Re: [TruthTalk] Eternal Judgment

[Terry Clifton]

[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In a message dated 3/27/2005 4:37:03 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes: The following is a rather involved and technical explanation for Col. 1:15-23.   I sincerely apologize for boring nature of the text.   It is the best that I can do.   All of it is exciting to me  --   and when I preach, the technical element is missing.  This is the kind of study that turns me "on."   And from it comes all manner of practical application.     The Smithmeister to you .     >John Smithson wrote: >>The Message of hope as found in Col 1:17-23 >>is profound and exciting. >>... I am comfortable thinking that YOU can keep >>your sin and still be considered righteous > >Aren't you ignoring some of the content of the very passage that you >referenced?  Paul puts a condition upon our realization of this >reconciliation: My answer to the question, above, is "no," which will come as no surprise to you.  But what may be of some surprise is this:  I did review the passage and my evolving belief concerning it's wording with your question in mind.  Thank you, David Miller.  > >Colossians 1:21-23 >And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked >works, yet now hath he reconciled in the body of His flesh through [His] death... to present you holy and unblameable >and unreproveable in his sight:  If ye continue in the faith... Well, our (yours and mine) theological construct is entirely differeent  --  as different as two world religions.    I am of the unmerited grace based, Jesus-did-it-all religion and you are not.    Each of us own a rather comprehensive and systematic theology that, in and of itself, defies or resists change.   You can pull a stone from under my foundation and the construct, the system, remains in tact because there is much more to the foundation than a single stone.   We are, indeed, worlds apart.   Our gospel is not the same  ----------   but our God is.  And that is important to me.   God does not exist in my definition of Him or in my understanding of His grace and His judgment and His partnership.   He is a sovereign reality.   And, because of that fact, He continues to be the Father of us all.   The short answer to your question is "yes, I do see it differently."   In this passage  (Col 1:15-23 for those of you are following along), I see the fact of reconciliation and the purpose of reconciliation . The fact of reconciliation cannot be separated from the purpose, in my thinking, and the following will demonstrate that point.   But  first, let's establish the fact of reconciliation as present in this passage.         We have no exitence apart from the Creator of the Universe.   We are in Him whether we care to make that admission or not.        John              Nice try, but you are still trying to mix oil with water (truth with blah blah blah) Romans 6 :1-3 says those in Christ do not continue in sin. Romans 8:1 says that those who are in Christ do not walk according to the flesh. Romans 16:7 (pay attention here) says that the apostles were in Christ before Paul was in christ. That means that they were put in Christ at different times, like when they decided to follow Jesus, not when Jesus was on the cross.  Having trouble with that?  Look at 2Cor.5:17 When you are in Christ, you are a new creature.  Old desires have passed away and are replaced by new ones, when you decide to follow Christ.  This did not happen at the cross.  Not everyone has a new nature.  Only those in Christ. Eph. 2:10 We were placed in Christ (dare I mention it ) for GOOD WORKS!   Salvation first, good works second.  He did one, we do the other, IF we are in Christ. So you can plainly see that even though God created us all and loves us all, we are not all in Christ. Terry