RE: [TruthTalk] Crucial Doctrines

[Charles P. Locke]

From: "ShieldsFamily" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Crucial Doctrines
Date: Mon, 23 Dec 2002 11:42:11 -0600

Perry,

David Miller has never said that he has never sinned--otherwise he would
not need a Savior. If I am correct, he has said that he believes
scriptures teach that Christ came to set us free from sinning any more
after receiving Him as our Savior.

Did you disregard Romans 6:10? I posted it there for you to read, to save you from having itlook it up.

What if His blood not only (1) atoned for the sins we have committed,
but (2) gave us the ability to decide not to sin anymore?

Suspend your judgments for a moment and consider: wouldn't this be

I beg you to point out where I judged. I simply asked Dave if he had sinned since being saved. If he says that he has not (and if you say the same) then you are liars according to Romans 6:10. If you have sinned since then, then you have made my point.

Really Good News??? Would you be happy if this were true? Would you
accept such a gift if it were offered? Would you have the faith to
believe it enough to accept it?

Sure, if it were true, I would be very happy. But if it is true, then I am not saved, because I know that I still am a sinner, but rest in the assurance that my salvation is in Christ, not through any effort of my own, other than to believe that he indeed has saved me from the penalty of sin and accept the free gifts of his mercy and hid grace. My goal is not to sin, and my effort is to do good, but in my humanity I sometimes fail. When I do, I ask for forgiveness, and he is faithful to forgive my sins. I also hold that every human being is also in this same state once saved.

What if you couldn't accept the one gift without receiving the other?

Well, I guess that I would not be a sinner, but the scripture says otherwise.

What if our obedience to the Law (ie: walking in Love, free of sin) was
a way of gauging whether or not we have accepted ALL of Christ's atoning
Blood gift to us?

Then no one would be saved.

What if God's Commandments are the measurement that
Jesus is using when He says, "Depart from Me, you who practice
lawlessness; I never knew you!"?

And what if it means they really never placed their faith in Jesus Christ?

Izzy

Perry

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] On Behalf Of Charles P. Locke
Sent: Monday, December 23, 2002 10:15 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Crucial Doctrines

David,

Since you became a believer, have you sinned?

You said "If you are still a sinner, then Jesus did not save you from
sin. Perhaps your faith is only that one day you will be saved from the
consequences of sin." You are saying two separate things here. Jesus did
not
save us from sin, he saved us from the penalty (death) of sin.

And, that little word "if" is indeed a big word. However, it does not

preclude our still being sinners. Check this out in 1 John 1 & 2,
especially
v. 10:

9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our
sins,
and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word
is
not in us.
2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not.
And
if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the
righteous:
2 And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but
also
for the sins of the whole world.

I believe in salvation the moment we truly believe and put our faith in
Jesus.

And sin does not have dominion over us once we are saved, in that it
does
not put us to death since we are saved from the penaty of sin. However,
we
are still can be tempted, and still can sin. In Romans 6 Paul is
specifically addressing a specific that believed that intentionally
sinning
increasingly demonstrated God's abounding grace. Paul is correcting this

incorrect doctrine. (See 6:1. I have read commentaries that label these
people "antinomians", who believed that since they were no longer under
the
law they could sin freely and that, in fact, this was a good thing
because
it showed how great God's grace was!)

Perry






----------
"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org

If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.

_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 3 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail&xAPID=42&PS=47575&PI=7324&DI=7474&SU= http://www.hotmail.msn.com/cgi-bin/getmsg&HL=1216hotmailtaglines_addphotos_3mf

----------
"Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org

If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.