Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 M.-A. Lemburg wrote: > On 2008-09-24 08:02, Jaroslav Lukesh wrote: >> But now I want to make some kind of portable, near OS independent (win/lin) >> compact zope solution. So I look for RDB with like "blackbox" functionality, >> with nothing special to make backups of running system (like make backup of >> Data.fs) and nothing to install when move - make backup copy of live system >> and then run it on another machine. Installations are allowed only in case >> of change OS platform. > > I guess you're better off with storing your data in the ZODB if > you're looking for file copy based consistent backups. ZODB's file storage doesn't allow it, either, although people get away with it most of the time. The only safe way to copy a FileStorage without stopping the server is to use repozo, which creates a backup set that can be copied and restored to recreate the same Data.fs. > I don't know of any RDBMS that would allow file copy based backups > from a running system while still maintaining consistency. At the very > least, the database system has to flush its buffers to the database > files, so you need special tools for the backup one way or another. > > OTOH, nearly all database systems provide live backup tools > which create consistent backups of a running system. That is repozo's job, too. Tres. - -- === Tres Seaver +1 540-429-0999 [EMAIL PROTECTED] Palladion Software "Excellence by Design"http://palladion.com -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFI2k0b+gerLs4ltQ4RArvDAKDBH41Lhj3rRSFNThB4elc7enJ0GACfW/8Q HvDlIevSC6cHinj3uYUhBrk= =GF/K -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
On 2008-09-24 08:02, Jaroslav Lukesh wrote: > Hi Andreas & all, > > I know, I does not use Zope and DB first day, but, are somewhere list of > pros/cons for that databases and zope/python DA? > > For example, my cons for ODBC at Win32 (NT, 2k, XP) - it is not ideal in > case of huge simultaneous access, it sometimes does not make write query > (generally, not only from Zope, but from any app). We have 2 apps - one for > production on Zope going thru sybase to MSSQL, we run multiple access many > years without any problems, second on ASP with nice ;) interface for > managers. When I was run my Zope at win32 over ODBC, here was problems in > production with missing data at DB, so I was switch to Linux. Now we have > same problems with ASP part - I need to repair inconsistency coming from > manager interface up to few times per month. My zope servers on linux runs > as blackbox - they are serving without problems, no intervetion needed if no > HW problems. So I think, that you know my reasons to non-odbc DB access. All > my words to our windoze IT staff in case of any production problems are > obligatory - "Golden zope!". Which database adapter have you been using for the Zope database connection ? We've never had reports of missing data or anything the like from our mxODBC Zope DA customers in all the years it has been in production on Windows. Perhaps you are facing database problems with the database that originate in the way the database does row level locking ? Or are you talking about ZODB conflict errors ? > But now I want to make some kind of portable, near OS independent (win/lin) > compact zope solution. So I look for RDB with like "blackbox" functionality, > with nothing special to make backups of running system (like make backup of > Data.fs) and nothing to install when move - make backup copy of live system > and then run it on another machine. Installations are allowed only in case > of change OS platform. I guess you're better off with storing your data in the ZODB if you're looking for file copy based consistent backups. I don't know of any RDBMS that would allow file copy based backups from a running system while still maintaining consistency. At the very least, the database system has to flush its buffers to the database files, so you need special tools for the backup one way or another. OTOH, nearly all database systems provide live backup tools which create consistent backups of a running system. > Many thanks, J. Lukesh > > - Original Message - > From: "Andreas Jung" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > --On 23. September 2008 16:05:03 +0200 Jaroslav Lukesh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > >> Hi all, >> >> Does somebody know some free database and free database adapter for Zope, >> which exists for Linux and for windows too, please? Do you know some >> pros/cons and some wiev from praxis for that? >> >> > > Zope supports all standard databases like Postgres, MySQL, Oracle and M$ > SQL server. On Windows it might be necessary to use the commercial mxODBC > product (cheap enough). > > -aj > > ___ > Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope > ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** > (Related lists - > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev ) -- Marc-Andre Lemburg eGenix.com Professional Python Services directly from the Source (#1, Sep 24 2008) >>> Python/Zope Consulting and Support ...http://www.egenix.com/ >>> mxODBC.Zope.Database.Adapter ... http://zope.egenix.com/ >>> mxODBC, mxDateTime, mxTextTools ...http://python.egenix.com/ Try mxODBC.Zope.DA for Windows,Linux,Solaris,MacOSX for free ! eGenix.com Software, Skills and Services GmbH Pastor-Loeh-Str.48 D-40764 Langenfeld, Germany. CEO Dipl.-Math. Marc-Andre Lemburg Registered at Amtsgericht Duesseldorf: HRB 46611 ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
--On 24. September 2008 09:34:13 +0200 Jaroslav Lukesh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: kindergarten-RDBMS :-D And what about Interbase Firebird? Is it stone-stable and is possible to do simple backup/restore process to make ready&go backup? Interbase Firebird is not widely used. Better ask on the related Firebird groups how the backup/restore dance works there (or ask on their IRC channel). -aj pgpGum1txMIGB.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
kindergarten-RDBMS :-D And what about Interbase Firebird? Is it stone-stable and is possible to do simple backup/restore process to make ready&go backup? I will use ZODB and filesysstem as main storage, but some SQL is needed too. - Original Message - From: "Andreas Jung" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Jaroslav Lukesh" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Andreas Jung" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; Sent: Wednesday, September 24, 2008 9:01 AM Subject: Re: [Zope] which platform independent database? --On 24. September 2008 08:02:23 +0200 Jaroslav Lukesh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > But now I want to make some kind of portable, near OS independent > (win/lin) compact zope solution. So I look for RDB with like "blackbox" > functionality, with nothing special to make backups of running system > (like make backup of Data.fs) and nothing to install when move - make > backup copy of live system and then run it on another machine. > Installations are allowed only in case of change OS platform. If you don't want any moving parts: don't use a RDBMS but soley use the ZODB (where the Data.fs is basically the only moving part). If you are looking for a kindergarten-RDBMS: look at SQLite. All other enterprise-level databases are of course more complex and require more maintenance..make your choice.. -aj ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
--On 24. September 2008 08:02:23 +0200 Jaroslav Lukesh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: But now I want to make some kind of portable, near OS independent (win/lin) compact zope solution. So I look for RDB with like "blackbox" functionality, with nothing special to make backups of running system (like make backup of Data.fs) and nothing to install when move - make backup copy of live system and then run it on another machine. Installations are allowed only in case of change OS platform. If you don't want any moving parts: don't use a RDBMS but soley use the ZODB (where the Data.fs is basically the only moving part). If you are looking for a kindergarten-RDBMS: look at SQLite. All other enterprise-level databases are of course more complex and require more maintenance..make your choice.. -aj pgpbXKLm4HWTr.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
Hi Andreas & all, I know, I does not use Zope and DB first day, but, are somewhere list of pros/cons for that databases and zope/python DA? For example, my cons for ODBC at Win32 (NT, 2k, XP) - it is not ideal in case of huge simultaneous access, it sometimes does not make write query (generally, not only from Zope, but from any app). We have 2 apps - one for production on Zope going thru sybase to MSSQL, we run multiple access many years without any problems, second on ASP with nice ;) interface for managers. When I was run my Zope at win32 over ODBC, here was problems in production with missing data at DB, so I was switch to Linux. Now we have same problems with ASP part - I need to repair inconsistency coming from manager interface up to few times per month. My zope servers on linux runs as blackbox - they are serving without problems, no intervetion needed if no HW problems. So I think, that you know my reasons to non-odbc DB access. All my words to our windoze IT staff in case of any production problems are obligatory - "Golden zope!". But now I want to make some kind of portable, near OS independent (win/lin) compact zope solution. So I look for RDB with like "blackbox" functionality, with nothing special to make backups of running system (like make backup of Data.fs) and nothing to install when move - make backup copy of live system and then run it on another machine. Installations are allowed only in case of change OS platform. Many thanks, J. Lukesh - Original Message - From: "Andreas Jung" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> --On 23. September 2008 16:05:03 +0200 Jaroslav Lukesh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi all, > > Does somebody know some free database and free database adapter for Zope, > which exists for Linux and for windows too, please? Do you know some > pros/cons and some wiev from praxis for that? > > Zope supports all standard databases like Postgres, MySQL, Oracle and M$ SQL server. On Windows it might be necessary to use the commercial mxODBC product (cheap enough). -aj ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
--On 23. September 2008 16:05:03 +0200 Jaroslav Lukesh <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi all, Does somebody know some free database and free database adapter for Zope, which exists for Linux and for windows too, please? Do you know some pros/cons and some wiev from praxis for that? Zope supports all standard databases like Postgres, MySQL, Oracle and M$ SQL server. On Windows it might be necessary to use the commercial mxODBC product (cheap enough). -aj pgpTtKdglcwrk.pgp Description: PGP signature ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
Re: [Zope] which platform independent database?
+---[ Jaroslav Lukesh ]-- | Hi all, | | Does somebody know some free database and free database adapter for Zope, | which exists for Linux and for windows too, please? Do you know some pros/cons | and some wiev from praxis for that? | | I know, Gadfly, but this is really tiny, with problematic backup (need to | disconnect, make backup and connect), sometimes it make mishmash in | datafiles and then you need your backup... | | Many thanks, J. Lukesh Postgresql ? (http://www.postgresql.org/) Psycopg or SQLAlchemy both have adapters for Zope for Postgresql -- Andrew Milton [EMAIL PROTECTED] ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
[Zope] which platform independent database?
Hi all, Does somebody know some free database and free database adapter for Zope, which exists for Linux and for windows too, please? Do you know some pros/cons and some wiev from praxis for that? I know, Gadfly, but this is really tiny, with problematic backup (need to disconnect, make backup and connect), sometimes it make mishmash in datafiles and then you need your backup... Many thanks, J. Lukesh ___ Zope maillist - Zope@zope.org http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope ** No cross posts or HTML encoding! ** (Related lists - http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-announce http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope-dev )
