On Nov 2, 2010, at 11:12 PM, Jerome Velociter wrote:
> Hi Vincent, all,
>
> See below
>
> On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 10:46 PM, Vincent Massol <[email protected]> wrote:
>>
>> On Nov 2, 2010, at 7:47 PM, Thibaut Camberlin wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 3:05 PM, Jerome Velociter <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Actually I've been thinking maybe we could provide a Macros/ space
>>>> with XE. The home page would be a improved version of the current
>>>> XWiki.WikiMacros page (adding for example a ClassSheet for macros, a
>>>> form to create a new macro, some documentation, etc.)
>>>>
>>>> WDYT?
>>>>
>>>
>>> This polishing would empower a standard user to use this XWiki advanced
>>> feature.
>>
>> I don't quite agree. Standard users shouldn't see this space. it's something
>> technical and 99% of wiki users don't want/need to see it (and they won't
>> even understand it). So for me this space would need to be hidden from
>> simple users (same as for other tech spaces).
>
> Then we should probably hide them from the WYSIWYG tooIbar too, I guess ;)
>
> Seriously, the space could be blacklisted, but it should be discussed,
> I'm not sure we want to have only admins seing it (personally I see
> that space as being "documentation on macros existing in the wiki"
> before being "a place to create new macros" - so not so technical in
> the end).
The reason is simple. Most people come to the wiki as a place where to find
information (not as contributors) and they'll see the list of spaces listed on
the home page mixed with spaces containing real content for that wiki. All I
want is a separation between "business content" and technical content. I'm fine
if we have 2 space lists on the home page, one for each type of content. But I
really don't like to mix the two kind of content.
> Maybe in some distant future we should have an intermediary level
> between "Normal users" and "Admins". BTW do users that chose to be
> "Advanced Users" in their profile see the blacklisted spaces ?
yes.
> Maybe
> the intermediary level could be this one.
I don't think we need one ATM.
>> I'm not sure what the proposal is about exactly.
>
> Well it's not a proposal yet, rather an idea.
>
>> Some open questions: Would the macros stay where they are currently located?
>
> If you ask me some should be moved already (like {{spaces}} and
> {{tags}}), since they are located in documents that already have
> another purpose, and thus can not benefit from a potential
> WikiMacroClassSheet (that for example could display the usage of the
> macro and its parameters ; thus becoming a sort of self-contained
> documentation for the held macro)
Well I'm not sure. IMO the dashboard should be moved to a dashboard application
and that spaces macro could be moved to that dashboard application.
Recent Activity should be moved to an Activity application too and the activity
macro there too.
Basically I still believe strongly that we need to list all our default XE
pages and assign them an application. I had done that exercise one and created
the jira components in XE asa result. Maybe we should revisit this and do this
mapping now?
>> Shouldn't macros stay with their apps?
>
> Yes they should.
> Right now we don't even have a rule for where to put applications
> documents (in their own space ? with a Code suffix ? in the XWiki
> space ? somewhere else ?)
Yes we need to define that too. We've been quite poor in term of wiki content
organization and as a result I feel that our default wiki content is a bit of a
disorganized mess. We should improve. Want to lead a proposal?
> I think the (not existing) UI at Macros.WebHome should retrieve and
> list documents from the entire wiki, not just the Macros space.
I agree
> Same
> as the scheduler (I changed that behavior just recently by the way - I
> wanted my application scheduler jobs in my application space, not in
> the Scheduler space - see http://jira.xwiki.org/jira/browse/XASCH-56)
Yep seen that and I agree.
>> Does it mean a new platform/application in svn?
>
> There is already one : the "wikibridge" I think, with just one
> document now (the name is not correct though, I agree)
Agree, it's a good place and it should be renamed or merged with another app,
all depending if we find that there are macros that don't belong to any
specific app.
>> What macros go there? When do we use wiki macros vs java macros (we haven't
>> really decided on this I think)?
>
> I'm quite sure you will not agree, but I would say generic (i.e. not
> tied to a particular application) wiki macros could go there. For
> example {{spaces /}} or even {{activity /}} which goes beyond just the
> dashboard app.
See comment above about the dashboard and activity apps.
>> Will java macros also be listed on that home page (they should IMO)?
>
> Yes they should. Maybe not under the exact same form, but they
> definitely should be listed and documented here
>
>>
>> Generally speaking I'm rather +1 (I'd like macros to stay in their apps
>> though).
>
> Cool. I'm +1 too and +1 to have the possibility for apps to bring
> their own macros.
Let's continue this discussion.
Thanks
-Vincent
>
> Jerome.
>
>>
>> Thanks
>> -Vincent
>>
>> PS: I didn't even know about
>> http://localhost:8080/xwiki/bin/view/XWiki/WikiMacros ;) I wonder why it's
>> not already using a livetable....
>>
>>> Here is my +1.
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jerome
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 2:03 PM, Arnaud bourree <[email protected]>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 2010/11/2 Thomas Mortagne <[email protected]>:
>>>>>> On Tue, Nov 2, 2010 at 10:14, Caleb James DeLisle
>>>>>> <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>>>>> If you're contributing a macro then just log in and fgo to this page.
>>>>>>> http://code.xwiki.org/xwiki/bin/view/Macros/CreateMacro
>>>>>>> It will put the macro in the Macros space and automatically add it to
>>>> the index.
>>>>>>> Thanks for contributing to code.xwiki.org ;)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think Thomas was talking about his how macro space, not where to put
>>>>>> contributed macro documentation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Yes, thanks Thomas,
>>>>> I decided to used Macros space.
>>>>>
>>>>> Arnaud.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Caleb
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 11/02/2010 04:57 AM, Arnaud bourree wrote:
>>>>>>>> 2010/11/2 Caleb James DeLisle <[email protected]>:
>>>>>>>>> In your own wiki I think you want to put macros in a space where you
>>>> will be able to find them
>>>>>>>>> easily. The XWiki space is full of important internals and I wouldn't
>>>> recommend putting any macros
>>>>>>>>> in there.
>>>>>>>>> "Macros" sounds like a fine choice.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I ask question more for macro we contribute to
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Arnaud.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Caleb
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 11/02/2010 04:40 AM, Arnaud bourree wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Where is the best space to put macros?
>>>>>>>>>> I check in some macro from code.xwiki.org, and find that macros are
>>>>>>>>>> commonly put in XWiki, Macros or Macro space.
>>>>>>>>>> I've a preference for Macros as it self explanatory and I think
>>>> XWiki
>>>>>>>>>> space more dedicated to XE pages.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> What do you think?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Regards,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Arnaud.
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