The SDO stuff (that was originally WDO) seems to be more related to the service engine in OFBiz than to the entity engine. I might be misunderstanding that though...
Whatever the case, what is it that you like about SDO, or how does it make your life easier? -David On Mar 11, 2010, at 6:43 PM, Rodrigo Lima wrote: > Hi David, > > I believe it is worth following in a path parallel to the Entity Engine, > which already has its > value and trust already established. > A model that looks interesting data model would be to create a layer as the > SDO (Service Data Objects http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Service_Data_Objects) > to > services layer, which could easily be used by various technologies UI Tier. > > A great detail is the question of objects typed and untyped. > > Some might say that this issue is easily solved with Web Services, however, > in practice, it is not so simple for many platforms. > > Regards, > > Rodrigo > > > 2010/3/11 Nicolas Malin <[email protected]> > >> -1 >> >> BJ, Ruth, >> >> Saying that OFBiz should move in the same way that other projects is a bit >> stupid, and show that you've not fully understand OFBiz and the entity >> engine. >> It is now 7 years I'm working on OFBiz, and I have made the same error at >> the beginning as others, I did'nt understood at the moment the beauty of the >> entityengine. >> Looking back at my hard start, I'm glad having done this error, and now >> more than mastering the entity engine, and all its abilities in tems of >> connections, abstractions, and more. >> The only fault I found was on huge customers projects where there were big >> business needs. >> >> At LibrenBerry and Nereide, we've then added generators to fill the gap, >> and this remove nothing from the entity-engine capabilities, but add more >> smoothness in its use. The combination form/screen/minilang is as strong as >> before and more stronger. For big business needs, where java is needed, the >> generated code is more reliable (who never has made on error on Strings ?). >> for an example, you can take a look to neogia accounting code, to see how >> entity-engine and code generation combination is valuable. >> >> From our side, it is sure that helping development by generation is not >> revolutionizing OFBiz, and should not do it, noone told to replace >> entity-engine with hibernate. >> Generation is adding a bigger flexibility and a more reliable product. >> >> From my point of view, OFBiz is more than just an ERP. It is also a strong >> base for any project, from the small ones to the big ones. Adding MDA tools >> in its data model can only be a good thing. >> >> Cheers, >> Nicolas >> >> Ruth Hoffman a écrit : >> >> +1 >>> Thank you BJ. >>> Ruth >>> ---------------------------------------------------- >>> Find me on the web at http://www.myofbiz.com or Google keyword "myofbiz" >>> [email protected] >>> >>> BJ Freeman wrote: >>> >>>> Let me ask this, if all these other approaches are better why is there >>>> not a application like ofbiz done in them, without using ofbiz at all? >>>> >>>> I keep getting the feeling that those that want major changes don't >>>> really understand the design goals of ofbiz. >>>> >>>> ======================= >>>> >>>> BJ Freeman >>>> http://bjfreeman.elance.com >>>> Strategic Power Office with Supplier Automation < >>>> http://www.businessesnetwork.com/automation/viewforum.php?f=93> >>>> Specialtymarket.com <http://www.specialtymarket.com/> >>>> >>>> Systems Integrator-- Glad to Assist >>>> >>>> Chat Y! messenger: bjfr33man >>>> Linkedin >>>> < >>>> http://www.linkedin.com/profile?viewProfile=&key=1237480&locale=en_US&trk=tab_pro> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> [email protected] sent the following on 3/11/2010 8:50 AM: >>>> >>>> >>>>> While reading the sentence "There are many people out there who don't >>>>> understand the Entity Engine", I felt a problem implied in it: There are >>>>> absolutely much more people "out there", and I'm sure the OFBIZ project >>>>> want to attract them in. Why they keep on asking "Hibernate", "Spring", >>>>> etc, though? Are they all wrong? >>>>> >>>>> In my opinion, the OFBIZ framework DID do a right thing - to provide >>>>> developers an integrated framework. What I mean is in OFBIZ, the >>>>> developer can define entity in one place and share the entity definition >>>>> across different tiers, form persistence to presentation. This kind of >>>>> integration saved developers a lot from typings and preserved >>>>> consistency across different application tiers. But, this is not what >>>>> Entity Engine itself can provide. All gains come from the integration. >>>>> If we simply separate the OFBIZ entity engine into a stand alone ORM >>>>> like tool, I bet its not very attractive and only people familiar with >>>>> OFBIZ already will use it. >>>>> On the other hand, if there are another framework such as Grails that >>>>> can provide at least same level of cross tier integration ability, while >>>>> leverage the sophisticated and WELL KNOWN technologies (such as >>>>> Hibernate/JPA for ORM, Spring for service tier component composition, >>>>> Spring MVC for view tier framework). Sounds a little bit attractive than >>>>> "home made" every thing, isn't it? >>>>> >>>>> Regards, >>>>> Miles. >>>>> >>>>> On Thu, 2010-03-11 at 10:23 -0500, Ruth Hoffman wrote: >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Hi David: >>>>>> >>>>>> Nothing! I think this is an amazing piece of work. IMO, there are many >>>>>> people out there who don't understand the Entity Engine value >>>>>> proposition. >>>>>> That is why they keep asking for "Hibernate" etc. >>>>>> >>>>>> Here's some things I'd consider as additions: >>>>>> >>>>>> * Maybe making a separate component/webapp to manage the Entity >>>>>> Engine. Take it out of WebTools. >>>>>> * Include in that webapp any security/role management specific to >>>>>> the Entity Engine. >>>>>> * Entity Engine performance tools (or more information on how to use >>>>>> existing tools). >>>>>> * Better backup tools (or more information on how to use existing >>>>>> tools). >>>>>> >>>>>> More to come... >>>>>> Ruth >>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------- >>>>>> Find me on the web at http://www.myofbiz.com or Google keyword >>>>>> "myofbiz" >>>>>> [email protected] >>>>>> >>>>>> David E Jones wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> If you could change anything about the data tier in OFBiz (basically >>>>>>> the Entity Engine), what would you change? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> All comments are welcome. If there is another tool you'd like to see >>>>>>> used instead of the Entity Engine, please describe what you like about >>>>>>> it >>>>>>> (like "I want to have an Java class for each table in my database") >>>>>>> instead >>>>>>> of just mentioning the tool (like "let's use Hibernate!"). >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Why am I asking? This topic comes up every once in a while, and it's >>>>>>> true that many suggestions never get enough support to actually happen >>>>>>> (or >>>>>>> on further research it is decided that the idea is not tenable), but >>>>>>> brainstorming about them to get ideas in the open is still a great >>>>>>> thing. >>>>>>> The history of OFBiz is full of things like this where users and more >>>>>>> casual >>>>>>> contributors had ideas and saw possibilities that others, even more >>>>>>> involved >>>>>>> contributors, totally missed or never looked at that way. What I think >>>>>>> would >>>>>>> be fun, and ultimately useful too, is to keep this mostly to >>>>>>> brainstorming >>>>>>> and not do too much comparing of ideas. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> BTW, if you want to brainstorm about another tier (ie the Logic or UI >>>>>>> tiers) please use the other threads on those. If you'd like to discuss >>>>>>> things that aren't specific to a tier look for the "General" thread. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -David >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> >> -- >> Nicolas MALIN >> Consultant >> Tél : 06.17.66.40.06 >> Site projet : http://www.neogia.org/ >> ------- >> Société LibrenBerry >> Tél : 02.48.02.56.12 >> Site : http://www.librenberry.net/ >> >>
