At the end you or me or the both us lost the real point which is
shows how useless and what a waste of time trying to explain things
to people who have already many preconcepts in their minds. Yes I am
very happy to be the endless begginer. What about you?
--- In Zen_Forum@yahoogroups.com, "Bill Smart" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Thank you for your interesting post. My comments are imbedded
> Donald Hwong wrote:
> Good morning Bill,
> Mayka's answer typifies one of the major difference between a
> and wester Zen. This is what I have discovered after learning
about Zen in
> In my opinion Mayka's answer is the same as most Westerners; in
> same as most beginning zen students. They believe Buddha Nature is
> something that someone else has, someone special - and they need to
> something to 'polish-up' or 'evolve' their Buddha Nature before
> Most of the Chinese Buddhists believe our Buddha nature are within
> only through Chan practice can we rid of karma and let it shine
> This is what I was taught from both a Japanese Soto and a Rinzai
> that you already are Buddha, and that your practice is to
> that. 'Realize' meaning to 'become aware', and also meaning
> or 'make real'.
> A Chan practitioner means in Chinese to cultivate Bodhisattva Heart
> act in Bodhisattva way - a cycle fine-tunes each other
until "everything" is
> consummated, satisfied and fulfilled. Which is the Third Practice
> I was taught not to 'cultivate', as 'to grow or nurture', because
> Buddha Nature is already present and complete; but to 'realize' or
> 'discover' it by 'peeling away all doubts' and 'revealing'
> your Buddha Nature.
> While a meditative practice based on Chi enable the practitioner
> connected with the universe, it constantly feeds the practitioner
> force and wisdom far beyond his mental capacity.
> I too was taught that mental capacity or 'intellect' is not
> 'realizing' your Buddha Nature. In fact I was led to believe and
> have experienced that intellect, although not mutually exclusive
> Nature, can be a big hindrance in realization.
> Chi foundation seems to be another major difference between a
> practitioner and a western one. When BodhiDharma taught for the
> in China, at Shaolin, both Motion Chan and Sitting Chan, the only
> thread of the two is the cultivation of the Chi/Qi/Ki. Without
> is no power to transform a person. Without Chi the entire practice
> a mental interpretation of the experience instead of the experience
> The Soto and Rinzai teachers with whom I was involved did
> and its important role in realization, but I was not taught any
> practices to cultivate Chi other than zazen. It was inferred that
> practicing zazen was all that was needed. From my experience that
> This may be why the foundamental Buddhism of karma and cause and
> not a major teaching in western Zen, because there is no practice
> The Soto and Rinzai teachers with whom I was involved did teach
> cause-and-effect; but the clear understanding is that these are
> and after realization are not important. Karma and cause-and-
> have an object on which to attach. I understand that object to be
> When the Self slips away and there is only Buddha Nature remaining,
> does karma and cause-and-effect operate?
> These are just my personal observations after discussion with
> western Zen priests.
> These are my personal observations after a long and intimate
> relationship with the two Soto and Rinzai teachers, many
> discussions with other zen practitioners and zen teachers of many
> lineages, and most importantly after 40+ years of practice.
> Do let me know your comments.
> You got them!
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