The morale of the story is instead of spending time and money to travel to the TC about an issue (and then get frustrated because you can't address the group), SUBMIT A PROPOSAL. This way the subject MUST be addressed and as the submitter you can speak at the TC meeting.

Educational item two: I disagree with using an allowance for preaction systems (and its much higher cost) as a basis for allowing a bell. This is not a case of saving pennies but spending dollars (ie the Congressional model of budgeting) since the preaction is an option likely applied in high-end homes. The bell would be a requirement for all homes.

For what it's worth, we support having a bell but sit in the minority corner. It is NOT for the benefit of the occupants, though. That is well addressed by smoke detectors. The value of the bell is the hope that an unoccupied home that has water discharge would get the attention of the neighbor in order to reduce the amount of water damage. IT appears that saving a few pennies is more important than the negative PR that could result for a weekend long discharge.

The size of the system is a building code and owner issue. It does seem silly to protect a 12 million house with a 13D system. The biggest I've heard of was just over 200,000 sf with a creek running through one of the rooms so the owner could fish for trout in comfort. That sounds more like a commercial lodge but what can you say.

Roland

On Feb 22, 2008, at 11:57 AM, Mike Brown (TECH- GVL) wrote:


George;

I was at the NFPA 13D meeting before the 2007 Edition of NFPA 13 came out and I went with one purpose and that was to discuss the questions that I get all of the time as a technical service manager. What do I (designer or engineer) do when I have a sloped ceiling more than 8 in. in 12 in. and what do I do it the sloped ceiling that also has beams. Additionally what do I do (designer or engineer) do I do when have a bunch of decorative beams creating pockets. Is it good fire protection to put 16 residential sprinklers in a room with beams and only calculate two sprinklers? I was not allowed to speak because I was not a member of the committee so I packed my bags and went home. I know that there are a lot of opinion about everything but it was really difficult to watch some of the members who really did not seem to know a lot about sprinklers but were there to protect their turf. My opinion was that put they could put in the code that there that you have to treat it like light hazard or whatever (say calculate six sprinklers) but give the designers and engineers some direction. What they did was dumped it back on the sprinkler designer or his company or the engineer and mostly the AHJ. In my opinion the committee abdicated their responsibility. There are also some other areas that need attention. The voted to allow dry and Preaction systems in single family homes. I answer questions all of the time about Preaction systems from sprinkler contractors that do more kinds of sprinkler systems than residential. Many residential sprinkler contractors do not know anything about Preaction nor have they ever done a Preaction system. Some of the people seemed to think that you could use the normal detectors in a home spaced any way you wanted to or that you would need a releasing panel. The reason was one of the members had a client that had ten million dollars worth of art and was concerned about accidental discharge. In my opinion if you have ten millions dollars worth of art you do not need a 13D sprinkler system. Another issue was not addressed and that is there is no limitation on the size of a single family home. In my opinion a 44,000 square foot home does not need a 13D system. Another question is why do we not require and alarm on a 13D sprinkler system. The answer was the cost. That is BS since an electric bell is not expensive and yet they pass dry and Preaction.

Overall, I was embarrassed and somewhat ticked off at the rampant attempts of certain parties to get the code changed to meet a product they either made or wanted to make. But that may be had it has always been.

All of this may be a moot point when you see the flows and pressures that are going to be required to pass the new UL testing requirements for residential sprinklers.

The insanity continues!

The above is my personal opinion and is not way intended to be the opinion of my company.

Sorry that I got carried away but that is the way I feel.

Mike Brown

_______________________________________________
Sprinklerforum mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum

To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
(Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)

Reply via email to