cave hunting

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

How do male bees find caves?

On Wed, Sep 20, 2017 at 5:54 PM, Terry Holsinger via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> A short PSA for those cavers going/caving in Mexico and looking at using a
> Drone while in country.
>
> Reading a recent page about "Drone laws by country" I noted that the
> recreational use of a drone in Mexico is RESTRICTED for foreigners.
>
> I.E. it is illegal for foreigner to use a drone without a permit.
>
> There is little to no enforcement of this BUT IF the authorities decided
> to, they can legally take your drone and fine/jail you.
>
> Going a little deeper and looking for a bit more information I found the
> following discussion of this matter, here lifted from a drone flyers forum:
>
> "The Mexican regulation does not allow giving a permit to fly a Foreign
> Remotely Piloted Aircraft Systems (RPAS) drone in Mexico. This prohibition
> is established in Circular Obligatoria CO AV-23/10 R3 paragraph 7.2.y). For
> your information the Circular Obligatoria aforementioned establishes the
> requirements and limitations to operate RPAS in Mexican airspace and it is
> in Spanish only. If you want, you could obtain a copy of the Circular
> Obligatoria in the following link:
>
> http://www.sct.gob.mx/fileadmin/DireccionesGrales/DGAC-
> archivo/modulo3/co-av-23-10-r3.pdf
>
> A direct question of so it IS illegal for any US citizen to operate a
> drone in Mexico:
>
> His first reply:
>
> "It is correct, it is not possible to grant authorization for pilots and
> US companies to provide services to Drones to Mexico, until there is a
> bilateral agreement where the rules for their acceptance are established
> for both countries."​
>
> I asked if this applied to both commercial and rec fliers; he replied: '
>
> "Is correct, it that applies to both commercial & recreational fliers, and
> so is necessary obtain Bilateral Agreement between FAA and DGAC, for
> established the conditions and limitations for do it."​
>
>
> BTW these reply's came from this guy:
>
> ng. Pablo Carranza Plata.
> Director General AdjuntO de Aviación
> DIRECCION GENERAL DE AERONAUTICA CIVIL
> Tels. (+52 55) 5723-9300 / 5482-4100 Ext. 18070,
> Blvd. Adolfo López Mateos 1990, 2º piso
> 
> Col. Los Alpes Tlacopac, Del. Álvaro Obregón,
> C.P. 01010, en México, D. F.​"
>
> Original page link:
>
> https://petapixel.com/2017/09/20/heres-map-date-drone-laws-every-country/
>
> forums thread link:
>
> https://phantompilots.com/threads/flying-in-mexico-prohibite
> d-for-americans.104976/
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Re: [Texascavers] Flood relief options

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Thou art a good fellow.

On Mon, Aug 28, 2017 at 2:43 PM, Fritz Holt via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

>
> This is my second invitation to coastal Texas Cavers to offer a free safe
> and dry place to stay if you can drive to my home in Dripping Springs, 25
> miles west of Austin on highway 290. We have three extra bedrooms with
> baths for any of our group in need. Just call me or June and let us know
> you are coming.
> Fritz Holt
> 713-818-2496
> fritz...@gmail.com
> June - 832-260-2526
>
> Sent from my iPhone
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Re: [Texascavers] Hello older cavers

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

They have their home in Rockport.

On Sun, Aug 27, 2017 at 6:21 PM, Louise Power via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Hello, especially Austin cavers from the 60s
>
>
> Have any of you heard from Tom and Janie White, formerly of Austin. They
> live on the coast facing the Gulf. My sister Jodie and I are worried.
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Tom & Janie White

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

They live in Rockport. Tom was a caver back in the sixties and early
seventies. He was one of the caver cooks.

On Sun, Aug 27, 2017 at 7:20 PM, Logan McNatt via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Louise, what years did they cave and who would they know? Where do they
> live on the Gulf?
> I have a fairly long contact list of old-time Austin cavers who don't
> subscribe to most social media. So send me names of people who associated
> with
> them, if you can remember.
>
> I certainly remember the name Tom White, but no details.
> LowGun
> 512-462-9581 <(512)%20462-9581> hm
>
>
> On 8/27/2017 6:21 PM, Louise Power via Texascavers wrote:
>
> Hello, especially Austin cavers from the 60s
>
>
> Have any of you heard from Tom and Janie White, formerly of Austin. They
> live on the coast facing the Gulf. My sister Jodie and I are worried.
>
>
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>
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Re: [Texascavers] [FYI] [@texascaversreunion] [Facebook]

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I know it is there but hardly ever go there. I go to Facebook less
frequently than e-mail.

On Sun, Aug 20, 2017 at 10:24 PM, Louise Power via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I see that you, like many others, just assume that everybody uses Facebook
> and all those other social media sites. Personally, I don't think anybody
> needs to know that much about me or that I need to know that much about
> anybody else. I get along just fine with email.
>
>
> --
> *From:* Texascavers  on behalf of
> Don Arburn via Texascavers 
> *Sent:* Tuesday, August 8, 2017 2:49 PM
> *To:* TSA Cavers List
> *Cc:* Don Arburn
> *Subject:* [Texascavers] [FYI] [@texascaversreunion] [Facebook]
>
> FYI
> For those who may not know TCR has a Facebook page. One may search for it
> using: @texascaversreunion
> Keep up with the latest notices, notifications & information.
>
> TCR needs a registration volunteer, Kris Peña cannot make it this year.
> Chat with Rob Bisset!
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> 
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> Association.
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> Messages by Thread [Texascavers] Songam Cavern David via Texascavers
> [Texascavers] New news story ? David via Texascavers [Texascavers] a new
> bat video ?
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] [TCR Kegs]&[Freetail Brewing]

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Never heard of them. But that isn't a stretch. Deer corn has only Bud Lite.

On Mon, Aug 7, 2017 at 11:03 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Anyone volunteering to get Kegs from Shiner, if the Man of Steele, works
> his magic again?
>
> Also
>
> Anyone have a contact over at Freetail Brewing?
>
> --Don
>
>
>
> --Don
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Re: [Texascavers] Speleo-vehicle related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Dear David
You my friend are as they say "SNAKE BIT". I have never experienced the
devastation you have, ever in 76 years. Either you are a tee total dumb ass
the you buy cars or they bite you on the butt and you don't realize it.


On Thu, Jul 27, 2017 at 7:15 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> The Texas Caver is occasionally looking for someone to write an article.
>
> One idea for a creative enthusiastic person is to write a good article
> about topics related to vehicles that cavers use to go caving.
>
>
> For example,
>
> One thing I learned in my ill-fated ordeal with my Sequoia is that on late
> mode cars, the fan-belts are not made of reinforced neoprene, but instead a
> rubber-like compound refered to as EPDM
> ( ethylene propylene diene monomer ).
>
> I was incensed/irked that the mechanic recommended reusing my old fan belt
> which might have had 191,000 miles on it. ( As he had the motor out of the
> car and had to do the same amount of work whether or not he used a new or
> an old belt. )  The mechanic insisted money spent there could be better
> spent elsewhere.  I sensed he could not justify charging me $ 100 for it,
> so it was not worth his over-inflated ego. Plus when it breaks, he gives
> some mechanic a high-paying easy repair job. ( I am not too fond of
> auto-shops at the moment ).
>
> It turns out the best way to inspect today's serpentine fan-belts is to
> use a magnifying glass and a light and look deep in the center of the
> groove for signs of thinning rubber. These EPDM belts allegedly last 10
> years.
>
> Allegedly, you can buy a premium quality version which is allegedly better
> than the stock fan-belt from the factory.
>
> Personally, I have never had a serpentine fan-belt fail in 4 cars with
> each having nearly 200,000 milrs, but I do not know if those were made of
> EPDM.
>
> I guess once we all have autonomous electric cars it won't matter.
>
> David Locklear
>
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[Texascavers] WHERE IS VICO?

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I am told that I need to be in touch with Vico

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Re: [Texascavers] National Park Pass fee to increase

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Got mine at Mt. Washington. Such a deal. Sometimes at Big Bend I just pay
the fee. They need it.

On Wed, Jul 19, 2017 at 7:34 AM, PRESTON FORSYTHE via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> The best $10  I have ever spent! The National Park Senior Pass. We have
> really used it over the years.
>
> Preston Forsythe in KY
>
>
> On Tuesday, July 18, 2017 10:15 PM, Louise Power via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>
> Bill,
>
> I agree. With all that Park Service has to pay for and for all they do for
> our parks and the fact that the Orange Menace's Congress seems to be
> cutting back the budgets for all the land management agencies, we shouldn't
> resent paying more considering what we get for our money. I've worked for
> both NPS and BLM and believe me they're not easy jobs.
>
> Louise
>
>
> --
> *From:* Texascavers  on behalf of
> Bill Steele via Texascavers 
> *Sent:* Tuesday, July 18, 2017 8:54 AM
> *To:* texascavers@texascavers.com
> *Cc:* Bill Steele
> *Subject:* Re: [Texascavers] National Park Pass fee to increase
>
> I got one in Zion National Park last year. It cost me $10 for a lifetime
> pass. It includes everyone in the vehicle with me. I told the NPS guy it
> was the best deal in the country and an incentive to live a long time.
>
> Bill Steele
> cwilliamste...@gmail.com
>
> > On Jul 19, 2017, at 1:37 AM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > I am sure you all have heard that if you qualify for a Senior Pass with
> NPS, and
> > do not have one that you should order one ASAP as the fee will increase
> in six weeks.
> >
> > I do not have the link in front of me.
> > ___
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> 
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> 
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> Messages by Thread [Texascavers] Photo request: Blaine and Rustler
> Formations Andrea Croskrey via Texascavers. Re: [Texascavers] Photo
> request: Blaine and Rustler ...
>
>
> > http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
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> request: Blaine and Rustler ...
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Old Scout 4x4 for sale

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Didn't Tonto ride Scout or was it Little Beaver?

On Sat, Jul 15, 2017 at 12:26 PM, Louise Power via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Looks like another money eater to me.
>
>
> --
> *From:* Texascavers  on behalf of
> David via Texascavers 
> *Sent:* Friday, July 14, 2017 2:35 PM
> *To:* CaveTex
> *Cc:* David
> *Subject:* [Texascavers] Old Scout 4x4 for sale
>
> This ancient thing is powder-coated forest green.  The vehicle has not
> passed inspection in 3 years.   Automatic transmission.  Leaf-springs under
> axles.  All-terrain tires are ruined.
>
> Frame is heavily rusted.   Tie-rods and such all worn out.  Shocks on back
> look new.
>
> Diamond-plate truck-bed
>
> 713-641-0980 <(713)%20641-0980> ( dealer )
>
> International Scout 2.
>
> Really good bumpers.
>
> Excellent ground clearance.
>
> Real tailgate
>
> 2 bucket seats.
>
> As cool as it would be to fix it up, a used Xterra would be such a better
> investment.
>
> It is a project for rich folks.   Right ??
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Don Arburn

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Nope nary a contact so I have left the building as go now. This is of
course silly as we all know and shouldn't be like this.


On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 8:34 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> And why have you not spoken to her? It's not like she is a recluse,
> introvert or in hiding. Amy, please talk to Old Man Wisdom.
>
>
> --Don
>
> On Jul 14, 2017, at 8:32 PM, Charles Loving <lovingi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Well good but I have had zero contact with this person who is head cook.
> Like I said I had a lot of things that I was lining up. But with zero
> contact with this AMY I have decided to retreat.
>
> On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 8:24 PM, Don Arburn <donarb...@me.com> wrote:
>
>> I replied to your FB post. I have not disappeared, I am not hiding, I am
>> easy to find. Amy Morton is head cook. She has created a FB TCR cooks page
>> for just these discussions. As I said before, you need to speak with her.
>> We welcome your help, experience and insight.
>>
>> We must take possession of the cooks trailer and she and I must inventory
>> it FIRST.
>>
>> We need meat.
>>
>> My last name is spelt aRburn
>>
>>
>> --Don
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --Don
>> > On Jul 14, 2017, at 8:18 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > This chap seems to have disappeared. I volunteered to help cook but got
>> zero response. I had a few of the old caver cooks in line but since there
>> seems to be zero interest. Don i had a few things lined up but it seems
>> that no one cares that there is anything organized. So black beans, a hog,
>> fajitas, corn on the cob and salad and desert are up to you now since no
>> one seems to give a damn that we could produce this. Sorry Mr Don. Lost and
>> gone forever dreadful sorry Clemintine.
>> >
>> > --
>> > Charlie Loving
>> > ___
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>> > http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Charlie Loving
>
>
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[Texascavers] Don Aburn

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

This chap seems to have disappeared. I volunteered to help cook but got
zero response. I had a few of the old caver cooks in line but since there
seems to be zero interest. Don i had a few things lined up but it seems
that no one cares that there is anything organized. So black beans, a hog,
fajitas, corn on the cob and salad and desert are up to you now since no
one seems to give a damn that we could produce this. Sorry Mr Don. Lost and
gone forever dreadful sorry Clemintine.

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Re: [Texascavers] A tiny new LED pen-light

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I bought a bee's wax candle to use caving. Seems to work if there is no
wind.


On Fri, Jul 14, 2017 at 7:30 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> This light is remarkable in that it very easily fits in your shirt
> pocket.  It is only a little bigger than a cigarette.
>
> Motorola ReLED500 ( MR500 )
>
> Sold at Fry"s Store $ 14.99, plus tax.
>
> Advertises 80 lumens on one triple-A alkaline  battery.
>
> The unique feature is it has a dimmer setting and a clip facing towards
> the lens so that you could clip it to your chest-harness.
>
> Claims to be waterproof to one meter.  Looks well-made.
>
> The main question I have is how good is the switch, as it comes in
> tamper-proof packaging.
>
> This will someday be my next light.
>
> There is also a dual-triple-A model called "ReLED515."Pelican and
> Coast and Streamlight probably beat them to that.  However this one is
> smaller and only $ 19.99 plus tax.
>
> David Locklear
> ( not officially stir-crazy yet, but getting there )
>
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Re: [Texascavers] my unsubscribe call may result in a new caver in India!

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Very cool.

On Tue, Jul 11, 2017 at 6:17 AM, Jacqueline Thomas via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Nicely done, Logan!
>
>
>
> J. LaRue Thomas
> jlrtho...@verizon.net
>
>
> > On Jul 10, 2017, at 11:30 PM, Logan McNatt via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > I want to share an unusual phone conversation I had today. As one of the
> Texas Speleological Survey Directors, I sometimes get unsolicited "Small
> Business" mailings to TSS c/o my address. Got one today from Dell, so I
> called to unsubscribe. The representative needed the exact address info to
> cancel it. Gave it to him, and of course had to spell Speleological. Asked
> him if he knew what it meant, and of course he didn't.
> >
> > When I told him it was the study and exploration of caves, he said "Wow,
> that sounds interesting. I enjoy trekking in the wilderness." I asked him
> where he lives--India. He asked more questions, so I gave him several
> website links (e.g. Sotano de las Golondrinas), which he looked at while we
> were talking. Told him I'm not familiar with caves in India. I thought we
> could get cut off at any time, so reached for the closest thing at hand--
> my copy of Atlas of The Great Caves of the World (Courbon, Chabert, Bosted,
> and Lindsley, 1989). We talked for about 20 minutes, and he said he was
> going to search online for caving groups in India. He is 24 years old,
> personable, and eager to learn and experience a new adventure. He actually
> gave me his email and asked me to send any more info I could.
> >
> > So, cavers, please send any contacts, references, and suggestions
> regarding cavers and caves in India to me. I don't want to give out his
> email address, but will forward them to him. Based on our brief
> conversation and his attitude, I think he has strong potential to become a
> hardcore caver.
> >
> > Thanks,
> >
> > Logan McNatt
> > Austin, TX
> > NSS 11274 RL (FE)
> > ___
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Re: [Texascavers] Speleo-ready truck

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Chris drove that vehicle on our trip to the Huasteca. It was an awesome
truck but it got like minus gallons per mile. My pickup didn't make it to
the top but Chris's did a mean attack vehicle and it was impressive.

On Mon, Jul 10, 2017 at 6:39 PM, Chris Vreeland via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I can guarantee that thing gets 10 mpg hiway, 8 mpg city. It's a year or
> two newer than The Grey Pendejo was, but essentially the same truck with
> minor body style differences. Not a smart long-distance choice unless
> you're unimaginably wealthy.
>
> Chris Vreeland
>
> > On Jul 10, 2017, at 5:27 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > I found this antique truck near the town of Chapell Hill on Hwy. 290
> >
> > Solid front axle with leaf-springs.  Dual gas tank.  3 speed manual on
> the floor
> >
> > Custom Deluxe 20.
> >
> > Diamond-plate flat-bed
> >
> > Super-duty bumpers
> >
> > Clean with metallic paint job.
> >
> > Bench seat.
> >
> > Headache rack.
> >
> > Tel.  979-421-3866
> >
> > I am taking a wild guess it is a 1982 Chevrolet K20.
> >
> > Heavy duty custom side-rails.
> >
> > I have a rear photo.
> >
> > David Locklear
> > <20170710_171043.jpg>
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Re: [Texascavers] Texas culture ?

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I don't know when it was? Nurdoo and Zeplin joined the NSS back in 1968 or
so with the purpose of finding the Holy Carbide Light which was said to
have been stolen from the NSS National Museum in the Bronx. It turned out
that the light was taken and the culprits escaped on a subway to Brooklyn.
That was the last that anyone heard of it. Now many years later the light
is still missing. There are rumors that it may have been taken to Mexico
where it was placed on a pile of breakdown. The last person to see it was
Dave Bockbeer. The keepers of the light were preening him as a human
sacrifice to the God Sequoia.

On Thu, Jul 6, 2017 at 5:21 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> This photo is a mural on the side of a mobile taco vendor in Houston.
>
> There appears to be a silhouette of a bat flying out of the cave to the
> left.  Or is that just a hole in the cliff ?
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Consumer tip - smartphones

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I got a smart phone and am too dumb to make it work properly. It rings and
I can't figure out how to answer it. I want my old flip phone back and
besides there is no service out here anyhow.

On Wed, Jul 5, 2017 at 8:44 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Cavers should spend their money caving and not on frivolous things like
> new smartphones and Toyota Sequoias.
>
> Some of the new Android smartphones use a new type of fancy connector that
> allow you to easily insert the charge cord. Sounds great.   Right ??
>
> It has been my experience these  "Type-C USB" cords fail faster than the
> older micro-USB.   These cords start at $ 22 ( with tax ) at Best Buy.
>
> I would not recommend these phones to cavers who are very frugal.  Meaning
> the LG G6.  I also bet the connection inside the phone is just as cheesy,
> meaning avoid the cheap phones like ZTE and Alcatel that use this.   I
> suspect that manufacturing the oval-like shape of the connector is
> difficult.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] speleo-vehicle related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Sheesh Locklear you have a Black Cloud over you. Why don't you get Savas or
one of the caver mechanics to fix your Lemon. They are most trustworthy.
Karst Walker for one has fixed my vehicle on occasion between trips to
Menard. You whine too much and are loosing credibility.

On Sun, Jul 2, 2017 at 12:23 AM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> This post is related to late model vehicles.
>
>
>
> In the event that any cavers or friends of cavers out there ever decide to
> purchase a Toyota Tundra
> or Toyota Sequoia, I just thought I would let you all know that if your
> motor ever does need
> to be replaced what the going price is for a "used motor" on e-Bay.
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/2007-Toyota-Tundra-5-7L-Engine-
> Motor-8cyl-OEM-58K-Miles-LKQ-153892788-/192224636701?fits=
> Year%3A2009%7CMake%3AToyota%7CModel%3ASequoia=item2cc17b2f1d:g:
> 9hgAAOSwT5xZSxQA=mtr
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/2014-Toyota-Tundra-5-7L-Engine-
> Motor-8cyl-OEM-43K-Miles-LKQ-152639713-/362004718021?fits=
> Year%3A2009%7CMake%3AToyota%7CModel%3ASequoia=
> 864020893=item544929a1c5:g:jlgAAOSw-29ZPEjk=mtr
>
> http://www.ebay.com/itm/2010-Toyota-Tundra-5-7L-Engine-
> Motor-8cyl-OEM-120K-Miles-LKQ-140830971-/362018163598?fits=
> Year%3A2009%7CMake%3AToyota%7CModel%3ASequoia=
> item5449f6cb8e:g:z9wAAOSw9~5ZTZtM=mtr
>
>
> I can only hope now that the auto mechanic will make a faithful effort to
> purchase the best motor that he can find.  Of course, he will charge me
> an arm just for doing the work of finding the motor and delivering it to
> his shop.How can you trust a stranger to make such an important decision
> for you ??
>
> One of the ironic things to my newest predicament, is that I have about $
> 1,000 worth of tools in my rental storage unit.   I once put a
> motor in my speleo-station wagon by myself, and I even took a class at A
> to restore an old 1952 Ford 8-N tractor from a rusty
> state at a junk-yard to a pristine state of museum quality.But there
> is no way I could pull that Sequoia motor out and put a new
> one in by myself.
>
> The mechanic alleges that the combined cost of labor and other parts is
> nearly twice the cost of whatever motor
> he ends up purchasing.
>
> With my current string of misfortune, I will drive the Sequoia off his lot
> in about 2 weeks and on the way home, the transmission with 190,000 miles
> will fail before I even get home. I just have to be optimistic that no
> more repairs will be needed for a year.Right ??
>
> Either way, my personal life is going to have to become far more sedentary
> than it already was.  ( I had gone completely
> stir-crazy before this event ).   This fiasco may have even been my
> last road-trip.
>
>
> I went to my 35 year high-school reunion last night and that sort-of
> cheered me up, as some of my classmates were also knee-deep in
> guano.   Their parents were caring for their kids, or they had temporarily
> moved back in with their parents, or were on their 4th marriage,
> or were too drunk to remember why they came to the reunion.It was
> almost like an alcoholics anonymous meeting.   Most
> of us had had similar setbacks in life, with car-accidents, lost friends
> and family and failed jobs.We mostly talked about when we first got
> a microwave oven, and how many of our bones and muscles ache. I wish I
> had gone to a high school in a karst area with a caving club.
> Then the reunion would have been cool.
>
> David Locklear
>
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[Texascavers] OK

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

A poll of Texas cagers. I once upon a time was a cook. I am asking if there
is any interest in joining in another massive cooking for OTR. They way we
did it in the past, or the way I did it was to get volunteers to do what
they did best and to do enough. Enough was an arbitrary number. We got lots
of things. We could do it again. Six or seven of my stalwarts are dead now
so I have to beg for others to step up. Cook what ever you feel like
cooking. And we will serve it.

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Re: [Texascavers] older cars/correct phone number

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

New cars and old cars. I usually buy a new car and bite the bullet and keep
it until it is an old car, 10 or 15 years. That way I know the car or
truck. Not everyone can do that of course but it has worked well. My
vehicle world started  with a Cushman motor scooter back in El Paso. It was
junk when I got it. It served to get me to work every afternoon. I saved up
and managed to get a 1954 Ford Coup with a V-8, four barrel carb and became
a menace on the roads. It was great for drag racing on Alameda Drive.

On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 1:59 PM, Nancy Weaver via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> oops 512.924.3391
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Re: [Texascavers] Thank you for the advice

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Dead Sequoia no bueno. Me thinks it should be relegated to boat anchor or
albatross t around your neck hat you do not need. If it were me I would
ditch it ASAP and come to grips with your life and stop being so much of a
dufus. Donate the damn thing to KFU or some such.

New cars cost a fortune and it is awful to have to pay off a car that is
dead and in car heaven or hell. I think a smaller vehicle would be a good
idea, maybe a Fiat,  Yugo or a Lada. They would be cheap.

 I drove a Ford  Ranger for 250,000 miles and gave it to my boy child and
360,000 miles  later it is still running and he is actually going to sell
it. Amazing. Of course it looks like crap.

My 2003 Ford pickup has 285,000 miles on it and still runs. Fixed the
breaks a few times, tightened the transmission and adjusted the clutch and
I change the oil every 3,000 miles. It is a Manuel transmission which the
Deer Corn mechanic recommends. If it were an automatic it would be long ago
dead he says and he wants to buy the silly thing.

My wife's Mazda SUV is also a manual six speed. It was the only one in San
Antonio, San Mucus, and the area. My Ford was the only one in Texas at the
time and I had to go to Dallas to get it. The 1983 Bronco I got from Rune
Burnet still runs and has a zillion miles on it, it has been to Chiappas
and back several times and to R14 on regular bi-monthly trips.

So, all this is meaningless BS. Buy something cheap and buy something with
a warranty that is longer than a week.

On Thu, Jun 29, 2017 at 10:31 AM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I had been hoping and hoping to write a happy feel-good story,
> as I have never done that before.   But the stars did not align
> that way. My Sequoia has died, and needs a new motor.
>
>
>
> Below is my current thoughts on the matter, but it would be best
> now to just hit the delete button as it is too depressing to read.
>
>
>
>
> Numerous cavers offered me sound advice about my situation
> with my broke-down Sequoia.  I just wanted to say thank you.
> Although, I was poking fun at myself for being such a klutz, I was
> stressing out about it all.
>
> A series of events unfolded last Wednesday, after my Sequoia first stalled
> and died.
> My first decision seemed to have a domino-effect to make it worse.
> Had I immediately called
> GEICO and towed the Sequioa to a shop, I might could have fixed
> it for under $ 2,000. But I put 100% of my faith and money in the
> road-side mobile
> mechanic, as I was way too optimistic that it was a minor problem.
>
> In hindsight, the mobile-mechanics final efforts to help me
> may have damaged the engine.   He seemed to be trying his best to help me,
> and I was grateful to him
> at the time, as it seemed like a good fortune of him showing up, and I was
> out of options.   But
> paying him cleaned out all my emergency money, and in the end,  I had to
> call relatives
> for help.   Almost all of those relatives, I am on unpleasant terms with.
>
> Had the plan been to change the motor, I should have left the vehicle in
> Mansfield,
> and focused on borrowing the money. But again, I chose to make the
> situation
> worse. I towed it to an expensive shop in Houston, hoping they had a
> better mechanic
> with a better option than motor replacement.
>
> Anyways, the Sequoia eventually arrived there, and that mechanic
> charged a 3rd diagnostic fee. He offered 2 options:A used motor
> with a 3 month warranty, or a new motor with a 3 year warranty.But the
> problem now, is that he is probably one of the most expensive shops in
> town, when
> it comes to hourly labor charges.  He did say he could have it back on
> the
> road in a week.He also said the labor on the new motor would be far
> greater. Meaning this repair is going to be around a $ 12,000
> nightmare.
>
> So my dilemma today, is to borrow money from my mom, and replace the motor,
> or send the Sequoia to a scrap yard. The transmission has 192,000
> miles on it.
> The brakes need immediate replacement. Several of you said to just
> junk it.
> I am 53 and my mom is 70.I love my mom, but I would not want to borrow
> money
> from her if I were dying.I already owe her a thousand dollars.She
> does not
> have any money, but she has good credit.
>
> This problem now appears to be my 2nd biggest mistake in life, but that is
> only
> because my memory is so bad.
>
> At this stage, I would have been better off to just abandon the Sequoia
> when it first
> broke down.  I think I already have wasted nearly $ 2,000. I still
> owe my
> credit union $ 8,700 on the car-loan.
>
> I am going to be in a very deep pickle jar for many years to come.I am
> just going to have to
> learn how to live in a pickle jar.   Right ??
>
> In hindsight now, buying my beloved Sequoia, was a setback.But I
> enjoyed it for 14 months.
>
> David Locklear
>
> ___
> 

Re: [Texascavers] semi-final Road-Trip report

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Mexico is not a good idea. They still have my Bronco on their records. They
are sticklers about that thought there are all those pickups in tow going
to Piedras.

On Tue, Jun 27, 2017 at 8:01 PM, Mark Minton via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> David,
>
>
> Give your old car to NPR via the Vehicle Donation Program. They'll take
> anything, even cars that don't run, and get something for it. If you
> abandon the car in Mexico you'll end up on their shit list and be banned
> from bringing in a vehicle in the future.
>
> Mark Minton
> mmin...@caver.net
>
> On Tue, 27 Jun, 2017 at 1:01 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> I must get rid of my Camry as soon as I have other transportation..   Does
> anybody want to buy a beat-up abused Camry ?   I plan to abandon it in
> Mexico in front of my niece's house in about 2 weeks and take the bus home.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Road trip Tip # 232

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Interesting. I only use my ATN card. It works in Mexico and you
get pesos back at the national rate. I used it in SLP and R14 as well as
the PEMEX in Cedral.
On Mon, Jun 26, 2017 at 5:35 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I might could have avoided the $ six dollar ATM fee at the Greyhound bus
> stop ( in the Waxahachie Gas Station ) had I just bought a beverage and
> asked for $ 60 cash back.
>
> All that sort of stuff takes practice.  I seldom use ATM cards and have
> only recently experimented with them.
>
> My Sequoia should be half-way to Houston by now on a big flat-bed truck, I
> presume.
>
> I may have to order sardines in bulk.   I lived off rice-cakes for 3 days
> one time in 1989 after I was laid off for the first time.   I did not know
> one could ask the gov't for help and missed the first 3 weeks of
> unemployment checks. But that turned out to be a huge blessing in
> diguise, as my boss was in the same line that day.   I learned a lot about
> life that day.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Any cavers near Mansfield, Texas ??

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Why don't you sell it to the mechanic? Ha might buy it? And you say you
have a Camray. Sitting for three months won't help it any. The battery, the
fuel will turn to schlac. The tyres will start rotting. I say get rid of it
before it eats you alive.

On Sun, Jun 25, 2017 at 10:56 AM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I must force myself to take an internet hiatus and focus
> on getting out of a giant pickle jar.
>
> Currently, the situation is somewhat like Humpty Dumpty,
> except there are not yet any king's men, or any king's horses.
>
> Here is my latest Craigslist ad:
>
>   https://houston.craigslist.org/com/6192188142.html
>
> Please email me privately, if you want to hear about lots of bizarre drama
> that
> is about to unfold.The next few weeks will certainly involve
> hitch-hiking,
> sleeping in my hot rental storage unit, giving up Wendy's chocolate
> Frosties
> for about 3 years, and other non-essential things to survive.
>
> I have been here before.   It is all deja vu.
>
> It is just that this time, I have a car-note on a car that does not run,
> and a kid, and a
> mortgage for a house that I do not live in, and I was in good health
> during the last
> pickle-episode.You may think that all sounds sad.I am doing far
> better than those
> landslide victims in Xinmo, or the family that went swimming in Lake
> Temple, or the
> homeless people from Grenfell Tower in London, etc.
>
> There is an old wise expression.
>
>   "Do not let your possessions possess you."
>
> I believe that.However, that guy didn't owe money to people for those
> possessions, or rely on those possesions to get to work.
>
> David Locklear
> 281-995-8487 <(281)%20995-8487> ( text okay )
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] The real NSS Convention

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Bockbeer and his famous sidekick Sequoia.

On Sat, Jun 24, 2017 at 8:51 PM, Nancy Weaver via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> David, I think you have found your forte.  all trip reports should be as
> imagined.  perhaps the pov of the sequoia  next?
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] need auto repair advice

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

But he is HOU?

On Sat, Jun 24, 2017 at 5:55 PM, carl.kunath via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Talk with Sayther, Savvas, or Falgout.  All good Austin caver mechanics.
>
>
>
> Sent from my Sprint Samsung Galaxy S® 6.
>
>  Original message 
> From: David via Texascavers 
> Date: 6/24/17 4:24 PM (GMT-06:00)
> To: texascavers@texascavers.com
> Cc: David 
> Subject: [Texascavers] need auto repair advice
>
> Please email me off line, if you have any suggestions
> how to get out of a remote deep sotano without a rope, and
> a broken leg.
>
> David Locklear
> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>
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Re: [Texascavers] need auto repair advice

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

There is a famous cartoon where a GI in WWII is shooting his broken down
Jeep.

On Sat, Jun 24, 2017 at 4:24 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Please email me off line, if you have any suggestions
> how to get out of a remote deep sotano without a rope, and
> a broken leg.
>
> David Locklear
> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>
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Re: [Texascavers] another intimate personal story

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

I like Bockbeer and have messed about with him a few times. He is a real
hoot. I guess my comments about him and my Bockbeer comic were taken the
wrong way. The last episode had him in the hands of the Giant naked women
of the under world and Karst Walker and BS trying to rescue him. The
tequila mobile was also involved flown by another well known caver. It had
drilled down the area in question. BS was involved with a monster rising
from a sumpmcand Karst was  about to be sacrificed to the Cave Gods. That
was to be continued.

On Fri, Jun 23, 2017 at 8:50 PM, Nancy Weaver via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Mallory - so well written and I totally agree.  I have zero interest in
> going to convention any how righteous I feel about the decision as I read
> David’s travails.  I also recall very fondly the ICS in Kerrville when at
> some banquet or another David set up a golf pitch which added immensely to
> the pleasure of ‘just another’ meal.
> I’m always so amazed by the rather sour folks who diss him.  Just don’t
> read it.  Or better yet, see a shrink and figure out why David’s trip
> reports make you so angry.
>
> cheers,
> Nancy
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Re: [Texascavers] Road-trip Report No. 5

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

NO!

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 6:39 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I am still trying to get home from the NSS Convention.   ( We left the
> Star Center about 11 a.m. on Tuesday. )
>
> I can only guess the Greyhound bus will drop me off in downtown Houston
> before 8 p.m ( Thursday night ).
>
> My options at that point are limited.   I need to get to my Camry about 40
> miles southwest of Houston..A city bus should get me half-way.
>
> Oztotl seems to be looking out for me, so I am optimistic I will get
> within hiking distance.   But I am sensing now very subtly, that I have
> used up my favors with him or her or it.
>
>
>
> The mechanic never called me back.  That is not a good sign.
>
> I lost my last pair of $ 10 reading glasses on the first bus and nearly
> lost my wallet during the frantic bus transfer in Waco.  This was in part
> to some silly shorts that have shallow pockets that I am wearing because my
> host last night would not let me do laundry.
>
> I do not think I could have concocted up a worse road-trip if I had
> diligently tried to.
>
> This road-trip has been the third worse experience of my life only because
> my poor memory can not remember the others.
>
> If I ever do get my Sequoia back to Houston someday, I will have to
> hunker-down and stay put for a while.
>
> In hind-sigh, I would have been better off to fly to the convention, or
> take a bus or hitch-hike or take my Camry.
>
> Any chance I will learn something from this tragedy ?
>
> David Locklear
>
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] The fun is non-stop

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Sequoia... Lemon.  Get shed of it now. A joey pit. You could have bought a
brand new something with what this is costing you. Come on get smart.

The bus stops everywhere. Greyhound is terrible. Get Tornado and go non
stop to Matehuala.

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 2:55 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I caught a ride to Waxahachie.
>
> I am now on a Greyhound bus heading towards Hillsboro, Texas. This bus
> will eventually pass Waco and College Station on its route to Houston.
>
> I used a non-bank ATM for the first time in my life as rural Greyound
> stops do not take plastic ( they want you to use their in-house ATM ?? ).
>  The moronic part of that, is that I was at my bank just an hour ago, but
> was too much of a scaredy-cat to withdraw any cash.
>
> I should be in Houston by 8 pm, but will immediately enter an intense
> chaos of drama that I call "The Realities of Life."
>
>
> The mechanic has had my Sequoia 5 hours.  He alleges that he has no idea
> why it won't start.  He alleges that he suspects a bad crankshaft or timing
> problem.  It does crank.
>
> The mobile-mechanic had said it was mis-firing on cylinder 6, and oil was
> leaking severely onto the new plugs and would foul the plugs.  So far I
> have spent about $ 600 that I was not planning to spend on this ill-fated
> trip, herein known as
>
> "Ill-fated Road-Trip Number 195."
>
>
> For the past 19 hours, I have been in a surreal place that I have spent 30
> years adamantly avoiding.   So it is a huge relief to escape from there.
>
> I should be able to meditate on the bus, and imagine that waterfall that I
> should have gone to visit.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] From bad to worse

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Of course.

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 3:07 PM, Bruce Anderson via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> No that was "Father knows Best". Your thinking of "Animal House".
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 22, 2017, at 2:01 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> Wasn't 'David Knows Best' a teevee show?
>
> On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 12:25 PM, Fritz Holt via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> David,
>> What you should have done is stayed home and taken care of business as
>> your beer budget would have allowed. But then, David knows best.
>> Such hindsight I have. Fritz
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> > On Jun 21, 2017, at 8:34 PM, David via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > I spent the entire day with a roadside mobile-mechanic futily
>> attempting to get back on the road.
>> >
>> > I abandoned the Sequoia at the Chevron station, and called my
>> estranged-brother-in-law ( my half-sister's husband ) to come rescue me.
>> That was a low-point in my life.
>> >
>> > A wrecker service is supposed to take the Sequoia to a shop in the town
>> of Mansfield, where it may need expensive repairs.
>> >
>> > I am at my half-sister's house now, in Mansfield quite bummed out and
>> concerned about my immediate future.
>> >
>> > Meanwhile, drama is going on down in Houston that I should have been
>> there to deal with.
>> >
>> > At this point, I am past the limit of exhaustion to deal with it all.
>> >
>> > I should have gone and sat in front of a waterfall like my 6th Sense
>> told me to do.
>> >
>> > I must find a ride to Houston.   I may have to take a bus.
>> >
>> > David Locklear
>> > <20170621_194323_HDR.jpg>
>> > ___
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>> > Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/te
>> xascav...@texascavers.com/
>> > http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
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>>
>
>
>
> --
> Charlie Loving
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Oztotl not a Mayan god!

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Dear Sleaze:
Donald Foxhall an old seas dog and caver is in Belize building a mansion to
retire in. Not sure where but I betcha you could find him. As for that
hotel. Ethnomusicologist Emory Whipple and I stayed there in 1969. And
those silly Gurkhas were there then to and some British MP's that stopped a
big brawl between the regular Brits soldiers and a bunch of locals over
something.

On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 6:02 PM, Sleazeweazel via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

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>
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: bmorgan...@aol.com
> To: bmorgan...@aol.com
> Cc:
> Bcc:
> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2017 19:02:57 -0400
> Subject: Oztotl not a Mayan god!
> So I'm palling it up with my pistol packing ranger buddy Canti (which
> means "snake" in Kekchi) and I ask if he knows about Oztotl and pays him
> the proper respect by throwing virgins into cenotes, etc. He screwed up his
> nose and said, "That's not a Mayan word, certainly not Kekchi, sounds more
> like Toltec to me. Those damned Mexicans have been bothering us for the
> last couple of thousand years and we keep getting blamed for their barbaric
> habits! We might have torn the hearts out of sacrificial victims with
> obsidian knives but we never ate them!"
>
> These short necked people never cease to amaze me with their intelligence
> and insight. It is normal for Belizean Mayans to speak at least four
> languages, Kekchi (plus Mopan and Yucatec), Spanish, English, and Creole.
> One of Canti's friends back in the home village can speak seven languages
> including Chinese even though he never went to school. As for Hell the
> concept is still current. Everybody knows about Xibalba (she BAL ba) and
> expects to go there soon. It turns out that only the anteroom of Hell is a
> scary place, after you get deep enough you are in Heaven!
>
> But enough about smart people. This morning I crossed the flood swollen
> Bladen in a canoe, and now I'm back in the real Belize which is to say the
> funky little coastal town of Punta Gorda better known as PeeGee. The
> culture is Garifuna which means that dreadlocked zombies stare out at the
> sea all day long while smoking spliffs and mumbling in broken Creole about
> Jah.
>
> When I got out of the bus I looked up and there by the sea side was the
> rotting remnant of the old Hotel Isabel, an enormous wooden structure
> which hangs over both the Caribbean sea and Front street. Twenty seven
> years ago I stumbled into PeeGee more dead than alive. The Hotel Isabel was
> already a rotting hulk but was open for business so I checked in and
> procured a stinking bug infested cubical on the second floor. Things were
> quiet since it was early afternoon. I staggered down the street to a
> Chinese restaurant and had their special poison soup with rotten meat.
> Thereafter I collapsed in my room and didn't wake up until after dark.
>
> When I awoke I had no idea where I was or what was going on but I could
> sense that there were countless people in my immediate proximity. The wall
> by my head was creaking, groaning, and bouncing, and I could hear numerous
> voices in an unknown language. When I opened the door I discovered an
> entire contingent of Gurkha soldiers awaiting their turn to be serviced by
> two Guatemalan girls who had the room next to mine, hence the thumping and
> bumping.
>
> I headed for the back porch to vomit and there discovered so many Rastas
> that a huge blue cloud of ganja smoke drifted over the sea. The Rastas
> would not leave me alone so I retreated to the front porch where the some
> of the Gurkhas had gone for a post coital smoke (tobacco not ganja). In the
> street below there were a handful of violently drunken British soldiers who
> were taunting the Gurkhas and daring them to fight. The Gurkhas were
> remarkably polite for professional killers but they couldn't help but
> finger their kukrie knives and one fellow even begged his commander
> to"please please pretty please let me kill just one of them!"
>
> I passed out again, then when I woke up it was nearly dawn but the noise
> hadn't stopped, it had simply been replaced by the cries of the Salvadorean
> children's refugee chorus who had moved into the room vacated by the
> exhausted Guatemalan girls. Starving children make terrible noises, it is
> best to simply smother them. I was going to do just that when an
> inexplicable event occurred, work. No one ever works in Belize, especially
> at dawn, but nevertheless someone decided to replace the rotting wooden
> planks of the outside wall by nailing on sheet metal. This was happening
> inches from my head and completely drowned out the children. That was when
> I discovered that my entire body was covered with bedbug bites. 

Re: [Texascavers] Still stranded

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Sequoia... Albatross.

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 10:53 AM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I am on 24 hours now of being stranded.
>
> I am not sure if my last post posted, which is probably a good thing.
>
> I am currently in Midlothian stuck visiting a very estranged relative.
> The Sequoia is in Mansfield, but the new mechanic has not even popped the
> hood yet.
>
> The only smart thing that I did on this catostrophic journey was paying
> for my motel in Houston for a whole week.   As all my stuff is there.   So
> that is a worry that I do not have until next Wednesday morning.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Road-trip final report

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Yeah... I knew it was a tool of some kind. Tons of trucks at the truck stop
in Matehuala and at the SLP turn off. The doble trailers make the U.S. ones
look whimpy.

On Thu, Jun 22, 2017 at 2:28 PM, Nico Escamilla via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Pistola=gun.. in this particular case they're referring to a pneumatic
> impact wrench.
>
> El jun. 22, 2017 6:46 AM, "Charles Loving via Texascavers" <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> escribió:
>
>> The adventures of Señor Bockbeer. Amazing indeed. Somehow I never
>> encounter such travils in my travels. Two weeks in Mexico without any
>> encounters with the dark side. And using rental cars keeps me out of the
>> Vulcanazadore con pistola. What pistoa is I have no clue?
>>
>> On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 10:54 PM, David via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>>
>>> It is 11 p.m. on Tuesday, and we are 65 miles west of Wichita Falls,
>>> Texas, almost to the town of Vernon on Hwy. 287.
>>>
>>> It will be difficult to make it to Decatur, tonight.   My chauffeur is
>>> burned-out, and he does not want me to drive.  I have been slightly
>>> car-sick since leaving Albuquerque, partly due to the bald lumpy tires on
>>> ***hat's truck.
>>>
>>> I doubt I will head to a Houston tomorrow evening, as Tropical Storm
>>> Cindy is currently forecasted to potentially drop lots of rain there.
>>>
>>> So unless ***hat kicks me out of the truck on the side of the road in
>>> the next 3 hours, this should be my final trip report.  The odds of him
>>> doing that are about 62 %, as he has nick-named me "D***weed."
>>>
>>> So,
>>>
>>> "The Adventures of ***hat and D***weed," will soon be coming to an end.
>>>
>>>
>>> Here is a pit-stop photo.
>>>
>>> David Locklear
>>>
>>> ___
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>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> --
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>>
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>>
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Re: [Texascavers] Road-trip final report

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

The adventures of Señor Bockbeer. Amazing indeed. Somehow I never encounter
such travils in my travels. Two weeks in Mexico without any encounters with
the dark side. And using rental cars keeps me out of the Vulcanazadore con
pistola. What pistoa is I have no clue?

On Tue, Jun 20, 2017 at 10:54 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> It is 11 p.m. on Tuesday, and we are 65 miles west of Wichita Falls,
> Texas, almost to the town of Vernon on Hwy. 287.
>
> It will be difficult to make it to Decatur, tonight.   My chauffeur is
> burned-out, and he does not want me to drive.  I have been slightly
> car-sick since leaving Albuquerque, partly due to the bald lumpy tires on
> ***hat's truck.
>
> I doubt I will head to a Houston tomorrow evening, as Tropical Storm Cindy
> is currently forecasted to potentially drop lots of rain there.
>
> So unless ***hat kicks me out of the truck on the side of the road in the
> next 3 hours, this should be my final trip report.  The odds of him doing
> that are about 62 %, as he has nick-named me "D***weed."
>
> So,
>
> "The Adventures of ***hat and D***weed," will soon be coming to an end.
>
>
> Here is a pit-stop photo.
>
> David Locklear
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] Anybody out there still blogging ?

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Mr. Sleaze:
I never get your posts because I don't know where to look for them. The
holes for the posts may be too deep? I have a project for you if you want
to consider a project?

On Wed, Jun 21, 2017 at 2:01 PM, Sleazeweazel via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

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>
>
> -- Forwarded message --
> From: bmorgan...@aol.com
> To: texascavers@texascavers.com
> Cc:
> Bcc:
> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2017 15:01:33 -0400
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Anybody out there still blogging ?
> The Wandering Weazel has been posting from Belize but I see no evidence
> that my posts are being published. What I do see is that my posts await a
> moderator due to an implicite destination whatever the hell that means.
>
> Just reinjured my already ruined shoulder so now I am trapped in Punta
> Gorda unable to lift my backpack and thus unable to continue into
> Guatemala. Damn if I know what I'm gonna do???
>
> Sleaze
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: Stefan Creaser via Texascavers 
> To: texascavers 
> Cc: Stefan Creaser 
> Sent: Thu, Jun 1, 2017 4:37 pm
> Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Anybody out there still blogging ?
>
> Well at least **somebody** is posting something!
>
> Quit complaining and post something cave related then, it’s too quiet here.
>
> -Stefan
> (retired cook and now professional PITA)
>
> *From:* Texascavers [mailto:texascavers-boun...@texascavers.com
> ] *On Behalf Of *James Jasek via
> Texascavers
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 1, 2017 5:10 PM
> *To:* texascavers@texascavers.com
> *Cc:* James Jasek 
> *Subject:* Re: [Texascavers] Anybody out there still blogging ?
>
> It is more or less like he is the only one posting on CaveTex and is the
> reason I got off.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Jun 1, 2017, at 3:06 PM, Louise Power via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> I thought you said a couple of years ago that you were going to quit
> emailing because nobody answered. Now nobody is answering the blog. Does
> this tell you something?
>
> --
> *From:* Texascavers  on behalf of
> David via Texascavers 
> *Sent:* Thursday, June 1, 2017 11:57 AM
> *To:* texascavers@texascavers.com
> *Cc:* David
> *Subject:* [Texascavers] Anybody out there still blogging ?
>
> I have decided to give blogging another try.My previous attempts
> failed
> miserably to annoy anybody.
>
> I am not sure how you find me on a blog, but I think the link below shows
> 10
> post that I blogged over the last 4 years.
>
>  https://www.blogger.com/blogger.g?blogID=6768672593579462012
> Blogger 
> www.blogger.com
> Free weblog publishing tool from Google, for sharing text, photos and
> video.
>
>
> Below is an example of a post that I added to my blog I today.
>
>
> 
> http://david-locklear.blogspot.com/2017/06/mageia-6-
> release-candidate-may-2017.html
>
> I should I have another blog out there somewhere on the web that I have
> not used in years, from
> before the blog above started.
>
>
> The NSS Convention is just 19 days away. In order for me to attend
> that I would want to leave
> Houston by Thursday the 15th, or Friday the 16th.  But knowing my past
> attempts, I will probably
> leave late, and arrive late.
>
> I have some new drama this year that I did not have on my road-trip to
> Nevada last summer.   I ma
> living in a motel, and it would be stupid to pay for a motel here in
> Houston, during the days I am out
> of town.While that would only be about $ 280 thrown away, it is still
> just stupid.  Moving out of the
> motel, would be complicated as I have most of my stuff here just as I
> would in a furnished apartment,
> It would take a full-day to pack up and store all my stuff in storage.
>  That would just be inconvenient,
> as I would have to repeat the process when coming back.Plus I do not
> want to lose this particular
> room as it is the best one in the motel.My next issue is 2 shyster
> customers ripped me off and it
> is starting to look like I am going to lose about $ 1,400.My next
> issue, is my gas-guzzling Seqouia
> needs lots of maintenance. If I were a betting person, I would bet
> that I do not make it to the Howdy
> Party this year.  So realistically, I need to lower my expectations,
> and just try to attend the Tuesday
> festivities only and just get a Day Pass.
>
> David Locklear
> 

Re: [Texascavers] Road-trip - part 2

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Sounds like a bad idea to me. Driving with some unknown person. I think I
would take a bus first. Besides its hot in New Mexico. But then I am in
Real de Catorce in the sierra at 9,000 feet and it rains everyday and is
cold at night. Life is good in Mexico.

On Sun, Jun 11, 2017 at 5:00 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I mentioned I would be brainstorming ideas.Here is my
> first Craigslist ad:
>
>   https://houston.craigslist.org/rid/6172535669.html
>
> There are 4 million people in the area around Harris County.
> I should be able to find at least one crazy person willing to go
> on a road-trip.   Right ??
>
> David Locklear
>
>
>
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>
>


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Re: [Texascavers] GPS Navigation gadgets

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Thank the gods some one can use maps. When Kim Jung Ding Batt destroyed the
GPS system.

On Mon, May 29, 2017 at 9:52 PM, PRESTON FORSYTHE via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Hey, topos are still in style. That is all I use. A topo with a cave
> location is the simplest thing.
>
> You have not navigated until the one klick grid is solid green and no
> contour lines or blue lines and your life depended on knowing where your
> were. Ask me how we did it and I will tell you a story at the NM convention
> coming up fast.
>
>
> Preston in KY
>
>
>
>
> On Monday, May 29, 2017 10:58 AM, Pete Lindsley via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>
> Charles and David: I thought Navigon was a bit pricy, particularly since
> long ago I had purchased iHike, following many years of use of MacGPS Pro
> on a Mac. [https://www.ihikegps.com/]  "No charges for Maps…Ever" .
> Download your maps when you have internet access. Take track logs and set
> waypoints in the field, and if you missed a map you can download it later
> to see where that new-found cave waypoint is located. Sailors will be
> interested in a related IOS application called iSail. Larry James does a
> great job updating his apps and listens to his user's suggestions.
>
>  - Pete
>
> On May 28, 2017, at 6:12 PM, Charles Goldsmith via Texascavers wrote:
>
> I'd suggest using your smartphone, and IMHO, google maps is superior to
> anything else, including the dedicated ones.  The fact that it's always
> updating and you can send corrections as well is great.
>
> It will do offline mapping, but it isn't the best at that.  I do keep
> another app on my iPhone as a backup that has offline maps, Navigon.
>
>
> On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 2:12 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> This may surprise the young cavers, but just about 5 years ago, most
> cavers did not have any kind of street navigation gadget in their cars.
>
> I can only guess that 40% either have a dedicated navigation gadget in
> their car,  or they mount their large smartphone or phablets in a bracket.
>
> I hope to purchase a dedicated navigation gadget this week.
>
> Anybody have any tips ?
>
> Is a touch-screen an important feature ?
>
> Is a slim model an important feature ?
>
> Does brand matter ?
>
> Why not just get a 2nd phone line ?
>
> David Locklear
> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>
> __ _
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> 
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> 
>
>
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>
>
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] GPS Navigation gadgets

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

In Africa we had ONC Charts, A Michlien Map, and a compass.
You figured out the coordinates off the map and then walk 50 yards from the
car and took a reading.
We also learned to shoot stars at night with a Surplus Yougslavian Army
sextant. Pointing out you YQYQLALALOLO was important since there were no
roads and lots of tracks. The old Military training was helpful. You
arrived at an Oasis and asked directions to the next Oasis. "100 clicks at
180 degrees then turn left 276 and drive 50 clicks and turn at the metal
rod..." Piece of cake.

On Sun, May 28, 2017 at 7:12 PM, Charles Goldsmith via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I'd suggest using your smartphone, and IMHO, google maps is superior to
> anything else, including the dedicated ones.  The fact that it's always
> updating and you can send corrections as well is great.
>
> It will do offline mapping, but it isn't the best at that.  I do keep
> another app on my iPhone as a backup that has offline maps, Navigon.
>
>
> On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 2:12 PM, David via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> This may surprise the young cavers, but just about 5 years ago, most
>> cavers did not have any kind of street navigation gadget in their cars.
>>
>> I can only guess that 40% either have a dedicated navigation gadget in
>> their car,  or they mount their large smartphone or phablets in a bracket.
>>
>> I hope to purchase a dedicated navigation gadget this week.
>>
>> Anybody have any tips ?
>>
>> Is a touch-screen an important feature ?
>>
>> Is a slim model an important feature ?
>>
>> Does brand matter ?
>>
>> Why not just get a 2nd phone line ?
>>
>> David Locklear
>> dlocklea...@gmail.com
>>
>> ___
>> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
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>> xascav...@texascavers.com/
>> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>>
>>
>
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>
>


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Re: [Texascavers] trapping hogs

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

We put up traps. Bait them with good old Purina Hog Bait. Rasberry cool aid
poured over corn or corn dipped in raspberry jam or this hog bait raspberry
gook. Works well. Like I said we killed an average of one a day for two
months. Sometimes you get a column of them. Shoot the tail end pig first
then work up the line. This is somewhat effective until the pigs figure it
out. My friend Al had to use his Glock on one that charged him. 250 pounder
with serious tusks. Going out next week again. Not so much fun but it saves
the ground nesting fowl and snakes. There are two endangered cactus
varieties where I hunt. They are fenced off and protected.

On Wed, Feb 22, 2017 at 11:30 AM, via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> This is the best time of year to trap wild pigs.  Fall acorns ect are gone
> and spring greens are not up yet.  Here is a article from TxAgriLife
> extension about best practices
> https://ipmsouth.com/2017/02/21/the-best-window-of-time-to-
> trap-wild-pigs-is-about-to-close/
>
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] meat for TCR

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

After I come back from Corpus I will try to contact Vico. He can contact me
if he wants. I am off to Corpus to elect a new bishop for west Texas.

On Tue, Feb 21, 2017 at 1:35 PM, Jim Kennedy via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Axis, aoudad, and pig is all good. If the new cooks don't want it, I'll
> take it. Vico and I can butcher and freeze it, and enjoy it cooked in many
> delicious dishes.
>
> Crash
>
> Mobile email from my iPhone
>
> > On Feb 21, 2017, at 7:19 AM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
> >
> > OK get in touch with Vico. We can work on this. We will have to shoot
> the small ones. Mac and I will set up traps next week and bait them. We
> were getting one a day for about three months awhile back. what about
> Aoudads? They are pretty rank but the small ones are sort of like cabrito.
> They are a pest too, destroy crops and such. And of course we could get an
> Axisi deer. The vegans will rebel I am sure and the PETA people will freak
> out but these three types of critters are bad news.
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Re: [Texascavers] Tcr cooks

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

OK get in touch with Vico. We can work on this. We will have to shoot the
small ones. Mac and I will set up traps next week and bait them. We were
getting one a day for about three months awhile back. what about Aoudads?
They are pretty rank but the small ones are sort of like cabrito. They are
a pest too, destroy crops and such. And of course we could get an Axisi
deer. The vegans will rebel I am sure and the PETA people will freak out
but these three types of critters are bad news.

On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 9:17 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I have freezer space.
>
>
> --Don
>
>
>
>
> --Don
> On Feb 20, 2017, at 6:24 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> If Vico wants a hog I have a dozen or so to shoot.
>
> On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 1:39 PM, Eric Flint via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> Well guess I'll toss it out. Unless some one else steps up I'm cook boss
>> this year. We are have hamburgers and hotdogs. Thank you Charlie Loving for
>> making me feel a lot better about making this menu desision. I haven't
>> decided if you people deserve katchup yet.
>> ___
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>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Charlie Loving
>
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Re: [Texascavers] Tcr cooks

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

If Vico wants a hog I have a dozen or so to shoot.

On Mon, Feb 20, 2017 at 1:39 PM, Eric Flint via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Well guess I'll toss it out. Unless some one else steps up I'm cook boss
> this year. We are have hamburgers and hotdogs. Thank you Charlie Loving for
> making me feel a lot better about making this menu desision. I haven't
> decided if you people deserve katchup yet.
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>


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Re: [Texascavers] for speleo-game enthusiast

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

My that was about as boring as things get. Not a game player but the bird
randomly flying around blowing up birds makes no sense at all. Tweet tweet.
Boom!

On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 11:57 AM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Imagine you are one of those tiny tropical birds that like to live in the
> entrance
> of large tropical caves like El Sotano de Golondrinas.
>
> Then imagine that you are trapped inside of a spherical shaped cave about
> 300 meters in diameter with
> no escape.Then imagine other species of birds are armed with weapons
> and are trying
> to blow you up.
>
> Then imagine you are also armed with a variety of weapons.
>
> Well you can stop imagining, because now we have a video game, called
> "Xbird."
>
> Please skip the first 2 minutes and 4 seconds of video to get to the
> cave.It resembles
> El Sotano de Barro with the Birdhouse inside of it, but with the structure
> of the Birdhouse
> attached to both the floor and the walls and some kind of unnatural
> force-field over the
> entrance.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwsUjpeXifI
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] TCR musician suggestion

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Sure. Who pays for them?

On Sun, Feb 19, 2017 at 1:00 AM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I vote we bring these folks to TCR to perform:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRwAl4pOAWE
>
> Anybody 2nd the motion ??
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] [TCR Food]

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Vico was one of the pillars of society.

On Sat, Feb 18, 2017 at 1:46 PM, Denise P via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Vico told me he would cook but doesn't want to spearhead the thing. I am
> probably doing TCMA breakfast so not interested in being in charge of
> dinner. I could help with prep and such. I volunteer Dale for dishes :)
>
>
> And I think catering is a fine alternative.
>
>
> Cheers,
>
> Denise
>
>
> --
> *From:* Texascavers  on behalf of RD
> Milhollin via Texascavers 
> *Sent:* Friday, February 10, 2017 10:12 PM
> *To:* texascavers@texascavers.com
> *Subject:* Re: [Texascavers] [TCR Food]
>
> Don
>
> If you can find an organizer I will be happy to help with a main dish or
> coordinate and produce a side dish
>
> I know there are several cavers who have done the same in the past, had a
> great time, and are eager to do it again
>
> For anyone who hasn't and has some aptitude for cooking... step up and
> have a swing at it, being part of this effort is fun and is a great way to
> get to know other cavers from across the big state. Who knows, you might
> get yourself invited on a "secret caving trip"
>
> Did I forget to mention cooks eat first
>
> RD
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 10, 2017, at 2:32 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> Currently TCR doesn't have a head cook, or menu. There have been
> complaints, rumors and talk about this subject. It seems there are three
> options: (a) fend for yourselves, (b) caterer, (c) volunteers come forward
> to cook.
>
> Each has its benefit and drawbacks. I need to get a feel for options.
>
>
> Discuss:
>
>
> --Tex Caver
>
>
>
> --Don
>
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Re: [Texascavers] News related

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

 John Wayne would not be grabbing women by the pussy.

On Sun, Feb 12, 2017 at 9:01 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> In case you have all been away from the national news, there is a flood
> emergency in the town of
> Oroville, California ongoing as of Sunday night.
>
> 39°31'38.0"N 121°31'48.2"W
>
> The video below was from Sunday afternoon showing the emergency spillway
> being
> breached.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbkz-F4PcaA
>
> This water is going to continue flowing thru the breach all night and for
> several days, and eventually
> the erosion could cause a giant hole, which might lead to a bigger hole,
> which might cause
> the entire emergency spillway to flow downstream. It looks like a
> potential disaster unfolding.
>
> Even if that doesn't happen, they are going to have a mess there around
> the spillway for the next few weeks
> or months, or maybe even until a new emergency spillway could be built.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] [TCR Food]

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Bruce Anderson:
e-mail me so we can keep in touch. lovingigor2gmail.com. I might just come
to the mountains as soon as the snow melts and we can cook corn on the cob
for five or six.

On Fri, Feb 10, 2017 at 7:27 PM, Bruce Anderson via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Although I was not one of the original cooks it seems a friend by the name
> of Charlie got me involved and I cooked the corn for a number of years.
>
> As Charlie points out we got old although not as old as some. Cooking is
> hard work and back then we did it because we liked to cook.
>
> The thing is we would cook all day Saturday and then come Sunday there
> would be a huge mess to clean up with very little help.
>
> I've always observed that those who complained the most did little or no
> work and would show up with no food expecting to get feed all weekend.
>
> The thing is we have moved out of Texas to the mountains of Colorado so we
> will not be going to OTR (ya I know it now called something else).
>
> My suggestion is to figure out what was allocated in the fee for Saturday
> dinner. Find out what it is going to cost to have BarBQue catered. Deduct
> the old cost bump it up 15 - 20% to be sure there is enough food.
>
> Anyone complaint tell them it's they and those like them who never help.
>
> Bruce
>
> Charlie, party on...
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 10, 2017, at 5:47 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> Cooking is work. And I think that became obvious to our last head cook and
> there is little in the way of recompense other than a pat on the back. That
> only works for so long. And like I have said I was head cook for many years
> and retired. Felicia Vreeland was my second in command and ran a very tight
> ship. The whole idea started moons ago when we decided to have a caver cook
> off at a ranch in Wimberly where the old UT Grotto guys showed up. I know
> It isn't a Grotto. There were about 20 guys there and they all cooked what
> they wanted to and enough to feed the crowd. We even had stuffed jelly
> fish, which won first prize. It was pretty much fun. Lots of food and lots
> of BS. The next was a real OTR and I know I call it by the wrong name. That
> was Luckenbach the first OTR and there were maybe a dozen cooks. After that
> the group got bigger because there was some competition as to how eclectic
> we could get in our menu. Most everyone prepared 20 pounds of something.
> That kept up for at least 20 years. And as time passed some of the cooks
> actually died. Some got too old to cook and other just moved away. The core
> held on for awhile and then they decided to pass the baton. Twentyfive
> years without many new volunteers was not inspiring.
>
> I have done a few events since then with catering. I always used someone I
> knew really well to cater. I grew up with Jim Mosley and his brother in law
> and ate at their house and remember the Dellwood Cafeteria with Jimmy's ice
> sculptures. Long gone and long ago. His son did the HEB Thanksgiving feeds
> in SA and was excellent. He did a couple of weddings for me and they were
> great. Lots of food and variety. But I lost contact with them and all their
> eating places have closed. But I am sure someone knows a good caterer who
> would understand the drill. You give them a menu and they prepare it. I
> always think three meats and as many salad and veggies as possible and
> perhaps the cavers make the deserts? This is just an idea. BBQ works as
> well as Mexican food. There are some great BBQ places in and around
> Fredicksburg and San Antonio is a bastion of Mexican food. Ed Alexander
> once upon a time catered Luckenbach with enchiladas in 1970. But he is gone
> now to the cave in the sky.
>
> On Fri, Feb 10, 2017 at 2:32 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> Currently TCR doesn't have a head cook, or menu. There have been
>> complaints, rumors and talk about this subject. It seems there are three
>> options: (a) fend for yourselves, (b) caterer, (c) volunteers come forward
>> to cook.
>>
>> Each has its benefit and drawbacks. I need to get a feel for options.
>>
>>
>> Discuss:
>>
>>
>> --Tex Caver
>>
>>
>>
>> --Don
>>
>> ___
>> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
>> Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/te
>> xascav...@texascavers.com/
>> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>>
>>
>
>
> --
> Charlie Loving
>
> ___
> Texascavers m

Re: [Texascavers] [TCR Food]

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Cooking is work. And I think that became obvious to our last head cook and
there is little in the way of recompense other than a pat on the back. That
only works for so long. And like I have said I was head cook for many years
and retired. Felicia Vreeland was my second in command and ran a very tight
ship. The whole idea started moons ago when we decided to have a caver cook
off at a ranch in Wimberly where the old UT Grotto guys showed up. I know
It isn't a Grotto. There were about 20 guys there and they all cooked what
they wanted to and enough to feed the crowd. We even had stuffed jelly
fish, which won first prize. It was pretty much fun. Lots of food and lots
of BS. The next was a real OTR and I know I call it by the wrong name. That
was Luckenbach the first OTR and there were maybe a dozen cooks. After that
the group got bigger because there was some competition as to how eclectic
we could get in our menu. Most everyone prepared 20 pounds of something.
That kept up for at least 20 years. And as time passed some of the cooks
actually died. Some got too old to cook and other just moved away. The core
held on for awhile and then they decided to pass the baton. Twentyfive
years without many new volunteers was not inspiring.

I have done a few events since then with catering. I always used someone I
knew really well to cater. I grew up with Jim Mosley and his brother in law
and ate at their house and remember the Dellwood Cafeteria with Jimmy's ice
sculptures. Long gone and long ago. His son did the HEB Thanksgiving feeds
in SA and was excellent. He did a couple of weddings for me and they were
great. Lots of food and variety. But I lost contact with them and all their
eating places have closed. But I am sure someone knows a good caterer who
would understand the drill. You give them a menu and they prepare it. I
always think three meats and as many salad and veggies as possible and
perhaps the cavers make the deserts? This is just an idea. BBQ works as
well as Mexican food. There are some great BBQ places in and around
Fredicksburg and San Antonio is a bastion of Mexican food. Ed Alexander
once upon a time catered Luckenbach with enchiladas in 1970. But he is gone
now to the cave in the sky.

On Fri, Feb 10, 2017 at 2:32 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Currently TCR doesn't have a head cook, or menu. There have been
> complaints, rumors and talk about this subject. It seems there are three
> options: (a) fend for yourselves, (b) caterer, (c) volunteers come forward
> to cook.
>
> Each has its benefit and drawbacks. I need to get a feel for options.
>
>
> Discuss:
>
>
> --Tex Caver
>
>
>
> --Don
>
> ___
> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
> Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/
> texascavers@texascavers.com/
> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>
>


-- 
Charlie Loving
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Re: [Texascavers] 39th Annual Texas Cavers Reunion

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Paradise Canyon for me has some ill feelings since one of my best life long
friends died in an accident there. Not the canyon's fault, too much beer
most likely and not paying attention. But that memory is still ingrained. I
don't really mind the place but I do like Brackettville it is only 40 miles
away.

On Fri, Feb 10, 2017 at 12:35 PM, Fritz Holt via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Herr Charles and others, Achtung!
> Paradise Canyon is a great venue, especially for an old fart and his
> precious June who both appreciate the convenience of a private cabin.
> However I do miss the after dark camaraderie of sitting around your and
> others camp fires before hitting the cot. My favorite venue of a few years
> ago was Fort Clark and Springs at Brackettville. A little far for a few in
> East Texas but better for West Texas and New Mexico. Great facilities,
> fabulous water and several of our favorite wild? caves in the general area.
> Gets my vote.
> Are we locked in to Paradise Canyon? We put too much emphasis on meal
> preparation for the whole group. I'm with Charles, I would be happy with
> everyone bringing and preparing their own meals. The event fee should
> remain the same if no meals are served and the fee used to defer other
> expenses. An exception would be the grottos offering breakfast for a
> contribution, always welcome. Bored yet?
> Herr Fritz (Holt)
> fritz...@gmail.com
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Feb 8, 2017, at 6:02 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> Why are we stuck at Paradise Canyon? The OTR used to be fun when it moved
> around. Now it is in a rut. Paradise Canyon is OK but to me it is
> incredibly boring after the tenth time. I recall the first one where I and
> a few other cooked at Luckenbach. Then a lot of places all over Central
> Texas. Now it is stuck, dead in the water.
>
> OK I was chief cook for 20 years and has a myriad of volunteer  people
>  who were involved in cooking. We had a rule for our volunteer cooks and
> there were about 35  or 40 of them. The rule was cook what you want but
> cook, but enough. Enough was a nebulous figure. We had tons of corn on the
> cob from the valley. Fish from Galveston, A roast pig, brisket, beef clod,
> chicken, turkey, hot links from Fredericksburg, bean salad, fruit salad,
> salad salad, black beans, refried beans, tortillas, pie, cake, cookies, a
> million brownies, chicken, Hatch chilis, gazpacho. all manner of stuff, we
> once had quail, and the people gobbled it up.
>
> All prepared by THE CAVER COOKS for the fun of cooking it. That tradition
> has died it would seem. Maybe caver don't cook anymore? Not sure why but
> the old cooks never got any new cooks to volunteer to take the reins.
>
> Maybe there was a great loss in cooking ability. I hate to say this but I
> haven't eaten the meal at OTR is four years. I am not sure why because I
> pay for it, but the last one just didn't meet my expectations. I apologize
> to those who worked so hard and long but what is, is and I am a dyed in the
> wool food Nazi. We didn't need a food trailer to cook in we just built
> fires and got after it.
>
> On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 3:42 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> Paradise Canyon
>> October 12-15, 2017
>>
>>
>> --Texas Caver
>> ___
>> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
>> Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/te
>> xascav...@texascavers.com/
>> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Charlie Loving
>
> ___
> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
> Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/
> texascavers@texascavers.com/
> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>
>
> ___
> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
> Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/
> texascavers@texascavers.com/
> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>
>


-- 
Charlie Loving
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Re: [Texascavers] 39th Annual Texas Cavers Reunion

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

OK I am pathetic as usual.

On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 8:51 PM, Nancy Weaver via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Not.  Just embarrassing and pathetic.
> Nancy
>
> On Feb 8, 2017, at 8:41 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> OK. At least we got an interesting dialogue going.
>
>
>
> ___
> Texascavers mailing list | http://texascavers.com
> Texascavers@texascavers.com | Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/
> texascavers@texascavers.com/
> http://lists.texascavers.com/listinfo/texascavers
>
>


-- 
Charlie Loving
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Re: [Texascavers] 39th Annual Texas Cavers Reunion

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

OK. At least we got an interesting dialogue going. I am really and truly
ambivalent toward it all. I love the visiting and sneak in and out. I fail
to register most of the time but see my old caver friends. And to tell the
truth I am still on occasion going caving. I am too old to do that but what
the hell. OMW has to die in a cave accident. Maybe in Musquiz? As for
Bockbeer he deserves all the propaganda he can get. He is a jewell that
needs to be shined. If not for Bockbeer we'd have to pick on Karst Walker
or that lady from Muldoon.

On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 8:31 PM, Charles Loving <lovingi...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Not nasty really.
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 6:41 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> I’ve found that TCR's biggest critics are NEVER step up and help. NEVER.
>> You got attitude because of your nasty criticisms. Touché.
>>
>> On Feb 8, 2017, at 6:33 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>>
>> Don;
>> That was a nasty response. I am 75 and can't walk that well. I did my
>> duty and I do not like your and I will say this shitty attitude. I have
>> been to OTR and so what if it has a different name now. I call it OTR
>> because I am old and senile and will die soon. So you can keep doing what
>> you do and I will enjoy the comrades and forego the food.
>>
>> On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 6:31 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>>
>>> On Feb 8, 2017, at 6:02 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
>>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Why are we stuck at Paradise Canyon?
>>>
>>>
>>> Charles, get over it. Paradise Canyon agreed to a good price if we kept
>>> TCR there for the next 5 years. If no one hasn't noticed things are getting
>>> more expensive these days. If you can find a better price than what we are
>>> currently paying with as many amenities, showers, river, electricity,
>>> bathrooms, ice, picnic tables, porto-potties, nice green manicured camping,
>>> Lodges with baths and A/C. What are you griping about, we haven’t seen you
>>> there in some time anyway. Besides weren’t you happy there was LODGING with
>>> A/C there? I distinctly remember you asking about it.
>>>
>>> The OTR used to be fun when it moved around.
>>>
>>>
>>> Well, this isn’t OTR.
>>>
>>> Now it is in a rut. Paradise Canyon is OK but to me it is incredibly
>>> boring after the tenth time. I recall the first one where I and a few other
>>> cooked at Luckenbach. Then a lot of places all over Central Texas. Now it
>>> is stuck, dead in the water.
>>>
>>>
>>> Dead? Are you volunteering to honcho it up? I’d be happy to turn it over
>>> to you. Just say the word and it’s all yours.
>>>
>>> OK I was chief cook for 20 years and has a myriad of volunteer  people
>>>  who were involved in cooking. We had a rule for our volunteer cooks and
>>> there were about 35  or 40 of them. The rule was cook what you want but
>>> cook, but enough. Enough was a nebulous figure. We had tons of corn on the
>>> cob from the valley. Fish from Galveston, A roast pig, brisket, beef clod,
>>> chicken, turkey, hot links from Fredericksburg, bean salad, fruit salad,
>>> salad salad, black beans, refried beans, tortillas, pie, cake, cookies, a
>>> million brownies, chicken, Hatch chilis, gazpacho. all manner of stuff, we
>>> once had quail, and the people gobbled it up.
>>>
>>>
>>> Great! Since we lost our cook last year, it sounds like you would be the
>>> perfect head cook. Are you volunteering? That menu sounds awesome, go ahead
>>> and purchase the stuff and get me a reciept and I’ll put you down as head
>>> cook. HEY EVERBODY! IGOR IS OUR NEW HEAD COOK! WOOO!!
>>>
>>> All prepared by THE CAVER COOKS for the fun of cooking it. That
>>> tradition has died it would seem. Maybe caver don't cook anymore? Not sure
>>> why but the old cooks never got any new cooks to volunteer to take the
>>> reins.
>>>
>>>
>>> Well, seeing you haven't come to a -TCR- (Texas Cavers Reunion, been
>>> named that for only the last THIRTY EIGHT YEARS) you have totally missed
>>> out on some fine cooking by the experts we have that ACTUALLY STEPPED UP
>>> and VOLUNTEERED. Stefan and Vico and the rest of the COOKS have done an
>>> awesome and thankless job for everybody. But of course your stepping up
>>> wil

Re: [Texascavers] 39th Annual Texas Cavers Reunion

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Not nasty really.

On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 6:41 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> I’ve found that TCR's biggest critics are NEVER step up and help. NEVER.
> You got attitude because of your nasty criticisms. Touché.
>
> On Feb 8, 2017, at 6:33 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
> Don;
> That was a nasty response. I am 75 and can't walk that well. I did my duty
> and I do not like your and I will say this shitty attitude. I have been to
> OTR and so what if it has a different name now. I call it OTR because I am
> old and senile and will die soon. So you can keep doing what you do and I
> will enjoy the comrades and forego the food.
>
> On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 6:31 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> On Feb 8, 2017, at 6:02 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>> Why are we stuck at Paradise Canyon?
>>
>>
>> Charles, get over it. Paradise Canyon agreed to a good price if we kept
>> TCR there for the next 5 years. If no one hasn't noticed things are getting
>> more expensive these days. If you can find a better price than what we are
>> currently paying with as many amenities, showers, river, electricity,
>> bathrooms, ice, picnic tables, porto-potties, nice green manicured camping,
>> Lodges with baths and A/C. What are you griping about, we haven’t seen you
>> there in some time anyway. Besides weren’t you happy there was LODGING with
>> A/C there? I distinctly remember you asking about it.
>>
>> The OTR used to be fun when it moved around.
>>
>>
>> Well, this isn’t OTR.
>>
>> Now it is in a rut. Paradise Canyon is OK but to me it is incredibly
>> boring after the tenth time. I recall the first one where I and a few other
>> cooked at Luckenbach. Then a lot of places all over Central Texas. Now it
>> is stuck, dead in the water.
>>
>>
>> Dead? Are you volunteering to honcho it up? I’d be happy to turn it over
>> to you. Just say the word and it’s all yours.
>>
>> OK I was chief cook for 20 years and has a myriad of volunteer  people
>>  who were involved in cooking. We had a rule for our volunteer cooks and
>> there were about 35  or 40 of them. The rule was cook what you want but
>> cook, but enough. Enough was a nebulous figure. We had tons of corn on the
>> cob from the valley. Fish from Galveston, A roast pig, brisket, beef clod,
>> chicken, turkey, hot links from Fredericksburg, bean salad, fruit salad,
>> salad salad, black beans, refried beans, tortillas, pie, cake, cookies, a
>> million brownies, chicken, Hatch chilis, gazpacho. all manner of stuff, we
>> once had quail, and the people gobbled it up.
>>
>>
>> Great! Since we lost our cook last year, it sounds like you would be the
>> perfect head cook. Are you volunteering? That menu sounds awesome, go ahead
>> and purchase the stuff and get me a reciept and I’ll put you down as head
>> cook. HEY EVERBODY! IGOR IS OUR NEW HEAD COOK! WOOO!!
>>
>> All prepared by THE CAVER COOKS for the fun of cooking it. That tradition
>> has died it would seem. Maybe caver don't cook anymore? Not sure why but
>> the old cooks never got any new cooks to volunteer to take the reins.
>>
>>
>> Well, seeing you haven't come to a -TCR- (Texas Cavers Reunion, been
>> named that for only the last THIRTY EIGHT YEARS) you have totally missed
>> out on some fine cooking by the experts we have that ACTUALLY STEPPED UP
>> and VOLUNTEERED. Stefan and Vico and the rest of the COOKS have done an
>> awesome and thankless job for everybody. But of course your stepping up
>> will easily surpass their cooking, no? We look forward to it!
>>
>> Maybe there was a great loss in cooking ability. I hate to say this but I
>> haven't eaten the meal at OTR is four years. I am not sure why because I
>> pay for it, but the last one just didn't meet my expectations. I apologize
>> to those who worked so hard and long but what is, is and I am a dyed in the
>> wool food Nazi. We didn't need a food trailer to cook in we just built
>> fires and got after it.
>>
>>
>> Well that's just awesome, good for you. Sorry you’ll be disappointed for
>> the next five years. Maybe you should just keep staying home.
>>
>> On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 3:42 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
>> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Paradise Canyon
>>> October 12-15, 2017
>>
>>
>>
>&

Re: [Texascavers] 39th Annual Texas Cavers Reunion

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Don;
That was a nasty response. I am 75 and can't walk that well. I did my duty
and I do not like your and I will say this shitty attitude. I have been to
OTR and so what if it has a different name now. I call it OTR because I am
old and senile and will die soon. So you can keep doing what you do and I
will enjoy the comrades and forego the food.

On Wed, Feb 8, 2017 at 6:31 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> On Feb 8, 2017, at 6:02 PM, Charles Loving via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>
> Why are we stuck at Paradise Canyon?
>
>
> Charles, get over it. Paradise Canyon agreed to a good price if we kept
> TCR there for the next 5 years. If no one hasn't noticed things are getting
> more expensive these days. If you can find a better price than what we are
> currently paying with as many amenities, showers, river, electricity,
> bathrooms, ice, picnic tables, porto-potties, nice green manicured camping,
> Lodges with baths and A/C. What are you griping about, we haven’t seen you
> there in some time anyway. Besides weren’t you happy there was LODGING with
> A/C there? I distinctly remember you asking about it.
>
> The OTR used to be fun when it moved around.
>
>
> Well, this isn’t OTR.
>
> Now it is in a rut. Paradise Canyon is OK but to me it is incredibly
> boring after the tenth time. I recall the first one where I and a few other
> cooked at Luckenbach. Then a lot of places all over Central Texas. Now it
> is stuck, dead in the water.
>
>
> Dead? Are you volunteering to honcho it up? I’d be happy to turn it over
> to you. Just say the word and it’s all yours.
>
> OK I was chief cook for 20 years and has a myriad of volunteer  people
>  who were involved in cooking. We had a rule for our volunteer cooks and
> there were about 35  or 40 of them. The rule was cook what you want but
> cook, but enough. Enough was a nebulous figure. We had tons of corn on the
> cob from the valley. Fish from Galveston, A roast pig, brisket, beef clod,
> chicken, turkey, hot links from Fredericksburg, bean salad, fruit salad,
> salad salad, black beans, refried beans, tortillas, pie, cake, cookies, a
> million brownies, chicken, Hatch chilis, gazpacho. all manner of stuff, we
> once had quail, and the people gobbled it up.
>
>
> Great! Since we lost our cook last year, it sounds like you would be the
> perfect head cook. Are you volunteering? That menu sounds awesome, go ahead
> and purchase the stuff and get me a reciept and I’ll put you down as head
> cook. HEY EVERBODY! IGOR IS OUR NEW HEAD COOK! WOOO!!
>
> All prepared by THE CAVER COOKS for the fun of cooking it. That tradition
> has died it would seem. Maybe caver don't cook anymore? Not sure why but
> the old cooks never got any new cooks to volunteer to take the reins.
>
>
> Well, seeing you haven't come to a -TCR- (Texas Cavers Reunion, been named
> that for only the last THIRTY EIGHT YEARS) you have totally missed out on
> some fine cooking by the experts we have that ACTUALLY STEPPED UP and
> VOLUNTEERED. Stefan and Vico and the rest of the COOKS have done an awesome
> and thankless job for everybody. But of course your stepping up will easily
> surpass their cooking, no? We look forward to it!
>
> Maybe there was a great loss in cooking ability. I hate to say this but I
> haven't eaten the meal at OTR is four years. I am not sure why because I
> pay for it, but the last one just didn't meet my expectations. I apologize
> to those who worked so hard and long but what is, is and I am a dyed in the
> wool food Nazi. We didn't need a food trailer to cook in we just built
> fires and got after it.
>
>
> Well that's just awesome, good for you. Sorry you’ll be disappointed for
> the next five years. Maybe you should just keep staying home.
>
> On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 3:42 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> Paradise Canyon
>> October 12-15, 2017
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] 39th Annual Texas Cavers Reunion

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Why are we stuck at Paradise Canyon? The OTR used to be fun when it moved
around. Now it is in a rut. Paradise Canyon is OK but to me it is
incredibly boring after the tenth time. I recall the first one where I and
a few other cooked at Luckenbach. Then a lot of places all over Central
Texas. Now it is stuck, dead in the water.

OK I was chief cook for 20 years and has a myriad of volunteer  people  who
were involved in cooking. We had a rule for our volunteer cooks and there
were about 35  or 40 of them. The rule was cook what you want but cook, but
enough. Enough was a nebulous figure. We had tons of corn on the cob from
the valley. Fish from Galveston, A roast pig, brisket, beef clod, chicken,
turkey, hot links from Fredericksburg, bean salad, fruit salad, salad
salad, black beans, refried beans, tortillas, pie, cake, cookies, a million
brownies, chicken, Hatch chilis, gazpacho. all manner of stuff, we once had
quail, and the people gobbled it up.

All prepared by THE CAVER COOKS for the fun of cooking it. That tradition
has died it would seem. Maybe caver don't cook anymore? Not sure why but
the old cooks never got any new cooks to volunteer to take the reins.

Maybe there was a great loss in cooking ability. I hate to say this but I
haven't eaten the meal at OTR is four years. I am not sure why because I
pay for it, but the last one just didn't meet my expectations. I apologize
to those who worked so hard and long but what is, is and I am a dyed in the
wool food Nazi. We didn't need a food trailer to cook in we just built
fires and got after it.

On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 3:42 PM, Don Arburn via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Paradise Canyon
> October 12-15, 2017
>
>
> --Texas Caver
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Re: [Texascavers] caver celebrity - follow up

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

http://www.commondreams.org/views/2017/02/07/citizens-getting-justice-done

On Tue, Feb 7, 2017 at 7:03 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> The video I mentioned last week is on Twitter and Facebook.
>
> https://t.co/5tUixgcLmH
>
> I have not found it elsewhere yet.
>
>
>
>
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Re: [Texascavers] video game for cavers

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Sheeesh I watched the thing and found it pretty silly. Not something that I
would ever buy or play.
But I thank Bockbeer for finding it and posting it. Good job Bock, keep up
the good work.

On Thu, Feb 2, 2017 at 7:13 PM, David via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> A new video game called Rust, allows a survival player to hunt for
> caves.
>
> The video below is a gamer demo showing hunting for the caves for the
> first time.
>
>  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mCGD0s-u15Y
>
> It has some interesting features or elements, and shows the potential for
> having
> a real video game about caving. The ridgewalking is good.The
> comment about
> not falling in the hole is funny.
>
> David Locklear
>
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Re: [Texascavers] William Russell and Facebook

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Please send all checks to Bock Beer c/o The Bock Beer brewing company Salt
Lake City, Utah. PO Box 911.


On Tue, Jan 31, 2017 at 4:21 PM, Terry Holsinger via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> If you have a "new/recent FACEBOOK friend request from William Russell, it
> is NOT legit. it's a spam account that copied his page and is phishing
> about:
>
> "Have you heard about Workers Compensation Appeals Board (WCAB) and
> Department of Health & Human Service (DHHS)"
>
> The Real William Russell's FB account will read as  william.russell.7771,
>
> the cloned SPAM account is william.russell.39566905
>
> Terry H.
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Re: [Texascavers] Green place in Mexico (Skinner Lee via Texascavers)

[Charles Loving via Texascavers]

Gaston Santos father was the Gov. of SLP and owned the ranch across the
street from the hotel in Tamuin. We had his permission to cave but had to
extra careful because he raised Toros for the corrida. He also had student
protestors shot in SLP and was fired.
Gaston Jr was a bull fighter and a pal of Foxey and a UT grad.

On Mon, Jan 16, 2017 at 11:46 AM, via Texascavers <
texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:

> Now we are getting somewhere!
>
> Aside from the Zetas, etc, why is the place so unpopulated? Bad dirt?
> Wretched vegetation? Thorn scrub never stopped a Mexican or a cow, and
> neither does cloud forest.
>
> Are these mountains older than the Sierra Madre Oriental? Different
> orogeny? Subsequent up igneous oozing? Salt dome? Nascent volcano?
>
> These are reputed to be "sky island" mountains but they seem too low and
> insufficiently isolated for that to be the case from a biogeographical
> perspective. Has anyone seen any cute little rattlesnakes there? Any other
> weird endemism?
>
> And why is Zacaton so deep? Is the whole area subsiding or is sulphuric
> acid rising up from Hell?
>
> After Trump takes office will it be possible to apply to either the Zetas
> or the Gulf cartel for political asylum? If so how can they be reached?
>
> Sleaze
>
> In a message dated 1/16/2017 12:07:47 P.M. Eastern Standard Time,
> texascavers@texascavers.com writes:
>
> There is, or was remnant cloud forest there.
>
> On Sun, Jan 15, 2017 at 11:50 AM, Lee H. Skinner via Texascavers <
> texascavers@texascavers.com> wrote:
>
>> On 1/15/2017 10:00 AM, Bill Mixon via Texascavers wrote:
>>
>> That valley El Picharo is certainly a curious feature. I wonder if it is an 
>> old caldera. Whole region looks virtually uninhabited, which might (or might 
>> not) make it a place for people up to no good to hang out. Surroundings 
>> seems to have well-developed surface drainage. -- Mixon
>>
>>
>> I wonder if it could be an old meteor crater?
>>
>>
>> Lee
>>
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>
>
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