Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Kevin Deegan wrote:DAVEH: Am I losing you on this one, Kevin? Let me put it another way. Jesus is the Son of [an exalted] Man [of Holiness] who remained in heaven when Jesus came to the earth. Does that help?
Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Kevin Deegan wrote:Be glad to discuss this with you.To start let's look at John chapter 3 verse 13And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
Do you agree:1) Jesus was the one who said thisDAVEH: Yes.
KD says OK
2) Jesus is the "Son of Man"DAVEH: Yes again.
KD says OK
Do you believe Jesus is literally the Son of Man, Kevin? Was Jesus the son of a woman? Yes, I think you would believe so as well. Then do you believe Son of Man and son of woman are synonymous, Kevin?KD says WOOOOAH!
DAVEH: To me it seems simple....Jesus is the Son of Man. You apparently agree with that. You just think the Man part applies to his earthly heritage. I believe the Man refers to his Heavenly Father's heritage, as his Father in Heaven is a Holy Man who is exalted.Do you believe Jesus' Father in Heaven is a man? I suspect not..... Then why do you think he was considered the Son of Man? Could his father be a man?
KD says It is too deep for you if you can't even follow this, besides you cahnged the subject
DAVEH: Yes, I have always admitted my LDS bias.Then the question is;Read the verse and tell me:Where was the "Son of Man"?DAVEH: I'd say the Son (Jesus) was on the earth, while the Man (his Father in Heaven) was in heaven. I think that is well illustrated in the baptism of Jesus (Mt 3:17) when.....
Kevin says your Mormon indoctrination is showing.
DAVE: ??? I consider it important to consider what Son of man means. Try separating Son from man. Think of the man part as being a heavenly man, who is exalted rather than a lowly earth type man who is a sinner.let's work on the original subject and I will be glad to revisit this and answer your questions.
Read the verse again: And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
KD says Again WHERE is the son of man NOT who or what is the Son of man
DAVEH: Just consider what Son of Man implies. I believe it is suggesting that Jesus has a divine heritage that comes from a holy man....his Father in Heaven.Who came down from Heaven? Who will ascend? Who is IN Heaven? The SUBJECT of this English sentence is the "Son of Man" Jesus Christ
DAVEH: I am suggesting you ponder if he didn't really mean it to be understood as.......Hint: the son of man came down to earth and stands speaking saying the son of man is in heaven.
And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of [that holy exalted] man which is [remaining] in heaven.DAVEH: I respectfully disagree, Kevin. IF he were EVERYWHERE Present, then why did he descend into hell after his death?.....or, why did he ascend up to heaven after his death? If he were already there, would it have been necessary for him to either descend, or ascend?Jesus Christ is EVERYWHERE Present
Are there any other passages that you feel validate your theory that God is omnipresent?
And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.
........clearly indicates Jesus' Heavenly Father was the one in heaven, while Jesus was on the earth. Do you disagree, Kevin? If so....do you think Jesus was using a ventriloquism to project the voice from heaven?
BTW........I am very interested to know if you believe Jesus is literally the Son of Man, Kevin. And...how do you contrast that to him being the Son of Woman? Do you believe Jesus' father is a man?
Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Kevin Deegan wrote:DAVEH: I guess you'll have to spell it out for me, Kevin. I see nothing in ch 3 that lends support to your theory.Jesus is Revealed in the Holy Bible as OMNIPRESENTJohn 3 the son of man who came down and yet is IN Heaven
DAVEH: Give me some Bible references, and the let's discuss it.God the Father is Revealed the Holy Bible as OMNIPRESENDoes he not fill Heaven & Earth?These are clear teachings of the Bible
DAVEH: I'll ask you the same question I asked John........How much of what you believe about the omnipresence of God is based on the T-Doctrine?not some Church council or some Prophet.All I need is a 5th grade education so I can read the Old Black Book
Dave Hansen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:In a message dated 1/21/2005 7:24:28 PM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:DAVEH: But why do you define God as omnipresent? Is it due to the T-Doctrine?
DAVEH: ??? Why do you think Jesus is omnipresent
Well, because He is God.
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