With all due respect Dane - read the annex, it specifically addresses that issue.
On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 3:42 PM Dane Long <[email protected]> wrote: > Anthony, > > > > I feel there might be a few sections you need to look at regarding this > question. > > > > For me I would start at *8.6.5.2 Obstructions to Sprinkler Discharge > Pattern Development.* > > > > *8.6.5.2.1.1 *Continuous or noncontinuous obstructions less than or equal > to 18 in. (457 mm) > > below the sprinkler deflector that prevent the pattern from fully > developing shall comply with > > 8.6.5.2. > > > > The section above lays the ground work for the 18in requirement (8.6.5.2). > Then I would look at *8.6.5.2.1.3* Minimum Distance from Obstructions.* > > > > *8.6.5.2.1.4* *For light and ordinary hazard occupancies, structural > > members only shall be considered when applying the requirements > > of 8.6.5.2.1.3. > > > > IMHO Because it specifically says “structural members only shall be > considered” I believe the intent of this section is to allow for us to not > provide sprinklers on both side to a reasonable degree, meaning we’re able > to get water on both sides of the obstruction as long as its not a > structural member. > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > *Dane Long, AET* > *Engineering Technician *| *Bamford Fire Sprinkler Co., Inc.* > P: *785.825.7710* > F: *785.825.0667* > A: *1383 W. North Street Salina, KS 67401* > > > > > > *From:* Anthony Johnson <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Thursday, March 9, 2023 2:26 PM > *To:* Discussion list on issues relating to automatic fire sprinklers < > [email protected]> > *Subject:* [Sprinklerforum] Re: Duct obstruction criteria in LH attic > > > > The 3x rule is the only one we think would apply but it only applies to > structural components. > > > > Best Regards, > > Anthony Johnson > > Mountain Fire Protection > > 'Saving Lives and Valuing Property' > > > > On Thu, Mar 9, 2023 at 12:58 PM Taylor Schumacher <[email protected]> > wrote: > > When you cannot apply one of the obstruction rules, it does not mean that > there isn’t an obstruction. > > > > If you think about this scenario the same way you would with sprinklers > directly attached to a pipe, that’s where to start. Look at the 3x rule or > sprinklers on each side. > > > > > > *Taylor Schumacher* > > Security Fire Sprinkler <http://www.j-berd.com/> > > 1 Industrial Blvd | Sauk Rapids, MN 56379 > > Office: 320.656.0847 | Direct: 320.640.7050 > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Thursday, March 09, 2023 12:37 PM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* [Sprinklerforum] Re: Duct obstruction criteria in LH attic > > > > I believe however, the intent of the section must still be applied. Water > on both sides. > > Not sure in the 13 edition the location, but in the 19 it is 10.2.7.1.2. > > We are referred back to it as applicable from the 3 times section. > > > > Sprinklers spaced on opposing sides, not to exceed the max half distance. > > > > R/ > > Matt > > > > *Please rate our customer service > <https://survey.medallia.com/?emailsignature&fc=3539&bg=Fire%20and%20Fabrication>* > > > > *Matthew J. Willis, CWBSP, CET* > > *Engineering Designer IV* > > *FERGUSON FIRE DESIGN, LLC* > > *A Wholly Owned Subsidiary of Ferguson Fire & Fabrication, LLC* > > 401 N 5th Street > > Suite 448 > > Wausau, WI 54403 > > C: 307-236-8249 > > *[email protected] <[email protected]>* > > *www.FergusonFire.com <http://www.fergusonfire.com/>* > > > > *From:* Anthony Johnson <[email protected]> > *Sent:* Thursday, March 9, 2023 11:24 AM > *To:* [email protected] > *Subject:* [Sprinklerforum] Duct obstruction criteria in LH attic > > > > I have an elementary question but know there are varying opinions on the > topic. The situation is a tight unused attic space in a LH occupancy. Our > upright sprinkler deflector will be 3" above the ductwork. Evaluating all > of the obstruction criteria presented in NFPA we've essentially came to the > conclusion that the ductwork would not pose an obstruction but came to this > conclusion mainly by process of elimination. The beam-rule would not apply > since the ductwork is below the deflector. The 3X rule is only for > structural components in light and ordinary hazards and the 'wide > obstruction' rule would not apply since the ductwork is only 24" wide. > That only leaves the 'suspended or floor mounted vertical obstructions' > rule of 8.6.5.2.2 ('2013 ed) but it specifically mentions free standing > partitions, privacy curtains and "similar obstructions". I don't think > duct-work is a similar obstruction. I would like to have my ducks in a row > if this design approach should be questioned but also want to make sure I > have a sound design. Is our reasoning correct that essentially if the > sprinkler deflector is above the duct water will spray on both sides and > the duct would not pose as an obstruction? > > > > Best Regards, > > Anthony Johnson > > Mountain Fire Protection > > 'Saving Lives and Valuing Property' > > > _________________________________________________________ > SprinklerForum mailing list: > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > To unsubscribe send an email to > [email protected] > > > _________________________________________________________ > SprinklerForum mailing list: > https://lists.firesprinkler.org/list/sprinklerforum.lists.firesprinkler.org > To unsubscribe send an email to > [email protected] > -- Greg McGahan *Genesis Fire Services, LLC* *4912 Glover Lane. Milton, FL **32570* *P- 850-637-8535* *C- 850-712-9555*
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