On Sep 3, 2008, at 4:55 PM, Leslie Wu wrote:
On Wed, Sep 3, 2008 at 10:56 AM, _why <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
On the note of sandboxing, I think Chrome has made me ditch my prior
ideas about how I want to handle security in Shoes. (Because that's
the big problem here, not a bunch of little platform bugs.)
Truth.
Indeed... particularly because of the implications of running multiple
Shoes apps simultaneously. Perhaps the first thing Shoes.app should do
is fork a new process?
I still think Shoes is best suited to compete with GUI toolkits
(since they are just so lousy) rather than to take on Flash. But
once Shoes is solid, I hope to get cracking on the security stuff
and, well, who knows what's in store after that.
That makes sense, but I suppose efforts such as Chrome and Adobe AIR
make me wonder what the boundarylines between "Web" and "GUI" land
will be...
Well, let's call a spade a spade... HTML is no longer just text mark-
up! Add in CSS and the combo is a full blown display layer. Mix in a
bit of Javascript and what makes it so different from an application
framework? Yes, the web is sandboxed and separated from your personal,
sensitive info, but then again so should any good client-server
interaction. Sure, HTML/CSS/JS isn't the snappiest of combo's on your
box, but it's slim across the wire (and that's what it was designed
for, right?).
The biggest issue I see with web apps in general (and Chrome
specifically) is that HTML _was_ just text mark-up not more than 20
years ago. Using the web as an application framework is a hack on top
of a hack on top of a hack and... as good as hacking is... at some
point you want to just wipe the slate clean and hack fresh!
Let's keep Shoes true to what it is: a tiny toolkit for building GUI
(Gooey?) apps. If you want to do client-server stuff, that's fine.
Maybe shoes need laces? What about Bluebie's legs? Let's not wedge one-
more-thing-over-the-web in there. What we learned from the web is that
the stack/flow (block/inline) GUI design model is easy and looks good.
Great. But I don't think we need more "web" than just that.
Don't get me wrong, I've contemplated a Shoes --> Web translation
layer myself. It would probably even be possible, especially with
stuff like IronTamarin. Still, I don't want Shoes to solve all the
problems, just its own.
-Josh
