No desire for confrontation here either, Kyle.
However, if that AHJ is willing to extend that "reasonable" perspective
and allow me to protect > 40,000 ft² of storage with a single system,
and ignore the limitation imposed by NFPA 13, then I'll likely ask him
if he's willing to sign a document defending me in court should it ever
come to that.
I've not had the experience in court that some of the others on this
forum have, however I can relate that in one instance I pointed to NFPA
13 and said, "It's right here, your honor, I didn't make it up," and was
dismissed from the case _*AND*_ awarded attorney's fees.
I don't have any issue with create a 2,000 ft² or more area of some
other occupancy.
sincerely,
*Ken Wagoner, SET
*Parsley Consulting***
*350 West 9th Avenue, Suite 206
*Escondido, California 92025
*****Phone 760-745-6181*
Visit the website <http://www.parsleyconsulting.com/> ***
On 01/29/2020 9:30 AM, Kyle.Montgomery via Sprinklerforum wrote:
Don’t mean to hi-jack, but does anyone here think that breaking a
42,000 sq. ft. building up into two separate systems actually improves
the level of protection? If your AHJ is reasonable, they might let you
save that extra riser and feed main and just use one system. Or, if
there is a small office in the corner or some area that will be
designated for manufacturing or something other than storage, you
could look at applying 8.2.3.
In a building this small, adding that extra zone will end up being a
not-so-insignificant cost increase.
-Kyle M
*From:* Sprinklerforum
[mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org] *On Behalf Of
*Brian Harris via Sprinklerforum
*Sent:* Wednesday, January 29, 2020 9:31 AM
*To:* sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
*Cc:* Brian Harris <bhar...@bvssystemsinc.com>
*Subject:* [EXTERNAL] RE: Misc. Storage
Ken-
Thank you sir, haven’t talked to you in a while. Much appreciate your
insight and clarity as always.
If EH kicks in looks like (2) Risers….
*Brian Harris, CET*
BVS Systems Inc.
bvssytemsinc.com
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bvssystemsinc.com_&d=DwMFAw&c=wn3mZQLIuInh2ClcJ0_DIA&r=Z_2A85VL7AQzoqudh6uOyS3bn8etxB7nLN8OBJwQd9A&m=_i-3gtRgUe3C3_NF6JEVrRsp03qeNc1whW5ctjjD9go&s=Eehr8EULwOEFVj7mx_BUUA9FU4i6_xpQB4y6xdkenyc&e=>
*From:* Sprinklerforum <sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org
<mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@lists.firesprinkler.org>> *On Behalf Of
*Parsley Consulting via Sprinklerforum
*Sent:* Wednesday, January 29, 2020 11:16 AM
*To:* Brian Harris via Sprinklerforum
<sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org
<mailto:sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org>>
*Cc:* Parsley Consulting <parsleyconsult...@cox.net
<mailto:parsleyconsult...@cox.net>>
*Subject:* Re: Misc. Storage
Brian,
I'll be happy to share my perspective for you.
* Review the definition of miscellaneous storage in the paragraph
you quoted. It sounds to me as though you've described a building
where the storage of 42,000 ft² *_is not_* "incidental" to other
use of the building, *_is not_* less than 4,000 ft² in area, and
*_is not_* less than 10% of the building area. It meets only one
of the criteria as miscellaneous storage - that it doesn't exceed
12' in height.
* So, we're looking at rack storage of class I-IV commodities, to
12'-0" high. In §16.2.1.2.1 the protection for those commodities,
stored up to and including 12'-0" "shall be the same as
miscellaneous storage from Chapter 13." That does not mean that
it *_IS_* miscellaneous storage, simply that it is to be protected
per the criteria in chapter 13. This is confirmed in §13.2.1(5)
which says Table 13.2.1 and Figure 13.2.1 shall apply to "storage
of class I through IV commodities up to 12' in height *_as
directed by_* 14.2.3.1 and *_16.2.1.2.1_*.
* Sorry to disagree with your client, however in my read of table
13.2.1, I see that Class IV commodities stored in "rack storage"
below 10' can be protected by an OH2 density. Once the storage
exceeds 10', but remains less than 12', the density jumps to EH1,
the ceiling height is limited to 32'.
* I suggest you take a good long look at 5.6.1.2, in its entirety
for protection of mixed commodities.
Also, how are you intending to exceed the limit for a system
protection storage of 40,000 ft² in 8.2.1, or EH?
hope that gives you some help,
*Ken Wagoner, SET
**Parsley Consulting
350 West 9th Avenue, Suite 206
Escondido, California 92025
Phone 760-745-6181
Visit the website
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.parsleyconsulting.com_&d=DwMFAw&c=wn3mZQLIuInh2ClcJ0_DIA&r=Z_2A85VL7AQzoqudh6uOyS3bn8etxB7nLN8OBJwQd9A&m=_i-3gtRgUe3C3_NF6JEVrRsp03qeNc1whW5ctjjD9go&s=weMlHZR15R1XKbhcZZfI65UsJDt_5jUCOoknwGbXThU&e=>
*
On 01/29/2020 7:44 AM, Brian Harris via Sprinklerforum wrote:
Just want to confirm per the definition of Misc. Storage (3.9.1.18
NFPA 2013) that just because something is stored less than 12’
high doesn’t automatically make it misc. storage. Working on a
project that is 42,000 sq.ft. and the owner is storing Class I-IV
commodities on double row racks. Says he was told as long as he
doesn’t exceed 12’ high he only needs OH-2 protection at the ceiling…
*Brian Harris, CET*
BVS Systems Inc.
Design Manager
bvssystemsinc.com
<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__bvssystemsinc.com_&d=DwMFAw&c=wn3mZQLIuInh2ClcJ0_DIA&r=Z_2A85VL7AQzoqudh6uOyS3bn8etxB7nLN8OBJwQd9A&m=_i-3gtRgUe3C3_NF6JEVrRsp03qeNc1whW5ctjjD9go&s=Eehr8EULwOEFVj7mx_BUUA9FU4i6_xpQB4y6xdkenyc&e=>
Phone: 704.896.9989
Fax: 704.896.1935
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