In the past I have had problems with the transfer policies of APNIC NIRs not matching APNIC’s own transfer policies.
When those differences prevented a transfer I asked APNIC to intervene by imposing the (governing, to my mind) APNIC transfer policies on the recalcitrant NIR. And that was effective but maybe it didn’t settle the issue, which I think should be clear to all. I believe that there is a hierarchy in which the topmost organizations delegate some specified roles to subsidiary organizations via some document like a Memorandum of Understanding (MOU). It would be such a document that spells out whether policies must match, or if they mismatch which is controlling. I have been under the impression that the APNIC NIRs must adhere to APNIC policies but could create their own policies if they don’t contradict those of APNIC. I hope somebody can clear it up. Regards, Mike From: Fernando Frediani <fhfredi...@gmail.com> Sent: Wednesday, January 24, 2024 10:25 AM To: sig-policy <sig-policy@lists.apnic.net> Subject: [sig-policy] Re: New proposal: prop-158-v001: IPv6 auto-allocation for each IPv4 request To resume my initial point there is no point in allowing NIRs to develop and have specific policies, complicate and confuse things unecessarily. Policies developed by the entire RIR community is more than enough in order to regulate how IP addreess assignment is conducted as in all.other RIRs worldwide. NIRs may well continue to exist and perform their administrative functions under the umbrella of the RIR facilitating things in certain economies and cultures. Best regards Fernando On Wed, 24 Jan 2024, 11:47 Fernando Frediani, <fhfredi...@gmail.com <mailto:fhfredi...@gmail.com> > wrote: Hi On Wed, 24 Jan 2024, 07:39 David Conrad, <d...@virtualized.org <mailto:d...@virtualized.org> > wrote: Fernando, On Jan 24, 2024, at 4:19 AM, Fernando Frediani <fhfredi...@gmail.com <mailto:fhfredi...@gmail.com> > wrote: > No government should ever be able to mandate anything related to policy > development and how they apply to IP space assignment and use. I’m actually curious: why do you believe you (or the RIRs) are able to tell governments what they can or cannot mandate? I think you are not following this discussion and trying to speak about soemthing different from what is being discussed. I mentioned several times the diference between policies and administrative and legal obligations and you simplify very much the question. No government is able in practice to determinate what should be the policies for IP address assignment anywhere. Don't confuse it with mandate legal obligations within a certain jurisdiction. > NIRs are never meant to be "mini-RIRs"or something in that line. I’m unsure what you mean by this. Simply, NIRs were (and are, as far as I know) intended to provide Internet registration services for entities within their economy. Overarching guidelines for the policies by which those service are provided are defined within the Internet numbers registry system (see RFC 7020) but those guidelines do not carry the force of law: they require the voluntary cooperation of the parties involved to be effective. Maybe your conception about NIRs may not be very accurate and the difefence between them and the RIRs and the hierarchy that exists. > No resources would arrive to a NIR if not via the RIR This is factually incorrect as it ignores the reality that addresses were allocated (to NIRs and others) prior to the existence of the RIRs. It also ignores the existence of the “transfer" market. This is incorrect understanding on how registration works worldwide. Any inter-RIR tranfers are made following - guess what - RIR policies and as such all transfers goes trough a RIR system even if they end up in a NIR, but following RIR policies. It has been already mentioned that anything done before the existance of certain RIRs is treated as legacy and from a long time this doesn't exist anymore so anything anywhere in the world that is not related to legacy resources is always done via the policies of one of the RIRs. Fernando Regards, -drc
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