On 23 May 2014, at 03:11, Gergo Tisza <gti...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

> On Wed, May 7, 2014 at 9:29 AM, Krinkle <krinklem...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> A rough timeline:
>> * 12 May 2014 (1.24wmf4 [9]): Phase 1 – Instrumentation and logging
>> starts. This
>>  will run for 4 weeks (until June 9).
>> * 19 May 2014 (1.24wmf5): Phase 2 – "Upgrade and Migrate". This will run
>> for 3
>>  weeks (upto June 9). The instrumentation continues during this period.
>> * 1 June 2014 (1.24wmf7) Finalise upgrade.
>> (...)
>> Q: When will the upgrade happen?
>> A: In the next few weeks, once we are happy that the impact is reasonably
>> low.
>> An update will be sent to wikitech-l just before this is done as a final
>> reminder.
>> This will be well before the MediaWiki 1.24 branch point for extension
>> authors
>> looking to maintain compatibility.
> I'm not sure this decision makes sense. This would mean that 1.23 shipped
> with jQuery 1.8 and 1.24 will ship with jQuery 1.11, without the backwards
> compatibility plugin. I don't see how this helps extension authors, and it
> will be a nuisance for wiki webmasters who will have to deal with the
> breakage of all the not-so-well maintained extensions, without any
> transition period where they could identify and fix/replace them, when they
> do the 1.23 -> 1.24 upgrade. There should be a major version which includes
> the migration plugin.

I disagree. These jQuery features were deprecated many years ago.

jQuery.browser was deprecated in 1.3.0[1][2]
* 2009-01 (over 5 years ago)
* MediaWiki 1.16 shipped jQuery v1.3.2

jQuery#live was deprecated in 1.7.0[3][4]
* 2011-11 (over 2 years ago)
* MediaWiki 1.19 shipped jQuery 1.7.1

Etc. etc.

They've been deprecated for a long time now (at least one or three major 
releases). So it's not like it all came out of nowhere. These are not 
deprecations, it's the removal of deprecated features.

MediaWiki 1.24 is a major release and this major change (potentially breaking 
change) has appropriate release notes.  I don't think there is an obligation 
here to maintain compatibility with extensions yet another release.

Extensions are branched at the same time as core. There is no assumption that 
an unmaintained extension will remain working with a newer MediaWiki core 
version (practically every release we have a few minor breaking changes that 
require changes to extensions, this is no different).

Also, shipping with the Migrate extension is essentially just shipping the old 
version of jQuery. We've been doing that already since MediaWiki 1.21 by simply 
not upgrading jQuery. It's been several releases since; that time is over now.

In addition, I think it's a bad idea to release MediaWiki with the Migrate 
plugin enabled by default. Is an odd environment to provide/support (a bit like 
trying to support IE8 in IE7 compat mode; people have a hard enough time 
already with different IE versions, avoid mutations if possible).

See also my comments on https://gerrit.wikimedia.org/r/#/c/133719/

-- Krinkle

[1] http://blog.jquery.com/2009/01/14/jquery-1-3-released/
[2] http://api.jquery.com/category/deprecated/deprecated-1.3/
[3] http://blog.jquery.com/2011/11/03/jquery-1-7-released/
[4] http://api.jquery.com/category/deprecated/deprecated-1.7/
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