This is not a question of throwing away good data.
It is a question of throwing away junk data and getting good data. Geeze Louise Rothwells fallback argument is his electric teapot - and as for serious science he is content with clamp meters instead of power analyzers and thermocouples instead of RTDs and datalogging LOL. Enough of this nonsense we will resume this debate when we get expert opinion, not dependent on second hand estimates and meaningless anecdote a tempest in a teapot and decaf to boot. Jones From: Jed Rothwell Jones Beene wrote: I don't know understand why there seems to be such resistance to the gain in this device being "only" in the range of COP 3-6 ? There is resistance because we do not think you can casually throw away calorimetry and pretend that industrial techniques and equipment such as water heaters in widespread use do not work. You can't just make things up! There is also resistance because you are claiming the error is by a factor of a thousand. You are also claiming that experts in measuring energy are making idiotic mistakes. If they can make idiotic mistakes, and if calorimetry is as unreliable as you claim, then we have no reason to think there is any excess heat at all. If they can be off by a factor of 1000, leaving practically no heat, they can just as easily be off by a factor of 1006, leaving no heat at all. Heck it could be endothermic. In any case, what you are describing could not be measured. Input power is 80 W. If output was 80 W * 6 = 480 W, given the flow rate of 1 L/s the Delta T temperature would be 0.11°C which would hardly register with this equipment. You can sure of a temperature 50 times greater than that, but 0.11 would be within the fluctuations and other noise. Or do you suppose the flow rate was hundred of times less than they measured, and less than the flowmeter registered? Or did the thermocouples suddenly register wrong, after showing the same temperatures (zero Delta T) before the machine was turned on? You cannot propose any reason how such a large error can occur. The fact that some "expert" who has never looked at a teapot or water heater thinks there may be something wrong theoretically is no proof of anything. - Jed
