A quick update: I have a demo up (shh, its a secret but you may be able to guess the url). I haven't enabled creating accounts yet because there is still a lot of administrative UI that I need to work out. It is running on a digital ocean droplet with apache and passenger handling the bits that they handle. Once I get the temporary accounts set up I will open that up so people can play with it a bit.
Stobot, I don't think that is taking the idea too far, considering that is one of my big motivations for doing this. I maintained the wiki reference wiki for a while but it was only me and I got distracted by other things, so having something community owned where multiple people can edit and maintain it is one of the prime motivators. I have lots of ideas about how to use this to help package and distribute plugins in a way that allows far more collaboration and community assistance than is currently available to people who aren't familiar with GitHub and other coding tools. I want things like community documentation and translations for plugins when there is a need, and this could lower the barrier to entry for contributing by a lot. On Sunday, December 27, 2020 at 5:59:21 PM UTC+1 Stobot wrote: > Jed, > > I don't want to take the idea too far, but if we were going to have a > community-run TiddlySpot-like option available (OokTech) - I wonder if we > could also cover / expand on what things like TiddlyTools used to be (and I > assume still is for TWC) for the community? The "TiddlyWiki toolmap" in > Dynalist from David, and the "scripts" area that Mohammad maintains are > fantastic and I'm appreciative that someone puts all the effort into > maintaining them. But, most other software has an unofficial plugin forum > or something where all authors can post to, get feedback on, and users can > vote - or we can see download count - or something else to rank / evaluate > them for newer users that don't spend time every day combing through Google > Groups like us addicts :) Loft goal, but could be a big step in the > maturity of the platform to have something like this available, and this > OokWiki could be the technology that could finally make that happen. > > On Sunday, December 27, 2020 at 6:14:20 AM UTC-5 Yann Moudet wrote: > >> Hello, >> we use tiddlywiki + BOB as a knolewdge base for our team. >> Our configuration: >> - a linux server with node (LTS versions). >> - oauth2-proxy: for authentication, Reverse-Proxy and SSL termination. >> - an S3 bucket for storing wiki. (versioning enabled). >> - TiddlyWiki plugins: Bob, Comments and CheckList. >> I could provision a demo server with this configuration and/or lend a >> server for 6 months as a first lease. For the second option, I would need a >> public key and a wished configuration. >> Yann >> Le mercredi 23 décembre 2020 à 14:25:38 UTC+1, Stobot a écrit : >> >>> Jed, >>> >>> I'm very excited to hear that this continues to develop - thank you! I >>> continue to believe that easy multi-user is a key pillar to growing >>> TiddlyWiki usage and adoption overall. As a fan of TiddlyWiki I am happy to >>> help anyway I can to support it's long-term health. To that end, I've been >>> going to your https://github.com/OokTech/TW5-BobEXE/releases page about >>> weekly hoping to see something new - now realizing that there were updates >>> being posted elsewhere. >>> >>> As you reference learning about use-cases from Google Groups here, I'll >>> share a bit about how I'm currently using BOB, and have been hoping to use >>> it in the future. My most elaborate usage has been around project >>> management. I run a project management team of about 40 project managers. >>> Each project has multiple team members, and there are levels of approvals >>> needed, as progress ties into people's bonus plans. We use a custom blend >>> of Six Sigma, Lean and a couple of other methodologies to track our >>> projects. So, I've setup a BOB on a spare laptop inside the corporate >>> network and built out something for everyone to use / collaborate with. I >>> have a business background, not a web / programmer background, so I >>> struggled through inventing a login process that was relatively easy from >>> my standpoint, but totally insecure. Essentially I gave them a url suffix >>> to access the site which is referenced as their username. >>> >>> From a functionality standpoint, this works - most of the time. BOB does >>> glitch a bit if you go into / out of edit-mode too fast (as an example, >>> even in the info area where you enter your starting tiddlers, you have to >>> type VERY slowly or it leaves out some of the characters). Running from a >>> laptop to host works okay generally, except in my company they have all >>> these forced updates that give a couple of hours notice, so that laptop >>> needs to be rebooted fairly frequently, and does so automatically. Of >>> course to the end-user, that means the "server is down" frequently which >>> comes off as unprofessional and unstable. This is an area that OokWiki >>> would help with. Additionally, I'm giving out a local address (10.xxx) >>> which means that although most of my team can work remotely and >>> off-network, they're having to login to VPN to access it, which is somewhat >>> annoying to them. By contrast for instance, any of us that are using >>> TiddlyWiki for personal use are hosting as .aspx on SharePoint (WebDAV I >>> think) and able to work completely "off-network". That last distinction >>> also means that they all have access to their personal wikis on their >>> phones, but not BOB. This is another area I'm hoping OokWiki can help with. >>> Actually now that I think of it, another hurdle is that we've recently >>> adopted Microsoft Teams extensively, and you can add web tabs as long as >>> they have https: prefixes - so again SharePoint ones can be added, but not >>> 10.xxx addresses. I'm hoping OokWiki can help there too - I've tweaked my >>> current theme to look very Microsoft-y to ease transition for my team. >>> >>> Anyways, those should help make clear some of the things I hope the >>> evolution of BOB will help me solve someday. I will say that we used this >>> system for a couple of months, but after a network issue caused us to not >>> use the LAN for a couple of weeks, many transitioned back to previous >>> methods of tracking, so we're currently not using it unfortunately. I've >>> been hoping that BOB would make some more progress before I re-introduce it >>> to the team. >>> >>> Aside from all of that, I've been thinking of various ways I could >>> invest some of my time into helping the TiddlyWiki community. One was to >>> see if adding some beginner-intermediate YouTube videos for how I use >>> TiddlyWiki. I think the more the better in this area for user adoption. A >>> second way to really highlight how game-changing BOB is was to start >>> building Games for BOB - which is what I hope to do over the coming weeks / >>> months! >>> >>> Games for BOB: My family (wife and 2 kids aged 13 and 10) are all stuck >>> at home pretty much full time at this point. We play a good number of board >>> / card games - which we enjoy. I tested the idea of building games in BOB >>> and having them all login and they're loving it so far (wife mainly rolls >>> her eyes). Using hidden tiddlers and just wiki-text you can get pretty far. >>> My plan is to build out some really basic versions of these games and post >>> them back here to give further (and fun) use cases for real-time multi-user >>> platforms like BOB. My test case was a tic-tac-toe, but have plans for >>> increasingly challenging games. I think most card games, and even things >>> like checkers / chess should be not too bad. I have no intention of >>> building a "computer" player as that would drastically make the code >>> harder, but for in-house simple games, I think it'll be really fun - they >>> can play from their tablets / phones - which they love :) >>> >>> Anyways Jed - your post was part announcement, part asking for help. I >>> can help a bit financially, but don't know if I have the technical skill >>> you need from that end. I will however continue to be a promoter of your >>> efforts! Let me know how I can help. >>> On Tuesday, December 22, 2020 at 8:04:05 PM UTC-5 TW Tones wrote: >>> >>>> Jed, >>>> >>>> Thanks for your work, this is very exciting. I would be happy to help >>>> with Windows configuration issues, but if the setup is only in Linux It >>>> may >>>> be hard for me to work it out. Although I know how to do Bob node on >>>> widows >>>> already, if I need only implement additional features. >>>> >>>> I continue to contribute by Patrion and hope others do so as well. Your >>>> solutions fill a gap in TiddlyWiki when it comes to serious multi-user >>>> wikis. This is a substantial feature release, thank you. >>>> >>>> I would be keen to implement it on my LAN and possibly through my Home >>>> firewall if possible in time, I can use docker and other solutions by do >>>> not know about digital ocean droplet, and I have cpanel apache services >>>> online and possibly even nodeJS and would love to configure a server as >>>> well. It would be great to be able to develop and have the results >>>> securely >>>> online. I would fund an Australian host on top of my Hosting services if I >>>> can set it up. >>>> >>>> It is sad you are not based in Sydney because I may be able to give you >>>> a laptop computer for this. My condolences on the loss of your current >>>> one. >>>> >>>> Best wishes for the season. >>>> Tones >>>> On Tuesday, 22 December 2020 at 21:05:17 UTC+11 [email protected] >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hello all, >>>>> >>>>> The short version: I have a potential replacement for tiddlyspot that >>>>> could be distributed and self-hosted on something small like a digital >>>>> ocean droplet. My computer died and help getting a new one would greatly >>>>> speed up the development and release. >>>>> I think that a community managed public server is a good idea, and it >>>>> is designed so that you can create your own private server. >>>>> >>>>> The long version: >>>>> I made a server that works with Bob and TiddlyWiki that adds a secure >>>>> token-based login that is appropriate for having a web-facing server. I >>>>> have been working on this periodically for a while, some of you may have >>>>> seen it when I had Ooktech.xyz up. I have been working on it periodically >>>>> for a long time and it is very close to ready for public release. >>>>> >>>>> The problem is that an adorable kitten decided that dancing on my >>>>> multiprise was a good idea and after some impressive sparks the computer >>>>> I >>>>> do my development on is dead. The kitten is fine and acts adorably >>>>> innocent. >>>>> >>>>> The server has all the features of Bob (multiple wikis, everything >>>>> configured from within the wiki itself, support for multiple simultaneous >>>>> users), as well as a secure login using JWT (json web tokens). Accounts >>>>> have granular permissions which can be set, there many but here is a >>>>> quick >>>>> incomplete description of what you can do, in no real order. Server >>>>> administrators can enable or disable almost all of these features if they >>>>> are not useful for your purposes. >>>>> >>>>> - A simple script to run that sets everything up >>>>> - Publicly viewable or private wikis >>>>> - Allow specific people to view or edit a wiki >>>>> - If an account owns a wiki they can set permissions on their own wikis >>>>> - optional quotas for accounts both in terms of number of wikis and >>>>> storage >>>>> - A plugin library built into the server >>>>> - Access controls for plugins as well (so plugins can be used to >>>>> distribute content >>>>> without making it public) >>>>> - Simple 1-click download for wikis as a single-file without Bob >>>>> - profiles/accounts and wikis can be set as private so on one can see >>>>> them >>>>> - Create an account on the server from a wiki >>>>> - update passwords and other account information from inside a wiki >>>>> - accounts can have some 'about me' information, if they want to set >>>>> it >>>>> - Set if an account can create wikis >>>>> - namespaces wikis (if I create a wiki called MyWiki it would be >>>>> inmysocks/MyWiki) so >>>>> that there are no naming conflicts >>>>> - change ownership of a wiki (give a wiki to someone else) >>>>> - inter-wiki federation, like chat and sharing tiddlers between wikis >>>>> >>>>> There are many other details about administrator controls, but those >>>>> are I think the highlights for using the server. Almost all of that is >>>>> implemented, I am in the process of adding usable in-wiki interfaces for >>>>> all of it. >>>>> The setup script is only currently for linux and osx, I would need >>>>> someone who is familiar with windows to make that if anyone wants it. >>>>> Hosting online is generally linux so I am not sure how much it would be >>>>> needed. >>>>> >>>>> My plan is to put up a demo site as soon as I can that has limited >>>>> life-time accounts to show the features. You could create an account that >>>>> lasts a day and after the account and wikis with it are removed. >>>>> >>>>> I am not interested in hosting and running this myself, it would be a >>>>> community with community governance supported by donations. I do not know >>>>> the demands that would be put on it, but I don't think that the hosting >>>>> costs would be more than about $100/month. >>>>> I would of course continue updating the server, but maintenance and >>>>> operation must be a group effort so we don't get a situation like >>>>> tiddlyspot where we rely on two people who may not be active members of >>>>> the >>>>> community and we have no way to shift ownership for continued operation. >>>>> >>>>> I don't know what interest there is in this, so I am going to gauge >>>>> that from the response to this post. Also, help with getting a >>>>> development >>>>> computer would speed things up a lot. >>>>> >>>>> A link to the amazon wishilst for the computer components: >>>>> https://www.amazon.fr/hz/wishlist/ls/2WM0S9VV3LJR1?ref_=wl_share >>>>> >>>>> ps: >>>>> >>>>> There are a lot of future features that I am working on, like the >>>>> ability to search multiple wikis from one wiki, inter-server federation >>>>> so >>>>> you can have your own private server and interact with other servers, >>>>> having a login on one server that lets you access wikis on other servers, >>>>> things like that. >>>>> >>>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/161bb975-d941-4576-b7a2-0d89e513f54dn%40googlegroups.com.
