The justification of " body of volunteers from across the Movement who have joined the Committee from various projects and who have a wide range of experience across opportunities and challenges when Wikimedia groups gather and formalize" indicates that *any body of volunteers* can "pilot".
At the moment I suppose that you should indicate why Affcom is better than any other body of volunteers because, as I said, *there are some barriers to enter in the Affcom* and these barriers don't assure a real variety of experiences. Specifically I have doubts that Affcom is better than any body of volunteers. Kind regards On Sun, Jul 17, 2022 at 1:43 PM Wojciech Pędzich <wpedz...@gmail.com> wrote: > Dear all, > > AffCom’s response here is to a specific Hub pilot project, not necessarily > the long-term future of Hubs, and hence the initial statement published on > July 11. AffCom is comprised of a body of volunteers from across the > Movement who have joined the Committee from various projects and who have a > wide range I suppose that you should of experience across opportunities and > challenges when Wikimedia groups gather and formalize. > > We do not see the situation in which Hubs are emerging as any threat to > the communities that already exist. Hubs, in their structure, can be seen > as a variety of affiliates who are gathering together to create something > new. In this manner, AffCom is definitely in a position to help Hubs grow > and prosper. While structures similar to the current discussion on Hubs > have previously existed, there is an advantage in having Hubs work > officially as structures similar to Affiliates, and this is where the word > “pilot” comes in. This is intended to indicate the beginning of having Hubs > as established structures with the current infrastructure of communities > that already exists. > > Kind regards > Wojciech, on behalf of AffCom > W dniu 12.07.2022 o 11:13, Gnangarra pisze: > > As hubs are not replacing the relationship between affiliates and affcom, > hubs purpose is to serve its community across multiple countries. I can > see the value in Affcom sharing some of its experiences but I caution > against the building of deeper power structures that widen the gap between > individual contributors, the BOT, and the WMF. That gap will get even > wider once the global council is put in place, there are already > significant communication problems, made worse by the lack of project > experience within the WMF staff, its contractors, and the BOT > > For many years these hubs have successfully existed outside Affcom > control, I think there should be greater respect shown to hubs for that > work treating hubs as pilots is itself disrespectful. Outside of Europe > where EU law allows cross border responsibility, hubs governance structures > face considerable legal hurdles from insurance to individuals being > required to make themselves subject to the laws of another jurisdiction to > hold a position of responsibility. > > <edit conflict with Ilario Valdelli> > >> This discussion should be naturally a discussion done by the community >> and not by the Affcom itself, naturally, like it's happening for the whole >> strategy. > > I wholeheartedly support this point, these discussions need to run > independent Affcom. > > On Tue, 12 Jul 2022 at 16:34, Philip Kopetzky <philip.kopet...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Hi Wojciech, >> >> thanks for this statement, it will definitely be helpful to have AffCom's >> insights into the current affiliates network when talking about hubs. While >> approval by the WMF BoT is one option, wouldn't that require a hub to be a >> formal organisation? Otherwise the BoT would be involved in micro-managing >> project grants that are funding some of the hub pilots. >> >> It would also be helpful to design the process in a way that has the >> Global Council in mind where in its absence the WMF BoT acts in its >> absence, to make clear that this is only a temporary solution because of >> how slow progress on the movement charter has been in the last two years. >> >> Best, >> Philip >> >> On Mon, 11 Jul 2022 at 20:54, Wojciech Pędzich <wpedz...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> During the strategic meeting of the Affiliations Committee (AffCom) in >>> Paris on June 24-26, members discussed how AffCom may be able to support >>> the movement in relation to the upcoming Hubs pilot process. We reviewed >>> two issues – whether it was within AffCom’s remit to contribute to the >>> Hub pilot process and if so, what our involvement might look like. >>> >>> AffCom has, since its inception in 2004, worked directly with all >>> Affiliates across the movement, i.e.: User Groups, Chapters, and >>> Thematic Organizations. Our role, as it has evolved, is to support these >>> different entities as they come into being and then as they grow, ensure >>> that they integrate best practices and with a view to long-term >>> sustainability. This has provided AffCom with both a broad overview, as >>> well as a deep understanding, of the various challenges faced by >>> affiliates across a range of circumstances that include socio-cultural >>> issues and affiliate-based conflicts. Hubs are intended to function as >>> formal movement bodies constituted by existing groups and/or affiliates, >>> able to use Wikimedia trademarks to present their association. They >>> will need to be independent, legally constituted Affiliates, recognised >>> by the Board of Trustees. This introduces a significant and exciting new >>> Affiliate model to our movement and AffCom would welcome the opportunity >>> to bring our institutional knowledge and experience to assist in their >>> development. >>> >>> Recognising the principles of subsidiarity, the committee would like to >>> offer its support as an advisory body for the Hubs piloting process, >>> working with the community to develop a process that will lead, >>> ultimately, to their approval by the WMF Board of Trustees. >>> >>> >>> Wojciech Pędzich >>> on behalf of AffCom >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines >>> at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >>> Public archives at >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/JKTUL7UPO3U37WNFF4B4B5SNDTXFR62P/ >>> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines >> at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >> Public archives at >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/MB7HVIYRYFYUASIWCI4QHJIFSJJ64SD6/ >> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org > > > > -- > GN. > > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > Public archives at > https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/C5UW7BI6TBKEHSPIKXFSXEJMXQ7HJLPI/ > To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines > at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > Public archives at > https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/MZ5WFYCUZ6BIYO42TA6K7HV2UVBHJX5Z/ > To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org -- Ilario Valdelli Wikimedia CH Verein zur Förderung Freien Wissens Association pour l’avancement des connaissances libre Associazione per il sostegno alla conoscenza libera Switzerland - 8008 Zürich Wikipedia: Ilario <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Ilario> Skype: valdelli Tel: +41764821371 http://www.wikimedia.ch
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