Hello Rod, Top floor 30' up, THEN they decide to add carpet and you are now 30' 1/2" and the AHJ has a field day.
Tuesday, March 11, 2014, 9:25:08 PM, you wrote: > I was asking with regard to the basis of design. What are they > trained for - mop up? Attack? Attack with small hose or large > diameter with straight stream tips? The question is about whether > they're required; besides that issue, if they're to be installed > then they should be optimized for use by the responding department > or brigade and that basis of design is infinitely subjective > depending on hardware, training and responder tactics. If I was > asking this same question in Delaware - given that Delaware > volunteer brigades are apparently highly trained - then my answer > would still be in the form of a question. > SL > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected] on behalf of Ben Young > Sent: Tue 3/11/2014 5:37 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: Standpipe requirement > > Volunteer shouldn't mean no training. Delaware is almost all volunteer > state-wide and they know exactly what to do with standpipes. > Benjamin Young > On Tue, Mar 11, 2014 at 7:34 PM, Steve Leyton > <[email protected]>wrote: >> PS: if a volunteer department, are they trained in standpipes and what >> pressure nozzles, what size attack lines, etc. will they bring to the >> party? >> SL >> -------- Original message -------- >> From: Rod DiBona <[email protected]> >> Date:03/11/2014 12:13 PM (GMT-07:00) >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: Standpipe requirement >> Thank you Craig and Pete, >> Interesting that I do an ICC online search and this is what comes up but >> it is for "[ 2010 California Fire Code, Title 24, Part 9 (First Printing), >> Includes Errata/Supplement through July 1, 2012 ]" >> 905.3.1 Height. In other than Group R-3 and R-3.1 occupancies, Class III >> standpipe systems shall be installed throughout at each floor where any of >> the following occur: >> 1. Buildings where the floor level of the highest story is located more >> than 30 feet (9144 mm) above the lowest level of fire department vehicle >> access. >> 2. Buildings that are four or more stories in height. >> 3. Buildings where the floor level of the lowest story is located more >> than 30 feet (9144 mm) below the highest level of fire department vehicle >> access. >> 4. Buildings that are two or more stories below the highest level of fire >> department vehicle access. >> In addition as Pete found it in NFPA 1 but not adopted for us..... Good >> point on the fire flow reduction- In Rapid City it is amended to a maximum >> of 50% in lieu of the allowed max of 75%. Will check local to see if they >> allow at all considering it does say "where approved" >> Appreciate the help fellas.... Still going to suggest standpipes as best >> practice. Does 30' mean 30 ' or 30' 6"? Volunteer FD, remote, rural... >> Rod at Rapid >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] [mailto: >> [email protected]] On Behalf Of >> [email protected] >> Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 11:45 AM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: Standpipe requirement >> NFPA 1 only applies if NFPA 1 is an adopted Code/Standard within the >> Jurisdiction. >> IBC or IFC has 30 ft above or below FD access as the trigger. It was >> probably an assumption at one time that three stories was approximately 30 >> ft but there was no Code verbiage using the three story mark as a trigger. >> I remember hearing the same terminology used regarding stories. >> In regards to the fire flow reduction, be sure to verify that as being >> acceptable to the local fire authority. I have had cases where the local >> FD said no reduction regardless of sprinklers. Obviously they had some >> concerns based on local experience. >> Craig L. Prahl, CET >> Fire Protection Group Lead >> CH2MHILL >> Lockwood Greene >> 1500 International Drive >> Spartanburg, SC 29303 >> Direct - 864.599.4102 >> Fax - 864.599.8439 >> CH2MHILL Extension 74102 >> [email protected] >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] [mailto: >> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Pete Schwab >> Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 1:20 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: RE: Standpipe requirement >> NFPA 1 - 13.2.2.2 >> Peter Schwab >> VP of Purchasing & Engineering Technologies >> Wayne Automatic Fire Sprinklers Inc. >> 222 Capitol Court >> Ocoee, Fl 34761 >> Mobile: (407) 468-8248 >> Direct: (407) 877-5570 >> Fax: (407) 656-8026 >> www.waynefire.com >> Celebrating over 34 years of life safety >> -----Original Message----- >> From: [email protected] [mailto: >> [email protected]] On Behalf Of Rod DiBona >> Sent: Tuesday, March 11, 2014 1:09 PM >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Standpipe requirement >> I thought that if I have a 4 story OR the elevation of the highest floor >> is 30' above or below the fd vehicle access I would need a standpipe. When >> I look at 2009 IBC section 905.3.1 it only references the 30'. So I have a >> 4 story apartment where the top floor is right at 30'- it doesn't look like >> I need a standpipe. I just had it in my mind that once I hit 4 stories it >> was a done deal. These are design build apartment complexes with S2 Parking >> garage below where the architect is considering IIIA, IIIB or VB and I am >> looking at the different sprinkler options for each. Looks like I can have >> a 13R in the residential floors in IIIA where the other options are 13 >> throughout. Is there another section that kicks it in at a 4th floor? >> Maybe that was old UBC or maybe I dreamed it up. >> 905.3.1 Height. Class III standpipe systems shall be installed throughout >> buildings where the floor level of the highest story is located more than >> 30 feet (9144 mm) above the lowest level of fire department vehicle access, >> or where the floor level of the lowest story is located more than 30 feet >> (9144 mm) below the highest level of fire department vehicle access. >> Another thing I will throw out there that it looks like I had wrong... I >> thought the fire flow reduction was only available for 903.3.1.1 (13 >> system) but when I look at IFC section B105.2 - exception- It clearly >> allows it for 903.1.2 as well. Probably common knowledge for most of you >> but fyi... >> Rod at Rapid >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org -- Best regards, Charles Thurston mailto:[email protected] Systems Design Manager NICET Certified _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org
