Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router

2006-08-22 Thread Scott Reed 




Thanks to all for the replies.  

I had pretty much determined that using a SOHO router but not the WAN port was going to be the answer, so that is what we will do.  I was hoping to save the customer some $$$, but alas, not to be.

Scott Reed 


Owner 


NewWays 


Wireless Networking 


Network Design, Installation and Administration 


www.nwwnet.net 




-- Original Message 
---

From: N White <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> 


To: WISPA General List  


Sent: Tue, 22 Aug 2006 01:03:07 -0700 


Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router 



> We usually get the Netgear WGR614 - sometimes refurbished. If you  

> 

disable DHCP it's essentially a Wireless AP bridge like what you're  
> 

wanting. You can usually pick these up for around $15-20 online,  
> 

depending on bulk. I think we got some in bulk for about $16 each and  
> 

their wired counterpart for $11. 
> 
> 

--  
> 

--- 
> 

| Nick White                    
  | 
> 

| [EMAIL PROTECTED]             | 
> 

--- 
> 
> 

Scott Reed wrote: 
> 

> I am looking for suggestions for customer AP that is not a router.   

> 

> Need equivalent or lower cost than SOHO router.  AP and a 4 port  

> 

> switch would be great. 
> 

> 
> 

> I am looking to use routing on the CPE, thus the customer does not  

> 

> need to purchase a router.  But, if they want wireless inside, need an 
 
> 

> inexpensive way to get it to them. 
> 

> 
> 

> 
> 

> Scott Reed 
> 

> Owner 
> 

> NewWays 
> 

> Wireless Networking 
> 

> Network Design, Installation and Administration 
> 

> www.nwwnet.net <http://www.nwwnet.net/> 

> 

> 
> 
> 

--  
> 

WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org 
> 
> 

Subscribe/Unsubscribe: 
> 

http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 
> 

> 

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ 
--- 
End of Original Message 
---






-- 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router

2006-08-22 Thread N White 
We usually get the Netgear WGR614 - sometimes refurbished. If you 
disable DHCP it's essentially a Wireless AP bridge like what you're 
wanting. You can usually pick these up for around $15-20 online, 
depending on bulk. I think we got some in bulk for about $16 each and 
their wired counterpart for $11.


--
---
| Nick White  |
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] |
---



Scott Reed wrote:
I am looking for suggestions for customer AP that is not a router.  
Need equivalent or lower cost than SOHO router.  AP and a 4 port 
switch would be great.


I am looking to use routing on the CPE, thus the customer does not 
need to purchase a router.  But, if they want wireless inside, need an 
inexpensive way to get it to them.



Scott Reed
Owner
NewWays
Wireless Networking
Network Design, Installation and Administration
www.nwwnet.net 



--
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router

2006-08-21 Thread Jason Hensley 



Why not keep some wireless AP's and / or Routers in 
stock and bring one with you to every install??  I do this and make a few 
bucks on the SOHO gear as well as being able to charge an additional 
fee. 
 
I think a lot of the wireless routers will also let 
you switch to bridge mode, which should accomplish what you 
want and give you flexibility in the future.  
 
We try to keep customers away from any other 
competitor for any reason, whether it be for network hardware, a new 
computer, etc etc.  Not much margin in new computers or hardware, but 
if it keeps a customer paying me $30+ / mth for Internet then I'm 
willing to make a few more dollars by selling them a cheap router, AP, or 
new computer. 
 
  
 

  - Original Message - 
  From: 
  Ryan 
  Spott 
  To: WISPA General List 
  Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 1:29 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o 
  router
  Most of my clients want wireless in their houses.Part 
  of my install is to configure their inside wireless for them if they have the 
  device there while I am there for a moderate fee.I tell them to just 
  go down to Staples or Radio Shack ("You got questions, we got blank stares") 
  and tell the guy at the counter that they are getting a DSL or Cable modem 
  connection (I find that the Staples or RS guys get confused when my customers 
  tell them they are getting a wireless connection)The guy at the 
  counter usually just sells them a 4 port linksys wireless router with a WAN or 
  Internet port on it.When I do my setup, I setup my TranzeoCPQ to 
  perform NAT and "QOS". The CPQ also does _limited_ DHCP serving so I set that 
  up to serve a 10.0.1.X network with the DHCP addresses of 
  10.0.1.50-58.I assign the LinkSys router a LAN ip of 
  10.0.1.2.I change the password to something random. I note 
  this on a piece of masking tape and put it on the bottom of the router for 
  future reference.I turn off the DHCP server on the LinkSys. I 
  tell the customer to NEVER use the WAN port or "bad things will 
  happen."I setup the SSID of the Linksys to something the customer 
  wants (usually a favorite dog or horse's name). I advise the customer that I 
  have not encrypted the signal and it is up to them to do so. In these parts 
  though, by the time some war-driver gets close enough to the property to steal 
  signal or data, the customer will have shot the trespasser or the customers 
  dog will have eaten the trespasser.Some customers have their spouses 
  run to Staples while I am on the roof so I can configure things for them while 
  I am there. Others buy the gear after the fact and have to call me after they 
  plug it in "according to the directions" and mess up the network in their 
  home. (ding! $ervice call over the phone!)For some reason the APs are 
  more expensive than the routers. They are the same thing the router is just a 
  more complicated piece of gadgetry. I think the producers of this equipment 
  are taking a moderate loss on some of this gear, or the volume of router sales 
  is staggering compared to AP sales.I hope this 
  helps!ryanScott Reed wrote: 
  
I am 
looking for suggestions for customer AP that is not a router.  Need 
equivalent or lower cost than SOHO router.  AP and a 4 port switch 
would be great. I am looking to use routing on the CPE, thus the 
customer does not need to purchase a router.  But, if they want 
wireless inside, need an inexpensive way to get it to them. 
Scott Reed Owner NewWays Wireless Networking 
Network Design, Installation and Administration www.nwwnet.net 

  
  

  -- WISPA Wireless List: 
  wireless@wispa.orgSubscribe/Unsubscribe:http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wirelessArchives: 
  http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
-- 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

RE: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router

2006-08-21 Thread Jonathan Schmidt 
I agree with Sam that the routers make an easy AP by turning off the
DHCP.  AP-only devices are no cheaper to make than routers since 
the routing code in the internal firmware is basically free to them
(and, in the case of Linksys, open source).

AP-only devices (like the WRT54G equivalent, WAP54G) are quite a bit
more expensive than the equivalent router.  One reason is that the
AP-only devices often easily configure into a bridge (Ethernet to
Ethernet) or "cable-less cable" and this extra feature makes them
special and more valuable if you need that.  

Another reason is that they are not mass marketed at every corner
Radio Shack (I just checked, the router is in every Radio Shack in
town and there are none of the APs in town.)

Due to the tremendous competition, you often see some brand of 
wireless router for $19.95 in the Sunday paper advertising 
packets...and Buy.com often has such promotions ($22.95 today for
a TRENDnet 802.11g after rebate but free shipping
http://www.buy.com/prod/q/loc/101/201683081.html ...ugly, eh?).

. . . j o n a t h a n
Jonathan Schmidt
Perftech

-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Sam Tetherow
Sent: Monday, August 21, 2006 2:22 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router


Most SOHO APs (dlink, linksys etc) allow you to turn off DHCP so you can 
just plug the CPE into ports 1-5 on the switch along with any other 
devices and you effectively have a 4 port switch and AP.

Sam Tetherow
Sandhills Wireless

Scott Reed wrote:
> I am looking for suggestions for customer AP that is not a router.  
> Need equivalent or lower cost than SOHO router.  AP and a 4 port 
> switch would be great.
>
> I am looking to use routing on the CPE, thus the customer does not 
> need to purchase a router.  But, if they want wireless inside, need an 
> inexpensive way to get it to them.
>
>
> Scott Reed
> Owner
> NewWays
> Wireless Networking
> Network Design, Installation and Administration
> www.nwwnet.net <http://www.nwwnet.net/>

-- 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/



-- 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router

2006-08-21 Thread Sam Tetherow 
Most SOHO APs (dlink, linksys etc) allow you to turn off DHCP so you can 
just plug the CPE into ports 1-5 on the switch along with any other 
devices and you effectively have a 4 port switch and AP.


   Sam Tetherow
   Sandhills Wireless

Scott Reed wrote:
I am looking for suggestions for customer AP that is not a router.  
Need equivalent or lower cost than SOHO router.  AP and a 4 port 
switch would be great.


I am looking to use routing on the CPE, thus the customer does not 
need to purchase a router.  But, if they want wireless inside, need an 
inexpensive way to get it to them.



Scott Reed
Owner
NewWays
Wireless Networking
Network Design, Installation and Administration
www.nwwnet.net 


--
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/

Re: [WISPA] Wireless AP w/o router

2006-08-21 Thread Ryan Spott 




Most of my clients want wireless in their houses.

Part of my install is to configure their inside wireless for them if
they have the device there while I am there for a moderate fee.

I tell them to just go down to Staples or Radio Shack ("You got
questions, we got blank stares") and tell the guy at the counter that
they are getting a DSL or Cable modem connection (I find that the
Staples or RS guys get confused when my customers tell them they are
getting a wireless connection)

The guy at the counter usually just sells them a 4 port linksys
wireless router with a WAN or Internet port on it.

When I do my setup, I setup my TranzeoCPQ to perform NAT and "QOS". The
CPQ also does _limited_ DHCP serving so I set that up to serve a
10.0.1.X network with the DHCP addresses of 10.0.1.50-58.

I assign the LinkSys router a LAN ip of 10.0.1.2.

I change the password to something random. 

I note this on a piece of masking tape and put it on the bottom of the
router for future reference.

I turn off the DHCP server on the LinkSys. 

I tell the customer to NEVER use the WAN port or "bad things will
happen."

I setup the SSID of the Linksys to something the customer wants
(usually a favorite dog or horse's name). I advise the customer that I
have not encrypted the signal and it is up to them to do so. In these
parts though, by the time some war-driver gets close enough to the
property to steal signal or data, the customer will have shot the
trespasser or the customers dog will have eaten the trespasser.

Some customers have their spouses run to Staples while I am on the roof
so I can configure things for them while I am there. Others buy the
gear after the fact and have to call me after they plug it in
"according to the directions" and mess up the network in their home.
(ding! $ervice call over the phone!)

For some reason the APs are more expensive than the routers. They are
the same thing the router is just a more complicated piece of gadgetry.
I think the producers of this equipment are taking a moderate loss on
some of this gear, or the volume of router sales is staggering compared
to AP sales.

I hope this helps!


ryan


Scott Reed wrote:

  
  
  I am looking for suggestions for customer AP that is
not a router.  Need equivalent or lower cost than SOHO router.  AP and
a 4 port switch would be great.
  
  
I am looking to use routing on the CPE, thus the customer does not need
to purchase a router.  But, if they want wireless inside, need an
inexpensive way to get it to them.
  
  
  
Scott Reed 
Owner 
NewWays 
Wireless Networking 
Network Design, Installation and Administration 
  www.nwwnet.net 
  
  




-- 
WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org

Subscribe/Unsubscribe:
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/