Jon, I personally like Chucks suggestion... Charging for subsriber count ranges via tiers, and using the honor system. It gives WISP an option to pay more, with the likelihood they will do the right thing, and those with more stake in the game with more to gain, will havea mechanism enabling to help more for mutual benefit.
However, I recognize your point, of not wanting to turnoff members. But we cant ignore there is a clear benefit to having tiers. If concerned about turning off people by a tiered method, a possible solution is to reduce number of tiers to fewer, the bare mminimum to address the problem. The biggest reason for tiers is to never have a dues amount to large that it prevents some smaller but interested parties from justifying joining, but yet having Due at a higher rate for most members, in line with what can best help accomplish the goals the members desire. A small startup being exposed to WISPA, might question $500, but likely wouldn't question $250. But $500 dues is really needed to make a large neough impact. There is jsut as much a risk of loosing large WISPs as members, because WISPA doesn;t charge enough to afford to make a large enough impact, and therefore looks less relevent to the larger WISP. A mechanism must be in place to accommodate both profile companies.. For example, the Tiers could be just two... $250 for under 100subs, and $500 for over 100. Another option could be to have a first year discount. Allow Startups to pay $250, to experience the benefit of WISPA, with the assumption that the startup needs a year of growth before they are made to put in equal contribution as other more established WISPs. And again, because of the honor system, it could be left up to the applicant to state whether they considered themselves a startup or not to get a discount.. But even then, Associate membership might serve the purpose of low cost membership for startups. However, I personally believe that the very best way to accomplish WISPA's revenue goals is the accumulative effort of many. The easiest sell, and biggest impact could be obtained if every WISPA member stepped up to pay just a little bit more. As I stated before in this thread.... I beleive the lowest tier WISP Principle membership fee should be $350 (not 250). I beleive all of us should be able to afford $350. (and if I'm wrong, the honor system can assist with that). And that alone would raise $30k, right off the bat. I feel strongly about that. So in compromise I think a good dues structure might be.... Assoicate $150 Principle upto 1000subs- $350 Principle over 1000subs- $600 Now if that is not enough revenue, well then I beleive that at this time, the additional revenue beyond that needs to come from elsewhere. Preferrably via new membership recruiting. Or additional fund raising events. Tom DeReggi RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jon Auer" <j...@tapodi.net> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 3:54 PM Subject: Re: [WISPA] WISPA DUES - (was: new list) > And would turn off more people than simply doubling the membership fee > from $250 to $500... > > On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 2:49 PM, Josh Luthman > <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote: >> >> That does add overhead... >> >> Josh Luthman >> Office: 937-552-2340 >> Direct: 937-552-2343 >> 1100 Wayne St >> Suite 1337 >> Troy, OH 45373 >> >> >> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 3:44 PM, Chuck Hogg <ch...@shelbybb.com> wrote: >>> >>> I think it should be based on customer count. Have a base rate, and then >>> have the extra based on customer count. It's up to the WISP to report >>> correctly. >>> 1-500 base rate >>> 500-1000 +100 >>> 1000-2000 +250 >>> etc. >>> Regards, >>> >>> Chuck >>> >>> >>> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 3:21 PM, Josh Luthman >>> <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote: >>>> >>>> $250 first year >>>> >>>> $500 second+ year >>>> >>>> Josh Luthman >>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>> Suite 1337 >>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>> >>>> >>>> On Wed, Jan 26, 2011 at 3:19 PM, Tom DeReggi >>>> <wirelessn...@rapiddsl.net> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> And I'd gladly pay another $250 per year more, if everyone would, and >>>>> it guaranteed that WISPA would double their legal spending, for twice >>>>> the FCC lobbying effort. My only complaint is that we could be doing >>>>> more, if more money was collected to fund it. >>>>> I'd argue after 6+ years at it, even just to cover inflation, a price >>>>> increase of 3% per year is in line. >>>>> Even if dues were raised jsut a little to $350 principle, and $150 >>>>> Associate, the increase would be substantial for the organization, but >>>>> almost unnoticed by the paying member. Just about anyone can afford an >>>>> extra $50-100 per year. >>>>> That combined with a target increase of 10% in membership recruitment, >>>>> it would add up. >>>>> >>>>> I'd agree... $500-$1000 Dues might deter some people from staying >>>>> members or joining. But I'll never understand why a small increase in >>>>> dues has not been initiated. At minimum just to slowly test the waters >>>>> on what members would be OK with. >>>>> >>>>> I can tell you, without a doubt, its impossible for a WISP not to get >>>>> $350 of value from this organization. >>>>> There is an arguement, why pay, if someone else will foot the bill. >>>>> But at WISPA, there is no one else to foot the bill. >>>>> Either members do it, or it doesn't get funded. >>>>> >>>>> I hope that this year that both the board raises dues, and that more >>>>> general list participants step up to become paying members, and join >>>>> our fight to steer the FCC and Congress into better decissions for our >>>>> industry. >>>>> >>>>> I know WISPA's voice has made a difference, even of the victory is not >>>>> clear. Even with NetNeutrality, some of us felt it was a loss and >>>>> WISPs were ignored. But in reality it was a victory because the rules >>>>> were not as restrictive as so many experts thought they would be. >>>>> >>>>> What we need is EVERY small, local, grassroots WISP joining our team. >>>>> The smaller the member company the better. I dont want to tell the >>>>> world that we are made up of mostly big WISPs that each have a million >>>>> subs, incorrectly suggesting the bigger WISPs are the most relevent >>>>> ones. Instead, I want the world to know that WISPA is the voice for >>>>> the MILLION small WISP Providers across the country. (I'll settle for >>>>> a 1000 :-) >>>>> But I KNOW we can do better than 300. >>>>> >>>>> And heck, even being a 10year old isn't an excuse not to join as an >>>>> assoicate member. Most parents would pay $100/year for a Toontown >>>>> subscription. I cant imagine that a parent wouldn't JUMP at the >>>>> opportunity to pay $100 to steer their kid (from toontown) into a >>>>> learning opportunity to interact with experienced WISP CEOs on a full >>>>> membership list. Thats as good as any intern program. >>>>> >>>>> And now for the full fledged WISP company... $250 is NOTHING! Just >>>>> think about everything that you can buy for $250. Some of us exect to >>>>> pay more than that for a nice dinner on the town or a pair of shoes. >>>>> $250 is Peanuts comparatively to what similar associations charge. I'm >>>>> pretty sure WISPA should go into the guinees book of World record as >>>>> the assoication with the lowest Dues of all time. Id argue that if >>>>> someone cant justify $250 represent the intereests of their business >>>>> and liveihood, should they even be in this business? And even then, >>>>> I'd argue, if money is that tight, even more of a reason to join >>>>> WISPA, to get more bank for the buck, cause they aren't going to be >>>>> afforing their own lawyers anytime soon. And when picking an >>>>> organization to support who else would a WISP choose more worthy than >>>>> WISPA to represent them? I cant think of anyone better. >>>>> >>>>> I'll be honest, this whole DUES thing is a big frustration to me, Its >>>>> a topic that has been discussed for 5 years now. I cant fathom to >>>>> understand what the hold up is to join or pay more. What more could >>>>> WISPA possibly do to show they provide over $250 of value? WHy would a >>>>> WISP not want to join and contribute, when there is so much to gain by >>>>> contributing the little amount asked to have contributed? >>>>> >>>>> There is a long road ahead of us, and every year its gonna just get >>>>> harder. The lobby battle is not over, it is just beginning in Congress >>>>> and FCC. >>>>> And I can tell you that in the next 2 years telecom policy will get >>>>> re-written, and there is no better time than now, to contribute and >>>>> effect possitive change. There is not a shortage of topics to fight >>>>> for... I'd even suggest when folks send in their membership Dues, that >>>>> they include a note that says, and please allocate some of my dues to >>>>> fight for topic XXXXX. Tell the Director what is important to you, and >>>>> back it with a check. >>>>> >>>>> I can tell you from experience... That I spent a large part of my life >>>>> the last 4 years engaged on WISPA board, and I did it, because what >>>>> WISPA does is important. It was important enough, that I wanted to be >>>>> there involved. But I can tell, since I left the board, and started >>>>> focusing more time on my own business, my business profitabilty has >>>>> increased substantially. I can tell you, $250 is a steal for me, to be >>>>> able to rest assured knowing that others are working hard for the >>>>> interests of my company at federal levels, so I can do my job and >>>>> focus on my company's operation. I say, help WISPA do their job, and >>>>> help fund their efforts via Dues. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> >>>>> Tom DeReggi >>>>> RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc >>>>> IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: Rick Harnish >>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 9:09 AM >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] WISPA DUES - (was: new list) >>>>> >>>>> Kurt, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> You are exactly right. Working inside the Beltway is very expensive. >>>>> Office Rent, Malpractice insurance, hotels, food and just about >>>>> everything else is twice what it is in the common world. However, to >>>>> be clued in and in touch with the daily events that happen at the FCC >>>>> and Congress, it is almost essential that we maintain a presence there >>>>> through our attorney. Many associations have their corporate offices >>>>> in the DC Metro Area. We are a long ways from doing that and we >>>>> maintain our virtual offices across the country at Board Member >>>>> offices and my little rented office in Indiana. We are appreciative of >>>>> all the supplies, electricity, insurance and other expenses incurred >>>>> by those that serve on the Board, so that we can maintain low overhead >>>>> and dedicate the major portion of our revenue to go to lobbying type >>>>> efforts. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> For those of you that are wondering. Our legal expenses last year were >>>>> almost $100,000. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I appreciate your kind words and we will continue to work for the >>>>> industry. Hopefully others will join the members in supporting our >>>>> efforts. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Respectfully, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rick Harnish >>>>> >>>>> Executive Director >>>>> >>>>> WISPA >>>>> >>>>> 260-307-4000 cell >>>>> >>>>> 866-317-2851 WISPA Office >>>>> >>>>> Skype: rick.harnish. >>>>> >>>>> rharn...@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser >>>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2011 8:11 AM >>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] WISPA DUES - (was: new list) >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rick, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> I just seen the total expenses sheet, and all I have to say is WOW. I >>>>> had no idea that there was as much legal fees associated with running >>>>> WISPA. Lets face it, these annual member fees are CHEAP CHEAP CHEAP >>>>> compared to the overall cost of running WISPA. And right now pretty >>>>> much everyone that is a WISP (paying member of WISPA or not) is >>>>> getting benefit from this organization from the lobbying efforts and >>>>> FCC agenda. I encourage anyone that is not a current member to sign >>>>> up. I know that there are a TON of wisps out there that are not >>>>> members. I would estimate that possibly only 25-50% of all total WISPS >>>>> are members. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> The WISPS that are not current members should be ashamed of themselves >>>>> because of all that they are benefitting from at the expense of the >>>>> rest of us…. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Kurt Fankhauser >>>>> >>>>> Wavelinc Communications >>>>> >>>>> P.O. Box 126 >>>>> >>>>> Bucyrus, OH 44820 >>>>> >>>>> http://www.wavelinc.com >>>>> >>>>> 419-562-6405 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sent from Microsoft Outlook >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Rick Harnish >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 6:57 PM >>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] new list >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Kurt, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> We will take this to the members list. I have a couple hours of work >>>>> to get the P&L ready. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rick >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Kurt Fankhauser >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 6:21 PM >>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] new list >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rick, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> What does WISPA take in total for a years time and where is all this >>>>> money going? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Kurt Fankhauser >>>>> >>>>> Wavelinc Communications >>>>> >>>>> http://www.wavelinc.com >>>>> >>>>> P.O. Box 126 >>>>> >>>>> Bucyrus, OH 44820 >>>>> >>>>> 419-562-6405 >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sent from Microsoft Outlook >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Rick Harnish >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 11:29 AM >>>>> To: bo...@burrow.com; 'WISPA General List' >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] new list >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> It isn’t about bashing WISPA in my view. It is providing input so that >>>>> the WISPA Board can make the appropriate decisions that are >>>>> representative of the majority of operators. The Board is made up of >>>>> operators just like the rest of you and they are human, they make >>>>> mistakes and they don’t always have the funding or impact to get >>>>> everything they want in regards to FCC policy. Any Board member will >>>>> tell you that criticism is the name of the game. If you can’t take it, >>>>> you don’t run the next year. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Sure I wish we could be right all the time and never receive any >>>>> criticism, but that will never happen. We pledge to do the best we can >>>>> do. Understand that the Board is still a volunteer position and they >>>>> do have a business to run as well. That is why they hired me to run >>>>> the day to day affairs and stimulate the membership totals. Below is a >>>>> graphic of WISPA revenues since March 2008. I started on August 1st, >>>>> 2010. You can see that typically, we have a revenue spike with every >>>>> tradeshow that we do as our membership grows. >>>>> >>>>> January 2011 numbers are not complete yet but in general, we seem to >>>>> be progressing nicely. The large spike was the Summer Regional Show in >>>>> St. Louis. Obviously there were rather large offsetting costs but it >>>>> was a profitable show for us. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Respectively, >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Rick Harnish >>>>> >>>>> Executive Director >>>>> >>>>> WISPA >>>>> >>>>> 260-307-4000 cell >>>>> >>>>> 866-317-2851 WISPA Office >>>>> >>>>> Skype: rick.harnish. >>>>> >>>>> rharn...@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Bobby Burrow >>>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 25, 2011 10:30 AM >>>>> To: 'WISPA General List' >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] new list >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> This is disappointing. IF you read the Mission Statement and Goals of >>>>> WISPA, you would understand that this forum is not the place to vent >>>>> or air ill feelings. We are supposed to be a community of peers that >>>>> can look to each other for support and encouragement as we pursue of >>>>> business goals. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Freedom of speech in these public forums is not intended to be the >>>>> freedom to complain or bash each other, let alone the organization >>>>> that provides the service. I would suggest that those that feel that >>>>> need should find another venue so the rest can continue on per the >>>>> goals and mission as defined. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Bobby Burrow >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Supporter >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Josh Luthman >>>>> Sent: Monday, January 24, 2011 11:30 AM >>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] new list >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> To be entirely neutral. We can't bash WISPA if we wanted to, for >>>>> example. We can't bash a company that is affiliated with WISPA. >>>>> Probably not the best example, but this way we are entirely free to do >>>>> what we want. >>>>> >>>>> Josh Luthman >>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 >>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 >>>>> 1100 Wayne St >>>>> Suite 1337 >>>>> Troy, OH 45373 >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Jan 24, 2011 at 12:26 PM, Steve Barnes <st...@pcswin.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Not sure of the reason for this Post here. Isn't the >>>>> wireless@wispa.org a free non-vendor specific list? Is this a post to >>>>> pull users from WISPA? >>>>> >>>>> Steve Barnes >>>>> >>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] >>>>> On Behalf Of Travis Johnson >>>>> Sent: Monday, January 24, 2011 11:36 AM >>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>> Subject: [WISPA] new list >>>>> >>>>> Hi, >>>>> >>>>> In an effort to create a neutral discussion forum, a new mailing list >>>>> has been created called Wireless Users Group. This list is 100% free, >>>>> and is not tied to any product or service being sold. It is hosted on >>>>> a free server, with free bandwidth and free administration. No fees or >>>>> vendor sponsorship will ever be asked by this new list. >>>>> >>>>> To subscribe to this new list, send an email to users-requ...@wug.cc >>>>> with "subscribe" in the subject field. >>>>> >>>>> We support many of the wireless pioneers in this industry such as >>>>> Motorola, Wireless Beehive, and WISPA. We would just prefer a vendor >>>>> neutral list that allows discussion of any product (whether good or >>>>> bad) so that we can all learn. >>>>> >>>>> __________________________________ >>>>> Wireless Users Group us...@wug.cc >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>>> >>>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>>> >>>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>>> >>>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>>> >>>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >> >> >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
