On 23 Aug 2000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> > So there are stacks of them around in theory. The problem is that
> > 286's, 386's and 486's are very limited use.
>
> Depends on what you mean by limited.
>
> 486s can serve as X-terminals
> 386s can do text based web browsing and mail, again diskless
> 286s can do telnet or ssh diskless (go to http://www.vein.hu/~nagyd if you
> disbelieve)
One thing I can't help thinking - at one stage all these machines were
sold as full fledged desktops (and only 10 years or so ago). So what's
happened that makes them less useful than that now? I'd really like to
know. eg I was still writing essays on an XT just 2 years ago, using
WordPerfect 5.1, and I could still do the same today, with no loss of
productivity. For most purposes, I just can't see the need for anything
more powerful than an XT (he said from his PIII :-), so why is it that
people aren't willing to use them, or even a much more powerful 486? It's
this bloody Internet thing isn't it? Really like to know if anybody has
any thoughts on this.
> Problem is a lot of people in the street feel uncomfortable with text mode. But
> when I see a few webmail sessions tie up a dialup line, I can't but help feel
> that pine would be a better use of the limited bandwidth. Another problem is
> that there is no good Open Source package for text mode word processing (you
> know the Wordstar, Wordperfects, etc). Don't everbody chime in with
> vim/emacs/joe/etc. WP != text editor, you have to be able to access the printer
> effects easily.
Very true WRT the lack of a good Open Source word processor of this
type. There seems to be a gap between vi etc (command line editors) and
Star Office etc (needs X-Windows) that nobody has filled. I just wish
Corel would make WordPerfect 5.1 Open Source... I would love to have a WP
of this type that'd run from the command line, with a similar memory size.
> What would a community organisation want with a free computer network anyway?
> I'm trying to puzzle that out myself.
Do you mean what would they do with it, or why would they want it free? I
think you probably meant something along the lines of the first, and
actually I don't really know. I guess that they could use it for email,
perhaps set up a web page.
> If they are happy with a network of pine
> and w3m/links/lynx terminals, this we can do that tomorrow. It would be far
> easier than a IF2K event. We don't have a variety of machines to install Linux
> on. We just make one big server out of a low end Pentium, then castrate, er rip
> the disks out of the 2/3/486s, whack in network cards with boot ROMs and away we
> go. Well, a few more details like setting up an ISP connection, but essentially
> not more difficult than setting up one machine.
I guess the problem is they want more than that, they want to run W2K and
don't understand that that's not really necessary for the job they want
done. (I agree with all you're saying BTW).
> > As I understood it, the problem with computerbank in Sydney was
> > storage/workshop space. So, if anyone knows of a long term vacant
> > warehouse - hint hint!.
>
> I guess I didn't make my thesis clear enough, also in response to Jon's post.
> There no point having lots of storage space if there is no outlet for the
> machines, at some point you end up with a bunch of people with aching backs,
> full warehouses and nowhere for the hardware to go.
Maybe the problem is that the only people willing to poke around with old
hardware are geeks - everyone else wants the latest version of Windows,
and if it won't run that, they're not interested. So you get a bunch of
geeks with some cool stuff in their garages that nobody else wants to look
at (You've got a web server running on your C64? Whoa dude!) sort of
thing. This seems to be a problem of education to me - if you can work out
a way to educate the non-geeks into understanding that the bunch of old
hardware the geeks have stacked up in their garages can do the job, then
you might find somebody to donate it to. Or maybe find somewhere to
install a bunch of old machines, show how they're working, get an article
in the paper. Perhaps hard to find though... I'd like to volunteer my
support all the way, I think it's INSANE the amount of old hardware that
just gets trashed.
Tom
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