[Vo]:REMOVED: Damon Craig on vortexB-L only
Removed for repeated flagrant violation of Rule #2 No Sneering. See: http://amasci.com/weird/wvort.html#rules http://amasci.com/weird/vmore.html Mr. Craig remains available via secondary flamewars list vortex...@eskimo.com. To subscribe, send a *blank* message to: vortexb-l-requ...@eskimo.com Put the single word subscribe in the subject line of the header. No quotes around subscribe, of course. You will get an automatic greeting message in response. Once subscribed, send your email to vortex...@eskimo.com. On Wed, 27 Jul 2011, Damon Craig wrote: Keep going Lomax. You are in over your head, and far out classed. When I arrived at Vortex-L you were stumbling around in the dark stuck on a humidity meter. ... Does your psychoanalyst know what you are doing on the internet? Are you currently institutionalized? Do you still see you analyst? I hope so. If you are not seeing your analyst I think you should. (( ( ( ( ((O)) ) ) ) ))) William J. BeatySCIENCE HOBBYIST website billb amasci comhttp://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 206-762-3818unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci
[Vo]:WTF: The Easiest 100% FREE Electricity...Build It In Less Than An Hour!
WTF! I really makes me sad that there are people trying to rip people off in this way. :(. No idea where they got my email address from. Joe Begin forwarded message: From: Maurice Brown maurice_br...@aol.com Subject: The Easiest 100% FREE Electricity...Build It In Less Than An Hour! Date: 1 August 2011 11:35:39 GMT+01:00 To: j...@tao.org.uk Hi, Nicola Tesla Is Finally Proven Right... On How You Can Make Your Own Free Electricity! A small groundbreaking device (the smallest you can build) that Generates 100% FREE ELECTRICITY day in and day out ... without using ANY kind of input except free radiant energy! http://mteurl.com/ce83 The video actually demonstrated a working TESLA generator along with clear, step by step instructions on how you can build it yourself. It's incredibly simple to build and requires almost NO maintenance at all. I couldn't believe it first but when I tested it by myself and really it actually worked! If you have just as little as 42 minutes and a DVD player, you already have all you need to cut the cord and break free from the electric company once and for all! Take a look at this short video that demonstrates a small-scale Tesla Generator in action : http://mteurl.com/ce83 To your success, Maurice Brown PS: There are other guides on the market, claiming they can teach you how to make the Tesla Generator. Some are pretty good, others are worthless... and none of them actually show you - on video - how to build the device. If you want to slash your learning curve - so you can see immediate results, and an instant drop of 50% or more in your electricity bill, order Building the Tesla Generator - The Uncensored DVD now. http://mteurl.com/ce83 To Unsubscribe: Send your message to maurice_br...@aol.com
Re: [Vo]:REMOVED: Damon Craig on vortexB-L only
Thank you, Bill! That was a good move IMO, which should certainly improve the atmosphere here. On 11-08-01 02:11 AM, William Beaty wrote: Removed for repeated flagrant violation of Rule #2 No Sneering. See:
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
On Sun, Jul 31, 2011 at 10:10 PM, OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson orionwo...@charter.net wrote: Back around 2008 I gather someone who went by the name of Alsetalokin (that's Nicola Tesla spelled backwards) brought an unusual magnetic motor configuration to the public domain's attention. He got the idea from a fellow forum member in the defunct Steorn forum. The member's handle was Overconfident or OC and envisioned a magnet configuration shown here by Clanzer: http://www.overunity.org.uk/cmps_index.php?pageid=whipmag1 The present belief is that the whipmag was a hoax which got way out of hand when the vid went viral. Al removed the vid but it got copied by others. OC has since passed away and Al seems to regret the whole incident from what little he will say. He post here: http://www.moletrap.co.uk/forum/ under the same handle . . . no doubt the same guy. He was the first banned from the Defkalion forum under the anagram Stella Nokia. He has a Youtube channel under the anagram TinselKoala with 164 vids to date including some attempting to debunk the Rossi ECat. As far as your questions are concerned, all I can say is we tested every configuration of magnetic motor we could imagine and always found the cycle conservative. I can say that we demonstrated an asymmetry between the attractive and repellent forces between magnets. I have never been able to explain this to my own satisfaction. T
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
On 11-07-31 10:10 PM, OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson wrote: Upon closer inspection, this counter-intuitive configuration is actually less bizarre to comprehend to those (such as me) who have studied magnetic characteristics, and who have performed countless Finite Element Method Magnetic computer simulations on similar configurations over the years. I should point out, however, that I have yet to personally discover a configuration that hints of OU. However, the software I was using (FEMM) was free and probably still is. Perhaps I got what I paid for. It was either that, or shell out $20K for a professional package. ;-) Please note that physics simulation packages are going to be based on physical law, as currently understood, and the conventional EM model of magnetism is conservative. As a result, the assumption of conservative behavior is built into the modeling package. Consequently, it should, in principle, be impossible to discover any non-conservative behavior between permanent magnets by running a simulation. If such exists, you'd need to use real magnets to find it.
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
I wrote: That's ~500 J/s. The flow rate is 2 g/s which takes 180 J to bring to boil, leaving 320 J, which is enough to boil about half the water. The other half would have to overflow unboiled. For the reasons given by Storms and me I think this is unlikely. That's wrong. I did not mean it unlikely that the machine boils half the water. I meant to say: for the reasons given by Storms and me I think it is unlikely that steam would emerge from the end of the hose, or that no one would notice the water is overflowing. Something that has not been clarified here is that the flow rate is rather slow; 120 ml/min. Before the water boils, when the liquid overflows, It would take a long time to fill up the hose. There would be a lot of water in there. Once it starts boiling the steam sparges in the slow moving water. I suppose it would cool down and condense by the time it reaches the end. In other words, the hose would radiate a lot of heat next to the machine, and less further on. On Saturday when I was trying to clean grout with a 1.3 kW steam cleaner, I noticed that when I turned off the trigger for a while, it soon filled with condensed water. The length of hose next to the machine remained a lot hotter than the hose close to the end, where the condensed water was. This is plastic hose, thinner than Rossi is using. The steam cleaner did not do as good a job as shown on TV. I tried it on the grill and some other hard-to-clean spots. I should have tried a food stain in the carpet. As I said, the plume of steam from 1.3 kW was puny. (1.3 kW was the rated power on plate at the bottom of the gadget. I did not measure it with an ammeter.) Anyway, the demonstration was unclear and there is not much point to trying to analyze it in detail. I cannot understand why Rossi does not do a more convincing test. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Anyway, the demonstration was unclear and there is not much point to trying to analyze it in detail. I cannot understand why Rossi does not do a more convincing test. Oh, Jed, now even you are doubting!
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Anyway, the demonstration was unclear and there is not much point to trying to analyze it in detail. I cannot understand why Rossi does not do a more convincing test. Oh, Jed, now even you are doubting! Sure. I have said this all along regarding the Krivit test. That is why I did not go to see it. I have fewer doubts about the previous steam tests, which were more careful and reported in more detail. I have no doubts about the flowing water test. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
From Stephen, Please note that physics simulation packages are going to be based on physical law, as currently understood, and the conventional EM model of magnetism is conservative. As a result, the assumption of conservative behavior is built into the modeling package. Consequently, it should, in principle, be impossible to discover any non-conservative behavior between permanent magnets by running a simulation. If such exists, you'd need to use real magnets to find it. Precisely. I didn't say as such in my comments, but I understand what you are saying. Very early in my training this principal was drummed into my head. Actually, it's a pretty sensible assumption to make, even if it might not be correct in the absolute sense of the word. (It's MOSTLY right!) ;-) Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Another question. If his facility in Florida is plenty of fine working devices, why bring people up to Italy just to see one ? Wouldn't be better to arrange demos next to the factory ? 2011/8/1 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Anyway, the demonstration was unclear and there is not much point to trying to analyze it in detail. I cannot understand why Rossi does not do a more convincing test. Oh, Jed, now even you are doubting! Sure. I have said this all along regarding the Krivit test. That is why I did not go to see it. I have fewer doubts about the previous steam tests, which were more careful and reported in more detail. I have no doubts about the flowing water test. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
Terry, Some follow-up comments. The present belief is that the whipmag was a hoax which got way out of hand when the vid went viral. Al removed the vid but it got copied by others. OC has since passed away and Al seems to regret the whole incident from what little he will say. Considering the fact that pretty much every replication attempt that I've come across failed... I'd have to conclude something fishy was probably going on as well. However, I did notice that some well constructed replications were not tested correctly. I recall one tester attempting to spin the stator magnet in the opposite rotational direction as the rotor disk, as if they were intermeshed gears. It's little irritating observations like that which lead me to conclude that some of the replication attempts were based on misinterpretation of the facts. Regarding the animated graphic purporting to represent the whipMag configuration in action, as shown out at: http://www.overunity.org.uk/cmps_index.php?pageid=whipmag1 this animation appears (to me) to have been assembled incorrectly. If one observes the stroboscope video of the WhipMag in action. See: http://www.youtube.com/v/Plzck4qSbAIhl=en_USfeature=player_embeddedversion=3 http://tinyurl.com/3plyzej One will quickly notice that BOTH the rotor disk and the rotating stator magnet are rotating counter-clockwise. As previously mentioned, such a dynamic configuration where both assemblages are rotating in the same rotational direction seems counter intuitive to our way of thinking. However, such a dynamic configuration cannot help but set up a situation where a considerable amount of magnetic migration of the flux lines will result. It is precisely the dynamic qualities of such migration patterns that I'm trying to get a better handle on. However, as previously mentioned, using the free FEMM software simulation package will NOT be able to reveal the dynamics of these kinds of migration patterns because each measurement it would attempt to generate would pertain to static configurations assumed to be at a standstill. The results would ALWAYS show perfect symmetry - perfect balance where all the pluses and minuses add up to zero. As Stephen Lawrence stated, most software of this kind is built around a bias showing conservative measurements. The software package was not designed to take into consideration how dynamic migratory changes to the overall location of flux lines could theoretically end up influencing over-all torque values. What I'm trying to get a better handle on is whether such migratory phenomenon might possibly introduce an asymmetry. Probably not, but I don't know that for sure. As far as your questions are concerned, all I can say is we tested every configuration of magnetic motor we could imagine and always found the cycle conservative. I can say that we demonstrated an asymmetry between the attractive and repellent forces between magnets. I have never been able to explain this to my own satisfaction. My (potentially flawed) understanding of why there appears to be a blatant asymmetry revealed between attractive and repellent forces is due to the fact that the magnetic domains pertaining to some of the atoms are flipping 180 degrees when two PMs in repulsive mode are brought closer together. My FEMM simulations clearly show the flux lines being PUSHED deeper into the PM configuration. Because these flux lines are being pushed deeper into the PMs the overall repulsive strength will appear to be weaker than if it was in attractive mode. This has lead many seekers of the Holy Grail of magnetic motor OU to proclaim to the world that they have personally discovered a mysterious asymmetry in magnetic physics. They are wrong. If one assembles careful torque measurements (aka: newton measurements) of a rotating PM as it rotates a full 360 degrees past a stationary PM one will eventually conclude that the torque measured in one direction cancel out same amount of measured torque in the opposite direction. IOW, while torque measurements in attractive mode might appear stronger, torque measurements accumulated in repulsive mode take up more spatial time throughout the entire 360 rotation. Therefore, when you add up all the torque measurements in both attractive and repulsive mode you tend to end up with a value close to zero. BTW, for the curious, here's a link to a free download of the FEMM s/w package: http://softwaretopic.informer.com/meeker-femm-heat-flow/ Once you get the hang of it, it's kind of fun to use! It was designed by David Meeker, Ph.D.: http://www.femm.info/wiki/DavidMeeker I gather David managed to piss off several vendors attempting to sell (for thousands of dollars) what he was essentially giving away for free. It's possible some of these companies finally got around to making an offer David couldn't refuse, but I dunno! ;-) Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Andrea Selva wrote: Another question. If his facility in Florida is plenty of fine working devices, why bring people up to Italy just to see one ? Wouldn't be better to arrange demos next to the factory ? You would think so. I have no idea why he only invites people to Italy. I can go to Florida in a few hours for $200 so it would be MUCH more convenient for me. When he invited me to Italy, I asked if I could go to Florida instead. He said no. Much of what Rossi says and does makes no sense to me. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Makes no sense is a word too strong. I guess you are leaning to think he is a crank. Well, if you Jed, throw in the towel, I will do it too, since you are a huge fan and supporter of LENR for over 20 years.
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Does anyone know where the Florida factory is located? He would respond that he does not want anyone to know... this man must be a secret agent, I even wonder if *he* is real... ;-) mic 2011/8/1 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com: Andrea Selva wrote: Another question. If his facility in Florida is plenty of fine working devices, why bring people up to Italy just to see one ? Wouldn't be better to arrange demos next to the factory ? You would think so. I have no idea why he only invites people to Italy. I can go to Florida in a few hours for $200 so it would be MUCH more convenient for me. When he invited me to Italy, I asked if I could go to Florida instead. He said no. Much of what Rossi says and does makes no sense to me. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 10:36 AM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: Regarding the animated graphic purporting to represent the whipMag configuration in action, as shown out at: http://www.overunity.org.uk/cmps_index.php?pageid=whipmag1 this animation appears (to me) to have been assembled incorrectly. Actually, the animation is per OC's idea which came to him in a dream. The whipmag was a variation on the dream. T
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
From Terry: Actually, the animation is per OC's idea which came to him in a dream. The whipmag was a variation on the dream. That may be so, but OC's dream variation is, IMO, categorically different than what Alsetalokin's original configuration appears to show. IMHO, OC dream, specifically the dynamic animation displayed out at the web site, is therefore irrelevant. OC's animation cannot be used in any practical way to help explain Alsetalokin's contraption, precisely because OC is rotating the stator magnets in the wrong direction. Alas, a burning debate that remains answered in my mind is whether Alsetalokin's original demonstration was a clever fake. Based on the fact that, as I understand it, few replications have shown much success, it is sensible to come to a conclusion that trickery may indeed have been involved. But silly me! I'm still curious. ;-) Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Michele sez: Does anyone know where the Florida factory is located? He would respond that he does not want anyone to know... this man must be a secret agent, I even wonder if *he* is real... ;-) I don't know if Michele was being serious about the secret agent bit or not. The little smiley at the end would suggest Michele wasn't being serious. ;-) In any case, I suspect many within the Vort Collective are showing clear signs of having contracted a bad case of Overs Speculatumus. The best cure for these kinds of aggravated mental machinations is to perform a little bit of Zen maintenance. IOW, stop thinking for a while. Just be. Stay in the present. Obsessively trying to predict what might be the case accomplishes nothing more than ripping us out of the power of the present moment, and the present moment is the only place where anything useful get's done. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 11:35 AM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: That may be so, but OC's dream variation is, IMO, categorically different than what Alsetalokin's original configuration appears to show. IMHO, OC dream, specifically the dynamic animation displayed out at the web site, is therefore irrelevant. OC's animation cannot be used in any practical way to help explain Alsetalokin's contraption, precisely because OC is rotating the stator magnets in the wrong direction. Unquestionably true. I wasn't clear. OC's dream came first; but, was the origin of Al's idea to create the device he did. Alas, a burning debate that remains answered in my mind is whether Alsetalokin's original demonstration was a clever fake. Based on the fact that, as I understand it, few replications have shown much success, it is sensible to come to a conclusion that trickery may indeed have been involved. The consensus at the time was it was driven with a compressed air nozzle. T
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Michele, if you look at this page http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2011/37/3705report3.shtml scrolling down just past 50% you can see a note and a picture of the factory location :) andrea 2011/8/1 Michele Comitini michele.comit...@gmail.com Does anyone know where the Florida factory is located? He would respond that he does not want anyone to know... this man must be a secret agent, I even wonder if *he* is real... ;-) mic
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
OK, not literally LOL, but that photo certainly got a chuckle out of me. The Florida factory and Rossi's factory which was heated for two years with a Rossi amplifier (and then sold before anyone else got to see it) seem to me to share some significant characteristics. Oh, and the isotope-shifted copper and nickel, which seemed to be strangely unshifted the one time he allowed someone else to test a sample... October's coming up fast; it's going to be an interesting month. On 11-08-01 01:25 PM, Andrea Selva wrote: Michele, if you look at this page http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2011/37/3705report3.shtml scrolling down just past 50% you can see a note and a picture of the factory location :) andrea 2011/8/1 Michele Comitini michele.comit...@gmail.com mailto:michele.comit...@gmail.com Does anyone know where the Florida factory is located? He would respond that he does not want anyone to know... this man must be a secret agent, I even wonder if *he* is real... ;-) mic
[Vo]:Kimbler's Parts
Like Art's Parts, these artifacts of the Roswell crash show isotopic anomalies: http://www.openminds.tv/test-confirms-roswell-debris-733/ We had always planned to check small animal lairs if we ever had a chance to visit the crash site. T
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 1:25 PM, Andrea Selva andreagiuseppe.se...@gmail.com wrote: Michele, if you look at this page http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2011/37/3705report3.shtml scrolling down just past 50% you can see a note and a picture of the factory location The address is from the state of Florida's records of the home office of the company. The alleged factory could certainly exist elsewhere. T
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
LOL I remember reading in JONP that he stated that the factory was way off from the leonardocorp office... indeed he may be welding his reactors in the garage under that building. mic 2011/8/1 Andrea Selva andreagiuseppe.se...@gmail.com: Michele, if you look at this page http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2011/37/3705report3.shtml scrolling down just past 50% you can see a note and a picture of the factory location :) andrea 2011/8/1 Michele Comitini michele.comit...@gmail.com Does anyone know where the Florida factory is located? He would respond that he does not want anyone to know... this man must be a secret agent, I even wonder if *he* is real... ;-) mic
[Vo]:More from Rossi : Hi-T Steam, Cooling, Warranty
Andrea Rossi July 31st, 2011 at 5:36 PM Dear Rick Gresham: We can reach 500 Celsius, but in a very instable mode. The lower is the T, the higher the stability. At the moment, to turn off the input power, we must make steam at 100.1-101 Celsius; above this limit we need the drive, we are able to arrive to 200 C with good stability, above not, so far. This is the problem we are dealing with. I think that we will resolve the problem soon, because we are making very fast progress in this period. This is why we are ready to produce heat and cold, but still fighting to produce electric power . Warm Regards, A.R. Andrea Rossi August 1st, 2011 at 7:56 AM Dear Peter Heckert: We are working on this issue, even if we are ready for hot water, heating systems, low pressure steam ( water desalinitation, sterilization, etc etc), air conditioned. and so forth. Warm regards, A.R. Andrea Rossi August 1st, 2011 at 7:53 AM Dear Raul Heining: As soon as our partner will give us all the characteristics of the air conditioner, we will give information of them. For sure, by October we will have the technology ready for sale. Warm Regards, A.R. Andrea Rossi August 1st, 2011 at 1:45 AM Dear Burt, Yes, the problems to make cold have been resolved, we found a very good Partner who is working on it. Warm Regards, A.R. [ Note : getting Cold from heat is very old technology -- eg with an ammonia cycle. I grew up with heat-powered fridges. That would have a major impact on US marketing -- heat in the winter, cooling in the summer. ] Andrea Rossi July 31st, 2011 at 5:29 PM Dear Koen Vandevalle: we will change every part which will break in 20 years for free. This is the guarantee we give to our Customers. Warm regards, and Thank You, A.R. [ Not clear if he's speaking for Defkalion here ] Andrea Rossi July 31st, 2011 at 12:38 PM Dear Georgehants: I am afraid that this year I will not have holidays. I dont even have time to sleep enough, actually. I have calculated that I have to increase to 18 hours per day my shift, to be sure to arrive with my 1 MW plant ready by the 20st of September; from 20 Sept throug 10 oct I will use the plant closed doors, by myself, then it will be placed in the factort of the Customer, to be started officially within the end of october, after a further period of operation with closed doors. Warm Regards, A.R. Andrea Rossi July 31st, 2011 at 12:33 PM Dear T Hilleshiem: Very interesting. Yes, we are studying the Green Turbine tech and it is a candidate. We have understood so far that we have to put in series the cats to reach 200 C to make electric power with 33% of efficiency, and we will do this. To reach tis T we need 4 E-Cat in series, we are alreading testing this. In this situation we need constantly the drive, while without series, but only parallel we can go without drive. About your second question, yes it is possible. Stay in contact, in end October I wnnt to see you at the 1 MW plant, so we will reason together on what you said. Warm Regards, A.R.
Re: [Vo]:Kimbler's Parts
Cool! Terry, can you give a link to something on the Art's Parts isotopic anomalies? And do you know if the isotope shifts were the same or similar in the stuff Kimbler found? On 11-08-01 01:37 PM, Terry Blanton wrote: Like Art's Parts, these artifacts of the Roswell crash show isotopic anomalies: http://www.openminds.tv/test-confirms-roswell-debris-733/ We had always planned to check small animal lairs if we ever had a chance to visit the crash site. T
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Yeah, Rossi might even be a scammer, but Krivit made a very weak argument there and it gives me doubts about the reliability of his report. I've had neighbors whose (small) companies' offices were their own apartment.
Re: [Vo]:Kimbler's Parts
On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 1:50 PM, Stephen A. Lawrence sa...@pobox.com wrote: Cool! Terry, can you give a link to something on the Art's Parts isotopic anomalies? And do you know if the isotope shifts were the same or similar in the stuff Kimbler found? How about one on alien implant isotopic anomalies? http://www.alienscalpel.com/updates/full-report-on-the-alleged-alien-implant T
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Makes no sense is a word too strong. It makes no sense to me! I guess you are leaning to think he is a crank. I don't like the word crank. He is one of the most eccentric people I know, and I know many eccentric people. (Come to think of it, a crank in the literal sense is eccentric in the literal sense.) Well, if you Jed, throw in the towel, I will do it too . . . Just because he is eccentric that is no reason to doubt his results. The correlation between the personality of an inventor and validity of the claim is weak. Straight-laced conventional people at IBM, Microsoft, and the plasma fusion program sometime come up with ludicrous ideas that will never work or products that will never sell. Strange people who seldom bathe sometimes come up with brilliant ideas. You have to judge the claim on its own merits. I think there is good evidence for Rossi's claims. I hope that Defkalion soon publishes good evidence for their claims, with more rigorous professional reports than Rossi and Levi et al. have produced so far. I do not think that any of the arguments against Rossi have merit, especially not the ones that attempt to disprove the 18-hour flowing water test. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Kimbler's Parts
Oh, dear. That went over the top. So John Smith took a sojourn on one of the Longer Boats, I assume...? I have an awful lot of trouble getting my disbelief sufficiently suspended to deal with aliens who take people away, stick things in them, and then put them back, even if Cat Stevens did experience such a thing. (I don't suppose Robert Koontz is related to Dean, by any chance?) On 11-08-01 01:58 PM, Terry Blanton wrote: On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 1:50 PM, Stephen A. Lawrencesa...@pobox.com wrote: Cool! Terry, can you give a link to something on the Art's Parts isotopic anomalies? And do you know if the isotope shifts were the same or similar in the stuff Kimbler found? How about one on alien implant isotopic anomalies? http://www.alienscalpel.com/updates/full-report-on-the-alleged-alien-implant T
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
From Terrry: The consensus at the time was it was driven with a compressed air nozzle. A reasonably educated guess. Nevertheless, I'm not yet ready to throw in the towel. (Or perhaps I'm not finished obsessing over... I mean amusing myself over the Alsetalokin matter.) ;-) The original Alsetalokin video is badly lit. The imagery flickers. There is also a loud extraneous buzzing noise that permeates the audio track. One has to question why the video was so badly shot. If I wuz a suspicious individual it would be easy to start asking myself: What was Alsetalokin trying to obfuscate by posting such an obscure video. However, I tend to side more on what might be described as the gullible side of these matters. Emotionally, I WANT to believe. If it wasn't for the fact that my intellect occasionally pipes up and sez annoying things like ...excuse me, but stop ignoring the man behind the curtain!!! I probably wouldn't be of much use to anyone. I'll now try to explain in more detail why Alsetalokin's video still makes the intellectual centers of my brain itch. The following assessment is based on the assumption that both the rotor and stator PMs are simultaneously rotating in the same rotational direction, either clockwise or counter-clockwise. Makes no difference. The only difference is the fact that the STATOR PM rotates at a higher RPM - in-sync at one complete 360 degree rotation while two ROTOR PMs pass nearby. A classic torque graph tends to show a sharp up spike as described in Newton forces. It is immediately followed by a quick down spike that looks like an exact mirror replica of the up spike. The only difference is that the down spike has been flipped both horizontally and vertically and shifted such that the zero nexus point meets exactly where the Newton forces equal zero. Where the up spike and the down spike meet is analogous to the bottom floor of two valleys where a boulder would naturally want to roll towards if free to do so... the magnetic cogging effect. If one were to rapidly rotate the Alsetalokin the ROTOR/STATOR configuration as describe above, a curious thing may begin to manifest, something related to magnetic viscosity and/or the effects of hysteresis. The flux lines of adjacent PMs will be dragged slightly to the right (or left) depending on what direction the ROTOR/STATOR configuration is rotating. That drag results in a small shift of the classic Newton torque measurements as portrayed on a graph. Granted, the shifted or dragged torque measurements are probably still symmetrical in of itself - except for one annoying little detail, a detail I have yet to resolve in my brain. It has to do with the fact that the ROTOR/STATOR configuration is an on-going DYNAMIC condition. Classic Torque measurements, as simulated in s/w packages like FEMM pertain to basic measurements from STATIC non-moving configurations. Therefore, it is still reasonable to speculate on a premise that the actual measurements of what actually happens in a dynamic configuration are not necessarily being accurately modeled here. It is still possible that a tiny sliver of asymmetry has been introduced into a dynamically rotating configuration. There are times when the torque forces are attracting the ROTOR/STATOR configuration, and times when the same torque forces are repelling against each other. Both effects will CHANGE the migratory pattern of flux lines in interesting ways. At first glance one might assume an obvious asymmetry would have to be introduced due to the fact that it's well known (among researchers) that repelling forces are never as strong as the attracting forces. However, spatially speaking, there is more spatial time in the repulsive torque phaze, and when you add all the pluses and minuses up it still comes to zero ... OR... OR!!! perhaps not. It's this uncertainty that I have yet to answer to my satisfaction in the Alsetalokin configuration. The point being: Is it possible that Alsetalokin's configuration manages to introduce a way to shave off a tiny slice of SPATIAL TIME pertaining to the repulsive phase. If that does happen a real asymmetry would be introduced into the configuration. Granted, it's probably a long shot since we are dealing with Newtonian events, not quantum events, but anyway... Inquiring minds want to know. Software simulations such as FEMM can only point theoreticians and researchers in a general speculative direction. In the end, there is only one way to know for sure. Build the damned contraption! A major difference I would introduce in future POC (Proof of Concept) constructions would be to add special gearing to the ROTOR/STATOR configuration. The gearing would force the ROTOR/STATOR configuration to always rotate in-sync, no matter what the RPM speed might be. The downside of adding gearing would be to introduce additional friction to the overall construction. However, if there exists sufficient asymmetry, (a BIG if here!), then OU does exist, and it may be
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
From Terrry: The consensus at the time was it was driven with a compressed air nozzle. Al spun the small gear several times before he was able to get the device to start. Could the 'failed' attempts have been a cover for winding a spring? The thing that bugged me about the whipmag saga was that Al did say, quietly, offhandedly, that no laws of physics were being broken, but made the demo look as convincing as he could. The result was that a number of semi-gullible people spent a lot of money trying to reproduce it, while he sat back and said nothing to dissuade them. Maybe that was a good lesson for them, but it seemed like a pretty nasty piece of work on Al's part.
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Daniel Rocha wrote: Oh, I see, only about Krivit's test. But I thought you'd like to go visit Rossi even before that test. Let me explain, briefly. Rossi invited me for a demonstration. We discussed what it would consist of. I suggested he use a shorter hose and a bucket to sparge the steam. I made a number of other suggestions and I said I would bring my own instruments to confirm the measurements. He said that would not be acceptable; he would only do the kind of demonstration he showed to Lewan, using his own instruments. I concluded there is no point to seeing that. It is inconclusive. It proves nothing. I am not going to spend airfare and time to see a mere impressionistic proof-of-principle demonstration. So I said no thank you and we called off the trip, with no hard feelings on either side. I fully agree that Rossi is under no obligation to do the kinds of testing that would satisfy me. However, I advised him that it would be a good idea and it would benefit him as well as the public. I still think it would. He disagrees. At about that same time, Rossi was also taking to Krivit. I had no knowledge of this. I have no idea what he told Krivit beforehand, or what Krivit expected to see. Rossi ended up showing him what he described to me. If Rossi did explain to Krivit beforehand what he was going to do, then Krivit and his friends might have written these Rossi #3 reports without going anywhere. I could have written the reports for them. I can summarize them in a three points: 1. These results are inconclusive. 2. It is not known whether Rossi put the reservoir on a weight scale in this demonstration, or if he did, whether Krivit observed this and wrote down the weight before and after. If this was not done then these results are so inconclusive they are meaningless. 3. It appears these instruments are owned by Rossi. You cannot do a valid verification of a claim with only the claimant's own instruments. That's absurd. Expanding on #3, you have to use your own to confirm that the claimant's instruments are working right. Getting on an airplane to go see something like this, and not packing your own instruments is a stupid, pointless waste of time. I have no idea whether Krivit brought his own instruments, or if he was allowed to use them, but if he did not he is a fool. When I was preparing to visit the Patterson demonstration at Disneyland, we discussed the matter beforehand. They agreed to let me bring my own instruments. I would not have gone otherwise. When I arrived, they changed their minds. Reding said you can look but no touching and no measuring with your own instruments. I said, in that case I will leave this hotel now without seeing anything, and I will tell everyone that you reneged on your agreement and wasted my airfare and my time. He thought about it for a while and then said okay, you can use your instruments after all. I did, and discovered that in the second test it was not working, so it is a good thing I checked. They fixed that problem. My instruments were crude. Patterson's were nothing to write home about either. I do not understand why people go to all the trouble to do these experiments using cheap, low precision instruments. I use low-precision ones such as red-liquid thermometers myself because my only purpose is to confirm the high-precision ones on site. I am not doing the whole experiment. I am just doing a reality check. Nowadays they have wonderfully precise and cheap power meters, thermocouples and computers so there is no excuse for not bringing your own stuff. I'll bet the $20 Radio Shack Kill-A-Watt meter is better than a $1,000 model was 15 years ago. You can't use it in Europe, but you can get something similar. You do not need to bring your own weight scale, by the way. Just test the one on site with a liter bottle of water. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Fw: New Energy Times #37 and Rossi Report #3
Now some fun with cheap psychology ;-) To explain some of Rossi's tactics look in his bio: he was a really strong long distance runner. Andrea Rossi spent at least 8 hours a day studying and playing sports (athletics, Italian champion of road race in 1970, in 1969 the junior world record of 24 hours race) http://ingandrearossi.net/gli-inizi/ If you have ever done some competition on endurance sports you know that you have to use similar tactics if you want to have the chance to win at the end of the race. Sprint and slow, get away and then hide in the group. mic 2011/8/1 Jed Rothwell jedrothw...@gmail.com: Daniel Rocha danieldi...@gmail.com wrote: Makes no sense is a word too strong. It makes no sense to me! I guess you are leaning to think he is a crank. I don't like the word crank. He is one of the most eccentric people I know, and I know many eccentric people. (Come to think of it, a crank in the literal sense is eccentric in the literal sense.) Well, if you Jed, throw in the towel, I will do it too . . . Just because he is eccentric that is no reason to doubt his results. The correlation between the personality of an inventor and validity of the claim is weak. Straight-laced conventional people at IBM, Microsoft, and the plasma fusion program sometime come up with ludicrous ideas that will never work or products that will never sell. Strange people who seldom bathe sometimes come up with brilliant ideas. You have to judge the claim on its own merits. I think there is good evidence for Rossi's claims. I hope that Defkalion soon publishes good evidence for their claims, with more rigorous professional reports than Rossi and Levi et al. have produced so far. I do not think that any of the arguments against Rossi have merit, especially not the ones that attempt to disprove the 18-hour flowing water test. - Jed
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
The thing that bugged me about the whipmag saga was that Al did say, quietly, offhandedly, that no laws of physics were being broken, but made the demo look as convincing as he could. Yes. Sounds like you were there for the whole stinking show. I have followed his posts on the Steorn forum and on the Moletrap forum and I find something very odd about Al. T
Re: [Vo]:Fw: Krivit Snarks
I've read the whole thing a couple of times, and been through the appendices once. I'm still struck by Krivit's overall snarkiness -- and also he's ignoring recent Rossi claims. I'm not commenting on ANY of the steam-quality issues. Last year Rossi and Focardi claimed an energy gain of 213 times. This year, Rossi downgraded that to six. But now he's claiming self-sustaining mode below 200 C. This month, Rossi upgraded that to infinity. On March 29, two Swedish professors went to Bologna, expenses paid by Rossi, to see Rossi's device in action. Krivit took cab fare and lunch from Rossi. Krivit Schematic He's showing 220V 3-phase power. I think that's 220V single-phase, which also (I think) limits power-phase tricks. Tools used by the plumber Outside of the reactor chamber and the hydrogen hook-up, those tools are entirely appropriate for the job. I was curious about his factory. According to the corporate registration of his company, Leonardo Corp., it is located at 1331 Lincoln Road, Apartment 505, Miami Beach, FL, 33129. It seems odd that Rossi could have a factory with 300 devices on the fifth floor of an apartment building in Miami Beach. Were the 300 devices in boxes? On benches? Drawing power? In various phases of manufacture? Perhaps this isn't really his current principal place of business as shown on the corporate registration; perhaps he lied to the Florida government. Pure snark. What's wrong with registering your corporation from an apartment and renting a factory somewhere else? There is another contradiction. Rossi has stated many times that he hasn't taken and won't be taking anybody's money until he delivers his 1 MW plant in October. When I spoke with Essén on July 15, I mentioned to him that Capiluppi had told me that the Rossi research agreement would not become active until Rossi made the first payment to the university. According to what I heard, Essén sad, the contract will become active in late October, because then Rossi will get money from Athens, but this is only speculation. According to the schedule I heard, nothing will happen until October. No contradiction -- in fact, it self-confirms. This section is talking about money Rossi plans to PAY. Rossi has said that Defkalion will pay him when the 1M plant is accepted. Kullander thought that the most significant piece of information was that Rossi had heated a building for a year with one of his devices. No evidence exists to support this claim. ... We have only Rossi's word that he had a practical, working device heating his building. ... True, but not inconsistent. EV world interview : http://pesn.com/2011/07/14/9501869_EV-World_Interviews_Andrea_Rossi/ A - Very good. With that reactor which was similar to the modern E-Cat that we are making, was a module of about 20 kilowatts. And with that we heated an area of the factory that was about 1000 square feet, with offices, etc. In that area in Italy it is very cold for at least five months a year, because in the North East the winter is very cold. We have temperatures that range between - 6 and 10 celsius degrees. And we heated our offices with that for one year, and studied it very well. It has worked at least one year, when I was there. Now we no longer have the factory. I had to sell everything to finance this. Now we have here in the United States. Here in Florida, the place where we make the reactors, and in Greece they are making huge production lines for the production of these products in Europe. A Hoax? Rossi has claimed, many times and in many reports, that he is not asking anybody for money until he delivers a working product for sale. ... Rossi has always said that he's licensing Defkalion and more recently Ampenergo. Rossi's Greek licensee, Defkalion Green Technologies, however, is asking for money and asking investors to bear the risk. For 40.4 million Euros, one company per country can have the exclusive rights to manufacture and sell Rossi's device, according to a July 6 letter from Symeon Tsalikoglou, the director of business development and marketing for Defkalion. http://newenergytimes.com/v2/sr/RossiECat/docs/Defkalion-Offering-July2011.pdf But he omits the critical non-scam lines : -- Meeting in our factory during October to inspect and verify kW units -- Meeting in our factory during December to inspect and verify MW units It's also exactly what Defkalion said they were going to do in their white paper: http://www.defkalion-energy.com/White_Paper_DGT.pdf p 7 Also : Krivit makes no references to the information on the defkalion site -- eg that the Hyperion uses Glycol in a closed circuit (see the white paper), and gives much higher COP's than the 6x mini-ecat. Overall : Krivit proves Rossi is not a scientist. But we knew that. And that Rossi often makes inconsistent statements. Ditto and likewise.
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 2:32 PM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: As for me, I'm tapped out cash wise. ... the garage is a mess, too. Well, Clanzer, and others, built exact replicas to no avail. I would not advise you to follow suit. T
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
From Terry: Well, Clanzer, and others, built exact replicas to no avail. I would not advise you to follow suit. I wasn't planning on it. My initial interest was strongly biased towards speculating on whether an asymmetry might begin to manifest in Alsetalokin's ROTOR/STATOR configuration if everything could be carefully choreographed with a customized gear setup. The point being to make sure both ROTOR and STATOR assembly would always be rotating in the same rotational direction and in proper sync. This could be constructed, mechanically speaking, with proper gear ratios constructed out of non-magnetic materials. However, despite my lack of funding no shop issues, what makes me seriously doubt my own speculation comes down to a personal suspicion that magnetic phenomenon, as perceived from our Newtonian frame of reference, is conservative, energy wise. As Mr. Lawrence previously stated, the ...EM model of magnetism is [perceived to be] conservative. I tend to agree with this assumption. It seems to me that if conservation wasn't maintained Mother Nature would either be constantly blowing herself up, or seizing to a screeching near absolute Zero temperature halt. Neither extreme seems to be happening, at least from our Newtonian frame of reference. An uneasy status quo seems to be maintained. It may turn out to be a very different story on the quantum level however, as we may soon discover. Regards Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 5:39 PM, OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com wrote: My initial interest was strongly biased towards speculating on whether an asymmetry might begin to manifest in Alsetalokin's ROTOR/STATOR configuration if everything could be carefully choreographed with a customized gear setup. Check Clanzer's vids and web site. I'll bet he's already tried it. T
[Vo]:Heat engine steam question
HI, If you have very hot dry steam but at atmospheric pressure, what are the options to convert that thermal energy into rotary energy? Stirling engine? Steam compressor? I know that most power plants use about 900°C and about 1000 PSI to run the turbines, but what if you just don't have the pressure? Thanks, Hoyt Stearns Scottsdale, Arizona US
RE: [Vo]:Fw: Krivit Snarks
From Jed, I don't know what it is with people, pointing in triumph to something that everyone knows, and no one disputes, as if they are revealing some deep secret. I realize you are probably expressing this out of a sense of exasperation. What interests me is that when someone chooses to investigate controversial claims what are the personal biases they bring to what it is they choose to investigate. Krivit often strikes me as a cynical investigator. This was not meant to imply criticism pertaining to Krivit's investigative skills. It's simply a personal observation of mine. Krivit tends to give me the impression that where there is controversy, there is also likely to be deception going on somewhere. Again, possessing a cynical outlook is not necessarily a bad thing in terms of being an investigative reporter. I think it served Krivit particularly well when he was investigating the bubblegate saga. There is strong evidence to suggest the fact that Taleyarkhan got f*cked over royally by some of his peers and by some of his superiors. If it hadn't been for Krivit's tenacity to ask unpleasant questions it's quite possible few in the public domain would have ever discovered what was going on under the tattered veneer of what was supposed to have been a routine investigation into Taleyarkhan's professional research skills. But now we come to Rossi. Rossi is obviously quite eccentric. He has his flaws, as do we all. It would seem to me that perhaps eccentricity and cynicism may not mix very well. My two cents. Regards, Steven Vincent Johnson www.OrionWorks.com www.zazzle.com/orionworks
Re: [Vo]:Fw: Krivit Snarks
On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 10:15 PM, OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson orionwo...@charter.net wrote: . . .perhaps eccentricity and cynicism may not mix very well. My two cents. :-) Eccentricity and cynicism . . . two scents! T
Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga
- Original Message - From: OrionWorks - Steven V Johnson svj.orionwo...@gmail.com To: vortex-l@eskimo.com Cc: Sent: Monday, August 1, 2011 5:39:36 PM Subject: Re: [Vo]:Revisiting The Whipmag All-Magnet Motor, saga However, despite my lack of funding no shop issues, what makes me seriously doubt my own speculation comes down to a personal suspicion that magnetic phenomenon, as perceived from our Newtonian frame of reference, is conservative, energy wise. As Mr. Lawrence previously stated, the ...EM model of magnetism is [perceived to be] conservative. I tend to agree with this assumption. It seems to me that if conservation wasn't maintained Mother Nature would either be constantly blowing herself up, or seizing to a screeching near absolute Zero temperature halt. Neither extreme seems to be happening, at least from our Newtonian frame of reference. An uneasy status quo seems to be maintained. This reminds me of a pre 17th century argument that the Earth cannot be turning. As everyone knows if the Earth was turning then the ground would move away from you whenever you jumped in the air. However from our experience we know it does not, theorefore the Earth is not turning. In hindsight, it appears to be silly argument, but that is because the concept of inertia was not well known or accepted. It may turn out to be a very different story on the quantum level however, as we may soon discover. Quantum mechanics is to a new (future) physics like the Coperincan system was to Newtonian physics. The Coperincan system was new in many respects but it retained the potelmaic principle of circular motion. Harry
Re: [Vo]:Kimbler's Parts
Was going to blog about this tonight. The punchline is that, contrary to the graph, the isotopic composition is very terrestrial. Sent from my iPhone. On Aug 1, 2011, at 13:37, Terry Blanton hohlr...@gmail.com wrote: Like Art's Parts, these artifacts of the Roswell crash show isotopic anomalies: http://www.openminds.tv/test-confirms-roswell-debris-733/ We had always planned to check small animal lairs if we ever had a chance to visit the crash site. T
Re: [Vo]:Wet Steam: Energy required disperse and suspend small droplets in the vapor state
Jed Rothwell wrote Harry Veeder hlvee...@yahoo.com wrote: Newtonian physics is generally not a part of everyday life experiences. It is an abstract generalisation deduced from some idealised situations. Good point. That's why these physics were not discovered until Newton, and why it took a genius like Newton to discover them. He provided the mechanical philosophy of nature with its first comprehensive mathematical formulation. If I have seen further than others, it is by standing upon the shoulders of giants. -- Issac Newton Harry
