Tony,
A 4-story residential bldg with 30,000 square feet should be able to be
protected by a single zone sprinkler system with one alarm zone per NFPA
101, Life Safety Code. Travel distance should be within the maximum
(generally 250 feet) unless the building is long and narrow with only an
exit at each end. If that is the case and you need 3 zones then the
middle one would have 100% horizontal exits which is not permitted. It is
hard to advise without knowing the building arrangement.
Are you sure these are horizontal exits? Horizontal exit walls must go
from slab to slab and outside wall to outside wall. They are only used
when the travel distance to an exit stairway exceeds the maximum allowable.
One would think that the exits in a 30,000 square foot building would be
such as to not require a horizontal exit. There are requirements that
require a 2-hour separtion (not a horizontal exit) between portions of an
occupancy and other parts of the building. This may just be a separation
wall.
John Hoffman, P.E.
Fire Protection Engineer
Facility Engineering Services, KCP, LLC
2000 E. 95th Street
Kansas City, MO 64131
Ph: 816-997-7213
"A.P.Silva"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To
Sent by: [email protected]
sprinklerforum-bo cc
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
er.org Subject
RE: Horizontal Exits
03/10/2008 01:50
PM
Please respond to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
resprinkler.org
It is a two hour concrete block firewall. There is a fire rated door in the
corridor, which will constitute the horizontal exit. Hose stations are
provided on both sides. Are separate zones being provided by others for
similar buildings? I know I will have to follow my building code, but what
is the industry practice?
Thanks,
Tony
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Roland
Huggins
Sent: March 10, 2008 7:51 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Horizontal Exits
IS it a firewall or a rated partition? A firewall can often be identified
by what looks like two walls butted together since they have to remain
standing with structural collapse on either side(kinda like seismic joints
for structural steel). Haven't looked closely lately at the penetration
allowance but you shouldn't be seeing doorways. Must confess, I haven't
focused on construction issues in a long time but such basic tenants should
be the same as in my Flintstone days.
If it is a firewall, each has a separate floor area because they are
separate buildings with common walls. So, are separate zones required in
separate buildings?
Just because the owner/GC is using an accelerated design as you go format
doesn't mean the the architect/engineer of record are exempt from such
trivial issues.
Roland
On Mar 8, 2008, at 11:00 AM, A.P.Silva wrote:
> I have another question related to this issue.
>
> A four storey residential buiding, having 30,000 sq.ft. building area,
> has two firewalls, splitting it to 3 compartments. The City is saying
> each compartment (approx. 10,000 sq.ft.) needs a separate zone.
>
> As per building code:
>
> The annunciator shall have separate zone indication of the actuation
> of the alarm initiating devices in each "floor area" so that the area
> of coverage for each zone is neither (a) more than one storey, nor (b)
> more than the system area limits as specified in NFPA 13.
>
> "Floor area" is defined as any space between the exterior walls and
> any required fire walls.
>
> I'm saying the zone indicatipon must be obtained by another alarm
> initiating device. Not sprinkler flow switch. The problem is the
> building code also permits deletion of heat detectors, if the building
> is sprinklered.
> So that
> leaves only manual pull stations and sprinklers.
>
> I know to reply, the applicable building code has to reviewed in its
> entirety. But most building codes are similar. My question is, are
> there any other jurisdiction that would require sprinkler zoning for
> each compartment?
>
> Tony
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jamie
> Seidl
> Sent: March 7, 2008 3:02 PM
> To: '[email protected]'
> Subject: Re: Horizontal Exits
>
> Yup in the NC 2006 IBC we have that same exception.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: [email protected]
> <[email protected]>
> Sent: Fri Mar 07 16:58:39 2008
> Subject: RE: Horizontal Exits
>
> What Jamie said. An exit through a fire-rated separation; the reason
> for Class I connections on both sides is that one side is presumed to
> be separated and safe from the fire on the other.
>
> Remember though, that if you are considering said connections based on
> prescriptive code requirements, you should check out whether there's
> an exception your state's adopted version of the IBC, section 905.4
> (Location of Class I standpipe hose connections. The new California
> version, based on
> 2006 includes the following for location of connections, which I think
> is straight IBC without amendments:
>
> 905.4.2 On each side of the wall adjacent to the exit opening of a
> horizontal exit.
>
> Exception: Where floor areas adjacent to a horizontal exit are
> reachable from exit stairway hose connections by a 30-foot hose stream
> from a nozzle attached to 100 feet of hose, a hose connection shall
> not be required at the horizontal exit.
>
>
> Steve Leyton
> Protection Design & Consulting
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Jamie
> Seidl
> Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 1:07 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: RE: Horizontal Exits
>
> Chap 10 of the 2003 IBC.
> Exit, Horizontal. A path of egress travel from one building to an
> area in another building on approximately the same level, or a path of
> egress travel through or around a wall or partition to an area on
> approximately the same level in the same building, which affords
> safety from fire and smoke from the area of incidence and areas
> communicating therewith.
>
> (Think 2 hr fire walls, double doors in corridors with magnetic
> holders).
>
> Jamie Seidl
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Richard
> Battershell
> Sent: Friday, March 07, 2008 3:45 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Horizontal Exits
>
>
> Class I standpipes as per NFPA 14 7.3.2 (2)2004 ed. requires hose
> connections be provided "On each side of the wall adjacent to the exit
> openings of horizontal exits". What constitutes a horizontal exit?
>
> Thanks for the help.
>
>
> Richard Battershell
>
>
>
>
>
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