Howdy Fran!
Yes, the demo was good, and the reversal of the piston was interesting; seemed to be 'pulled' down to some degree and if that is the case, then there is a physical expansion and contraction going on with the gasses. It was good that they took it apart to show how simple the thing really is. The video link I supplied is a much better video of just how simple it is inside. no details on the electronics, nor how the coil is wound. As for possible theoretical mechanisms. that's what we're here for (as he wipes the drool from his chin with a shirt sleeve)! What purpose does the coil play? Creating an intense mag-field to align the plasma ions? There are two sets of electrical contacts: - Electrodes - Anode and Cathode I know that sounds redundant, but that was Rohner's jargon. If I remember correctly, the anode/cathode are there to supply a (DC?) current AFTER the electrodes spark and 'energize' the plasma. guess it's time to look at the patents, if they've been published. Is the spark discharge creating the plasma, and then one gets a DC current flow across the anode/cathode? The spark is NOT for combustion, so it must be meant to have some kind of effect on the ions/free electrons? This is a hoot! All these technologies (CF, Papp, and who knows what's next, Hutchinson Effect!) mired in obscurity for many decades, and they all get credibility and (hopefully) commercialization in a year or three!!! At least it occurred before we passed on, but it sure would have been great if the lost ol'timer Vorts could have been here to watch this unfold. Hey, has anyone ever thought of holding a Vortex-l union??? Can't really call it a 'reunion' since I don't think there's ever been a union! J -Mark From: Roarty, Francis X [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 7:45 PM To: [email protected] Subject: RE: [Vo]:Noble Gas Plasma Engine Mark, I had similar apprehension but the demonstration itself was pretty convincing -I don't think the energy consumption of the ignition ckt was much different open air vs driving a weight up and I agree with Rhoner that the instant reversal of the piston ahead of the weight as the gases contract is telling us something - I don't agree anything is necessarily being consumed even from a nuclear perspective as McKubre is suggesting but would posit this is the same catalytic/Casimir geometry we see in the Mills/Rossi designs.only the medium has changed such that we have anomalous displacement / expansion of gas instead of temperature changes but it is still all just manipulating the variables in gas law - where Mills and Rossi contain the PV forcing t to change this device contains Pt forcing the v to change. We have all been told that the random motion of gas is due to VP fluctuations below the plank scale [HUP] and are not exploitable but I am convinced that Casimir geometry accumulates and segregates the isotropy such that these zero point fluctuations can be exploited by gas atoms exposed to these regions in a biased manner. IMHO The plasma forms layers like the argon layers Rhoner makes mention of that are in constant motion with trapped ions in between forming dynamic menisci of Casimir geometry that constantly alter the fractional [inverse Rydberg] state of the ions .. you can take your pick after that whether it be Mills like hydrino ions in collision, Haisch - Moller Lamb Pinch, or something similar to the MAHG oscilation between bond states only with noble gas I guess this would be between ionic and noble states. Fran From: MarkI-ZeroPoint [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 9:54 PM To: [email protected] Subject: EXTERNAL: RE: [Vo]:Noble Gas Plasma Engine I'm glad I watched that video to the end, because the first half brought back bad memories! I and many Vorts have been following the fringe sci/tech world for decades, and the first half of this presentation was VERY poor. reminds me of the charlatans which showed up at the Tesla Society conferences with their overunity device or whatever, and when their presentation came up, it was, "aaahh shucks, I was testing the device this morning and something went pop and I must have burned something out! And we didn't bring any spare parts. ; So we won't be able to demonstrate the overunity device, but we will do the presentation and there are books and CDs if you want more details." That's why I gave up on that venue 20 years ago. there might have been a few individuals that had useful stuff, but 90+% was BS. This looked pretty painful for McKubre! His body language and facial expressions did not look real relaxed at first. I bet this was so much different from a room full of PhDs, and *not* in a good way professionally speaking, that he felt his reputation was suffering! I don't blame him. the problems with microphones, with the slide presentation and with the non-playing videos, were so amateurish they would make any professional eng ineer/scientist cringe! I know I did, more than once. It wasn't until the last few minutes that McKubre provided some history of how he got involved, and that is when I felt the time spent watching it was worth it. He chose his words carefully as a good scientist will do, but, **he seemed to be quite sure that this was also a very important and new kind of phenomenon**. I applaud Rohner for his efforts and openness to demo this thing, and for McKubre to even show up and more or less vouch for this kind of thing. 20 years ago, it would have been a career limiting move! The operation of this device is quite intriguing, especially the video with Rohner and Dannel Roberts in Rohner's shop. they use a pneumatic cylinder at 120psi (??) for measuring the force, and it is substantial. See this link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zWJNyoFgJM <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zWJNyoFgJM&feature=plcp> &feature=plcp This is the kind of thin g that causes Vorts to start salivating! Looking fwd to some discussions about this thing. -Mark Iverson From: Axil Axil [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, August 08, 2012 2:59 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [Vo]:Noble Gas Plasma Engine http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPY0skKjJU8 <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZPY0skKjJU8&feature=player_detailpage> &feature=player_detailpage Rohnermachine.com Mike and John are the two Rohber brothers who are competing in the development of the Papp engine. John is developing a two cylinder horizontally opposed version of the engine. John does not demo his version of the engine as a business decision but Bob does do demos. The video shows the Tesla 2012 demo whose YouTube link is listed above. In it, McKubre is bearing witness as Mike Rohner rambles on about Papp technology. Mike Rohber provides incite into Papp's motivations and business thinking which are interesting. The demo shows the device that McKubre used to appraise the Papp reaction in a 20 minute private evaluation with Mike. At 1: 03 into the long video, McKubre states his position as an advocate of the Papp engine stating th at it is based on a nuclear process. McHubre sites Cecil Baumgartner a first hand witness to the Feynman test for his initial interest in the engine. A first hand eye witness to the Dr. Rickard P. Feynman ill fated demo said Dr. Feynman actually kills that poor unlucky by-stander when he pulled the power plug which in tern disables the control electronics on the Papp engine and the engine over-revs. The engine eventually blows a rod the killed the guy. Cal Tech removed all records of the incident to protect Feynman and so died the Papp engine in the science community. As a personal opinion, McKubre deserves some credit, He has a open mind and is not fixated on the deuterium LENR reaction. Cheers: Axil
