Re: [time-nuts] Power supply for time source concerns

2019-12-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
an measure any kind of difference, be it frequency stability or noise spectrum. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained b

Re: [time-nuts] Lowest Power NTP Server

2019-12-01 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
when you do not have to do the "sync clock from remote servers" part. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained

Re: [time-nuts] tracking position & orientation

2019-11-23 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Sorry, I read it as "NRCAN wil *only* do L1" -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by in

[time-nuts] Looking for HP8566A or HP8568A eprom content

2019-11-23 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
I know this is a little bit off-topic, but I am looking for the EPROM content of the HP8566A or HP8568A spectrum analyzers for a computer archaeology project. Direct email reply, please. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956

Re: [time-nuts] tracking position & orientation

2019-11-23 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
:62520 713469.6500 713470.3210 0.6710 0.0081 0.3067 1. POS Z IGS14 19:301:62520 5227269.8000 5227271.1311 1.3311 0.0133 0.8625 0.2978 1. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 F

Re: [time-nuts] tracking position & orientation

2019-11-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
more relaxing hobby than "Watching continental drift in real time" :-) [2] But only one antenna because Scandinavia has no noticeable rotation. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since

Re: [time-nuts] tracking position & orientation

2019-11-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ck "ITRF" output. If you need to convert the result to any other coordinate-system or projection, 'proj4' is your software. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe

Re: [time-nuts] Cold Rubidium over hyped?

2019-11-09 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
magnitude all the myriad of "small issues" to fix add up real fast, and when you are done with all of it, you will still have frequency drift. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe

Re: [time-nuts] Cold Rubidium over hyped?

2019-11-08 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
gling, I wouldnt be at all surprised if the next two generations of that concept delivers almost two orders of magnitude improved performance. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe

Re: [time-nuts] Cold Rubidium?

2019-11-03 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <20191103191220.eb7af29b45fdaf77f2fa4...@kinali.ch>, Attila Kinali writes: Not _quite_ a DIY project yet, but certainly easier than a fountain... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD com

Re: [time-nuts] Cold Rubidium?

2019-10-26 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
em in a cesium standard ? I wonder if you can replenish the Rb supply ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained b

Re: [time-nuts] Cold Rubidium?

2019-10-26 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , Anders Wallin writes: So sort of a "one-way/drop" fountain really ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can ade

Re: [time-nuts] HP5071A with bad tube.... can I get one used?

2019-10-25 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
be "tested, certified & packed at the factory in specific emballage approved as part of the exemption." Ie: HP had an exemption to ship to customers, but not the other way. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 Fre

Re: [time-nuts] Do ordinary clouds adversely affect GPS reception?

2019-10-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
actice that means "any ion ..." Rain clouds harbour significant ionization, long before they become thunderstorms. Apart from that, the lower atmosphere is pretty predictable with respect to ionization. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org |

Re: [time-nuts] BME280 board.

2019-10-09 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ut the temp/humidity/light/battery voltage part works great. Havn't played with the motion detector, and didn't buy the microphone option. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe

Re: [time-nuts] DC distribution crimp quality

2019-10-07 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
people want to learn about connections, soldered, crimped and otherwise some very good articles can be find in the BSTJ around the time when they invented wire-wrap. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer

Re: [time-nuts] DC distribution, Moderator comment

2019-10-06 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <38b5000d-c878-4470-943c-089153b15...@alignedsolutions.com>, Mark Spencer writes: >The catalogue also lists retention clips [...] I use those, they work fine. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 95

Re: [time-nuts] DC distribution

2019-10-06 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
hese available in a public document ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. __

Re: [time-nuts] DC distribution

2019-10-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <9e07d884-3d64-1b3a-f753-233cac347...@earthlink.net>, jimlux writes: >On 10/4/19 1:41 PM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >> >> In message <5d979ac0.80...@rogers.com>, MLewis writes: >> >>> With audio signals, a soldered crimp is

Re: [time-nuts] DC distribution

2019-10-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ion for you claim. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. ___

Re: [time-nuts] DC distribution

2019-10-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ounting holes instead of oddly shaped plastic -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

Re: [time-nuts] DC distribution

2019-10-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <36676b65-57b2-4b2d-94d6-326385ce5...@gmail.com>, Bill Dailey writes : I use http://www.westmountainradio.com/rigrunner.php -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3

Re: [time-nuts] Building a DMTD/phase noise set in the 21st century

2019-08-30 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ture-sensitivity of all electrolytics is different from pretty much any other type of capacitor, in that it has a component related to chemical reactions. That makes them totally unsuitable for filtering any voltage references. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.o

Re: [time-nuts] OCXO pressure sensitivity before TCXO

2019-08-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
t of a batch will be the ones selected >for use - based on their observed stability - Do you know where their trash bin is located, and if it is locked ? :-) I would love to get my hands on a unit from, say, the 10-25 tier of that process. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zi

[time-nuts] Z9P PPS and RTCMv3 corrections

2019-07-25 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
consistent x2-x3 improvement in Modified Allan Variance. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence

Re: [time-nuts] Hobbyist and prototyping boards with U-blox ZED-F9P

2019-07-23 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
I'm using the olimex board. Works fine. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompe

Re: [time-nuts] Galileo service currently degraded

2019-07-13 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
s, and was a major >source of issues. The gpsd software has what looks like a moderately competent python library for UBX. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute

Re: [time-nuts] High accuracy temp controller ckt

2019-07-13 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
that (think: live animals and human transplant organs) Costs a fortune. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by

Re: [time-nuts] Galileo service currently degraded

2019-07-13 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ports it is attempting to acquire satellites and not producing a navigation >solution. But that is (almost certainly) because they have the sats broadcast "unhealthy" status. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 Free

Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 180, Issue 22

2019-07-12 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ey on the guy who spent a whole career on quartz resonators over the guy who just walked out of the library :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what

Re: [time-nuts] High accuracy temp controller ckt

2019-07-12 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
duct of absolute temperature and resistance. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained

Re: [time-nuts] Used Hydrogen Maser, and Mercury Stored-Ion Clocks

2019-07-12 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
t wishes for the "3rd age"! Poul-Henning -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be exp

Re: [time-nuts] Advantages of GNSS ???

2019-07-09 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
far bigger challenges than the hanging bridge from the GPS... [1] Or, I guess, if you want to feed the PPS to your HP5370 without having to postprocess the TI measurements for the sawtooth. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956

Re: [time-nuts] LT3042, etc. Re: HP E1938A schematics.

2019-07-09 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
inal power-supply, typically a LDO, and move it physically closer to the load. On high-end kit, it is not uncommon to see a big chip surrounded by a ring of tiny LDO's spaced as little as a centimeter apart along its periphery. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebs

Re: [time-nuts] 60Khz received on Wide-band WebSDR

2019-07-06 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ion I am hearing or something else? No, that is the UK Rugby transmitter. For SDR transmitters all over the world, mainly John's KiwiSDR, visit http://sdr.hu -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer |

Re: [time-nuts] Aerial coax downlead placement

2019-07-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
gh frequency energy through, so lightning tend to jump from bends and loops, to less inductive paths if possible Be careful with EMI/EMC clam-on ferrites, they can explode in lightning strikes. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC

Re: [time-nuts] DSAC launches tonight

2019-06-25 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
on measurements of the >atmosphere using a directive array of helical antennas facing the limb. How do you orient a choke ring antenna in space ? Is the distance for LEO to GNSS orbits long enough that you can still just "point it upwards" ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp |

Re: [time-nuts] generalization of three cornered hat

2019-06-16 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ortant property of any timescale algorithm is the ability to alert and exclude false-tickers as early as possible, which makes Kalman filters obvious, despite their quirks. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer

Re: [time-nuts] The forbidden question

2019-06-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
blic, even if they do not know it has happened, (ie: longitude navigation, digital telephone networks, GPS. Peeking 20-30 years into the future is an unsolved problem, so I would argue that your question is unanswerable at this time. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@free

Re: [time-nuts] timing properties of "spectrum spreading" clocks

2019-05-19 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <80833925-1229-45a3-18ad-3395793c0...@earthlink.net>, jimlux writes: >Has anyone measured the details of the spread spectrum clocks used to >help meet emission limits (like FCC Part 15)? Most of the ones I've seen just FM modulate with a triangle. --

Re: [time-nuts] Rubidium Cells for Sale ?!

2019-05-07 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
quite as fantastic at sea-level. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by inc

Re: [time-nuts] Rubidium Cells for Sale ?!

2019-05-06 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
re they will sell you one. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

Re: [time-nuts] PRS-10 with 1 PPS IN goes nuts - 40 million degrees!

2019-04-18 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <1309221062.1589930.1555609586...@mail.yahoo.com>, Taka Kamiya via t ime-nuts writes: If you poll the PRS-10 too fast, the built-in microcontroller can get seriously confused about the serial interface. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freeb

Re: [time-nuts] Do GPS augmentation services improve 1pps?

2019-04-15 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
eriments[1] and unless you _also_ use your augmentation while in pos-hold, I dont think it is a good idea to use it get into pos-hold. Poul-Henning [1] see: http://phk.freebsd.dk/raga/sneak/ -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 Fre

[time-nuts] Rollover: Oncore

2019-04-07 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
DATE AUG 14 2002 MODEL #P273T12T11 HWDR P/N # 2 SERIAL # P04N3Z MANUFACTUR DATE 2K06 -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since

Re: [time-nuts] 4.19 MHz xtal

2019-03-31 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , Neville Michie writes: >Can any of the quartz crystal gurus explain why this >frequency was chosen? 2 to the 22nd power = 4194304 ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer

Re: [time-nuts] reply re Harrison's timing method - #13 in Vol 176, Issue 44 digest

2019-03-28 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
elite which a rocket failure left stranded in the parking orbit ... but they still completed their science objectives. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute

Re: [time-nuts] multimeter

2019-03-23 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , Jim Palfreyman writes: >Could I have some recommendations? I'll caution against the Fluke 287: It takes forever to start and it eats batteries faster than is comfortable. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP s

Re: [time-nuts] inexpensive fiber optic distribution

2019-03-21 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
overy and/or the AGC that sets up the switching level. If we are only inside a lab, look at TOSLINK which can be made to do interesting stuff if you play a bit with it. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer

Re: [time-nuts] statistical distribution of initial frequency error in tcxos

2019-03-14 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
some form - but it was a thought..) Do they have to transmit continuously, our could you use a dutycycle of, say 10%, to reduce the problem to something more manageable ? Obviously that introduces cycle-slips into the math... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.or

Re: [time-nuts] HP Stories: An architectural view of the HP 5060/5061 and awkward oscillator adjustments.

2019-02-25 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
-- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. ___ time-nuts mailing lis

Re: [time-nuts] HP Stories: An architectural view of the HP 5060/5061 and awkward oscillator adjustments.

2019-02-24 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
very brief voltage spikes must be kept under the rated voltage, so overrating would buy some transient durability, but other than that... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never

Re: [time-nuts] HP Stories: An architectural view of the HP 5060/5061 and awkward oscillator adjustments.

2019-02-24 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
e 'lyt up. Drying out is an entirely different failure mode, caused mainly by high temperatures, either from ambient (Tubes) or self heating due to ripple-current in the ESR. Poul-Henning [1] I have tried to find out how slow one needs to ramp. People with chemical clue tell me that elec

Re: [time-nuts] Correcting measured PPS values with receiver sawtooth correction values

2019-02-15 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ese events show up as spikes of almost one clock-period outside the normal band, at the "towers" of the "hanging brides". In other words: Standard deviations and variances is not the right tool, you are looking for outliers at a quite distinct distance (+/-) from the mean.

Re: [time-nuts] HP Stories: Battery Chargers, and a fading idolization of HP

2019-02-10 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Christopher Shawn McGahey's wrote his phd at Georgia Tech on the subject, and it sorts a lot of facts from fiction. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malic

Re: [time-nuts] HP Stories: Battery Chargers, and a fading idolization of HP

2019-02-09 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Hugh, I notice your design, like all other HP designs I have seen from that era, operates with a very high margin for low mains voltage. Do you happen to remember what HP's design criteria were for this ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | T

Re: [time-nuts] Good clean-up oscillators

2019-01-23 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
and feed it from your LPRO instead. If you only need one GPIO pin, I doubt the exact clock frequency matters much. (The BeagleBone is interesting too, since the PRU units run autonomously at 200 MHz from their own memory, so the main CPU could do other jobs for you.) -- Poul-Henning Ka

Re: [time-nuts] Ublox F9P multi-band GPS receiver

2019-01-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
n the GPS receiver internals, and it is very hard to keep stable, but you _can_ do it. I know, because I did :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what

Re: [time-nuts] Ublox F9P multi-band GPS receiver

2019-01-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
>The one thing which is missing is a external frequency input. You can >get a frequency output in its place, but it does not fully replace the >input. That's where the module vs. chip comes in. Consider talking to sparkfun about how they should do the next version ? -- Pou

Re: [time-nuts] Ublox F9P multi-band GPS receiver

2019-01-22 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
own …. >Stuff gets better from L1 / L2, but then gets worse when you put hanging >bridges back in …. >Keep in mind that hanging bridges do not *always* average out. It's even worse than that: The better your GPS's oscillator, the less the hanging bridges average out. -- Poul-

Re: [time-nuts] Calculating sidereal time

2019-01-19 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , Mark Sims writes: >When I was playing with the sidereal time code I found lots of >buggy/bogus implementations This book is the cure: https://www.cs.tau.ac.il/~nachum/calendar-book/third-edition/ -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus

Re: [time-nuts] Misuse of word "decimate" (was Re: Short term 10MHz source)

2019-01-11 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <293ce126-e9ef-40a2-e742-966d638cf...@rubidium.se>, Magnus Danielson writes: I can add that as of this morning, "decimate" is also used for the act of reading only every Nth email in a long thread :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20

Re: [time-nuts] Atomic Clocks: It is important that they keep good time, Part 1

2019-01-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
2_working_clock/index.html I still have a pile of those PCB's in case any of you want one. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice w

Re: [time-nuts] Atomic Clocks: It is important that they keep good time, Part 1

2019-01-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
http://phk.freebsd.dk/hacks/HP5065A/20151225_clock/index.html http://phk.freebsd.dk/hacks/HP5065A/20160112_working_clock/index.html (I still have spare PCBs available) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer

Re: [time-nuts] TIC Characterization

2018-12-31 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ity you want to tweak it to 9.999 MHz rather than 10 MHz. Yes, that is a fall-back if your siggen cannot control the phase. Of course if you both set 9.999 MHz *and* sweep the phase, you will be able to separte the effects of the siggen and counter even better. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX

Re: [time-nuts] TIC Characterization

2018-12-30 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
have patience for. Plot results, and wonder why you don't get a straight line... -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attr

Re: [time-nuts] question about multi-way measurement

2018-12-26 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
e your >time-nut hat on, they are crappy clocks with lots of common mode errors >(temperature, network delays). I think the techniques should apply. They do. But in my experience all you end up getting is a very precise measurement of the air-conditions performance. -- Poul-Henni

Re: [time-nuts] Some ES100 WWVB BPSK success

2018-12-25 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
e latency or jitter >is systematic and if several of us determine they are consistent, >board-to-board and city-to-city, then we can simply apply hard-coded >corrections in s/w. The really interesting experiment is running two of them next to each other, and see if the IRQ timing varies be

Re: [time-nuts] ES100 BPSK WWVB jitter data

2018-12-25 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , Tim Shoppa writes: >I don't see any sawtooth or other weird stuff going on in the residual. I don't think you would be able to detect a sawtooth, even if it were there, with a pulse-per-minute signal between two bare X-tals ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp

Re: [time-nuts] Comparing the performance of 17 different GPSDOs

2018-12-09 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
r how many of these still run with SA optimized PLL time constants ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence.

Re: [time-nuts] Project GREAT - Galloping Galileo version

2018-12-08 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
he name seems a bit grandiose ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained

Re: [time-nuts] simple phase finder addendum

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
> if anyone uses a coiled antenna .. best keep it in sight and have a fire > extinguisher handy. That's when you transmit, not when you receive. If having coiled wire were that dangerous, they would not sell it on drums. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog

Re: [time-nuts] simple phase finder

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ked the one on page six here: http://www.home.earthlink.net/~christrask/Complementary%20Push-Pull%20Amplifiers.pdf It goes from practically DC to around 150-200 MHz in my hand-soldered SMD implementation. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | T

Re: [time-nuts] WWVB data to play with

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
quot;r % 480" gives an output line every 10 msec The "if n < 12000" is the averaging factor of an exponential average. A proper low-pass filter will give much sharper amplitude. Johns sample-rate appears to be almost 1000PPM fast and drifting, it it is trivial to adjust the "

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
he first) in each second, but more bits are encoded each second after the first one, I belive for some kind of "telecontrol" scheme. See 4th plot from the top for (old) evidence: http://phk.freebsd.dk/loran-c/CW/ -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@fre

Re: [time-nuts] simple phase finder

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , jimlux writes: >On 12/5/18 5:39 AM, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: >All manner of PLLs don't work as well when the input signal is of >varying amplitude. Maybe it works well enough here. The PLL needs a phase offset input, if you do the circular buffer you c

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
here were some Loran-C stations left :-) > >I could see the GRI 8000 Chayka constellation thought. I have never been able to calculate a plausible position from that here in Denmark, I'd be very interested to see your calculations if you succeed. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zi

Re: [time-nuts] simple phase finder

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
t;has one) There is one experiment I have thought about, but not tried: Wind a big loop, run it directly into a sound card with microphone input. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
an-C stations left :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. ___

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message <20181205150943.d18ce043dfd44d2731220...@kinali.ch>, Attila Kinali w rites: >On Tue, 04 Dec 2018 22:56:54 +0000 >"Poul-Henning Kamp" wrote: > >> And the BPSK does improve timing. >> >> If you have access to, and tracks the carrier,

Re: [time-nuts] simple phase finder

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
riers this way using the same single circular buffer. If you multiply it by 77.5 kHz sine+cosine, you get DCF77 phase and amplitude. If you multiply it by 198kHz you get... There's some very old plots here: http://phk.freebsd.dk/loran-c/CW/ -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNI

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
allows you to capture and save the raw IQ data. If necessary read: https://www.dspguide.com/ Now, stop talking and start coding :-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-05 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
In message , "John Moran, Scawby Design" writes: >I think I will get distracted over Christmas sketching out some designs ... Grab som I+Q samples from a kiwisdr somewhere and start playing with signals instead. If you like it, start making hardware. -- Poul

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ause you can average for minutes if you want - provided you feed the ADC a good stable clock. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be e

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
e-standard. And BPSK *does* improve the timing, because you can very precisely measure when the change of phase happens, and it since it happens at a carrier zero-crossing you can filter it down to +/- sample. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | T

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
odulation of RDF and BBC on 198kHz can be nailed down very precisely that way. But the crucial thing is: You need to digitize the carrier. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
sub-volt VREF and still be perfectly happy. There really isn't anything to it... The only reason I'm not active in VLF any more is that I have to choose between VLF reception or my robotic lawn-mowers, and with 5000m² of lawn, that is not even a close call. -- Poul-Henning Kamp

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
there. But for anything more than that, you *have* to get hold of the carrier and not just the modulation. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice wh

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ssing ;-) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by incompetence. ___ time-nuts

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
Fort Collins. :-) Write a WWVB extension to KiwiSDR so you can try it all over the world ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
rely possible. See also: Loran-C ? And with the new phase modulation, you can do get down in low microseconds at tau=1, but the atmosphere will ruin longer taus. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD

Re: [time-nuts] new WWVB BPSK dev board

2018-12-04 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
signal you prefer (or an ensemble of them) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by i

Re: [time-nuts] SRS PRS10 RFC

2018-12-03 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
signal dithers the mediocre 1PPS timestamping, but the serial correction prevents the "hanging bridges" from causing wander. Not all PRS10 firmwares support this btw. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD commit

Re: [time-nuts] Detecting gravity with optical atomic clocks

2018-12-01 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
e. Thanks. > >How is your pendulum oriented? > >If you had good seismic data, could you correct? And can you reverse-engineer the local ground movement from the pendulum measurements ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since

Re: [time-nuts] Adoption of revision of the SI at CGPM #26

2018-11-17 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
f I thought Resolution B was much more relevant for us: It defines TAI https://www.bipm.org/utils/en/pdf/CGPM/Convocation-2018.pdf (page 34 forwards) -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD

Re: [time-nuts] Helium and MEMS oscillators don;t mix well

2018-11-01 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
had migrated out. Most likely: Because some piece of MEMS machinery broke of ? -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can adequately be explained by

Re: [time-nuts] Helium and MEMS oscillators don;t mix well

2018-11-01 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
ration >1%, the room oxygen sensor would be alarming (having dropped to 20%) and >people would be running for the doors. That's not my experience, most ${GAS}-level detectors are based on some kind of chemical reactivty (or spectroscopy if they are _really_ expensive) and they tend t

Re: [time-nuts] Helium and MEMS oscillators don;t mix well

2018-11-01 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
talking deep unventilated mineshaft kind of concentrations... Hydrogen is a lot more plausible in my view. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attribute to malice what can

Re: [time-nuts] Helium and MEMS oscillators don;t mix well

2018-11-01 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
few days supports this hypothesis. At least that is what >Jack told me. Right, but you need a LOT of Radon before the Helium concentration becomes a problem, and the alphas would literally make things glow in the dark. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org

Re: [time-nuts] Helium and MEMS oscillators don;t mix well

2018-10-31 Thread Poul-Henning Kamp
s even smaller than Helium atoms, and present in copious amounts near any rechargeable battery and a fair number of industrial processes. -- Poul-Henning Kamp | UNIX since Zilog Zeus 3.20 p...@freebsd.org | TCP/IP since RFC 956 FreeBSD committer | BSD since 4.3-tahoe Never attr

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