Can you tell me the frequencies in the 6 GHz bands that are desired? Are there any modulation limits, as to bandwidth and power output? What sort of distances are typically involved? A 6 foot dish can push a signal a very long distance or have a very high signal at a shorter distance.
Lonnie On 8/6/05, A. Huppenthal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > $20K is about right for the radios for a licensed path. $500 to $2000 > for the path analysis and license. > > The market has set that price. If 200 ISPs that belong to WISPA > indicated their interest.. Well Lonnie might make them or someone else. > The chipsets are there to operate in those bands, getting the FCC to > allow them to be used in that band is a challenge. > > Whatever anyone wants to say about improve our effiency in using > existing spectrum, we need to be fighting for more at this point, since > there will be a swell of DSL users moving to Fixed wireless over the > next year, as Telcos attempt to dominate that marketplace. Which will > in-turn cause more congestion on the airwaves. That and the > Anti-competitive actions of telcos - pricing below cost, are the two > areas I recommend we all focus on. > > Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 wrote: > > > Last I heard a guy could get a Harris system (both ends, just radios) > > for a shade under $20k. Might be a bit lower now as it's been a > > couple of years. For a 45 meg system that's pretty high by today's > > standards. > > > > Let me say this again guys. We're talking LICENSED bands here. > > Interference isn't an issue no matter what antennas etc. are used. If > > you get interference on YOUR band you can make the other guy stop. > > It's just that simple. > > > > I honestly see few down sides to this idea. > > > > I'd sure like to see more of the 300 or so companies here chime in. > > So far it's looking like 2 to 1 that we do nothing. I must admit I'm > > more than a bit shocked. > > > > Marlon > > (509) 982-2181 Equipment sales > > (408) 907-6910 (Vonage) Consulting services > > 42846865 (icq) And I run my own wisp! > > 64.146.146.12 (net meeting) > > www.odessaoffice.com/wireless > > www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom DeReggi" > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> > > Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 1:46 PM > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] 6 foot 6ghz antenna rule > > > > > >> Marlon and Lonnie, > >> > >> First Off, Lonnie I fully agree with your point that we should not > >> suggest rules that discourage good design or make it to easy to do > >> poor designs. > >> > >> However, saying we don't need more spectrum is rediculous, expecially > >> in these urban areas with lots of competition. We need to gain access > >> to every ounce of spectrum that we can. > >> > >> I FULLY agree with Marlon, that it would be a GREAT idea to find a > >> way to have 6 Ghz more usable for us. It is factual that the 6 foot > >> antenna requirement makes it near impossible for most WISPs to use > >> the band cost effectively. I personally am effected by this and > >> could have need for the band. However doing away with the large > >> antenna rule all togeather I think would be a mistake. A PtP band > >> with safety rules is advantageous. I'd suggest asking to modify the > >> rules to the extent necessary to make it usable for us. For example, > >> what if the min antenna size requirement was reduced down to a 3 ft > >> dish? Thats still down to around 5 degrees, and pretty easy getting > >> approval for a 3 ft dish. > >> > >> Marlon, whats the most cost effective 6 Ghz radios on the market > >> today, excluding the antennas? Just so I understand the ball park we > >> are talking about. When you say Licenced is still twice the cost, > >> that doesn't mean much unless you identify wether you were talking > >> about unlicenced redline or Trango :-) > >> > >> Tom DeReggi > >> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181" > >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >> To: "Lonnie Nunweiler" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "WISPA General > >> List" <[email protected]> > >> Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 11:50 AM > >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 6 foot 6ghz antenna rule > >> > >> > >>> I think you guys are wrong on this. This is still a ptp band and > >>> it's licensed. So interference issues can be dealt with. > >>> > >>> As for links that are not correctly aimed. Why in the world would > >>> we want to give up on what could be a very useful rule change just > >>> because some minority (probably a very small minority) will likely > >>> screw up? > >>> > >>> Think, instead about how nice it would be if the manufacturers could > >>> modify today's relatively cheap 5 gig radios to do 6 gig. It's not > >>> all that much of a leap. But today MANY of you couldn't use that > >>> gear because you'd never be able to mount the antennas. Or because > >>> it's licensed gear it's still nearly twice the cost of unlicensed. > >>> > >>> It's easy to come up with reasons not to make changes. A man once > >>> told me that if no one ever changed we'd still all be eating with > >>> our fingers. Your points are valid but I don't think they are likely > >>> enough to happen that it'll matter. Or we can take steps now to > >>> deal with those issues. Again, it's a licensed band, interference > >>> isn't really an issue. You have protection against that. > >>> > >>> I've got a customer in Fresno that's got no place to go with 2.4 or > >>> 900. He's using VERY high end radios in the 5 gig bands. Even the > >>> big boy toys won't work well anymore. Even ptp links. He's getting > >>> by but it's getting much harder all of the time. He needs the 6 gig > >>> band to pull some ptp links around but can't use them because of the > >>> antenna size issue. > >>> > >>> And lets not forget about the cost part of the mix. 6' antennas are > >>> listing for $1800 in the EC cat without a raydome. That's for a > >>> good Radio Waves unit, but still. > >>> > >>> I really can't see a down side to trying that comes anywhere near > >>> the potential upside. I see a few that don't think it's a good > >>> thing. Do the rest of you agree with that? I happen to think that > >>> anything that gives us more flexibility without letting the bad > >>> people out there do bad things is a good thing to try to do. > >>> > >>> Marlon > >>> (509) 982-2181 Equipment sales > >>> (408) 907-6910 (Vonage) Consulting services > >>> 42846865 (icq) And I run my own > >>> wisp! > >>> 64.146.146.12 (net meeting) > >>> www.odessaoffice.com/wireless > >>> www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lonnie Nunweiler" > >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> > >>> Sent: Thursday, August 04, 2005 9:28 PM > >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] 6 foot 6ghz antenna rule > >>> > >>> > >>> APC is useless if the antennas are not aimed properly or the distance > >>> is excessive for the antenna gain. These conditions will cause the > >>> transmitters to pump out full volume, and if the antennas are your > >>> lower gain variety that means spraying noise everywhere. > >>> > >>> I would recommend leaving the nice tight 6 foot dishes. That simple > >>> rule keeps the band clean for those long distance shots, instead of > >>> polluting it for close in shots. > >>> > >>> You guys have to start asking yourself what you are doing wrong if you > >>> continually need more bands. The growing trend to higher power and > >>> wide beam antennas has to stop. We are now doing a shot with 3 foot > >>> antennas and the CM9 Atheros radios in the 5 GHz band that is just > >>> over 52 miles and pulling -71 to -77 dB (variance through the day), > >>> yet I see people lining and almost drooling for the 400 mW high power > >>> cards. > >>> > >>> In short, most guys have little RF knowledge and they naturally take > >>> the easy way. I would expect to see 400 mW cards and patch antennas > >>> if the rules get changed as you are proposing. > >>> > >>> I say that is a mistake. > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> Lonnie > >>> > >>> > >>> On 8/4/05, Marlon K. Schafer (509) 982-2181 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > >>> wrote: > >>> > >>>> Hi All, > >>>> > >>>> For those that don't know, the 6 gig band is licensed ptp only. > >>>> It's a > >>>> pretty cheap license and you can get a LOT of throughput for very long > >>>> distances. > >>>> > >>>> For short (less than 50 miles :-) the 6' antenna requirement often > >>>> kills the > >>>> deal because of size limits on what towers can handle. Or the > >>>> building > >>>> owner doesn't want such large antennas etc. > >>>> > >>>> Certainly for something that just shoots a mile or three up the > >>>> road it's a > >>>> tough rule to deal with. > >>>> > >>>> I'm not exactly sure how to go about it but I've got the name of > >>>> the person > >>>> at the FCC that'll help us if we'd like to request a rule change. > >>>> > >>>> I'd like to suggest that we push for elimination of the 6' antenna > >>>> rule for > >>>> the 6 gig band. If people are worried about undue interference in > >>>> the band > >>>> due to the wider beam antennas we could toss out an APC (automatic > >>>> power > >>>> control) requirement to use smaller antennas. > >>>> > >>>> Thoughts? > >>>> Marlon > >>>> (509) 982-2181 Equipment sales > >>>> (408) 907-6910 (Vonage) Consulting services > >>>> 42846865 (icq) And I run my own > >>>> wisp! > >>>> 64.146.146.12 (net meeting) > >>>> www.odessaoffice.com/wireless > >>>> www.odessaoffice.com/marlon/cam > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> -- > >>>> WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] > >>>> > >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >>>> > >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > >>>> > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Lonnie Nunweiler > >>> Valemount Networks Corporation > >>> http://www.star-os.com/ > >>> -- > >>> WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] > >>> > >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >>> > >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > >>> > >>> -- > >>> WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] > >>> > >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >>> > >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> No virus found in this incoming message. > >>> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. > >>> Version: 7.0.338 / Virus Database: 267.10.1/64 - Release Date: 8/4/2005 > >>> > >>> > >> > >> -- > >> WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] > >> > >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >> > >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > -- > WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > -- Lonnie Nunweiler Valemount Networks Corporation http://www.star-os.com/ -- WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
