On 21/12/19 21:25, Francesco Ansanelli wrote:
And with existing tags how you describe it?
I don't.
Il sab 21 dic 2019, 10:28 Warin <61sundow...@gmail.com <mailto:61sundow...@gmail.com>> ha scritto:On 21/12/19 19:49, Francesco Ansanelli wrote:Dear Volker, I saw that someone went ahead and changed the wiki again: Use roundtrip=yes to indicate that start and end of a route are at the same location. I think this new definition matches your idea of roundtrip and it's fine for both definitions. My last offer is to abandon the closed_loop tag in favour of: roundtrip:type=linear|circular Do you agree?No. "Type" means nothing. Perhaps roundtrip:route=*??? As for the values .. you will need to define them! 'My' local bus route starts off with ways that are used both directions .. and then separates into a loop where the segments are only used in one direction. I could imaging routes that have several loops used in one direction and then ways that are used in both directions .. arrr there is another route that does that ... So what values will there be to cover complex cases???Francesco Il ven 20 dic 2019, 22:45 Volker Schmidt <vosc...@gmail.com <mailto:vosc...@gmail.com>> ha scritto: Please revert the roundtrip wiki change, but let's put any other wiki-changes on halt for a moment. What we need to do is to find out how the roundtrip tag is being used (the wiki is suposed to document the actual use, not what the use should be) and in particular if there is a more-than sporadic use of roundtrip=yes|no for anything else than loop=yes|no. It's difficult to get reliable quantitative results, but: A fast overpass turbo wizard query "type:relation and route=bicycle and roundtrip=yes in Italy|France|England|USA|Bayern" resulted in Italy: 58 lines with at best a handful of them not closed loops France: 358 lines with maybe 10 non-loops England: 25 lines, all loops. USA: 29, about 6 non-loops Bavaria 213, did not find any non-loops For me this is a strong indication that the large majority of all cycle route relations in these countries that have a roundrip=yes are in fact loops and that that this is the de-facto use of the tag. I think this is a strong case against any change. Taginfo points in the same direction 12665 roundtrip=no 21774 roundtrip=yes 42 closed_loop=yes no closed_loop=no Volker On Fri, 20 Dec 2019 at 18:17, Francesco Ansanelli <franci...@gmail.com <mailto:franci...@gmail.com>> wrote: In my opinion the options are: - deprecate roundtrip in favour of 2 tags with a generally agreed naming convention (best at this point) - keep roundtrip and closed_loop with the wiki definition I did change (relations must be updated accordingly) I read many of you asked a revert, I just want to point out that is not a resolution because tag is currently messed up Il ven 20 dic 2019, 15:08 Steve Doerr <doerr.step...@gmail.com <mailto:doerr.step...@gmail.com>> ha scritto: On 19/12/2019 22:48, Phake Nick wrote:Merriam Webster and some other resources you have quoted are dictionary for American English, not the variant of English used by OSM. Posts by original author of the topic on the wiki talk page have explained the meaning of the term in British English.The OED definitions read as follows: Originally U.S. A. n. 1. a. A journey to a place and back again, along the same route; (also) a journey to one or more places and back again which does not cover the same ground twice, a circular tour or trip. b. Baseball. A home run. Cf. round-tripper n. 2. 2. In extended use and figurative, esp. (Mining and Oil Industry) an act of withdrawing and replacing a drill pipe. 3. Stock Market (originally U.S.). The action or an instance of buying and selling the same stock, commodity, etc., often simultaneously. Cf. round turn n. 4. B. adj. (attributive). Chiefly North American. 1. Of or relating to a round trip (in various senses). Cf. return n. Compounds 1. 2. That makes or has made a round trip (literal and figurative). C. adv. Chiefly North American. As a round trip; by travelling to a place and back again. Note the frequent references to 'U.S.' and 'North American'. It's an American phrase, though now widely adopted in the UK.-- Steve_______________________________________________
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