Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
In a message dated 8/24/2004 12:26:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: There is no spiritual discernment at all outside of the ministry of the Holy Spirit John. Since "spiritual discernment" is something other than discerning right and wrong, what inthe world are you talking

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 8/22/2004 9:30:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: DAVEH: John..would you mind elaborating a bit more on how vs 12-16 help this Mongolian who dies without hearing the gospel, please? DaveH, when you read that

Re: [TruthTalk] One with God

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
ShieldsFamily wrote: DaveH, I cant answer that until you answer my question more fully: what does we will become one with them in bringing to pass our immortality and eternal life means specifically. DAVEH: I probably should not have framed it as such, as it is a

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
Judy Taylor wrote: You'd be as wellsticking with the LDS as to embrace this confusion DaveH. DAVEH: I'm not sure what confusion to which you are referring, JudyT. If you are speaking of John's reply to me, it sure sounds better than much of what I've heard previously from

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
In a message dated 8/23/2004 9:26:33 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: John, I have been reading Kruger and am not, so far, impressed. But I have decided to withhold judgement until I am finished. However I have a couple of questions for you. (So I can make Lances day so

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
ShieldsFamily wrote: Satan loves to divide and conquer. Izzy DAVEH: Are you alluding to me, Izzy? From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Lance Muir Sent: Monday, August 23, 2004 11:21 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
In a message dated 8/24/2004 11:48:13 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 8/22/2004 9:30:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: DAVEH: John..would you mind elaborating a bit more on how vs 12-16 help this Mongolian

Re: [TruthTalk] Jenna

2004-08-25 Thread Judy Taylor
Terry: Thanks for the reminder about Jenna and thank you to everyone who is praying for her. She had a 4hr pass last Sunday and they took her to Church. My daughter told me there is one song where they have an adult man, a woman, and a child to come fwd and lead with hand motions to help

Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger

2004-08-25 Thread Judy Taylor
On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 02:47:03 EDT [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In a message dated 8/24/2004 12:26:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:There is no spiritual discernment at all outside of the ministry of the Holy Spirit John. Since "spiritual discernment" is something

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
In a message dated 8/25/2004 12:16:02 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judy Taylor wrote: You'd be as well sticking with the LDS as to embrace this confusion DaveH. DAVEH: I'm not sure what confusion to which you are referring, JudyT. If you are speaking of John's reply to

Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
In a message dated 8/25/2004 12:51:30 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In a message dated 8/24/2004 12:26:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: There is no spiritual discernment at all outside of the ministry of the Holy Spirit John. Since "spiritual

Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger

2004-08-25 Thread Judy Taylor
On Wed, 25 Aug 2004 03:59:47 EDT [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: In a message dated 8/24/2004 12:26:59 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:There is no spiritual discernment at all outside of the ministry of the Holy Spirit John.Since "spiritual discernment" is something

Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger

2004-08-25 Thread Lance Muir
semper reformanda - Original Message - From: Slade Henson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 24, 2004 20:30 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger Best I can come up with is someone who favors progress or reformÂ… be it religious or political

Re: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger

2004-08-25 Thread Lance Muir
I can align myself with that. - Original Message - From: Slade Henson To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: August 24, 2004 20:30 Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Smithson and Kruger Best I can come up with is someone who favors progress or reformÂ… be it religious or

Re: [TruthTalk] Israel as the preparatory womb for the Incarnate One

2004-08-25 Thread Lance Muir
Slade:Briefly put:God's unilateral covenant with humankind is set forth through Abraham (Israel). Israel's entire history may be viewed as the 'gestation periord' (womb). Jesus (Emmanuel) assumes Adamic humanity at the virginal conception. Empowered by the Spirit the man Jesus, undoes what

Re: [TruthTalk] Christians' authority over nature

2004-08-25 Thread Terry Clifton
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 8/24/2004 2:16:55 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Remember it is Jesus who said ...be it unto you according to Your faith, not His power etc. When Jesus came down from the mount of transfiguration and the father pleaded

Re: [TruthTalk] Christians' authority over nature

2004-08-25 Thread Lance Muir
Amen Amen (John Terry) This so-called HW gospel is better 'marketed' in the West. When one goes to Asia, the Middle East, Central South America Africa 'one' finds an incompatibility with the lived reality. NB:a good book on this: Faith, Health Prosperity - Andrew Perriman (Paternoster

RE: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread ShieldsFamily
Well, come to think of itthats possible DaveH! Funny you would think of it. J Izzy From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dave Hansen Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 1:33 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

RE: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread ShieldsFamily
Izzy replies in red below: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 1:19 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16 In a message dated 8/23/2004 9:26:33 AM Pacific

RE: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread ShieldsFamily
I am not a Pretestant. Protestantism is especially the high church (Preby, Espisco, Methodi, and the like -- the robed and liturgical church. ) As far as I know, I am the only one who believes this way ;-) John, Ive always assumed that if you arent Catholic you are stuck with the moniker

RE: [TruthTalk] Jenna

2004-08-25 Thread ShieldsFamily
How precious...if only we were more like children as adults. Izzy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 1:49 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Jenna Terry: Thanks for the reminder

Re: [TruthTalk] Christians' authority over nature

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
In a message dated 8/25/2004 5:28:23 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Well said, John. Though there is nothing at all wrong with going to God with your concerns, it is quite evident that the big picture is us serving God, not God serving us. Jesus said, "I must be about my

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
DAVEH: Ahh shucks, John.A little Mormon Class might be good for you, even though most folks would consider it to be low class. 8-) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 8/25/2004 12:16:02 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Judy Taylor wrote:

RE: [TruthTalk] Christians' authority over nature

2004-08-25 Thread ShieldsFamily
Michael, John, and Terry. Its a blessing to read the viewpoints of all of you. I hope we dont all jump on Michael, because what he says is true to a point, no doubt about it. But as we walk longer with the Lord I think Michael will find that the real test of faith comes when we do pray,

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
Brown is in -- red is out. John ;-) In a message dated 8/25/2004 6:20:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: Izzy replies in red below: From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 1:19 AM To: [EMAIL

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
ShieldsFamily wrote: Well, come to think of itthats possible DaveH! Funny you would think of it. J Izzy DAVEH: I've learned to read your mind, Izzy... 8-) ShieldsFamily wrote: Satan loves to divide and conquer. Izzy DAVEH: Are you alluding to me,

RE: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread ShieldsFamily
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Dave Hansen Sent: Wednesday, August 25, 2004 8:11 AM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16 ShieldsFamily wrote: Well, come to think of itthats possible DaveH! Funny you

Re: [TruthTalk] Christians' authority over nature

2004-08-25 Thread Knpraise
Even though I write as if I know -- I am never or seldom fully convinced. Michael's return comments would be appreciated. My comments, and probably Terry's, are statements from us that reveal why we a little different viewpoint. For me, my statement is problematic to Michael's view -- and if my

RE: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread ShieldsFamily
Ok, John; now I will be green/bold. Izzy I have been reading Kruger and am not, so far, impressed. But I have decided to withhold judgement until I am finished. However I have a couple of questions for you. (So I can make Lances day so that he can ridicule my ignorance.) (1) What do

RE: [TruthTalk] Israel as the preparatory womb for the Incarnate One

2004-08-25 Thread Slade Henson
Well, thats an interesting Remez, to coin a Hebraic phrase (Remez = spiritualization of a text, leaving the pashat/plain-sense behind for a higher or deeper meaning). However, you are not entirely correct when you stated that Christianity is unique in its Triune nature of God or

RE: [TruthTalk] Christians' authority over nature

2004-08-25 Thread Slade Henson
Interestingly, in the face of a possibly devastating storm, I did not ask God to send it somewhere else. I hoped [and prayed] it would dissipate in the face of the front that was moving down toward it. When this scenario failed, I prayed (as we fled) the book collection would survive the

Re: [TruthTalk] Christians' authority over nature

2004-08-25 Thread michael douglas
Michael D: Judy touched on much that I would offer in response to the questions asked. You see, all through Jesus' walk on earth He kept asking, where is your faith; oh ye of little faith; how come you have no faith? and on and on and on. The biggest problem God has is not as much with whether it

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 8/24/2004 11:48:13 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 8/22/2004 9:30:19 PM Pacific Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: DAVEH: John..would you

Re: [Fwd: Re: [TruthTalk] Romans 2:12-16

2004-08-25 Thread Dave Hansen
ShieldsFamily wrote: ShieldsFamily wrote: Well, come to think of itthats possible DaveH! Funny you would think of it. J Izzy DAVEH: I've learned to read your mind, Izzy... 8-) Then you are way ahead of my husband, DaveH! J Izzy DAVEH: