I've already sent an email into Redline asking why AirSpan is so much higher and then why the documentation filed with the FCC further limits what the grant's maximum is for, The documentation that accompanies the grant has everything limited to 26 db, well, for 7 MHz. There's no way I'd use 3.5 MHz.
----- Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tom DeReggi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 9:18 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service > Wow- Thats a huge difference. > For those that don't want to pull up the link... > > Redline: 25Mhz ch: 1.3w > AirSpan: 20Mhz ch: 4.07 w > AirSpan: 15Mhz ch: 7.24 w > > Tom DeReggi > RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc > IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mike Hammett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 5:42 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service > > >> and the Redline grant: >> >> https://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/Eas731GrantForm.cfm?mode=COPY&RequestTimeout=500&application_id=549096&fcc_id=QC8-AN100UA >> >> So Redline unit does have FAR less power available then AirSpan. >> >> >> ----- >> Mike Hammett >> Intelligent Computing Solutions >> http://www.ics-il.com >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Gino Villarini" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >> Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 2:23 PM >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service >> >> >>> Airspan grant: >>> >>> https://gullfoss2.fcc.gov/oetcf/eas/reports/Eas731GrantForm.cfm?mode=COP >>> Y&RequestTimeout=500&application_id=686827&fcc_id=O2J-365T >>> >>> Gino A. Villarini >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>> Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp. >>> tel 787.273.4143 fax 787.273.4145 >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On >>> Behalf Of Tom DeReggi >>> Sent: Sunday, January 13, 2008 4:24 PM >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service >>> >>> Mike, >>> >>> Now that I've read those posts of yours, I better understand your >>> position. >>> I was not taking reduced power into consideration. I just had in my >>> mind >>> the 25watts EIRP often mentioned in FCC precentations over the years. >>> >>> To the best of my knowledge, the AirSpan product that I am familiar >>> with, do >>> not have that same limitation. >>> Although I do not have that data off the top of my head, to respond >>> accurately. >>> >>> But regardless... What we have here is not a limitation by WiMax, nor by >>> >>> 3.6G, nor FCC, but a limit posed by the manufacturers and their designs. >>> >>> Doesn't anyone have any insight on why the FCC rules allow more power >>> for >>> wider channels? >>> >>> I realize that wider channels create larger internal system noise, which >>> >>> could be a reason for needing more power for wider channels. >>> But that is in contradiction to 2.4Ghz rules for Smart Array antennas, >>> that >>> rewarded in highr power for those that had narrower beamwidths, and >>> interfere less. >>> In that spirit, I would think it would have been wise to reward those >>> who >>> strived to use smaller channels, apposed to penalize them for being more >>> >>> efficient. >>> There obviously has to be a technical reason apposed to spectrum >>> ediquete. >>> >>> Tom DeReggi >>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>> >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Mike Hammett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Saturday, January 12, 2008 10:20 AM >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service >>> >>> >>>> See my other post about Redline's comments and their FCC filed >>> documents. >>>> It just doesn't have the power. >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- >>>> Mike Hammett >>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>> http://www.ics-il.com >>>> >>>> >>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>> From: "Tom DeReggi" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 8:12 PM >>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service >>>> >>>> >>>>> Wimax APs can go much fartehr than 2-5 miles. >>>>> You are spec'ing the distance limits of their advanced NLOS features. >>>>> In LOS, they can go just as far as any other unlicened gear. >>>>> >>>>> I think its important to define country. If you are talking about >>> Idaho >>>>> with houses 20 miles apart, yes, you'd be correct. 2.4Ghz and less is >>> the >>>>> better option. >>>>> But where 3.6 Wimax could be exciting is small little towns. where 3 >>> 6Mhz >>>>> channels would actually be enough to get decent speed, and able to >>>>> acheive >>>>> high modulations because its noise free. >>>>> >>>>> Tom DeReggi >>>>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>>>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "Mike Hammett" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>>>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 3:24 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Exactly. >>>>>> >>>>>> What good is an AP that can only do 15 megs throughput in the city? >>>>>> >>>>>> What good is an AP that can only do 2 - 5 miles in the country? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- >>>>>> Mike Hammett >>>>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>>>> http://www.ics-il.com >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>> From: "John Scrivner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>>>>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 2:11 PM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX Service >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>>I guess I am a bit perplexed by this premise. Why would people in >>> urban >>>>>>> areas pay for low bandwidth wireless broadband options? What >>> problem >>>>>>> does this platform solve under that scenario? >>>>>>> Scriv >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Mike Hammett wrote: >>>>>>>> I would like to note that Redline echoed my thoughts on 3.65 GHz. >>> It >>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>> for rural providers and is not for high bandwidth providers. It's >>> >>>>>>>> only >>>>>>>> practical implementation is a dense urban environment with low >>>>>>>> throughput >>>>>>>> clients. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- >>>>>>>> Mike Hammett >>>>>>>> Intelligent Computing Solutions >>>>>>>> http://www.ics-il.com >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>> From: "John Scrivner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, January 11, 2008 12:18 PM >>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX >>> Service >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> There are a number of WiMAX 3.5 GHz solutions that will tune to >>> 3.65 >>>>>>>>> just fine. I doubt that we would need to force the forum to issue >>> a >>>>>>>>> new >>>>>>>>> profile for a frequency band that existing profiles already >>> cover. As >>>>>>>>> far as I am concerned WiMAX in 3.65 GHz is here in all respects >>> and >>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>> not just marketing verbiage. Bravo to Matt Liotta on making a >>> move >>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>> I am sure many others will follow. Way to go Matt. >>>>>>>>> Scriv >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Clint Ricker wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Tom, >>>>>>>>>> I'd agree. I'm in no way advocating marketing that is deceptive >>> in >>>>>>>>>> terms >>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>> deliverables. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> My main point is more that communications in marketing often >>>>>>>>>> involves >>>>>>>>>> using >>>>>>>>>> buzzwords that coopt something someone knows for describing your >>>>>>>>>> product. >>>>>>>>>> Even if that is, on a technical level, incorrect, on a business >>> and >>>>>>>>>> communication and marketing standpoint good practice--the >>> reality is >>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> the end user understands what you are saying and more "truth" is >>>>>>>>>> communicated--they better understand what to expect from your >>>>>>>>>> product. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Now, using terms that mislead the customer into expecting >>> something >>>>>>>>>> that >>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>> isn't is an entirely different matter, and one that I don't >>> advocate >>>>>>>>>> and, >>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> the end, is very detrimental. I think it comes down to the >>>>>>>>>> deliverables, >>>>>>>>>> in >>>>>>>>>> that sense. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Thanks, >>>>>>>>>> Clint Ricker >>>>>>>>>> -Kentnis Technologies >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Jan 11, 2008 11:56 AM, Tom DeReggi >>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> First, two thumbs up for Matt. 1) He's leading the way to >>> expand >>>>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>>> new >>>>>>>>>>> technologies. 2) He's clever enough to use maximize how he >>> uses of >>>>>>>>>>> Press >>>>>>>>>>> Releases. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> With that said, in response to Clint, I had mixed feelings >>>>>>>>>>> regarding >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> release. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I didn't see a problem listing "Wimax" in the press release. >>>>>>>>>>> Wimax/Non-Wimax, whats the difference, its wireless, its latest >>>>>>>>>>> state >>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> art. All the same to the consumer. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Where I saw it riding the line was stating "Granted a License". >>>>>>>>>>> I believe that misleads the public to come to a false >>> conclusion. >>>>>>>>>>> There is a big difference between licensed and unlicensed in >>> the >>>>>>>>>>> public >>>>>>>>>>> eye. >>>>>>>>>>> Licensed has 100% protection, Unlicensed 100% doesn't. >>>>>>>>>>> Licenses are usualy exclusive, unlicensed is not. >>>>>>>>>>> 3650 light licensing is "experiental" and much closer to the >>>>>>>>>>> characteristics >>>>>>>>>>> of unlicensed, with registration added. >>>>>>>>>>> Sure technically 3650 is licensed, but again the reader is >>> misled >>>>>>>>>>> to >>>>>>>>>>> think >>>>>>>>>>> the service is something more than it really is. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Is that ethical? Is it deceptive? Could you here the spin? Its >>> not >>>>>>>>>>> illegal. >>>>>>>>>>> Nothing was said that could be miscontrued as a lie. Is it any >>>>>>>>>>> different >>>>>>>>>>> than typical forward thinking statements of other press >>> releases? >>>>>>>>>>> Maybe >>>>>>>>>>> just >>>>>>>>>>> clever marketing? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Tom DeReggi >>>>>>>>>>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>>>>>>>>>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>>>>>>>> From: "Clint Ricker" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>>>>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 10:15 PM >>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] One Ring Networks To Rollout New WiMAX >>> Service >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I'd like to make a point in return. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> This is a press release, and it is generally used for >>> marketing >>>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>>> publicity. Who the flip cares about the exact nuances in >>>>>>>>>>>> technology? >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> If >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Matt's company expresses their product in terms that their >>> target >>>>>>>>>>>> market >>>>>>>>>>>> understands, then it is good marketing. It's not like their >>>>>>>>>>>> customers >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> are >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> going to do deep layer1 and 2 analysis to see that their >>> bandwidth >>>>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>>> coming >>>>>>>>>>>> over the "one true WiMax". If it looks like a duck and quacks >>> >>>>>>>>>>>> like >>>>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> duck >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> and you're talking to kindergarteners, just go ahead and call >>> it a >>>>>>>>>>>> duck >>>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>>> reeducate the 1/1000 of 1 percent who become ornithologists >>> when >>>>>>>>>>>> they >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> grow >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> up and care to learn the subtle nuances. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I know companies that sell/sold "wireless DSL". Technically, >>> this >>>>>>>>>>>> is >>>>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>>>> complete absurdity. >>>>>>>>>>>> But, I'd bet that it did a good job of communicating the >>>>>>>>>>>> concept--which >>>>>>>>>>>> is, >>>>>>>>>>>> after all, the point of marketing. I'd imagine that they do >>>>>>>>>>>> better >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> then >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> companies that sell "High bandwidth 802.11A/B/G Data Traffic >>>>>>>>>>>> Transport >>>>>>>>>>>> Solutions". >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> There are service providers who still keep on trying to sell >>>>>>>>>>>> "VoIP" >>>>>>>>>>>> with >>>>>>>>>>>> multi page explanations about how the analog voice get >>> digitized, >>>>>>>>>>>> packetized, encapsulated, and 20 other gazillion processes >>> that no >>>>>>>>>>>> one >>>>>>>>>>>> really cares about unless they like reading RFCs every time >>> they >>>>>>>>>>>> make >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> even >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> mundane purchase decisions. Then there's Comcast who, while >>>>>>>>>>>> definitely >>>>>>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>>>>>> hurt by the existing customer base and financial resources and >>>>>>>>>>>> technical >>>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure, became the fourth largest telco in quite a >>> short >>>>>>>>>>>> amount >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> time. They did this by having the marketing common sense to >>> sell >>>>>>>>>>>> "telephone >>>>>>>>>>>> service", not "Voice over IP". >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> If the customers understand what Matt's product is better >>> because >>>>>>>>>>>> he >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> calls >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> it "WiMax", then great. It sure sounds better than "Modified >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> pre-release >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> quasi 802.16". You're in business to sell products...and, >>> that >>>>>>>>>>>> involves >>>>>>>>>>>> communication. Using language that people can understand >>> sells >>>>>>>>>>>> products >>>>>>>>>>>> and, in the end, gets more "truth" across--if that is your >>>>>>>>>>>> objective >>>>>>>>>>>> here--by actually communicating with people as opposed to >>> using >>>>>>>>>>>> language >>>>>>>>>>>> that people just don't understand--nor care to. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -Clint Ricker >>>>>>>>>>>> Kentnis Technologies >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Jan 10, 2008 7:49 PM, Mike Bushard, Jr >>>>>>>>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Do your radios have sub channelization? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> I Congratulate you on the build, but I have to question if >>> stuff >>>>>>>>>>>>> like >>>>>>>>>>>>> this >>>>>>>>>>>>> is not part of the total misunderstanding of WiMAX (what it >>> is >>>>>>>>>>>>> and >>>>>>>>>>>>> isn't). >>>>>>>>>>>>> I >>>>>>>>>>>>> really don't think WiMAX is the right term, Maybe WiMAX >>> based, >>>>>>>>>>>>> but >>>>>>>>>>>>> it >>>>>>>>>>>>> definitely is not WiMAX. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> We just turned up our first WiMAX base station today. Running >>>>>>>>>>>>> 2.5Ghzand >>>>>>>>>>>>> using 16e ready hardware. I'm Not trying to steal glory here, >>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> just >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> making >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> a >>>>>>>>>>>>> point. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Mike Bushard, Jr >>>>>>>>>>>>> Wireless Network Engineer >>>>>>>>>>>>> 320-256-WISP (9477) >>>>>>>>>>>>> 320-256-9478 Fax >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>>>>>>>>> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] >>>>>>>>>>>>> On >>>>>>>>>>>>> Behalf Of Matt Liotta >>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, January 10, 2008 2:22 PM >>>>>>>>>>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [SPAM] Re: [WISPA] [SPAM] One Ring Networks To >>> Rollout >>>>>>>>>>>>> New >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> WiMAX >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Service >>>>>>>>>>>>> Importance: Low >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Steve Stroh wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Fixed WiMAX profiles for 3.5 (non-US), but NOT 3.65 GHz in >>> the >>>>>>>>>>>>>> US >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> because >>>>>>>>>>>>> of >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> the unique "contention protocol" requirements (systems for >>> 3.65 >>>>>>>>>>>>>> GHz >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> should >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> be considered proprietary and quite possibly >>> non-interoperable). >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> The lower 25Mhz of 3.65Ghz does not have a "contention >>> protocol" >>>>>>>>>>>>> requirement. However, if the radio implements contention then >>> it >>>>>>>>>>>>> won't >>>>>>>>>>>>> be restricted to the lower 25Mhz. As of today, only WiMAX >>> radios >>>>>>>>>>>>> have >>>>>>>>>>>>> been certified for 3.65Ghz. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -Matt >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> ---- >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> ---- >>>>>>>>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! 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