Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Am 04.11.2007 um 22:51 schrieb Quey: If you are going to use that as a stand point, maybe you need to use bloated winblows :) No thanks. Or for that matter in Linux I think Ubuntu, or OpenSolaris as they all apparently have trillions of packages ... It's not the packages - it's the ports-system that let's you easily compile these packages yourself with the customizations _you_ need and want (if you know what you need). but I rather know whats going into my system and I know where it goes, and I know its compiled just right for my system, never any dependency issues and I *know* the sources have not been messed about with, FreeBSD ports are just like a RH/Deb, they will customised for the OS, and I hate it when they do it. It depends - FreeBSD in my experience messes a lot less with the packages than most other "distributions" out there. Recently, more stuff has been split-up into the different /usr/local subdirectories (lib, libexec, share etc.), but it's still all very logic and simple. It's also nice for running a server because the base-OS is split from the applications. Of course, to understand what the "toasters" do, you should have done some work with qmail and vpopmail. So you're not completely helpless when something breaks. (But the people building the toaster-scripts usually also sell support for these cases...) I tried CentOS5 once, but I'm not sure if I could get happy with it. E.g. I can't seem to be able to get around the 32bit vs. 64bit package-mess (I tried the 64 bit version inside VMware). It's just another bloated RedHat OS. I don't think it's bloated - it's just next to useless running any kind of OSS that needs dependencies or customizations outside the packages provided on the CDs (CentOS has some more than RHEL, but the problem is the same). Need a PHP-module for some webmail that isn't on the CDs? Either do your own PHP RPM or try to create additional modules from the (horrible) SPEC-file provided (and subsequently also backport your own patches - thank you). Cool for running Oracle, SAP or Notes, where the OS is just kernel +filesystem+sshd (in case of Oracle, even the filesystem is sometime not used). Qmail + Vpopmail+clamav etc. need so many dependencies with so many special compile-time configurations that it's usually a big hassle to do it on any Linux distribution (maybe Ubuntu or Debian is better, but they also do a lot of behind-the-scene magic (and freeze the API, so squirrelmail never get's updated, only bugfixed etc.). FreeBSD has a nicely balanced approach for most of these problems. Not to start a flamewar - but the original poster did ask for suggestions ;-) cheers, Rainer -- Rainer Duffner CISSP, LPI, MCSE [EMAIL PROTECTED] !DSPAM:472fbd2c32002112017289!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
I fail to see what this has to do with vpopmail. Please take it off the list. Rick Michael Johnson wrote: Quey wrote: Michael Johnson wrote: It is nice to use Slackware because it doesn't do funky stuff with software. qmail installs fairly easily and fits in decently well. Oh, it also works great on slower hardware because you can strip services to the bare essentials easily and thus leave more resources for the actual functions it needs to do. and boots in 1/8th of the time RHES/CentOS does :) Likely because RH actively probes for new hardware on every boot and also launches a bunch of processes. While you can cut all that out and make it boot fast, it takes a lot of work. The only downside to Slackware is that it doesn't use PAM, so you need to make local login accounts. Personally, I don't like PAM (it has had many security issues in the past) and qmail doesn't use it, so it isn't a big thing. Also, Slackware doesn't hold your hand on dependencies, but if you are a decent system administrator, you shouldn't have problems with that. Eh? for what do you create local login accounts? I follow the rule that one should never log in directly as root. In this case, you need at least one mortal local account as an initial login. - Michael !DSPAM:472e5ef532006682418239!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Michael Johnson wrote: I follow the rule that one should never log in directly as root. In this case, you need at least one mortal local account as an initial login. - Michael It should not matter about a local root login, after all you do protect your servers at the core routers dont you. Of course if you run it on a home cable/dsl connection thats a different matter altogether, but even then I'd be surprised if you allowed ssh access to just anyone. So long as your router ACL's are setup right, you wont have any issues, a lot of servers require ssh access to do many things in scripts, afterall you have to restart a web server after you add a new host, sure you can change the cons via secure NFS, but apache for example isn't good enough to know when its conf files change :) Back end stuff (along with NFS) for example only runs on pvt address space on a second interface, ssh listens on that interface only and not the net ip, then we also have ILO on yet another pvt address space. It's pretty safe. !DSPAM:472e5dd032001325012172!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Quey wrote: > Michael Johnson wrote: >> It is nice to use Slackware because it doesn't do funky stuff with >> software. qmail installs fairly easily and fits in decently well. Oh, it >> also works great on slower hardware because you can strip services to >> the bare essentials easily and thus leave more resources for the actual >> functions it needs to do. >> >> > and boots in 1/8th of the time RHES/CentOS does :) > > Likely because RH actively probes for new hardware on every boot and also launches a bunch of processes. While you can cut all that out and make it boot fast, it takes a lot of work. >> The only downside to Slackware is that it doesn't use PAM, so you need >> to make local login accounts. Personally, I don't like PAM (it has had >> many security issues in the past) and qmail doesn't use it, so it isn't >> a big thing. Also, Slackware doesn't hold your hand on dependencies, but >> if you are a decent system administrator, you shouldn't have problems >> with that. >> >> > Eh? for what do you create local login accounts? > > > I follow the rule that one should never log in directly as root. In this case, you need at least one mortal local account as an initial login. - Michael !DSPAM:472e589f32001838832398!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Michael Johnson wrote: It is nice to use Slackware because it doesn't do funky stuff with software. qmail installs fairly easily and fits in decently well. Oh, it also works great on slower hardware because you can strip services to the bare essentials easily and thus leave more resources for the actual functions it needs to do. and boots in 1/8th of the time RHES/CentOS does :) The only downside to Slackware is that it doesn't use PAM, so you need to make local login accounts. Personally, I don't like PAM (it has had many security issues in the past) and qmail doesn't use it, so it isn't a big thing. Also, Slackware doesn't hold your hand on dependencies, but if you are a decent system administrator, you shouldn't have problems with that. Eh? for what do you create local login accounts? !DSPAM:472e3fbe32001874710587!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Rainer Duffner wrote: Quey schrieb: Remo Mattei wrote: Hello I have a few questions since I am building a new server. Now the box is running centos 4.5 with qmail and fuzzyocr, spamassassin,dspam and tmda with simscan the load during the day is hi since it's an old P3 1.2mgz and 1.5g of mem. this box is running mysql 4.1.x, vpopmail 5.4.17 with the DB already modified for the 5.4.20. I was looking at the new centos 5 with mysql 5. Anyone has done the installation on this distro or is anyone suggesting any other. Thanks. Sl;ackware 12, MySQL 5, Qmail, MailScanner, S.A and so on... MailScanner has the advantage of processing for spam/viruses in batch mode, thereby not holding open smtp connections and running multiple copies of everything, also nicely does phishing fraud tests and bad files and so on. I've used RH based OS's before and trust me, for servers, I'd never use anything but Slackware now, its modern, clean and lean and not really modified from what all the programs were in tarball releases, which = less problems and less required updates because the likes of RH and co have not butchered it to bits. But it's still Linux ;-) Who would want to run a linux-distribution when most of the software he wants are not included in the packaging-system? I try to run as much as possible on FreeBSD. FreeBSD has most of the stuff that is needed for a Toaster in the ports - and what is missing is on http://mail-toaster.org/ If you are going to use that as a stand point, maybe you need to use bloated winblows :) Or for that matter in Linux I think Ubuntu, or OpenSolaris as they all apparently have trillions of packages ... but I rather know whats going into my system and I know where it goes, and I know its compiled just right for my system, never any dependency issues and I *know* the sources have not been messed about with, FreeBSD ports are just like a RH/Deb, they will customised for the OS, and I hate it when they do it. I tried CentOS5 once, but I'm not sure if I could get happy with it. E.g. I can't seem to be able to get around the 32bit vs. 64bit package-mess (I tried the 64 bit version inside VMware). It's just another bloated RedHat OS. cheers, Rainer !DSPAM:472e3ed832008045019048!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Rainer Duffner wrote: > Quey schrieb: >> Remo Mattei wrote: >>> Hello I have a few questions since I am building a new server. Now the >>> box is running centos 4.5 with qmail and fuzzyocr, spamassassin,dspam >>> and tmda with simscan the load during the day is hi since it's an old P3 >>> 1.2mgz and 1.5g of mem. this box is running mysql 4.1.x, vpopmail 5.4.17 >>> with the DB already modified for the 5.4.20. I was looking at the new >>> centos 5 with mysql 5. Anyone has done the installation on this distro >>> or is anyone suggesting any other. >>> >>> Thanks. >>> >>> >>> >>> >> Sl;ackware 12, MySQL 5, Qmail, MailScanner, S.A and so on... >> MailScanner has the advantage of processing for spam/viruses in batch >> mode, thereby not holding open smtp connections and running multiple >> copies of everything, also nicely does phishing fraud tests and bad >> files and so on. >> >> I've used RH based OS's before and trust me, for servers, I'd never >> use anything but Slackware now, its modern, clean and lean and not >> really modified from what all the programs were in tarball releases, >> which = less problems and less required updates because the likes of >> RH and co have not butchered it to bits. > > > But it's still Linux ;-) Who would want to run a linux-distribution when > most of the software he wants are not included in the packaging-system? > I try to run as much as possible on FreeBSD. > FreeBSD has most of the stuff that is needed for a Toaster in the ports > - and what is missing is on http://mail-toaster.org/ > > I tried CentOS5 once, but I'm not sure if I could get happy with it. > E.g. I can't seem to be able to get around the 32bit vs. 64bit > package-mess (I tried the 64 bit version inside VMware). > > > > > cheers, > Rainer > > > > > > > > > Slackware is actually fairly nice for this. I'm running on Slackware 11.0 using qmail + vpopmail with MySQL auth and NFS mounted mailboxes. I have a different server handle spam and virus scanning so I can optimize each for the task they handle. It is nice to use Slackware because it doesn't do funky stuff with software. qmail installs fairly easily and fits in decently well. Oh, it also works great on slower hardware because you can strip services to the bare essentials easily and thus leave more resources for the actual functions it needs to do. The only downside to Slackware is that it doesn't use PAM, so you need to make local login accounts. Personally, I don't like PAM (it has had many security issues in the past) and qmail doesn't use it, so it isn't a big thing. Also, Slackware doesn't hold your hand on dependencies, but if you are a decent system administrator, you shouldn't have problems with that. As for choosing what to use, you shouldn't base your decision on what has a "toaster". You should instead learn how the system is put together so you can diagnose issues and fix problems. Use the "toaster" and other items as a guide in assembly, not the actual solution. My personal procedure on installing is a combination of jms' scripts and patches, some points in QMR, and my own preferences (and limitations, I'm stuck with pop-before-smtp). I'd be happy to send a copy of my install notes if anyone is interested. - Michael !DSPAM:472e15ff32001688120240!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Quey schrieb: Remo Mattei wrote: Hello I have a few questions since I am building a new server. Now the box is running centos 4.5 with qmail and fuzzyocr, spamassassin,dspam and tmda with simscan the load during the day is hi since it's an old P3 1.2mgz and 1.5g of mem. this box is running mysql 4.1.x, vpopmail 5.4.17 with the DB already modified for the 5.4.20. I was looking at the new centos 5 with mysql 5. Anyone has done the installation on this distro or is anyone suggesting any other. Thanks. Sl;ackware 12, MySQL 5, Qmail, MailScanner, S.A and so on... MailScanner has the advantage of processing for spam/viruses in batch mode, thereby not holding open smtp connections and running multiple copies of everything, also nicely does phishing fraud tests and bad files and so on. I've used RH based OS's before and trust me, for servers, I'd never use anything but Slackware now, its modern, clean and lean and not really modified from what all the programs were in tarball releases, which = less problems and less required updates because the likes of RH and co have not butchered it to bits. But it's still Linux ;-) Who would want to run a linux-distribution when most of the software he wants are not included in the packaging-system? I try to run as much as possible on FreeBSD. FreeBSD has most of the stuff that is needed for a Toaster in the ports - and what is missing is on http://mail-toaster.org/ I tried CentOS5 once, but I'm not sure if I could get happy with it. E.g. I can't seem to be able to get around the 32bit vs. 64bit package-mess (I tried the 64 bit version inside VMware). cheers, Rainer !DSPAM:472e050532001336789273!
Re: [vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Remo Mattei wrote: Hello I have a few questions since I am building a new server. Now the box is running centos 4.5 with qmail and fuzzyocr, spamassassin,dspam and tmda with simscan the load during the day is hi since it's an old P3 1.2mgz and 1.5g of mem. this box is running mysql 4.1.x, vpopmail 5.4.17 with the DB already modified for the 5.4.20. I was looking at the new centos 5 with mysql 5. Anyone has done the installation on this distro or is anyone suggesting any other. Thanks. Sl;ackware 12, MySQL 5, Qmail, MailScanner, S.A and so on... MailScanner has the advantage of processing for spam/viruses in batch mode, thereby not holding open smtp connections and running multiple copies of everything, also nicely does phishing fraud tests and bad files and so on. I've used RH based OS's before and trust me, for servers, I'd never use anything but Slackware now, its modern, clean and lean and not really modified from what all the programs were in tarball releases, which = less problems and less required updates because the likes of RH and co have not butchered it to bits. !DSPAM:472cfd7d32001645642163!
[vchkpw] new server OS suggestions
Hello I have a few questions since I am building a new server. Now the box is running centos 4.5 with qmail and fuzzyocr, spamassassin,dspam and tmda with simscan the load during the day is hi since it's an old P3 1.2mgz and 1.5g of mem. this box is running mysql 4.1.x, vpopmail 5.4.17 with the DB already modified for the 5.4.20. I was looking at the new centos 5 with mysql 5. Anyone has done the installation on this distro or is anyone suggesting any other. Thanks. !DSPAM:472cb85732001823840940!
