I think I meant to type “raped”, and I assume I can include all of us in that.
I’m not defending bad journalists (most on TV) or weak politicians. I am saying Trump is something different. It’s a delusion that better journalists would have prevented Trump. We the people got what we deserved On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 1:25 PM Doug Fields <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > “Who you callin’ ‘we’, Kemosabe?” > > > > > > I’m not familiar with the term “taped” as it applies to intoxicated > people, so I can’t judge there…but many of us (the “we” that apparently > excludes you) absolutely **do** blame journalists and other politicians > for not doing their > > jobs and getting Trumped. Journalists are supposed to hold politicians’ > feet to the fire, and make them accountable for their actions. Politicians > are supposed to work for the betterment of the country and its citizens. > Too many of both groups have been > > shirking those duties for the last four years. > > > > > > Doug Fields > > > Tampa, FL > > > > > > > > *From:* [email protected] <[email protected]> > > *On Behalf Of *PGage > > > *Sent:* Wednesday, September 30, 2020 4:16 PM > > > *To:* [email protected] > > > *Subject:* Re: [TV orNotTV] Debate #1 > > > > > > > > > > I specifically resist your last point. Yes the media is lazy and ratings > driven; yes Democrats are weak and cowardly. Those are serious but baseline > problems. Trump is something qualitatively new and toxic. We don’t blame > intoxicated people > > for getting taped; we don’t blame journalists and other politicians (R & > D) for getting Trumped. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 12:36 PM Kevin M. <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 10:50 AM PGage <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Wallace did reset Biden’s clock several times, but only to get him back > his original 2 minutes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The debate moderator has much less discretion than a K-12 teacher, or any > standard employee. All they can do is whatever the two campaigns agreed to > with the Commission. This was not an episode of Wallace’s Fox News Sunday, > where he would > > have had more discretion. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As I say, the only thing he could have done beyond what he did was tell > Trump if he broke the rules he himself had agreed to one more time, he > (Walllace) was going to end the debate and walk off the stage. Perhaps he > should have, but no > > news person would like to make themselves the center of the story, and > it’s a judgment call if that net benefits Trump anyway. I get why he didn’t > do that. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As you’ve said, except that wasn’t all Wallace could have done. Within the > parameters of the debate rules, his job is to ensure fairness and equal > time for both men. He literally did not moderate; he asked questions then > sat back and did > > nothing. If moderators have no power, as you keep saying, then there are > no moderators... just assholes asking inane questions with no follow-up or > accountability. Last night, Chris Wallace acted like an asshole instead of > acting like a moderator. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > This is why I say the Commission needs to tell both campaigns that > remaining debates will only be held if moderator has the ability to enforce > rules already agreed to by turning off mikes. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will strongly dispute any attempt to spread blame for last night’s shit > show. This was not due to Fox News, the degradations of News by cable tv, > poor journalistic standards, three white old men, reliance on obsolete old > school media > > (all of which And more I have seen blamed). > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The blame for what happened last night is completely and exclusively on > Donald Trump. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Trump was Trump. Neither man on stage with Trump did a damned thing to > stop Trump from being Trump. In much the same way the media and the > Democrats enabled his first term in office, it seems as if they are going > to enable his second term > > as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 8:14 AM Kevin M. <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 7:29 AM PGage <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > But what did he not do that you would have wanted him to do, that he could > have done? As I say, short of walking off the stage, I don’t think there is > anything. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > As a former teacher, there are basic skills that can be used to get even > the most recalcitrant child in line. As a former Hollywood flunkie, there > are basic skills that can be used to coax even the most entitled prig to > take direction. > > It isn’t that Trump does whatever he wants or says whatever he wants... he > doesn’t. The one thing he wanted last night was to be the center of > attention. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > California labor law is quite clear that all employees be given ten > uninterrupted minutes of break time for every four hours worked. If I’m on > my sixth minute of a break, and the boss asks me a work-related question, > the clock is reset > > and I get ten minutes starting from whenever the boss is done talking to > me. All Wallace had to do, the first time Trump interrupted Biden, was to > reset Biden’s two minute clock. Give Biden more uninterrupted time. Make > Biden the center of attention longer; > > Trump would have capitulated. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The problem is not that Trump doesn’t play by the rules; it’s that nobody > (especially the Democrats) makes him play by the rules. There were a dozen > other different things Wallace could have done, and even a few things Biden > could have > > done, but instead Trump was Trump. And America is all the worse because of > it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 7:19 AM Kevin M. <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Sep 30, 2020 at 3:54 AM Doug Eastick <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I watched it. Actually the whole family sat down to watch it. Fifteen > minutes in, one left the room. 60 minutes in, two others left the room. > > > > > > > > > > > > Dana Bash of CNN called it a "shit show". > > > > > > > Indeed it was. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chris Wallace failed, badly, as well. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Chris Wallace failed so badly that Mike Wallace also failed, and he’s been > dead eight years > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed., Sep. 30, 2020, 12:38 a.m. Kevin M., <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > > > > I’m willing to entertain those still of the opinion that the debates are > useful for undecided voters, or that they help raise awareness of issues or > policy ideas. But I endured the entire debate tonight, so I’ve got to tell > you, if you’re > > going to defend debates after tonight, you’d better come loaded for bear. > Because whatever that goatf*ck was, it served no purpose; it wasn’t even > good theater. It was like watching The View, if after watching The View I > was then forced to vote for either > > Joy Behar or Maghan McCain. -- > > > > > Kevin M. (RPCV) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "TVorNotTV" group. > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to > > [email protected]. > > > > > > > > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKgmY4BFJ8JxG9HOWiwFBQ13pu0fbrAwBUGm5682a4%2Bu%3DnZpOQ%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKgmY4BFJ8JxG9HOWiwFBQ13pu0fbrAwBUGm5682a4%2Bu%3DnZpOQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "TVorNotTV" group. > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to > > [email protected]. > > > > > > > > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAK5Q1Boy%3DCGp35JbHXhvgwUp-zhgQcL_QfTbfGj4tf4J4F8oJg%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAK5Q1Boy%3DCGp35JbHXhvgwUp-zhgQcL_QfTbfGj4tf4J4F8oJg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Kevin M. (RPCV) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "TVorNotTV" group. > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to > > [email protected]. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKgmY4D7yw_Ed%2B4eUDn7TJmbeFHkuM6pzc18bac8rq1Pvmos8Q%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKgmY4D7yw_Ed%2B4eUDn7TJmbeFHkuM6pzc18bac8rq1Pvmos8Q%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Sent from Gmail Mobile > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "TVorNotTV" group. > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to > > [email protected]. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKGtkYJ%2Bb%2BiKZoxfnEdMYKg6UYhNeO307YyXtn_oQ%3DYRj%3DVraw%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKGtkYJ%2Bb%2BiKZoxfnEdMYKg6UYhNeO307YyXtn_oQ%3DYRj%3DVraw%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Kevin M. (RPCV) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "TVorNotTV" group. > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to > > [email protected]. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKgmY4C4xMhQZ-A0yK30Lw2CVnZyv_yjY1PrS8R5gozLo-kQ%2BQ%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKgmY4C4xMhQZ-A0yK30Lw2CVnZyv_yjY1PrS8R5gozLo-kQ%2BQ%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Sent from Gmail Mobile > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > > > > > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "TVorNotTV" group. > > > > > > > > > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to > > [email protected]. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > To view this discussion on the web visit > > > > > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKGtkYKMqxxsR_Qtx51fE1rQnpDDO8ionVZqqKk9o0nxNHTbmg%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tvornottv/CAKGtkYKMqxxsR_Qtx51fE1rQnpDDO8ionVZqqKk9o0nxNHTbmg%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Kevin M. 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