Cde Sabelo, When I write this piece I never intended to show elements of discriminating any person on the bases of HIV/AIDS status. You references of Soccer player is not assisting my leader. No one and up today no proof was produced that Sizwe died of AIDS, not because you cannot diagnose the root cause when a person died.In reality I lost an Uncle recently who has the symptoms of what killed Sizwe and for almost 41 years and he was no longer able to do the very same work you are referring to Sizwe. This is the myth we should confront that when you are HIV/AIDS you remain strong while the reality is that you body develop weakness that overtime will bring you down. You know what it was said, my uncle died on pneumonia, TB, etc and there was no mentioning of HIV/AIDS. Infact the issue of Soldier like I said before has to looked into in details. You have witness the programme wherein our Soldier are deployed in Burundi, DRC, Rwanda, Mogadishu and other areas wherein the risk to the State is not a simple straight line but requires an indebt analysis of how a positive person will perform in those harsh area. Maybe you have not being exposed to the conditions which we are referring to here and as such a general statement is made.
You see commander, it therefore means that the right to privacy will have to be dealt way with since we should know what type of commanders we are deploying and to come with a complex solution is not easy not to you or to the Minister. I happened to have a relative who is in that condition and continue to work in the Military and on the bases of the progressiveness of the base leadership, he is stationed in the base. What this say is that conditions ought to be studied before a decision is made. All of you are quick to blame the Minister and no one including the leadership of the Union want to diagnose the root cause that came all the way from Mbeki's era. All I am appealing to all of you is to understand the condition, the Minister find herself. I remain >>> sabelo gina <[email protected]> 2009/09/01 02:00 PM >>> Comrade Nndwamato, I have never thought one day I will read in the pages of this debating forum an opinion of a comrade who argue that HIV positive comrades must be discriminated against because the judge that made the ruling was reactionary, maybe we must debate what is being reactionary according to your definition. I would like to use the example of Sizwe Motaung, the best full back that South Africa ever had in the National Team. It is alleged that he died from AIDS. Could it be possible that in 1996 when the National Team won the Cup with his superb contribution, he was already HIV positive if indeed he died from AIDS? Now, as a person who works for a respected research institution, can you convince me how does an HIV positive fail to perfom like any other person? The call by the YCL is correct. You do not correct a wrong by doing another wrong, an amicably solution must be found on the matter. I think the commander in chief must intervene in this matter. Comradely, Cedric Gina. On Tue, Sep 1, 2009 at 1:40 PM, Nndwamato Mutshidza <[email protected]>wrote: > > Cdes, > > While some of us sympathise with those provisionally dismissed, we need to > get it clear that Dr. Lindiwe cannot just act out of anger to fulfil her > task. You see cds, this tendency of YCL just from nowhere send condemnation > without an analysis of the situation is problematic. For starters those > soldiers who behaved like hooligans does not deserved to be called real > workers as they seems not progressive and does not know what is right and > wrong. If you are not granted permission to march the law should take its > own cause period and they were aware of these quensequneces. SA has laws and > as such people particularly those assigned responsibility to ensure that > there law and order should be the first to guide this process. It cannot be > right for us to make noise on lawlessness. > > Now on the issue at hand, cdes it does not matter who put who in power, the > Minister has a duty to ensure that things are done in order. You cdes seems > to have memory lapse, in that you think that it has been long she has been > in the help of the mess created by Terror when he was in charge. The root > cause, which the Zuma Administration has prioritised are issues of taking > care of our combatant, issue of recruitment and building loyalty to serve > this country. All these principles are not displayed by these soldier you so > dearly want us to defend. The issue of support for those that requires > training and those that are HIV are issue of Social responsibility of the > State to provide for. The issue of just hiring people who amongst other is > fitness cannot be overlooked no matter which reactionary judge ruled. Just > like in Mining Industry, if you blood pressure cannot allow you to go deep > down we are not obliged to hire you and thats what we called progressive > discrimination for someone else sake. The same applies to soldiers who are > HIV/AIDS infected, they know and studies have shown that you cannot be at > your peak in a war zone as SA is doing currently in Central Africa. Hence we > should have a debate as to this issue of opening the gate for everyone is in > the interest of whose family. I am rasing this view to show that it is not > easy to implement but you have to carefully plan the implementation of the > court order looking at your own capacity. Assume we rush the implementation > and in a scale of 1:10 you find that 5 are dying on this dieses as the stats > shows, who take responsibility? The State through Tax payers and you want us > not to have a say on this matter, maybe someone should educate me here. > > Lets give the new Minister chance to look at the implications and then > report to this members. I am not qualified to talk to Salaries as I do not > know how much they earn and what grade are they supposed to be and I would > like to advice other to do the same and leave the rest to the due process to > resolve the impasse. > > I remain > > Cde Tom > >>> sipho shandu <[email protected]> 2009/09/01 12:10 PM >>> > Greetings Cadres, > > I am of the opinion that our president made an error when choosing a > minister of defence as she cannot discuss issues. The soldiers are the most > underpaid civil servants in the country and yet they have chosen to guard > and put their lives at risk. > > I believe that the ministers' decision to dismiss them was not well thought > and was very much selfish. The minister tends to forget as to who put her > and her bosses in government. She tends to forget her constituencies. > > I feel that the minister should reconsider her decision as she was still > feeling a little bit sleepy at the time it was decided. We surely do not > want war. This decision also shows the manner that government treats us as > citizens and civil servants. > > I strongly condemn the minister because she does not understand the > background of these soldiers. How does it now help that she has dismissed > them? Who is going to feed their families? Is this part of the NDR? > > All cadres out there, let us rally behind our soldiers to get their jobs > back and after that to get a salary review. All ministers tend to forget > that we as the people elected them into those cushy positions and we could > easily cut them down to size. > > If they want war, then war it that they shall get and that is not a threat! > > AMANDLA MASOSHA OMZANSI!! AMANDLA!!! > > > On 9/1/09, Gugu Ndima <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > *YCLSA condemns the dismissal of soldiers by the Minister of Defence and > > Military veterans* > > > > *01 September 2009* > > > > The Young communist league of South Africa (UFasimba) would like to > condemn > > the Minister for dismissing soldiers that were involved in the strike > > action. We believe that this does not help the matter but exacerbates it > > further. The YCLSA strongly opposes the violent nature of the action by > the > > soldiers who are members of the South African National Defence Union. > > > > The YCLSA believes that there is no form of grievance that justifies > > violence and threat to national security. However, dismissing soldiers > who > > are bread winners and heads of family households implies that the > Minister > > is using dismissal as a political tool to avoid dealing with the gist of > the > > matter. > > > > We call on the Minister of Defence and Military Veterans not to solve > the > > problem by avoiding it, but by urgently giving the soldiers a hearing. We > > believe that the concerns of the soldiers, especially related to wages > and > > transformation of the military, are genuine and should be addressed. > > > > Labour practises should be applied to any worker irrespective of their > > occupation. We condemn any attempt to try and bar soldiers from being > > members of trade unions, and do not agree with the sentiments made by the > > MKVA. We therefore call upon the Minister to meet with representatives of > > both unions and come to an amicable solution to the matter at hand. > > > > *Issued by the YCLSA Head office* > > > > *Contact* > > > > *Gugu Ndima (076 783 1516) * > > > > *National spokesperson* > > > > > > -- > > Gugu Ndima > > +27 76 783 1516 > > > > > > > > > > > -- > This message is subject to the CSIR's copyright terms and conditions, > e-mail legal notice, and implemented Open Document Format (ODF) standard. > The full disclaimer details can be found at > http://www.csir.co.za/disclaimer.html. > > This message has been scanned for viruses and dangerous content by > MailScanner, > and is believed to be clean. MailScanner thanks Transtec Computers for > their support. > > > > > -- This message is subject to the CSIR's copyright terms and conditions, e-mail legal notice, and implemented Open Document Format (ODF) standard. The full disclaimer details can be found at http://www.csir.co.za/disclaimer.html. 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