From: Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Like God and One With God Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2004 00:40:05 -0800
Charles Perry Locke wrote:
> >DAVEH: I've previously wanted to discuss these Perry, but so far I don't
> >recall anybody wanting to have a serious discussion. Are you willing to do
> >so? If you don't like how I defined them, please offer your definition and
> >we can chat about our contrasting views.
>
> My goal in pointing out the LDS meaning v. the Christian meaning is to
> remind people that when LDS use words, they often mean something different
> than what Christians mean when they use them.
DAVEH: I've got no problem with that, Perry. I have often given my definition for words as I see them just so TTers wouldn't be confused. All I ask in return is that TTers tell me how they define them, so we can carry on a reasonable conversation about
them.
> I do not want Christians who
> do not know the LDS meanings to be mislead into thinking that the Mormons
> think or believe the same way Christians do. Call me protective, but I feel
> it is my duty, if I know that someone is being mislead by words, to correct
> that. You certainly aren't going to tell them that you mean something
> different.
DAVEH: LOL.....Nonsense, Perry. Have I not said that I believe being one with God refers to purpose? And, have I not said that it is the ultimate goal of our eternal progression to become like God.....as in, becoming a God? Do you think there are any
TTer who thinks I've been trying to hide my beliefs about these definitions? Long before you came to TT, Perry, I've tried to make a point of defining my terms so that there would be as little confusion as possible in TT about what I believe. My past
posts speak for themselves.
> And, if you want "my" definition, use the Bible and a good dictionary. > Strong's, Vine's, and Zhodiates' come to mind.
DAVEH: I see. Could this mean you don't want to discuss them with me?
You can look them up as easily as I can. Strongs is a foundational translation dictionary, and is indexed to the KJV...I am surprised that you do not own it. Zhodiates is far more advanced than Strongs...it describes and breaks meanings of words down by what part of speech they are being used in, and in what sense they are used in each verse in wehich they appear..
I am a bit of a disadvantage here Perry, as I don't have any of the reference sources you mentioned above......excepting the Bible. And as I read Jn 17, purpose certainly seems to be the underlying message of the oneness of God with his Son and
ourselves. However, I do have a non-LDS work, THE INTERPRETERS ONE-VOLUME COMMENTARY ON THE BIBLE. May I assume that meets with your approval? Let me in part quote from it in reference to Jn 17......
Please do not assume that anything meets with my approval, especially since I do not knwo who wrote this volume and what their objective with it was.
"But the last and the eternally continuing prayer of Jesus is that the unity of love AND PURPOSE he has with his Father will be reflected in the unity of the church in himself, and that the mission he received and fulfilled from his Father will be the
same mission of all who find joy fulfilled in his discipleship throughout all times and ages." pg 724
I'm at a bit of a loss how to proceed from here, Perry. The above commentary clearly describes purpose as being an integral definition of the oneness described by the Lord in ch 17. If you disagree, please explain why?
Purpose is part of the picture, but there is an aspect of their unity that you have been not able to understand, even though you admit that it has been explained to you for 3-4 years by several TT'rs, including me. When the Holy Spirit chooses to reveal it to you, you will see it.
Perry
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