Hi Chris, Some very interesting ideas in your comments. My time is short now, and I'd rather give you a mindful response. So, I will do so later.
Thanks again for the reply. Have a good day.. k --- In [email protected], ChrisAustinLane <chris@...> wrote: > > My only contact with Cheryl Huber has been to read about half of a book she > wrote, called something like 'There is nothing wrong with you.' it was not > especially my style, and it is still sitting on my 'being read' shelf of > books. > > I have not heard of a Mountain View Zen Center, but I will look into it. I > have been sitting with Angie Boissivin's San Jose sangha when I am with a > group. Their sesshin was quite pleasant. > > As far as attention and life, I find my constant challenge comes from finding > more parts of my life that I have trouble paying attention to, ao my life > seems to be rather more than i imagine. i prefer Karen Maezen Miller's > formulation that what we attend to florishes. > > For my personal psychological work, I have distinctly non verbal wounds and a > generally non verbal way of thinking, more geometric than wordy, so I favor > more physical and experiential ways of de-conditioning myself over all these > 'working with voices' sort of stuff. > > While I was victimized as a child, I also grew up as an educated, intelligent > white apparently straight male who was super good at programming while > computers were becoming ubiquitous, so I think the sort of totalizing > powerlessness that Cheryl's technique is aimed at was not my lot. I have had > a bias against believing that I deserve kindness and respect, but I have no > doubt that I can please people by doing stuff they can't do with math or > computers. > > I haven't had much depression, at least since getting out of adolescence, or > desire for suicide, so I do not have much comment about the uses of > mindfulness for those struggles. My own therapy was rather conventional > trauma recovery therapy, based on shoring up daily routines, learning that I > am safe basically, that it is ok to feel actual feelings, and that the > body/mind is a fairly reasonable system (rather than rational). I regard it > as being good prep work for Zen. > > Thanks, > Chris Austin-Lane > Sent from a cell phone > > On Mar 8, 2011, at 10:03, "Healthyplay1" <healthyplay1@...> wrote: > > > Chris, > > > > I haven't followed the postings recently, but as I was looking over the > > thread topics, I saw your comment here, and have a quick question.. > > > > Being in No. Cal, have you attended any classes /retreats or such with > > Cheryl Hubert? I think her center is near Murphys-- ( Mountain View Zen > > Center), but she has been at Spirit Rock and other centers in the Santa > > Cruz area. > > > > As I honor much of your practice style, I'm curious--in light of your > > statements here-- how you would respond to her belief that your life is > > what you give your attention to, and how to work constructively and > > compassionately with what Cheri calls "the negative voices in the head". > > > > I-- of course, do believe in actively engaging in compassionate service > > and actions. For me, zen is a means--not an end. But I will be teaching > > with her & others next fall, on how mindful practices influence depression > > and suicide. > > > > Just interested in your thoughts. > > > > Thanks...k > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], Chris Austin-Lane <chris@> wrote: > >> > >> On Tuesday, March 8, 2011, mike brown <uerusuboyo@> wrote: > >> > >>> Chris, > >>> > >>> My apologys if I've got my wires crossed. I thought your original post > >>> was referring to compassion when you said that, "sit, allow your > >>> body/mind to stop twisting itself up, see that we are all one, all > >>> changing, and fundamentally ok, and allow that belief to soak into you > >>> body so that your body/mind components are confident and able to see when > >>> action is appropriate", then perhaps that is more acceptable. > >> > >> That paragraph was in contrast to the one above it, a straw man > >> statement "just get enlightened and all the worlds problems > >> disappear." > >> > >> That paragraphis my attempt at the marketing of no-marketing. > >>> > >>> And also: > >>> > >>>> Many Zen groups do sponsor outward facing activity; many more > >>>> individuals who undertake training also perform actions of benefit to > >>>> others; >however the zen model is to make no more fuss about that than a > >>>> hand adjusting the pillow for the head; of course that's what the hand > >>>> does, no big >deal. > >>> > >>> I took the above as talking about compassionate 'action' and my point was > >>> referring to how that action was performed - by thought or 'thoughtless' > >>> intuition. The point about Red Cross parcels being sent to orphans wasn't > >>> really beingà addressed to what you said, but rather that compassion > >>> arises in every action of the awakened rather than just the obvious ones > >>> (which anyone can do - even cynically). > >> > >> Yes, that paragraph was responding to ED's saying that his local zen > >> center visits the imprisoned. > >> > >> As for how the action is performed, action is action, how can it be > >> performed by thought? > >> > >> I rather find this dogged desire to split things into thought filled > >> vs intuitive to be tedious. People do what they can. Certainly > >> blindness to my own beliefs and my own nature makes it easier to piss > >> off my neighbors when I thought i was being helpful, but to postpone > >> responding to the people around you until you climb some mountain of > >> enlightenment seems like another form of placing an idea above your > >> actual life. Acting as we can as we are, with that little openness to > >> the chance that we may be missing something quite important, is > >> something we can do right now. > >> > >> Note: by my own nature, I do not mean no-self, I mean the stuff that > >> all my friends and acquaintances well know about me which I do not > >> like to see at all. > >> > >> Cheers, > >> > >> --Chris > >> > >> > >>> > >>> Mike > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> From: Chris Austin-Lane <chris@> > >>> To: [email protected] > >>> Sent: Tue, 8 March, 2011 23:17:13 > >>> Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Two Potent Quotes > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> It is just clear. My original post wasn't about sending food to the > >>> hungry orphans, I am not sure where you got that; or compassion either. > >>> --Chris > >>> > >>> On Mar 8, 2011 3:38 AM, "mike brown" <uerusuboyo@> wrote: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Chris, > >>> > >>> > >>>> At the time, in the moment, it is clear. > >>> > >>> Do you mean it is consciously clear (as in an active judgement) orà > >>> intuitively clear, without thought? For me, I still see compassion > >>> arising from any > >>> action performed in the awakened 'state'- sending Red Cross parcels to > >>> children in Eithiopia is beside the point. > >>> > >>> Mike > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> From: Chris Austin-Lane <chris@> > >>> > >>> To: Zen_Forum@: Tue, 8 March, 2011 13:54:13 > >>> Subject: Re: [Zen] Re: Two Potent Quotes > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> At the time, in the moment, it is clear. I did not mean something which > >>> would be labelled approp... > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are > >>> reading! Talk about it tod... > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ > > > > Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are > > reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! 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