[Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
Lots of interesting ideas are flowing here on Vortex on various aspects of LENR engineering - methods to control the phenomenon, different materials to be tried, temperatures to focus on, geometries etc. How could all these ideas be collected and structured, in order to make the information searchable for anyone who's trying to develop and engineer future devices? Frank Acland made an initiative with a kind of Wiki: http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=E-Cat_World_LENR_Knowledge_Base , but I don't know if it has any chance of being used for this kind of flow of ideas. Probably the gathering of information should be automated with text analysis. Comments? Mats Mats www.animpossibleinvention.comhttp://www.animpossibleinvention.com
Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
Mats, some thoughts: Maybe the guys from LENR-cities have some ideas. They promote an open IP structure, although not well defined yet. I've asked for more details, but they probably are lacking time in detailling this out for the moment. Part of valuable ideas will probably be converted into patent applications as well by individuals. Those inventors may want to promote their ideas as soon as their ideas are secured. The other part will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Collecting and stucturing ideas also require serious moderation to keep a certain professional level. I've been thinking of several places to moderate professional engineering ideas: - meetup groups - moderated LinkedIn groups - dedicated e-mail reflectors I see several sub-groups that handle following activities: - a think tank that defines engeneering topics and brainstorms about solutions - a review team that reviews proposed engineering ideas - a feasibility team that is able to prototype (e.g. MFMP) - F2F meetings in several regions. Another approach: Are there similar global cooperation projects that can be used to piggy back on? - How is the 3D printing society organized? - How is the Drone society organized? - Cooperate with FabLabs that facilitate tooling? - Other global cooperation activities that have usefull ways of working ? Cheers, Rob On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 10:42 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Lots of interesting ideas are flowing here on Vortex on various aspects of LENR engineering – methods to control the phenomenon, different materials to be tried, temperatures to focus on, geometries etc. How could all these ideas be collected and structured, in order to make the information searchable for anyone who’s trying to develop and engineer future devices? Frank Acland made an initiative with a kind of Wiki: http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=E-Cat_World_LENR_Knowledge_Base , but I don’t know if it has any chance of being used for this kind of flow of ideas. Probably the gathering of information should be automated with text analysis. Comments? Mats Mats www.animpossibleinvention.com
SV: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
Good thoughts Rob. I believe that the main challenge for LENR Cities will be to provide substantial innovation of its own. Experience from the IT industry tells us that in order to grow a successful eco-system where talented people will contribute, you need to offer attractive innovation for others to build upon, e.g. Windows, IOS/iPhone/iPad, Android (the counter example is Nokia/Symbian that was not good enough). Just to offer a network will not do, if you want to produce revenue from you eco-system. And even if you don’t plan for profit you need to offer innovation – e.g. Wikipedia (the idea + the wiki tool), Linux (the Linux kernel by Torvalds et al). This would correspond to the part that you mention will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Maybe enthusiasm could do initially, but sooner or later you probably have to offer something substantial to build upon, to attract people. Yet, I think that the structures you suggest are spot-on, and the idea to look at other community projects is good. 3D printers and drones are examples of communities that are more loosely held together, and yet they have information sharing. Mats www.animpossibleinvention.comhttp://www.animpossibleinvention.com Från: Teslaalset [mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com] Skickat: den 13 februari 2015 11:41 Till: vortex-l@eskimo.com Ämne: Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices? Mats, some thoughts: Maybe the guys from LENR-cities have some ideas. They promote an open IP structure, although not well defined yet. I've asked for more details, but they probably are lacking time in detailling this out for the moment. Part of valuable ideas will probably be converted into patent applications as well by individuals. Those inventors may want to promote their ideas as soon as their ideas are secured. The other part will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Collecting and stucturing ideas also require serious moderation to keep a certain professional level. I've been thinking of several places to moderate professional engineering ideas: - meetup groups - moderated LinkedIn groups - dedicated e-mail reflectors I see several sub-groups that handle following activities: - a think tank that defines engeneering topics and brainstorms about solutions - a review team that reviews proposed engineering ideas - a feasibility team that is able to prototype (e.g. MFMP) - F2F meetings in several regions. Another approach: Are there similar global cooperation projects that can be used to piggy back on? - How is the 3D printing society organized? - How is the Drone society organized? - Cooperate with FabLabs that facilitate tooling? - Other global cooperation activities that have usefull ways of working ? Cheers, Rob On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 10:42 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.semailto:mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Lots of interesting ideas are flowing here on Vortex on various aspects of LENR engineering – methods to control the phenomenon, different materials to be tried, temperatures to focus on, geometries etc. How could all these ideas be collected and structured, in order to make the information searchable for anyone who’s trying to develop and engineer future devices? Frank Acland made an initiative with a kind of Wiki: http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=E-Cat_World_LENR_Knowledge_Base , but I don’t know if it has any chance of being used for this kind of flow of ideas. Probably the gathering of information should be automated with text analysis. Comments? Mats Mats www.animpossibleinvention.comhttp://www.animpossibleinvention.com
SV: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
Frank, Let’s hope the ECW knowledge base can contribute to this. I think it would be extremely valuable to have all these ideas and all this knowledge accessible and searchable. Actually, I believe that this is part of a new way of developing knowledge, faster than what was ever possible before the internet, which will further contribute to the well-known trend with inventions spreading over the world to mass adoption at an ever increasing speed (compare automobiles, television, mobile phones). Judging from technology history, LENR will reach mass adoption faster than any earlier invention. Mats www.animpossibleinvention.comhttp://www.animpossibleinvention.com Från: Frank Acland [mailto:ecatwo...@gmail.com] Skickat: den 13 februari 2015 14:20 Till: vortex-l@eskimo.com Ämne: Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices? Mats, I hope that in time the the ECW LENR Knowledge Base would be useful for the kind of thing you are discussing. We certainly want to have information about LENR engineering included. The Wiki structure using MediaWiki software is familiar and quite flexible, and allows for searching capabilities. It's not organized like a discussion forum or email list, but there is the capability for discussion on every article on the site in the talk section. Right now there are just a very few people active in creating content -- and we've only just started, so it's rather limited so far. I hope in time that number of contributors will increase. Anyone interesting in getting involved in editing the KB, please email me at ecatwo...@gmail.commailto:ecatwo...@gmail.com, and I'll get you set up with an account. Best, Frank On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 5:26 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.semailto:mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Good thoughts Rob. I believe that the main challenge for LENR Cities will be to provide substantial innovation of its own. Experience from the IT industry tells us that in order to grow a successful eco-system where talented people will contribute, you need to offer attractive innovation for others to build upon, e.g. Windows, IOS/iPhone/iPad, Android (the counter example is Nokia/Symbian that was not good enough). Just to offer a network will not do, if you want to produce revenue from you eco-system. And even if you don’t plan for profit you need to offer innovation – e.g. Wikipedia (the idea + the wiki tool), Linux (the Linux kernel by Torvalds et al). This would correspond to the part that you mention will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Maybe enthusiasm could do initially, but sooner or later you probably have to offer something substantial to build upon, to attract people. Yet, I think that the structures you suggest are spot-on, and the idea to look at other community projects is good. 3D printers and drones are examples of communities that are more loosely held together, and yet they have information sharing. Mats www.animpossibleinvention.comhttp://www.animpossibleinvention.com Från: Teslaalset [mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.commailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com] Skickat: den 13 februari 2015 11:41 Till: vortex-l@eskimo.commailto:vortex-l@eskimo.com Ämne: Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices? Mats, some thoughts: Maybe the guys from LENR-cities have some ideas. They promote an open IP structure, although not well defined yet. I've asked for more details, but they probably are lacking time in detailling this out for the moment. Part of valuable ideas will probably be converted into patent applications as well by individuals. Those inventors may want to promote their ideas as soon as their ideas are secured. The other part will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Collecting and stucturing ideas also require serious moderation to keep a certain professional level. I've been thinking of several places to moderate professional engineering ideas: - meetup groups - moderated LinkedIn groups - dedicated e-mail reflectors I see several sub-groups that handle following activities: - a think tank that defines engeneering topics and brainstorms about solutions - a review team that reviews proposed engineering ideas - a feasibility team that is able to prototype (e.g. MFMP) - F2F meetings in several regions. Another approach: Are there similar global cooperation projects that can be used to piggy back on? - How is the 3D printing society organized? - How is the Drone society organized? - Cooperate with FabLabs that facilitate tooling? - Other global cooperation activities that have usefull ways of working ? Cheers, Rob On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 10:42 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.semailto:mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Lots of interesting ideas are flowing here on Vortex on various aspects of LENR engineering – methods to control the phenomenon, different materials to be tried, temperatures to
Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
I think that would be a good idea to compile this knowledge in one place. My opinion is that it should start where we are in the field to facilitate advancement. The first thing needed is a relatively simple design to demonstrate LENR. I think once that has been achieved, and it has been replicated by many, the advancement would go along the lines of controlling/regulating the reaction. Accessible working designs at present include only Parkhomov. Until at least one other group can replicate his results there remains some doubt (at least to me). Jack On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 7:33 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Frank, Let’s hope the ECW knowledge base can contribute to this. I think it would be extremely valuable to have all these ideas and all this knowledge accessible and searchable. Actually, I believe that this is part of a new way of developing knowledge, faster than what was ever possible before the internet, which will further contribute to the well-known trend with inventions spreading over the world to mass adoption at an ever increasing speed (compare automobiles, television, mobile phones). Judging from technology history, LENR will reach mass adoption faster than any earlier invention. Mats www.animpossibleinvention.com *Från:* Frank Acland [mailto:ecatwo...@gmail.com] *Skickat:* den 13 februari 2015 14:20 *Till:* vortex-l@eskimo.com *Ämne:* Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices? Mats, I hope that in time the the ECW LENR Knowledge Base would be useful for the kind of thing you are discussing. We certainly want to have information about LENR engineering included. The Wiki structure using MediaWiki software is familiar and quite flexible, and allows for searching capabilities. It's not organized like a discussion forum or email list, but there is the capability for discussion on every article on the site in the talk section. Right now there are just a very few people active in creating content -- and we've only just started, so it's rather limited so far. I hope in time that number of contributors will increase. Anyone interesting in getting involved in editing the KB, please email me at ecatwo...@gmail.com, and I'll get you set up with an account. Best, Frank On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 5:26 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Good thoughts Rob. I believe that the main challenge for LENR Cities will be to provide substantial innovation of its own. Experience from the IT industry tells us that in order to grow a successful eco-system where talented people will contribute, you need to offer attractive innovation for others to build upon, e.g. Windows, IOS/iPhone/iPad, Android (the counter example is Nokia/Symbian that was not good enough). Just to offer a network will not do, if you want to produce revenue from you eco-system. And even if you don’t plan for profit you need to offer innovation – e.g. Wikipedia (the idea + the wiki tool), Linux (the Linux kernel by Torvalds et al). This would correspond to the part that you mention will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Maybe enthusiasm could do initially, but sooner or later you probably have to offer something substantial to build upon, to attract people. Yet, I think that the structures you suggest are spot-on, and the idea to look at other community projects is good. 3D printers and drones are examples of communities that are more loosely held together, and yet they have information sharing. Mats www.animpossibleinvention.com *Från:* Teslaalset [mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com] *Skickat:* den 13 februari 2015 11:41 *Till:* vortex-l@eskimo.com *Ämne:* Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices? Mats, some thoughts: Maybe the guys from LENR-cities have some ideas. They promote an open IP structure, although not well defined yet. I've asked for more details, but they probably are lacking time in detailling this out for the moment. Part of valuable ideas will probably be converted into patent applications as well by individuals. Those inventors may want to promote their ideas as soon as their ideas are secured. The other part will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Collecting and stucturing ideas also require serious moderation to keep a certain professional level. I've been thinking of several places to moderate professional engineering ideas: - meetup groups - moderated LinkedIn groups - dedicated e-mail reflectors I see several sub-groups that handle following activities: - a think tank that defines engeneering topics and brainstorms about solutions - a review team that reviews proposed engineering ideas - a feasibility team that is able to prototype (e.g. MFMP) - F2F meetings in several regions. Another approach:
Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
Mats, I hope that in time the the ECW LENR Knowledge Base would be useful for the kind of thing you are discussing. We certainly want to have information about LENR engineering included. The Wiki structure using MediaWiki software is familiar and quite flexible, and allows for searching capabilities. It's not organized like a discussion forum or email list, but there is the capability for discussion on every article on the site in the talk section. Right now there are just a very few people active in creating content -- and we've only just started, so it's rather limited so far. I hope in time that number of contributors will increase. Anyone interesting in getting involved in editing the KB, please email me at ecatwo...@gmail.com, and I'll get you set up with an account. Best, Frank On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 5:26 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Good thoughts Rob. I believe that the main challenge for LENR Cities will be to provide substantial innovation of its own. Experience from the IT industry tells us that in order to grow a successful eco-system where talented people will contribute, you need to offer attractive innovation for others to build upon, e.g. Windows, IOS/iPhone/iPad, Android (the counter example is Nokia/Symbian that was not good enough). Just to offer a network will not do, if you want to produce revenue from you eco-system. And even if you don’t plan for profit you need to offer innovation – e.g. Wikipedia (the idea + the wiki tool), Linux (the Linux kernel by Torvalds et al). This would correspond to the part that you mention will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Maybe enthusiasm could do initially, but sooner or later you probably have to offer something substantial to build upon, to attract people. Yet, I think that the structures you suggest are spot-on, and the idea to look at other community projects is good. 3D printers and drones are examples of communities that are more loosely held together, and yet they have information sharing. Mats www.animpossibleinvention.com *Från:* Teslaalset [mailto:robbiehobbiesh...@gmail.com] *Skickat:* den 13 februari 2015 11:41 *Till:* vortex-l@eskimo.com *Ämne:* Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices? Mats, some thoughts: Maybe the guys from LENR-cities have some ideas. They promote an open IP structure, although not well defined yet. I've asked for more details, but they probably are lacking time in detailling this out for the moment. Part of valuable ideas will probably be converted into patent applications as well by individuals. Those inventors may want to promote their ideas as soon as their ideas are secured. The other part will be shared openly by those who do not care about IP. Collecting and stucturing ideas also require serious moderation to keep a certain professional level. I've been thinking of several places to moderate professional engineering ideas: - meetup groups - moderated LinkedIn groups - dedicated e-mail reflectors I see several sub-groups that handle following activities: - a think tank that defines engeneering topics and brainstorms about solutions - a review team that reviews proposed engineering ideas - a feasibility team that is able to prototype (e.g. MFMP) - F2F meetings in several regions. Another approach: Are there similar global cooperation projects that can be used to piggy back on? - How is the 3D printing society organized? - How is the Drone society organized? - Cooperate with FabLabs that facilitate tooling? - Other global cooperation activities that have usefull ways of working ? Cheers, Rob On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 10:42 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Lots of interesting ideas are flowing here on Vortex on various aspects of LENR engineering – methods to control the phenomenon, different materials to be tried, temperatures to focus on, geometries etc. How could all these ideas be collected and structured, in order to make the information searchable for anyone who’s trying to develop and engineer future devices? Frank Acland made an initiative with a kind of Wiki: http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=E-Cat_World_LENR_Knowledge_Base , but I don’t know if it has any chance of being used for this kind of flow of ideas. Probably the gathering of information should be automated with text analysis. Comments? Mats Mats www.animpossibleinvention.com -- Frank Acland Publisher, E-Cat World http://www.e-catworld.com
Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
I started using gmail almost exclusively for Vortex. I began in July 6, 2006 and have over 17,000 emails. Gmail search engine makes it easy to find past messages and they are all there in the cloud. On Fri, Feb 13, 2015 at 4:42 AM, Lewan Mats mats.le...@nyteknik.se wrote: Lots of interesting ideas are flowing here on Vortex on various aspects of LENR engineering – methods to control the phenomenon, different materials to be tried, temperatures to focus on, geometries etc. How could all these ideas be collected and structured, in order to make the information searchable for anyone who’s trying to develop and engineer future devices? Frank Acland made an initiative with a kind of Wiki: http://kb.e-catworld.com/index.php?title=E-Cat_World_LENR_Knowledge_Base , but I don’t know if it has any chance of being used for this kind of flow of ideas. Probably the gathering of information should be automated with text analysis. Comments? Mats Mats www.animpossibleinvention.com
Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
A wiki is an interesting idea for something like this. A challenge with such a project is that opinionated folks are likely, through the force of personality, to end up irremediably skewing the content towards their own view of what's going on with LENR, and even what LENR supposedly is. I have seen this happen in other cold-fusion wiki projects and in forums. As far as I can tell, there is nothing to be done about it. Nonetheless it would be great if there were a wiki that became a clearinghouse to which people carrying out actual experiments contribute concrete details about their experiments. A very nice addition to such a wiki would be a file store of experimental results -- csv files, data dumps, etc -- which could be analyzed using statistical software. Perhaps common protocols might gradually be sorted out, and the format of the data would become more and more similar across different trials by different experimenters, making it possible to do cross-comparisons. I think such a site would be great even if the only contributors were hobbyists and not big personalities in LENR circles. I do not think LENR will become the subject of regular meetups until it breaks out of obscurity. Eric
Re: [Vo]:How could we collect ideas and knowledge on engineering of LENR devices?
Again I think it would be practical and realist to separate in great extent- classic LENR that has an excellent database, library, reviews from LENR+ enhanced heat excess. Needing its own strategy. I will publish today about the LENR + KNOWLEDGE MANAGEMENT PROJECT Thanks to Mats and you all for the initiative. Peter. On Sat, Feb 14, 2015 at 9:19 AM, Eric Walker eric.wal...@gmail.com wrote: A wiki is an interesting idea for something like this. A challenge with such a project is that opinionated folks are likely, through the force of personality, to end up irremediably skewing the content towards their own view of what's going on with LENR, and even what LENR supposedly is. I have seen this happen in other cold-fusion wiki projects and in forums. As far as I can tell, there is nothing to be done about it. Nonetheless it would be great if there were a wiki that became a clearinghouse to which people carrying out actual experiments contribute concrete details about their experiments. A very nice addition to such a wiki would be a file store of experimental results -- csv files, data dumps, etc -- which could be analyzed using statistical software. Perhaps common protocols might gradually be sorted out, and the format of the data would become more and more similar across different trials by different experimenters, making it possible to do cross-comparisons. I think such a site would be great even if the only contributors were hobbyists and not big personalities in LENR circles. I do not think LENR will become the subject of regular meetups until it breaks out of obscurity. Eric -- Dr. Peter Gluck Cluj, Romania http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com
